RootsChat.Com
Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Inverness => Topic started by: madfrankie23 on Saturday 16 January 10 22:27 GMT (UK)
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Hi, as per usual with this stuff i've hit a wall, in the Inverness area....i'm trying to find a John Fraser from either Dores(one document says Strathglass??) or Congash...both born around 1846 - 1848...both left in their twenties, spent a wee while in Glasgow and ended up in S Wales, where i am...any help would be gratefully received
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Hi madfrankie23
Welcome to Rootschat ;D
Both born around 1846-1848
Both left (Inverness) in their 20's
Both then spent time in Glasgow
Both ended up in South Wales
Are there definitely two John FRASERs who followed that path?
Cheers
AMBLY
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Hi and welcome to Rootschat
It would be much better if you got the marriage cert for John which would show his fathers name and occupation
There is this entry on the Scottish 1851 for Dores Inverness - all b Dores except where shown otherwise
James Fraser 42 carpenter
Catherine 36 b Boleskin
Catherine 10
Flora 8
John 5
James 3
Donald 1
Catherine McRae 16 b Inverness
Finlay McGillivray 20 b Daviot - apprentice
Dores ED 567 Page13 Line 21
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Hi Ambly, thanks for the reply....and the welcome x...they both fit the first 2 criteria but only one went on to Glasgow and then S Wales...thats where i'm stuck :-\
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Which is why you need the marriage cert for the one who ended up in S Wales
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Which is why you need the marriage cert for the one who ended up in S Wales
yeah i've done that...but the trouble is where it says place of birth it just says 'strattigay', someone has obv misread it, so theres no Congash or Dores...hence the problem...thanks fer the welcome btw x
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Hi again
If you have the marriage cert, can you give us the full details from it of the couple, including who is the groom's father and what was his occupation.
If you have your John, definitely, on any census - can you tell us the details of those so we can have a look? Maybe we can start from Wales and work back....
Cheers
AMBLY
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but the trouble is where it says place of birth it just says 'strattigay'
If he married in Wales or England - no birthplace would be shown, only his address at the time of the marriage
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sorry, my mistake...that was from the welsh census...thats the prob i have and the marriage cert was no help at all
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and the marriage cert was no help at all
Did it have a fathers name and occupation on it.
Can you give us ALL the info you already have (ie) census and marriage cert so we have everything upfront
He was single in 1871 living in Aberdare but I can't see him in 1881/91 in Wales
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i'll get back to you on that, its late and im working tomorrow...thanks you for your interest and help xxx
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Hi
Look forward to hearing back from you - We'd really like to help ;D ;D Often suprising what a combined Rootschat effort can find!
But for us to do that, I can only re-iterate what Carole has said.......We need you to share the full details of what you already know to be your John
For what it's worth I think the pob of the John FRASER 24, unm, Draper, in Aberdare 1871 - is written as Strathglary
Cheers
AMBLY
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Is this him in 1901 in Glamorgan
John Fraser 57 b Scotland traffic ? iron works
Elizabeth 56 b Glyn Heath/Neath Glam
Rees G 25 b Glyn Heath/Neath Glam
James 23 b Glyn Heath/Neath Glam
Margaret 18 b Scotland
RG13 Piece 4981 Folio 26 Page 43
Looks like he was in Scotland between censuses
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1881 for Glasgow
John Fraser 35 b Dores Inverness stock taker
Elizabeth 37 b England
Catherine 7 ditto
Rees Griffith Fraser 5 ditto
James 3 ditto
Glasgow Govan ED 20 Page 18 Line 17
1891 for Cambuslang indexed as Traza
John 42 b Boleskine Inverness - stock taker
Elizabeth 44 b Wales
Catherine 17 Wales
Rees Griffith 15 Wales
James 13 Wales
Margaret Hannah 8 b Glasgow
Thomas Connor 21 lodger b Glasgow
Cambuslang ED 14 Page 29 Line 14
Because of the variation in his birthyear and birthplace - there are too many 1851 entries that could match without knowing who his father was
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1881 for Glasgow
John Fraser 35 b Dores Inverness stock taker
Elizabeth 37 b England
Catherine 7 ditto
Rees Griffith Fraser 5 ditto
James 3 ditto
Glasgow Govan ED 20 Page 18 Line 17
1891 for Cambuslang indexed as Traza
John 42 b Boleskine Inverness - stock taker
Elizabeth 44 b Wales
Catherine 17 Wales
Rees Griffith 15 Wales
James 13 Wales
Margaret Hannah 8 b Glasgow
Thomas Connor 21 lodger b Glasgow
Cambuslang ED 14 Page 29 Line 14
Because of the variation in his birthyear and birthplace - there are too many 1851 entries that could match without knowing who his father was
Carole, thank you so much for all the work you have done, it is very much appreciated, i cannot thank you enough....yes i believe this is him because i know that the james fraser mentioned is definately my great-grandfather....but as you can see there seems to be inconsistancies between the information...for instance, why has he changed his place of birth?...as things stand i believe the john fraser i am looking for was born in Dores, son of James Fraser and Catherine Fraser (nee Chisholm), about 1846/47...but because of the aforementioned changes in birth location i'm not sure how i can prove this...and i cannot find a birth certificate for him, even though he is mentioned in the 1851 census as being born in Dores...anyway, i can only thank you again for the obvious effort you have put in.
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Hi
Look forward to hearing back from you - We'd really like to help ;D ;D Often suprising what a combined Rootschat effort can find!
But for us to do that, I can only re-iterate what Carole has said.......We need you to share the full details of what you already know to be your John
For what it's worth I think the pob of the John FRASER 24, unm, Draper, in Aberdare 1871 - is written as Strathglary
Cheers
AMBLY
Yes Ambly, i am amazed and so thankful with the help i have received, thank you ......and yes that is a problem, if this is the john fraser i'm looking for why is the place of birth different?...it is so frustrating
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Is this him in 1901 in Glamorgan
John Fraser 57 b Scotland traffic ? iron works
Elizabeth 56 b Glyn Heath/Neath Glam
Rees G 25 b Glyn Heath/Neath Glam
James 23 b Glyn Heath/Neath Glam
Margaret 18 b Scotland
RG13 Piece 4981 Folio 26 Page 43
Looks like he was in Scotland between censuses
yes this is him...
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Re: place of birth
Are Boleskine & Dores very close together or the same parish etc?
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You still haven't told us what John Fraser's fathers name and occupation was on his Welsh marriage cert.
Come on - don't keep us in suspense any longer .................
If it was James and he was a carpenter - then the 1851 entry I posted way back up the board is the right family
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You still haven't told us what John Fraser's fathers name and occupation was on his Welsh marriage cert.
Come on - don't keep us in suspense any longer .................
If it was James and he was a carpenter - then the 1851 entry I posted way back up the board is the right family
ok firstly there's a place called Easter Boleskine? which is on the west bank of loch ness and is about 6 miles away from Dores....secondly, i have just got john fraser's marriage cert, married elizabeth griffiths when he was 26, in 1873, and his occupation looks like 'weigher in ironworks...his father, james fraser, is listed as a joiner!
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Bingo - so he is the one on the 1851
Here's the 1861 for Dores (did you notice that mum Catherine was b Boleskine in 1851)
All b Dores except Catherine
James Fraser 52 carpenter
Catherine Fraser 45 b Boleskine
Catherine Fraser 18
John Fraser 14
James Fraser 12
Donald Fraser 10
William Fraser 8
Jessie Fraser 6
Elizabeth Fraser 4
Dores ED 3 Page 10 Line 14
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son of James Fraser and Catherine Fraser (nee Chisholm), about 1846/47
Where did you get Catherine's maiden name from?
See 1851 census entry re: daughter Catherine - then this submitted IGI entry
CATHERINE FRASER Birth: 01 SEP 1841 Christening: 24 SEP 1841 Dores, Inverness Father: JAMES FRASER Mother: CATHERINE CAMERON
Extracted record
JAMES FRASER Spouse: CATHARINE CAMERON Marriage: 12 DEC 1839 Boleskine, Inverness
Submitted entry - some differences
JAMES FRASER Spouse: CATHERINE CAMERON Marriage: 11 DEC 1839 Dores, Inverness
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son of James Fraser and Catherine Fraser (nee Chisholm), about 1846/47
Where did you get Catherine's maiden name from?
See 1851 census entry re: daughter Catherine - then this submitted IGI entry
CATHERINE FRASER Birth: 01 SEP 1841 Christening: 24 SEP 1841 Dores, Inverness Father: JAMES FRASER Mother: CATHERINE CAMERON
Extracted record
JAMES FRASER Spouse: CATHARINE CAMERON Marriage: 12 DEC 1839 Boleskine, Inverness
Submitted entry - some differences
JAMES FRASER Spouse: CATHERINE CAMERON Marriage: 11 DEC 1839 Dores, Inverness
Carole, firstly thank you again for your efforts, i can't tell you how much i appreciate your help........ok, i was recently contacted by a relation who is researching our family, she found the dores connection...she also did a search for james and catherine's wedding certificate and sent us what she found.....' 1838 Nov 20th James Fraser Carpenter to Catherine Chisholm.. ***'...pls note the *** signifies a place name i simply cannot read...seems like Achleuthan?
PS if i may draw on your experience, do you think we need to find a birth certificate for John Fraser to be 100% certain all this is correct?
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This is the submitted IGI entry
JAMES FRASER Spouse: CATHERINE CHISHOLM Marriage: 20 NOV 1838 Glenmoriston, Inverness, Scotland
If you do a parent search on the IGI (see below) it shows a number of submitted entries but no births in Dores/Boleskine
PARENT SEARCH ON IGI
www.familysearch.org - On home page - click on “Advanced Search” to the right of the SEARCH button
Select “International Genealogical Index” from the left hand menu
Input fathers name and surname and mothers name and surname (Chisholm)
REGION – select British Isles from the menu
COUNTRY – select Scotland
COUNTY (will appear when you select COUNTRY) – select Inverness
Click SEARCH
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This is a little strange. I've not been doing family history stuff for some time but I think madfrankie and I might be quite closely related.
This is what I have (capital letters show that I'm not sure yet but it's looking promising):
James Fraser c1808
James was born to JOHN and JANET in Dores, Invernesshire on 18 FEBRUARY 1808.
He married Catherine CAMERON/CHISHOLM from Dores, Invernesshire on 11 December 1839 in Boleskine. They lived at Duhallow.
They had eight children: Catherine, Flora, John, James and Donald, William, Jessie and Elizabeth
James was a carpenter and by 1851 he had taken on an apprentice, 20 year old Finlay McGillivray from Dores.
They had one servant, 16 year old Catherine McCrae also from Dores.
John Fraser c1847
John was born to James Fraser, a joiner, and Catherine Cameron/Chisholm in Dores, Invernesshire, Scotland on around 1846/47.
He had two older sisters: Catherine and Flora; three younger brothers: James, Donald and William; and two younger sisters: Jessie and Elizabeth
John grew up in Dores until his early 20s when he left to be a traffic weigher in various iron works in Wales and Scotland
John met Elizabeth Griffith in Glynneath where they married on 16 May 1873 and lived together on Oddfellows Stret.
John and Elizabeth had four children.
His first three children: Catherine, Rees Griffith (named after Elizabeth’s father) and James were born in Wales. However, the family moved to Tradeston Street (then Dale Street) in Glasgow city centre in the early 1880s and this is where Margaret was born in 1883.
By 1891 the family had moved out of the city to Westburn Drive in an area of Glasgow called Cambuslang, where they had a lodger.
By 1901 the family was back in Wales and living in 7 Sanquhar Street in Cardiff but by this time Catherine was no longer living at home DON'T KNOW IF SHE MARRIED/DIED/OTHER.
James Fraser
James was born to John Fraser and Elizabeth Griffith on Christmas Eve 1877 in Landore, Plasmarl, north of Swansea.
By his third birthday he had been moved to Glasgow with his older siblings: Catherine and Rees Griffith (named after Elizabeth's late father).
James lived in Scotland from infancy until his early 20s when the family returned to Wales, this time to Cardiff. He followed his father as a weigher.
James met Sarah Ann Allen at some time around 1905 with their son John James Allen being born around this time. They got married a few years later on Christmas Day, the day after James’ 31st birthday in 1909 by which time he had become a yard foreman.
By 1911 James, Sarah and their son John were living at 36 Singleton Road in Splott.
Their second son, Hector was born four years later.
Hector was my grandfather (although he died before I was born).
If you would like to get in touch
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Hi Seanc,
I am very sorry but your reply to Madfrankie23 has sadly bounced back to us, it looks like they have changed email address :-\
I have tried googling the information given when registering but sadly I have not managed to find an alternative way of contacting this user.
I have removed your email address as this how spammer collect addresses, any user can contact you by replying to your posts or by sending you a private message.
Regards
Sarah