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Some Special Interests => Travelling People => Topic started by: flumpit2 on Tuesday 01 September 09 20:35 BST (UK)
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Hi all,i wondered if anyone was related to the Sherriff family from Warks & surrounding areas?My family line goes Reginald Sherriff B:1921 Warks...Matthew Sherriff B:1880 staffs m Annie Morgan 1900 Warks...Abraham Sherriff 1851 Chester m Delilah Smith 1850...William Sherriff 1814 Redditch m Mary Ann Tracey Boswell 1806 Leicestershire...Edward Sherriff abt1779 m Mary Hart ...George Sherriff m Susannah Palmer.
I have read the Henry Dry Bread book & its given me some great info but unfortunatly none of me direct descendants are mentioned so it seems there was a parting of the ways with Henrys g g grandad Hope & his brother (my ggg grandad Abraham).
I have scoured the internet for any info but seem to of drawn a blank as the Sherrriff family isnt well documented.I know that my Grandad was still traveling with his family until around 1930 when they moved into a house in Staffordshire.
Any info is greatly apprechiated!!
Thanks for reading.
Shaz :O)
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Hyah, Flumpit2. Interesting that ye mention ye Grandad Sherriff went into brick, in the 1930's. Only, according to Bob Dawson's book, that name fizzled out, amongst travelling Gypsys, around 1995. Maybe ye've recorded the trend there?
Prior to that? Yeppers. It was recorded in the counties ye mention, and more. He does indicate its occurrence was intermittent though.
Funnily enough, as a Pest Controller, the name Sheriff is now synonymous, to me, with 'Bee Suits'. Theirs are just about the industry standard. But, those Sheriff's are based in Cornwall.
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Probably of no consequence flumpit2, but my Grt Grt Gran was a Dinah Sherrif from the North West . She was the wife of one Othea Boswell. Her children used both the names Boswell and Sherrif. If you look on Romany Genes, you will see a photo of John Sherrif, who was the Brother of my Grt Grandad, Lavina Boswell.
The lady who posts on here as An65, imformed me that the Sherrif and Boswell names, were along with Boss, pretty much interchangeable.
This family frequented the counties that you mention.
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hi i dont know if im part of this family do u know if abraham had any gransons also what was his sons name its just ive found a cousin and she asked about abraham as it was the name of my dad and her dads grandad thats y im askin i about abrahams son
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Hi,to the best of my knowledge Abraham had 1 son Matthew & 2 daughters Myra & Louisa.Im not saying that there wernt more children tho as 3 seems quite a small number for a gypsy family but i havent found anymore as of yet.Abrahams grandchildren on Matthews side are Reginald,Matthew,Alfred,Dennis and Bella.I havent yet managed to find out who Myra & Louisa were married to or about Children yet.
Abraham was one of 14 children (Alfred,Francis,Oati,Joseph,William,Perrin,Thomas,Matilda,Uriah,Loreni,Eldri,Mary & Hope being the other 13).
I have a family tree on Ancestory if you send me ur email addy i will send you an invite to it so you can see for urself if ur part of this family.My name on Ancestory is shazza_3197 & the trees called Sherriff (Romany Gypsy) Family Tree.
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my email addy is (*) my dad was called kenneth he had 2 brothers 1 was peter and i forget the other im nt sure if it was george my middle name is alfred i was told i was named after my grandad we r romany fam
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my grandad musta bin born around 1870s if this helps my grandad was born in burton at wetmore road but his birth wasnt registered
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You can contact me if you wish, (*)
My name is Julie Sherriff, that is my birth name.
My father is XXXX
His brothers were XXXX
Their parents were Alfred Sherriff c1894
And
Emily Smith b3/09/1899
Emily’s parents were Peter Smith b1879 Stapenhill B-o-T &
Phylis Holland b1879 Derby.
This is were the problems start
My father told me Grand dad Alfred was born in Wetmore Road, Burton-on-Trent.
I can trace two Alfred Sherriffs but none seem to match and he said Alfred’s father was called Abraham who was married to Maria. The only Abraham I can find means he was in his 40’s when he had Alfred. I wonder if this is feasible.
If you have any questions or info do not hesitate to contact me.
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davesherriff & gemini250554,i have sent you both invites to my family tree on Ancestory so that you can both have a look & see if you think you might be part of my family.Hope so as would be nice to add more relatives!! ;D
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Have you had a look at the tree?Do you recognise anyone in it?
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I don't recognised anyone I will upload some pics, I don't have many. My grandparents lived in an old bus up to the 70's I think. I used to travel with my parents to Evesham every year plum or pea picking with the rest of the travellers in the late 50's early 60's. By the way, Dave Sherriff and myself are cousins, his dad and my dad were brothers.
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My grandad use to go to Evesham with his family when he was young.
Just because you dont recognise any1 in my tree,you could still be family.As you can see,iv only really concentrated on my direct line.To be honest,id be suprised if your not related some where along the line as the name Sherriff is not that common,exspecially in the Romany lines.
Let me know any info you have about your family & il see if i can place them in my tree somewhere.
Shaz
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Hi flumpit2, I have been delving into all my paperwork, I think now maybe, we are related. You mention Abraham being 1 of 14 children, I'm not sure but I suspect Matilda is my ancester. I think she married Isaiah Holland and had a daughter Phyllis ( my great grandmother )
Julie
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Hello, I've decided that I would love to trace my Romany roots. My granddad lived as a Romany when he was younger. I am actually a 1/4 Romany and want to find out if I have any relations still living the Romany lifestyle. My granddad was Peter Sherriff. My mum's name is Julie Sherriff. I think my granddad lived in Burton. Can anyone help or advise as to the best place to start looking.
Thanx
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i have an uncle XXX he has a daughter called XXX if yes to either then im still a relative uncle XXX lives in winshill in burton
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:-\
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No, Sherriff is my mum's maiden name. I've attached a photograph that I acquired last night and a low res jpeg of a family tree that I acquired last night.
Thanx
Scott
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Hello Shaz
I just came across your message - I am related to your Abraham Sherriff, he was my gggg-uncle. I am descended from his elder brother, Joseph. Joseph married Eliza Hodgkinson and settled down in Uttoxeter.
I have read Henry Dry-Bread and The Boswell Family book and do wonder about some of the info in there - it doesn't all quite add up. One thing that was suggested to me, and I'm starting to think is possible, is that William Sherriff's parents may not have been Edward and Mary, but instead a William Sherriff and Elizabeth (possibly Elizabeth Claydon/Clayton).
I have a webpage here with more info - see what you think:
http://www.garenewing.co.uk/family/hodgkins.html
Here are some newspaper clippings I picked up recently concerning an Abraham Sherriff...
The Derby Mercury 5 Apr 1885 mentions an Abraham Sherriff, along with William Johnson aka Billy Redman, involved in a fracas with William Eley, mentions brother as being ‘Gipsy Jack’, previosuly charged with a stabbing.
Derby Mercury of 27 Nov 1895 mentions an Abraham Sherriff and Israel Draper aka Cornelius Colbourne, charged with taking six rabbits and attacking the snare watcher on the land of Philip Hanson at Radbourne on 1 Nov.
Derby Mercury of 28 Feb 1900 mentions “Abraham Sherriff, gipsy, hawker’ summoned for allowing his horses to stray on the highway at Cubley and also for encamping there".
best wishes - Garen
PS - just checking some old emails, I'm wondering if your husband already contacted me back in Aug 2008?
Hi all,i wondered if anyone was related to the Sherriff family from Warks & surrounding areas?My family line goes Reginald Sherriff B:1921 Warks...Matthew Sherriff B:1880 staffs m Annie Morgan 1900 Warks...Abraham Sherriff 1851 Chester m Delilah Smith 1850...William Sherriff 1814 Redditch m Mary Ann Tracey Boswell 1806 Leicestershire...Edward Sherriff abt1779 m Mary Hart ...George Sherriff m Susannah Palmer.
I have read the Henry Dry Bread book & its given me some great info but unfortunatly none of me direct descendants are mentioned so it seems there was a parting of the ways with Henrys g g grandad Hope & his brother (my ggg grandad Abraham).
I have scoured the internet for any info but seem to of drawn a blank as the Sherrriff family isnt well documented.I know that my Grandad was still traveling with his family until around 1930 when they moved into a house in Staffordshire.
Any info is greatly apprechiated!!
Thanks for reading.
Shaz :O)
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Hi Garen, I have messaged you before, years ago now. I have learnt much more about my family tree since then. I do believe me and Shaz share ancestors but I have a problem with Abraham, my dad is still alive, he was born in 1920, his father was named Alfred Sherriff, born Burton-on-trent Staffs. My dad tells me his grandad's name was Abraham who was married or not, to Maria. Alfred was born approx 1894, I can't find a Abraham who fits in with this. Any help would be appreciated. According to Shaz's family tree I am a descendant of Matilda Sherriff but she is on my grandmothers side and not my grandfathers side, I am totally confused.
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Hello Julie
I think if you have Romany ancestors you have to accept a certain state of confusion! Every time I think I've pinned something down, something comes along to contradict it. Names changed and varied so much, families intermarried, friends called each other brother... etc. etc. :-)
I have an Alfred Sherriff in my tree, born 1892 in Uttoxeter, grandson to Joseph Sherriff (Abraham's brother). There's also Alfred William Sherriff, grandson of Abraham through Matthew Sherriff.
Abraham married Delilah/Delia Smith in 1871, though I think he was also married to a Coralina Boswell. I have Matilda Sherriff married to Isaiah Holland (1874).
There is another Abraham Sherriff - I think - who was the son of Hope Sherriff (another of Abraham's brothers) and Trinity Boyling.
I've just seen your avatar photo of Phyllis Holland, who I do have on my tree (from the 1891 census return for Isaiah and Matilda). My ggg-grandparents, Joseph and Eliza Sherriff, were witnesses to the marriage of Isaiah and Matilda.
- Garen
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Yes, Phyllis Holland was my ggrandmother, I did find the Alfred Sherriff you talk about, but if my dad is right he was born in Burton and not Uttoxeter. It certainly looks like we are related then as Matilda m Isaiah Holland is also in my tree. Many thanks for your help.
Julie
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Hi all,sorry iv not been on here for abit.Iv kinda run out of steam on the Sherriff tree at the moment so been havin a break from it.
Garen,i think it was my uncle that got in touch with you (my auntys husband Roger).You have a great website,my trees on ancestory.Great newspaper clippings,i wouldnt even know where to start.Any tips would be greatly apprechiated!!!
Julie,in the Sherriff family many of the people named there kids after their siblings,so you will find there are probaly quite afew Abrahams etc.Its just trial and error in finding the right one.As Garen said,they changed names & intermarried,anyone older was called uncle & anyone the same age was brother or sister.Also sometimes they were born in one place but not registered until in another place or sometimes the births were registered in several districts.The Romanys of yonder deffinatly didnt make it easy for us to find them etc,lol!!!
I just wish my grandad was still alive to ask.
Shaz xxx
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Shaz - ah yes, it was indeed Roger - very nice and helpful and we shared some good info.
I mined the British Library 19th Century newspaper archives and got quite a few extracts relating to Sherriff names from the Derby Mercury (for Staffordshire). You can't always be sure someone with the same name is the exact person you're after, but sometimes it's obvious.
http://newspapers.bl.uk/blcs/
My ggg-grandfather and his son (Joseph and Alfred Sherriff) were done for highway robbery - stealing some shillings from a servant girl as she went to work through a park in 1880. That's the trouble with them appearing in newspapers - it's usually for bad stuff! But then again, it does give you more info. (I looked up census info for the girl, Lucy Rock - she was only 18 - if I ever come across her descendants I'll feel as though I'll have to apologise for my ancestors' terrible behaviour!)
Here's a few from my files:
The Derby Mercury 17 April 1895: A Derby Convict and his License - Levi Sherriff was charged with failing to report himself from July last, he being a convict on license. Detective-sergeant Payne said that on April 10th 1889 he was sentenced to five years’ penal servitude and five years police supervision on two charges of horse stealing. He was, however, liberated in May 1892, but a year afterwards he was convicted at this court for drunkenness and police assault. The Home Secretary revoked his license, but he was again liberated the following May from Portland prison. He came to live with his parents at 35 Gisbourne Street, and twice reported himself, but then left the town. On March 10th he was arrested at Chesterfield for horse stealing, but he was discharged at the County Sessions on Wednesday, when witness took him into custody. Had he kept out of trouble his term of imprisonment would have expired next May. Sherriff begged to be let off, saying that his father was on his death bed and he wanted to see him before he died. He failed to get work in Derby and went to the colliery districts. He got nine months taken off his sentence for saving an officer’s life in Portland prison. A prisoner struck one of the warders with a clay pick, and he (Sherriff) interfered. The Bench sentenced him to three months with hard labour, but did not revoke his license.
Levi Sherriff, who appears a few times (and is in Portland prison on the 1891 census), was the son of Perrin and Maria (it would be great to confirm when Perrin died, and if that was indeed their address in 1895). And speaking of Perrin, and probably his brother, Thomas...
The Derby Mercury 17 May 1865: Pern [sic] Sherriff and Thomas Sherriff, two travelling gipsies, were brought up in custody of police-constable Shaw, of Longford, charged under the Vagrant Act with being found camping by the wayside at Longford, not havng any visible means of subsistence. Defendants, on promising to remove their tents, were discharged.
Another Thomas, son of Hope...
The Derby Mercury 14 Mar 1900: Thomas Sheriff of Wirksworth, a private in the 3rd Batt. Sherwood Foresters, who appeared on remand, pleaded guilty to assaulting Henry Clayton on the 19th ult. Complainant stated that on the day named he was passing through the Market Place when Sheriff, without any provocation, struck him a number of blows in the face with his fist, knocking him down, when he became unconscious. Committed to prison for seven days with hard labour. Thomas Sheriff, the same defendant, also pleaded guilty to using violent language at Wirksworth on the 18th ult. He was quarrelling with next-door neighbours. Defendant’s father, a private in the 3rd Batt. Sherwood Foresters, stated that his son would probably be required to proceed to the front about the 15th of the present month. Fined 2s. 6d. and 17s costs or seven days.
I'm very intrigued by the name Clayton appearing here, as a few of the Sherriffs seemed to use that name sometimes. Hope has a few entries himself. Here's one for Isaiah Holland:
The Derby Mercury 20 Jul 1881: Isaiah Holland of Church Gresley, was charged with assaulting Arthur Clamp, licensed victualler, at Gresley, on 18th June last. It appeared the defendant came into the prosecutor’s house drunk, and on being refused drink assaulted him. The Justices said it was a most unprovoked assault, and sent him to gaol for 21 days. A charge of refusing to quit was withdrawn.
Best - Garen
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Hi Garen,
Thanks for the link to the newspapers archive,il have a look when i get a chance (son keeps goin on pc).The articles you typed out were very interesting and make the people seem more real somehow rather than just a name in history.sounds as if some of the Sherriffs were right scoundrels and there would probaly be a lot of descendants to apologise to,lol!!!
I have noticed that Sherriff is a hard name to find cus in searches it brings up the Sherriff of a county instead of someone with the surname Sherriff,lol.
To be honest,i havent got much info on the ppl in our family tree,alot of it is from either Henry Dry Bread or from ancestory.I honestly dont know where to look for info apart from ancestory,free bmd,free cen & family search.
Id love to be able to put faces to names but unfortunatly my Grandad & his family never had any old pictures & have not been able to find any on romany genes etc..
Anyway,better go as son wants to go on facebook again.
Best Wishes
Shaz :D
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hi we have never spoken before i think the phyllis smith nee holland might be my gg grandads sister
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Keep plodding flumpit2. I was stuck for years before Gemini250554 contacted me, also putting me in contact with davesherriff. Both of whom are previously unknown family. :)
We share the connection with my Gt Grandmother, Phyllis Smith nee Holland and little bits just fall into place slowly!
(PS hi to both cousins too) ;)
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hi we have never spoken before i think the phyllis smith nee holland might be my gg grandads sister
Please get in touch, We must be related...
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sorry, it was my great grandfather not gg grandfather, Thomas Holland, sorry to mislead, he was married to Violet Annie Haywood in 1897, regards Glynn
(attatchment: Thomas Holland and Violet Annie Haywood)
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What a lovely picture, thanks for sharing it...Now I have something interesting here, I have checked my paper work, Isaiah Holland and Matilda Sherriff had I think 6 children, Phyllis ( my gr grandmother ), Thomas ( your gr grandfather) Benjamin, Isaiah, William and Beatrice, actually Beatrice married an Arthur Samuel Haywood. So to me looks like the Haywoods for travellers too, they did marry into family...
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According to family records Isaiah and Matilda had another four children , Vera , Adelaide,Jonas,and Henry all the information i have leads me to think they travelled the same root having 10 children in approx 17years,the places Isaiah plyed his trade as a brass brazier and cutler included Rugeley, Stoke,Brailsford, Litchfield , Uttoxetter,Abbots Bromley,Hanbury,and Church Gresley
Regards Glynn
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Yes, I do believe your are right, my grandparents lived for a while at the Park overseal, I was brought up in Linton, my other grandmother lived in Castle Gresley, I have records that I have found too, that coincided with what you are telling me, I still have cousins living in Burton, plus my dad in Winshill....he is the last brother alive out of 4 from the marriage of Phyliss's daughter to my grand dad....my tree is growing really good....I have Isaiah and Matilda has having 12 children...the most interesting part in my tree is Matilda was a Sherriff, she had Phyllis, Phyllis had Emily, ( my grandma) and she married a Sherriff.....so I am confused as to the Sherriff line, and that is the one I am most interested in.....
Thanks for getting back in touch....If you want to know anything and I can help, you only have to ask.....
regards Julie
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Just a bit of information that might help. A family of Sherriff's and a family of Holland's were camped at the outwoods in Burton when an incident took place involving three of the Sherriff's son's in the early 1900's. The lads were poaching on farmland when the farmer caught them, a fight started and the farmer and his son were chased off. The farmer came back with the local policeman and the fight continued, later the policeman died of his injuries. Hope Sherriff and Arkless Holland were later arrested for aiding the escape of the Sherriff lads.
regards Glynn
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Thanks for that information, very interesting....so do you have your tree published anywhere, I have mine on ancestory.co.uk....I am interested as to how you come into my tree, I know your gr grandfather, just wondered if I knew anymore of your family. regards Julie, you could email me....
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Hello All,
I have recently come across the name of Sherriff in a tree that I am researching on behalf of someone else although the information was originally given to me by someone on another site.
I am doing a tree primarily centred round the Hodgkins family who travelled in Worcs area and I've just linked a Patience Holland to them somehow.
Now, Patience (1794, Crayton) was apparently married first to a Thomas Hodgkins and had at least one son called Thomas (1821, Hillton, Leics) who married Unity (1820, Whittaker, Warks). Patience then married a Jonas Holland (1806, Tate Brook, Warks) and they had John, Joseph, Henry, Isaac, Jacob, Patience and Ezekiah.
There is a 1861 census at Bloxwich, Staffs which list Patience and Jonas Holland plus 16 other people but it's a heck of a confusing census list because only 5 of the total of 18 people have a Relationship noted for them. Jonas is Head, Patience is Wife, Thomas Hodgkins is 'Son of Patience', John Holland is 'Son of Patience' and then Unity is described as 'Wife of Thomas Hodgkins'. The rest of them have no description at all ans none of them are in much order of age or connection so it's very difficult to work out who is who.
Now then.... in 1881 there is a census recorded in Great Barr, Staffs in Travelling Vans.
Apart from a couple of Holland families mentioned, there is also a register of a John Sherriff (1848) as Head abiding with Patience Holland listed as Grandmother. Now, I've traced this John Sherriff down as a son of Jonas Sherriff (1819) and Jane ?? (1822).
What I don't know is the following...
Was Patience's maiden name Sherriff and this is a son she had before she married her first husband Thomas Hodgkins (he's older than the son I have registered to them as being born in 1821 so it is possible) or was he another son of her union with Thomas but just took her maiden name. Or was John's mother Jane a daughter of Patience and she then married a Sherriff.
Another possible Sherriff I have is Catherine (1800) married to Joseph Hodgkins (1781, Tredington, Worcs). I say 'possible' because the person who gave me the initial link to Sherriffs and Hodgkins believes that she was a Sherriff but I have nothing so far to back up his theory.
Joseph and Catherine had, amongst others, Job Hodgkins (1827, Exhall, Warks) who married Trainnet Hodgkins (1825, Tannot, Warks) and this is the line that I'm following for direct descendants. The connection between these two Sherriffs is that John Holland (1828, Braunton, Warks) s/o Jonas Holland & Patience married Sarah Hodgkins (1824, Braunton, Warks) d/o Joseph Hodgkins and Catherine which makes both mothers possible Sherriffs.
I can't see that any of these names fit in with the names already mentioned on this thread but I was hoping that someone could throw a light on the subject if they are connected to their lines in any way.
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Hi there, I have read your information, some of it sounds familiar to me but you see so many names when you are researching...I am sure I have some info on Patience Holland, I will look through my paperwork and get back to you.....
Regards Julie
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@ gemini250554
Thanks for such a quick response and I would be immensely grateful for anything you can add
Scally
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HI ya all
I am a direct off spring of Isaiah Holland & Matilda Sherriff via their youngest son Henry who was my grn. father, have records showing that they had 15 children which 11 lived.
Looking for futher info on any of the families, have very little on Phyliss & William Holland.
The holland famly married into many families i/e Smith, Hollyoke,Haywood, Elliott,Coxon, Horton, Whootton.
Get back to me @ (*) Roy Holland Canada
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Hi Lynden, I too have Isaiah & Matilda Sherriff on my tree. Phyliss Holland was my gt grandmother....regards Julie
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Hi Julie
Any info you can give reguarding Phyliss would be nice, have nothing but the 1891 c, have lots on the remaining family except Williamwhich I am pursuing.
Roy
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Hi Lynden, Please get back in touch if I can help in anyway, regards Julie
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I am the great grandson of Hope and Etty Sherriff and the grandson of John William Sherriff. I am researching my family tree and history,any comments or communication will be much appreciated.
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I am the great grandson of Hope and Etty Sherriff and the grandson of John William Sherriff. I am researching my family tree and any communication will be greatly appreciated.Thanks Chris
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I am the great grandson of Hope and Etty Sherriff and the grandson of John William Sherriff. I am researching my family tree and any communication will be greatly appreciated.Thanks Chris
Hello Chris
Hope and Etty (Trinity) were my gggg-uncle and aunt. I have a webpage here (http://www.garenewing.co.uk/family/hodgkins.html) with more detail on where I fit into the Sherriffs (I'm descended from Hope's older brother, Joseph).
Best wishes -
Garen
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Also of the sheriff descendants. Hope and etty being my gg grandad and grandmother.
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Hi All
I know this post hasn't been commented on in quite a few years but I stumbled across this forum and seeing as I am completely stumped thought perhaps someone would be able to help?
I was Sherriff before I got married and although my family tree has so far been based in Scotland I'm now stuck with the Sherriff line around the 1800's and cant seem to get any further back! I'm assuming that as Sherriff (especially the way it's spelt) is unusual, perhaps my family originated in England and moved to Scotland?
My last known record is of a James Sherriff (1818 - 1873?) who married a Katherine Westwater in 1846 - they were based in Fife. I have James father also as James Sherriff marrying a Janet Wishart but I can't get any further - no dates, nothing.
Any help would be majorly appreciated & if I'm thinking along the wrong lines just let me know.
Thanks, Aimie
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Hi All
I know this post hasn't been commented on in quite a few years but I stumbled across this forum and seeing as I am completely stumped thought perhaps someone would be able to help?
I was Sherriff before I got married and although my family tree has so far been based in Scotland I'm now stuck with the Sherriff line around the 1800's and cant seem to get any further back! I'm assuming that as Sherriff (especially the way it's spelt) is unusual, perhaps my family originated in England and moved to Scotland?
My last known record is of a James Sherriff (1818 - 1873?) who married a Katherine Westwater in 1846 - they were based in Fife. I have James father also as James Sherriff marrying a Janet Wishart but I can't get any further - no dates, nothing.
Any help would be majorly appreciated & if I'm thinking along the wrong lines just let me know.
Thanks, Aimie
My ancestors were from the same area, Dysart, Fife. There were Romani in Fife but they used local surnames sometimes too, so you could not say the surname Sherriff is exculsive to Romany. The name Sherriff started in England amongst the English and the spelling is all over the place. My earliest ancestor in Fife was married in 1667. To go back beyond the records at Scotlandspeople and the family search records I looked at old newspapers and asked for local help. With the brides surnames you mention I would start a thread in the Fife section of Rootschat.
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Whiteout7 - thanks for your reply, I'll give that a go!
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Hi there, Abraham sherriff was my great, grandad. His son Arthur was my great grandad and his daughter Rose was my nan.
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hi my grandad and grandma was Alfred sherriff and Emily smith had three sons peter George and Kenneth all past
i am George son Clive
they went round with smiths fair grandad running the .22 shooting dad coconut shy mum ball in the goldfish bowl before i was born
grandparents did live in a bus at rickmans corner overseal and i did go on the fruit picking they all so made pegs and grandma use to go round selling them in later life she when into a home in midway and grandad i think stayed with Kenneth for more info please contact
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This is a reply to page one post one on this thread
Hi all,i wondered if anyone was related to the Sherriff family from Warks & surrounding areas?My family line goes Reginald Sherriff B:1921 Warks...Matthew Sherriff B:1880 staffs m Annie Morgan 1900 Warks...Abraham Sherriff 1851 Chester m Delilah Smith 1850...William Sherriff 1814 Redditch m Mary Ann Tracey Boswell 1806 Leicestershire...Edward Sherriff abt 1779 m Mary Hart ...George Sherriff m Susannah Palmer....
Any info is greatly apprechiated!!
Thanks for reading.
Shaz :O)
Hi Susan is a far distand Cousin to me we both share fragments of ancient dna, Susan's father was Reginald Harold Sherriff 1921–1993 Nuneaton Warwickshire r.i.p who's father was Matthew Sherriff 1880–1950 Burton upon Trent Staffordshire who's father was Abraham Sheriff 1849–1925 Alsager, Yorkshire, who's father was William Sherriff 1812–1891 Redditch, Warwickshire, it looks like William may have come down from Edward Sherriff 1780William's wife was Mary Ann Tracy Boswell, 1799–1897 Loughborough, Leicestershire, Abrahams wife was Deliah Smith 1850–1930, Delilahs mother and father were Priscilla Smith 1824– Belper, Derbyshire, and Frederick Heap 1826–Snelston, Derbyshire, Reginald's mother was Annie MORGAN 19011-972 Alcester Warwickshire
Susan shares 44 dna matches with me who all descend down from the old Gipsy's, this is in the 1st to 6th range, there are old family names within the stated 44 such as the Holmes Lovell's Lees Wharton's Boswells Gray Smiths Young Adams Jeffery Anderson's Love Stanley plus many more, there will be many more at the 8th range, these only show up when you click on their individual names, there will be far more in the 6th to 8th range but you must hunt them down in a individual way for ancestry only bring together your shared clusters from 1st to 6th in the Cousin sequence
I also share dna with a male who descends down through the Booths on his male side his father is Hope Booth 1911-1958 r.i.p who's parents were Ephraim Booth 1884–1963 and Matilda Sheriff 1886– who is my matches grandmother, Ephraim Booths parents were Henry Booth 1864 - and Elizabeth Boyling 1864–1950, Henry Booths parents were Ephraim Clayton/Booth 1841–1910 and Diana/Dinah Booth 1836Elizabeth Boyling 1864–1950 parents were Absalom Boyling 1816-and Rebbecca Booth 1823–1888
Now back to Hope Booth 1911-1958 r.i.p well Hopes mother was Matilda Sheriff 1886– Matilda's parents are Hope Sheriff 1855–1934 and Trinity Boyling 1860-1937 Hope Sheriffs parents were
William Sheriff 1812–1891 and Mary Ann Tracey Boswell 1805–1897 Aka Tresi Boss descended from Haniel Bosswell 1583, Trinity Boyling 1860-1937 parents were also Absalom Boyling 1816- and Rebbecca Booth 1823–1888.
So it looks like these Sherriffs descend from the same family to which Susan's Sherriffs family come down from, Abraham and Hope must both be sons of William and Mary Ann there is also a mentioned Elizabeth Sherriff 1725–Sutton In Ashfield Nottinghamshire on my matches tree so she may be along with the old Edward Sherriff from the 1700s in some way or relation who may be Williams dad, Nellie Smith 1906–Sutton In Ashfield, Nottinghamshire r.i.p was the Mother of my dna match, Hope Booth 1911-1958 r.i.p was her husband, Nellie comes down through a long line of Smiths to a Jane Smith1727–1797, i do not know if these Smiths are of the Gipsy's but they are connected to family's like Thompson and Wildgoose, me and this male born with the above Sherriff ancestry both share dna with 24 dna match's with many of the names above but this time the Bucklands join this cluster.
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Hi all,sorry iv not been on here for abit.Iv kinda run out of steam on the Sherriff tree at the moment so been havin a break from it.
Garen,i think it was my uncle that got in touch with you (my auntys husband Roger).You have a great website,my trees on ancestory.Great newspaper clippings,i wouldnt even know where to start.Any tips would be greatly apprechiated!!!
Julie,in the Sherriff family many of the people named there kids after their siblings,so you will find there are probaly quite afew Abrahams etc.Its just trial and error in finding the right one.As Garen said,they changed names & intermarried,anyone older was called uncle & anyone the same age was brother or sister.Also sometimes they were born in one place but not registered until in another place or sometimes the births were registered in several districts.The Romanys of yonder deffinatly didnt make it easy for us to find them etc,lol!!!
I just wish my grandad was still alive to ask.
Shaz xxx
On page three of this thread above Roger is talked about well Roger managers Susan's Ancestry page and Susan is your Aunt, dna is not talked about in this day like a family tree but before the internet i listened to people talk about the black blood, this you had to have if you was from the Romany Gipsy's, you had to have this regardless of family or lifestile, you had to be of the black blood no matter what big or small, to me this is the true meaning of what people have been talking about, its all there in the dna clusters, it is not like them old tree rings that people search out for answers about how old a tree is its not like when the scientists crush up bones and date the dust of the dead, the dna in people living will tell you if the dead are alive in you in this day, its not like the halogroups that people looks for that tell of far of placers, the black blood gets past down through generations and is kept alive as long as it is alive, if you know you know if its in you its in you, when its gone its gone, by looking for cracks in science people may fool evan themselves into thinking they open an hidden door that lets them rejoin, i do not think that this is the black blood,
the black blood is what the old Gipsy's would talk about, someone once said that the Romany in this day know who is who for they themselves would know all the old names connected to the Gipsy's through family ties that others would not know, this is how they new who was who and who had the black blood in them now in this day the dna that is within all the Gipsy descendants in this day shows them who are the people who are left from the ancient peoples, its living dna not dead crushed bones or tree rings or long gone country's, the black blood is the living dna not the dead dna, the black blood doesn't mutate it is just passed down this is the only true line of the Romany Gipsy's, it may come from your Aunt, your Uncle, your great Gran or Grandad, it will be there if its there, no Gipsy alive or dead would ever say different, it as nothing to do with being a male or female, theres no mutations no secrete line to be uncovered there is no chalice there is only whats in you, when it runs out its out and gone, if its still in you just recognise it for what it is, you may not be of the Gipsy's in this day but know as true that the dead still live in you in this day for if you still carry what was given you are truly descended from them, my Mother said to me never michael to be afraid of the dead if they come to you just be having the talk to them, never be afraid just talk to them right, well this talk i just have had is the right true talk and I'm not afraid of the dead.
michael Leahcim...... this is my Ancestry name
I just wanted to show you this, well i am a far Cousin to this lady below named Lorraine her grand mother was Ellen Sheriff 1902–1982
who comes out of Thomas Holland there does not seam to be any more information that Lorraine knows, i think she is from the Gipsy's though for me and Lorraine both share dna with 12 people and each and every one of those 12 are ritch in Gipsy history we share no history through dna with no other peoples, these are the 12 below
Stanley Young Smith Seed Jeffery two Lovell's Hodgkin's Davidson Deese Boswell a Weddell who father was a Lovell and who as these ancestors in his tree
Duke Lee
1785–
Union Lee
1797–1880
Duanna (Diana) Lee
1785–
Elisha 'Rightdoer' Lee
1710–
Elisha 'Rightdoer' Lee1737–
Letitia Lee
1765–1802
Manfield Lee
1765–1835
so you see evan when someone as a name like Weddell that may not be known by anyone yet when you look into their dna as a family in dna you then start to learn, me and Weddell then go on to share 27 people who we both match to and each and every one of those 27 are from the Gipsy's, i have 17 thousand dna matches thoughout the world i have still not looked at thousands of these matches but so far i have over seven hundred people from the old Gipsy's worldwide who match through dna with me, over 20 now are from the Romany Gipsy of Europe, how i match to them is a mystery for they hold no British way dna as in ethnicity yet we share far ancestry in dna as dna.
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hi i know this is an old thread but il try my luck anyway. my names luke smith iv always been told i have roma blood and its about time i found out how. today i found out from a great auntie that the name smith is actually from my maternal line on my dads side and my real 2nd name is sherriff my great great grandad was called william sherriff and he was from around nottingham way? any info would be great thankyou
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Hello All,
I have recently come across the name of Sherriff in a tree that I am researching on behalf of someone else although the information was originally given to me by someone on another site.
I am doing a tree primarily centred round the Hodgkins family who travelled in Worcs area and I've just linked a Patience Holland to them somehow.
Now, Patience (1794, Crayton) was apparently married first to a Thomas Hodgkins and had at least one son called Thomas (1821, Hillton, Leics) who married Unity (1820, Whittaker, Warks). Patience then married a Jonas Holland (1806, Tate Brook, Warks) and they had John, Joseph, Henry, Isaac, Jacob, Patience and Ezekiah.
There is a 1861 census at Bloxwich, Staffs which list Patience and Jonas Holland plus 16 other people but it's a heck of a confusing census list because only 5 of the total of 18 people have a Relationship noted for them. Jonas is Head, Patience is Wife, Thomas Hodgkins is 'Son of Patience', John Holland is 'Son of Patience' and then Unity is described as 'Wife of Thomas Hodgkins'. The rest of them have no description at all ans none of them are in much order of age or connection so it's very difficult to work out who is who.
Now then.... in 1881 there is a census recorded in Great Barr, Staffs in Travelling Vans.
Apart from a couple of Holland families mentioned, there is also a register of a John Sherriff (1848) as Head abiding with Patience Holland listed as Grandmother. Now, I've traced this John Sherriff down as a son of Jonas Sherriff (1819) and Jane ?? (1822).
What I don't know is the following...
Was Patience's maiden name Sherriff and this is a son she had before she married her first husband Thomas Hodgkins (he's older than the son I have registered to them as being born in 1821 so it is possible) or was he another son of her union with Thomas but just took her maiden name. Or was John's mother Jane a daughter of Patience and she then married a Sherriff.
Another possible Sherriff I have is Catherine (1800) married to Joseph Hodgkins (1781, Tredington, Worcs). I say 'possible' because the person who gave me the initial link to Sherriffs and Hodgkins believes that she was a Sherriff but I have nothing so far to back up his theory.
Joseph and Catherine had, amongst others, Job Hodgkins (1827, Exhall, Warks) who married Trainnet Hodgkins (1825, Tannot, Warks) and this is the line that I'm following for direct descendants. The connection between these two Sherriffs is that John Holland (1828, Braunton, Warks) s/o Jonas Holland & Patience married Sarah Hodgkins (1824, Braunton, Warks) d/o Joseph Hodgkins and Catherine which makes both mothers possible Sherriffs.
I can't see that any of these names fit in with the names already mentioned on this thread but I was hoping that someone could throw a light on the subject if they are connected to their lines in any way.
Hi . I am currently researching this line and wondered if you have any further information on the parents of William Hodgkinson / Hodgkins. Married Elizabeth Mear .
Thanks
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Hi . I am currently researching this line and wondered if you have any further information on the parents of William Hodgkinson / Hodgkins. Married Elizabeth Mear .
Thanks
My theory is that it's William Hodgkinson and Eleanor Young, m. 1785; children including Elizabeth, Richard, William and Edward. Both William (1791) and Edward (1796) had daughters named Eleanor, and both Richard and William were b. Dudley. Edward married Sarah Mayer and William married Elizabeth Mear - I think both of these were daughters of Obadiah Mear/Mayer. Lots of connections with these families ... but all just tantalising theory so far :)
- Garen
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Hi . I am currently researching this line and wondered if you have any further information on the parents of William Hodgkinson / Hodgkins. Married Elizabeth Mear .
Thanks
My theory is that it's William Hodgkinson and Eleanor Young, m. 1785; children including Elizabeth, Richard, William and Edward. Both William (1791) and Edward (1796) had daughters named Eleanor, and both Richard and William were b. Dudley. Edward married Sarah Mayer and William married Elizabeth Mear - I think both of these were daughters of Obadiah Mear/Mayer. Lots of connections with these families ... but all just tantalising theory so far :)
- Garen
Do you have a date and place of birth for Obidiah please?
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From FreeREG:
St Michael Other Transcript . Lichfield . Staffordshire
Marriage: 27 Jul 1812 . William Hodgkins . Elizabeth Mear
Witnesses: Isaac Hodgkins . Joseph Slater
Notes: Bride, Groom and Witness 1 sign (X)
Any help?
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Do you have a date and place of birth for Obidiah please?
Not a definite one (a few candidates 1771-79). Marriage is Obadiah Mare and Sarah Blewer, Whitmore, Staffs, 1 Dec 1793. They had a daughter, Sarah 'May' (Trentham, 1797), who I think may be the wife of Edward Hodgkinson (possible/likely brother to William Hodgkinson). Other children were b. Trentham and Longton (Elizabeth claims to have been born Blurton, between Trentham and Longton - all very close).
Obadiah's grandson, also Obadiah Mayer (son of William and Ann), had as a witness on his 1852 marriage Caroline Blewer - very likely this is Caroline Hodgkinson who married John Bloor/Blewer - Caroline being the daughter of William Hodgkinson and Elizabeth Mear. And this Obadiah was a witness on the marriage of Charles Nield and Mary Ann Grundy.
Best - Garen.