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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Roscommon => Topic started by: corisande on Monday 21 September 09 19:50 BST (UK)
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Anyone able to add any more about these two Roscommon brothers, on either side of the divide during the Easter Rising 1916
Lieutenant Gerald Aloysius NEILAN 10th Battalion from Mount Harold Terrace, Dublin. Aged 34. Son of John Neilan, of Ballygalda, Roscommon.Killed 24 April 1916 at the Mendicity Institution on Usher Island. Buried at Glasnevin Cemetery. Shot by a sniper on Ushers Quay.
His younger brother Anthony NEILAN was taking part in the rising with the Volunteers and was deported to Knutsford Detention Barracks.
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maybe another sibling.
valentine neilan 13-2-1880 ballygaldy,roscommon,ire.
parents.john neilan & eva kelly.
regards mary.
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Mary
Thanks, that was very useful.
I had tried and failed to get them in1911 census in Roscommon. But trying Mary, the mpther in it now, I found her living at Mount Harold Terrace Dublin, and that is where Gerald Neilan had as his address on army information. The father was dead by 1911
So yes it would appear that Valentine was a brother
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Appears they married in Dublin in 1876 source: http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#p=home
John Neilan
Registration District: Dublin South
Date: 1876
Volume 7 Page 661
Eva Kelly {same registration details}
You could order marriage record from www.groireland.ie
Include the above information and a photocopy will only cost four euro. The form is not designed to include some of the information but include it where you can.
Also found few more births source: www.familysearch.org
Anne Neilan
10-Dec-1878 Roscommon
Daughter of John Neilan and Eva Kelly
John Neilan 30-Apr-1877 Roscommon
Son of John Neilan and Eva Kelly Kilteevan Roscommon
(another record on same website says Birth 1st May 1877 Baptised 6th May 1877)
Evalen Anna Neilan birth: 20th Feb 1880 Baptised: 27 Feb 1880 Kilteevan Roscommon
daughter of John Neilan and Eva Kelly (Evalen is another form of Valentine i think)
This appears to be Eva's death
Eva Neilan
Registration District: Dublin South
Jul-Sep 1930
Estimated Birth Year: 1857
Age 73
Volume 2 Page 199
Ger
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Evalen Anna Neilan birth: 20th Feb 1880 Baptised: 27 Feb 1880 Kilteevan Roscommon
daughter of John Neilan and Eva Kelly (Evalen is another form of Valentine i think)
More likely a form/mis-spelling of Evaleen/Evelyn.
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Thanks for that additional information - never fails to amaze me what is out there is you know where to look for it :)
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this i think is them on the 1901 census for roscommon.
john neilan head age 55 occ.farmer+justice of the peace. wife eva age 45. annie 22. mary 11. evelyn 8. arthur 6. leo 1. johannan cass 25 servant. mary anne mulvihill 25 sevant.
regards mary.
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Thanks Mary,
We are gradually putting their lives together
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There is a memorial plaque on the interior wall of the sacred heart church in Roscommon town in memory of a Neilan who was shot dead in Dublin during easter week while serving with the british army. Ballygalda is a townland a short distance outside the town on the galway road.
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Thanks for that info on the memorial, I'll try to get to see it when I am back in Ireland next year.
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You are welcome, I will send exact details of the inscription on the plaque in course.
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the elder brother, John Alexander Neilan (1877-1947), was a doctor with a practice in Seaham, Co Durham. He'd setup practice there with his cousin Dr Luke G Dillon. John qualified as a Dr in 1899. He didn't serve during WW1 as far as I known but was a Major in the Home Guard in Seaham.
Charles James Neilan (1886-1952) joined him in Seaham after serving in the RAMC (Lt) during WW1. He qualified as a Dr in 1909.
Alan Joseph Neilan (1888-1959) qualified as a Dr from the Royal College of Surgeons in June 1916 so in the vicinity when his 2 brothers were fighting it out. Joined the RAMC; reached rank of Captain according to his medal card.
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That's interesting - it looks as Anthony (the brother who was arrested by the British), was the "odd man out", in as much as the other seem to have been in the army.
They were Catholic. I appreciate that this does not have to mean that they were Republicans! The family appears to have been solidly middle class, which, one would assume is the reason for the army connection.
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The LDS British Isles Vital Records Index set of 16 CDs lists the baptism of three Neilan children. The LDS film includes baptismal sponsors. The LDS film is a photo copy of the baptismal register. The LDS films can be viewed worldwide, including the Dublin City Library.
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LDS film 868119 records the change of occupiers of land in Ballygalda (aka Trust) townland from 1854 to 1920.
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For details on Ballygalda townland and notes on “change of occupiers” visit
http://www.roscommonhistory.ie/People/JohnHunter/Notes.pdf
http://www.roscommonhistory.ie/People/JohnHunter/Index2.pdf
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John
Thanks
Perhaps I can get you to answer another question about that CD set. I have it, but stopped using it when so much LDS stuff went online
Question is "what does it have that online does not"?
Is it worth my while digging it out
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Arthur Neilan is at Clongowes school in the 1911 census aged 16 where Gerald was educated; there's a John Neilan from Roscommon too aged 15. Possibly a cousin or relation of some sort but unlikely to be a sibling(?) I would think. The eldest son John Alexander was also educated here.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Kildare/Balraheen/Castletown__or_Clongowes_/539762/
Anthony is missing on the 1901 census so possibility that he is there in 1901? No sign of him in the 1911 census so far either.
No sign of Leo Neilan after the 1901 census so far.
http://www.clongowes.com/
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And thanks for that extra information.
I started the thread as I was interested in Gerald Neilan, who was a Lt in 10th Royal Dublin Fusiliers.
My grandfather was also a Lt in RDF, and the day of the rising Gerald Neilan and my grandfather led a group of RDF from Royal (now Collins) Barracks to relieve Dublin Castle.
They were fired on from Mendicity Institute - Gerald Neilan was killed - my grandfather survived, got married and had a son (my father) such are the differences between life and death that lead to our existence!
I recently came across a diary onlineof one of the men inside the Mendicity Institute, posted by his grandson,
I have a page on the 10th Battalion and Lt Neilan's death here (http://www.dublin-fusiliers.com/battaliions/10-batt/campaigns/1916-10th-easter.html)
Any further info on that welcome too
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I am researching a John C Neilan, born about 1911 probably in Northern England. He went on to become a notable glider pilot and test pilot. One possibility is that he is the son of John Alexander Neilan who married Sybil Stuart Corbett in 1907. John is sadly no longer with us and was a colleague of mine when he was Chief Production Test Pilot of Britten-Norman on the Isle of Wight. We think his middle name was Charles (the first name of John the elder's brother and fellow doctor).
Has anyone researched the family of John Alexander?
Cheers
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John Charles Stuart Wortley Neilan appears to have been registered in Q1 1911, Easington, Durham. Date of birth 14th January 1911. Aero cert registered 1/9/1934; address Tempest House, Seaham Harbour, Durham.
Dr John Alexander Neilan died in Scarborough in 1947. He registered an aero certificate on the 24th November 1935 for the same plane as John C S W Neilan; same address as above.
The birth of Sybil Mary S Neilan was registered in Q3 1908 in Easington, Durham. Date of birth 23rd July 1908. She appears not to have married and died in Scarborough in 1995. The mother Sybil S Neilan appears to have died in Scarborough in 1954.
Gerald P Neilan's birth was registered in Q1 1918 in Easington, Durham. Mothers maiden name Corbett. Gerald Patrick Neilan died 5th June 1933. His gravestone can be seen at
http://www.fototime.com/ftweb/bin/ft.dll/detailfs?userid={07E767B9-6071-47FE-B9B9-DAC9E87A8215}&ndx=28&slideshow=0&AlbumId={3A315EDF-8E88-4861-8655-15F842968DC0}&GroupId={FE659845-C803-46E8-9CC6-DC7FFE07B593}&screenheight=800
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http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=37603704
Dr Alan Joseph Neilan died Wakefield, Yorkshire 1959. Tempest House, Seaham is his on his WW1 medal index card.
Eva Neilan (nee Kelly) died in Dublin, 1930.
Eva Mary Neilan married William Harriss in Easington, Durham Q1 1919
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The info on John Charles Neilan, aviator was much appreciated. I imagine Johnny that you have access to the Royal Aero Club pilot record cards and if so you were kind enough to give the date but I wonder if I might have the number of John's certificate and any detail of the aircraft and different levels of licence he achieved over time.
On a general point, I thought I saw somewhere that Hohn's father, John Alexander Neilan was one of seven children born to a John Neilan from Ballyglada, Roscommon, but can't put my hand on it. Any thoughts?
Cheers
Peter
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Hi guys.
I am working in the BBC in Belfast, putting together a programme proposal about the 1916 Rising for its 100th anniversary.
We're really interested in the Neilan brothers, and I was wondering if anyone knew any more. Especially about Arthur/Anthony - Corisande has done some fantastic work in putting together info on Gerald. Ideally, I'd send a PM or two, introducing myself, but I need to post a couple times more to be able to do that.
Would I get my knuckles rapped for posting a couple of times for the sake of it, so I could PM?
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It is often suggested! What do you need to know about the men? Family memories or family tree references?
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I've noticed them mentioned in passing in a number of different books or websites. I was wondering if anyone knew if there were any diaries or letters etc in any sources? Family memories would be fantastic. I have a broad-brushstrokes sense of the family - Catholic, middle-class, most joined British armed forces - and just would like to start digging down into their story.
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Right - as Arthur went to Clongowes which is still in existence you may find you can source information there as they are a school that tends to keep in touch with past pupils
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Many thanks. I've seen that Arthur/Anthony died in St Bircin's military hospital, and that he was still in the Irish Army. Is there a way to go digging there? I see on their website they say they will only respond to family requests for information.
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St. Bricin's is still in operation and is sitiated close to Heuston Railway Station
It is operated/ran by the military LINK (http://www.military.ie/army/organisation)
As it has remained in continuous military operation records may be available
other links
1901 Census return for the NEILAN family (http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Roscommon/Roscommon/Ballygalda/1669758/)
1911 Census for Eva and three children (http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Rathmines___Rathgar_West/Mount_Harold_Terrace/52148/)
1911 Census for Arthur (http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Kildare/Balraheen/Castletown__or_Clongowes_/539762/) There is also a John shown who is too young to be his brother, a cousin perhaps?
Marriage of John NEILAN and Eva KELLY (http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/5d55320026655)
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If anyone would have any ideas about surviving descendents (without over-stepping any bounds of privacy), I'm all ears...
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FYI, there are several threads re Gerald Neilan on the Great War Forum
http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=179917&hl=neilan
http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=164888&hl=neilan
Re tracing family, there is no family tree on Ancestry.
Arthur J Neilan (and an Annie Neilan) were still living in Mount Harold in 1939/40.
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According to the 1911 census Eva stated she had 12 children of whom 8 were still living;
I therefore deduce that the children of
John NEILAN (bc1845 died possibly 1903 Roscommon Oct-Dec V3 P203)and
Eva KELLY (bc 1855 died possibly Aug 10 1930 Dublin North Jul-Sep V2 P199)are,
subject to verification, the following:
1. John Alexander
b. Apr 30 1877 (Civil Reference: Roscommon 1877 V8 P392)
m. Sybil Stuart CORBETT in 1907 in Durham (Houghton le Spring District) 3 children
d. 1947 Seaham, Co. Durham
2. Anne
b. Dec 10 1878 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Oct-Dec 1878 V3 P314)
d. after 1959 as named in Alan’s will May 05 1961
3. Valentine/Eveleen
b. Feb 13 1880 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Jan-Mar 1880 V3 P352)
d. he possibly before 1911 as fourth child who had died prior to 1911 census
4. Gerald Aloysius
b. 1881 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Apr-Jun 1881 V3 P353)
d. Apr 24 1916 of Seaton View, New Seaham, Co. Durham according to his will
5. George Patrick
b. 1883 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Apr-Jun 1883 V3 P317)
d. 1885 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Jan-Mar 1885 V3 P270)
6. Charles James
b. 1886 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Oct-Dec 1886 V3 P268)
m. Dorothy Forster SMITH 1928 possible 3 children
d. Sep 10 1952 of Brackloon, Dawdon, Seaham, Co. Durham according to his will
7. Allen/Alan Joseph
b. 1887 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Oct-Dec 1887 V3 P259)
d. Jan 09 1959 of 17 Tanfield Street, Leeds; died at Pinderfields Hospital
8. Mary Geraldine
b. 1890 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Apr-Jun 1890 V3 P281)
d. after 1911: possibly 1919 Jan-Mar Dublin South V2 P782
9. Eva Mary (Evelyn)
b. 1892 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Jul-Sep 1892 V3 P250)
m. 1919 William HARRISS Eastingham Durham; no obvious children on online records
d. after 1959 as named in Alan’s will: possibly 1964 in Kensington, London
10. Arthur James
b. 1895 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Apr-Jun 1895 V3 P259)
d. after 1939: possibly Nov 24 1944 Oct-Dec 1944 Dublin South V2 P197
11. Leo Kelly
b. 1899 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Jul-Sep 1899 V3 P241)
d. Jul 15 1905 (Civil Reference: Dublin South Jul-Sep 1905 V2 P430)
12. Elizabeth (Elsie) Teresa
b. 1902 (Civil Reference: Roscommon Apr-Jun 1902 V3 P259)
d. Mar 23 or 28 1908 (Civil Reference: Dublin South Apr-Jun 1908 V2 P503)
There is an A. Neilan of 4 Mount Herald Tce, Harold’s Cross named
in the The Weekly Irish Times, Sinn Fein Handbook Easter 1916
I believe that this refers to Arthur
Anthony - I cannot locate a birth or death and I believe that the reference here is perhaps an error
modified to include dates of death from gravestone link
Thanks johnny_doyle
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the deaths of Anne, Elsie, Leo and Arthur are all listed on the gravestone as well as Gerald
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=pv&GRid=37603704&PIpi=65586818
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Reference was made at the start of this topic to Neilans' first cousin Dr. Luke DILLON
The connection to Gerald NEILAN is that his Aunt, Maria NEILAN, married Charles Blake DILLON who was from a well known Roscommon family Details of DILLON family (http://books.google.ie/books?id=zpR6uNPmV1EC&pg=PA123&lpg=PA123&dq=%22john+neilan%22+stonepark&source=bl&ots=vozhguzcuR&sig=zHt7sSS_9YJ5nMnzPQOxCr6gb2c&hl=en&sa=X&ei=McIgUef6Js2KhQe9ioDAAw&ved=0CEgQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=%22john%20neilan%22%20stonepark&f=false)
Dr. Luke Gerald DILLON (http://www.thepeerage.com/p3415.htm#i34141) which has links to the present family
On Eva Kelly's side; her parents were John KELLY and Maria O'CONOR; I believe that the Dewar name shown on the marriage record on Irish Genealogy is a transcript error. The witnesses at Eva's marriage were her sister and her husband to be Alice KELLY and Thomas SHEIL (http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/c40bab0068751); note typo again of RELLY when they married in 1880! Thomas was a Justice of the Peace in Roscommon and is shown in Thoms and Slater directories. They had at least 7 children; Thomas died in 1896; I found no record for Alice's death. Three of their boys are in boarding school in Castleknock in 1901 but I can only find two into adulthood - Cecil Patrick b.1881 d.1950 Cheshire unmarried; his will refers to his elder brother Thomas John b. Dec 16 1880 a retired bank manager.
Eva's brother John married Julia BURKE in 1880 and remained in Essex Lawn; he died c1894; Julia on 1901 census (http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Roscommon/Roscommon/Clooneybeirne/1669824/) and Julia on 1911 census (http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Roscommon/Roscommon_Rural/Clooneybeirne/783528/)
Son George Alexander is a Lieut AVC in Aldershot in 1911 when his sister Gertrude married (http://www.roscommonpeople.ie/itemdetail.asp?itemID=17150&menu=d17150)
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George Alexander Kelly finished WW1 as a Major and WW2 as a Colonel(temporary Brigadier). Retired in 1947 and allowed to use the rank Brigadier.
http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/38152/supplements/6071/page.pdf
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=54418434
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Reference J. C. Neilan:
I own 2 maps which belonged to J.C Neilan, which I have owned for about 18 years.
If anyone is interested in contacting me about these, please ring Mervyn on: (*) or (*), because I am interested in knowing more about J. C. Neilan's history, & am happy to share any information that I have.
Thank you very much.
(*) Moderator Note: phone numbers removed in accordance with Rootschat posting guidelines
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I didn't realise it would remove the numbers... Please email me & I'll send them to you.
Moderator Note: email address also removed- please read Posting Guidelines in Help pages and use PM (Personal Message) to exchange such details