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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Perthshire => Topic started by: mygirlbill on Thursday 25 February 10 21:48 GMT (UK)
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I have very little info on this couple. John was apparently born in Breadalbane Perthshire between 1805 and 1820. He married Temperance Perkins date and place unknown. Their first child was Robert Perkins Campbell birthdate unknown, place Breadalbane, Perthshire. John and Temperance came out to Australia with at least 3 of their children that I know of and they being Robert Perkins, John Edwin and Frederick Foster Campbell. Have no idea when they came out to Australia or on which ship. I have been led to believe that Frederick was born in 1838 so it had to be sometime after that. Can anyone advise me how to move along with the minimal information that I have. Any help no matter how small would be so much appreciated. Many thanks in advance. mygirlbill
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Hi mygirlbill
How certain are you on the locations and names? It is just that particularly with the name of Temperance Perkins I'm not sure if their origins are in Scotland :-\
I also think that Temperance may have been Temperance Perkins Stevens.
There is this for example http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=derwood&id=I62680
There are also a number of Ancestry Trees on the line of a John "Tinker" Campbell and Temperance Perkins Stevens where the children show as:
John Edwin Campbell b. 1834 in Queensland, Australia, d. 1898
Rebecca Elizabeth Campbell b.1836 in Queensland, Australia -
Frederick Foster Campbell b. 1838 in Queensland, Australia, d. 1893
Robert Perkins Campbell b. 1844 in Cudgegong River, New South Wales, Australia, d. 1916
Monica :)
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There is also this link which seems to work back on Temperance's line http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=AHN&db=derwood&id=I38653
Monica
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Wow!! WOWEEE!! Thank you so much Monica for the info. I'm absolutely delighted. Yes it is the same family alright but it would seem that I have been given the wrong information as to where the children were born etc. As I mentioned earlier, I was told that the first 3 sons were all born in Breadalbane and that their 4 daughters, Emma, Bessy, Rebecca and Clara were all born in Queensland somewhere. I am not a subscriber to Ancestry but I'll check out the sites that you send me and see what I can find out. I've got a start and will now see what I can find out. Also, from where in Scotland did ships leave to come to Australia or did ships only leave from England? I may just browse the net and see what I can find. Once again, many, many thanks. Very grateful. mygirlbill
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I can't seem to locate the Ancestry online family tree of John Tinker Campbell and Temperance Perkins Stevens. Does it say where they were born? If they are the very same couple born in the U.S. then I will have to change my research to that area and try to find out if this couple came to Australia sometime in the 1840's. The plot thickens.........cheers. mygirlbill
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Hi
The family trees information does seem to indicate that John and Temperance were from the US (although one tree has John being born in Nova Scotia) but marriage dates all see to correspond.
You need to have a subscription to Ancestry to access the member submitted family trees which explains why you are not able to access them unfortunately. Do your state libraries have the Ancestry library access that perhaps you could take advantage of?
Would the family have come through the UK before heading off to Australia? Would they not have sailed directly there from the US perhaps?
If I can give you some suggestions. It might be worthwhile putting up two new posts here on RC. One on the Australian board and the other in US board. This way, people with access to more relevant resources could hopefully find more on the family. If you put links on any new post to any other related posts, such as this one, then people can see what has been found to date and work from there - always helps :)
Monica
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Mygirlbill
I have been researching the family tree of John 'Tinker' Campbell and Temperance Perkins Campbell (nee Stevens). My family is descended from their son, Robert Perkins Campbell.
The dates that I have are as follows:
John 'Tinker' Campbell
b. 1808 - Cape Elizabeth, Maine.
d. 08 Dec 1877 - Cleveland, QLD
Temperance Perkins Campbell
b. 09 Feb 1809 - Brooksville, Hancock, Maine
d. 14 Dec 1877 - Cleveland, QLD
I have a marriage date for the couple in Cape Elizabeth on 29 Oct 1833. Family members have recrods which indicate that they emigrated from Halifax, Nova Scotia to Sydney, Australia in 1833 on the MicMac.
There are certainly some records in Australia especially NSW, but I am still not sure if the birth certificates relate to registering their births as opposed to birth dates.
Happy to keep in contact - are you able to outline your connection to John Tinker Campbell - I am going to New York and then onto Maine next month and hope to get some recods on John Campbell and the marriage certificate of the couple.
BT
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Mygirlbill
Just a point of clarification - my research indicates that the Campbell family starting with John and Temperance had three boys and one girl. These include John Edwin, Frederick Foster, Robert Perkins and Rebecca Elizabeth.
I am also not sure if you are working backwards from here or moving forward down the family tree. I have been researching the family tree forwards - there is a fair amount of information on Temperance's family going back, if you research the family Perkins in Castine, Maine. There is a museum there - Wilson Museum - that includes the Perkins House. Temperance was the daughter of Major Thomas Stevens and Rebecca Elizabeth Perkins, and REP came from a large familly.
As for going backwards from John 'Tinker' Campbell, the family has been unable to get any records going back from him. I hope to get something when I travel to Maine next month. Check this website out for John Tinker Campbell - http://adbonline.anu.edu.au/biogs/A010188b.htm
I have done some major research on the descendants of the Campbell's who eventually resided in Moreton Bay, Queensland (just off Brisbane) and married into Aboriginal families from North Stradbroke Island, namely Robert Perkins Campbell married Rose Gonzalles. Rose's father was Fernando Gonzalles, a Spanish emigrant from the Phillipines. Robert Perkins Campbell had 10 children and there a fair amount of family on Stradbroke Island, Brisbane and around Australia (and I daresay the world) that can describe their heritage back to Robert and Rose Campbell.
The other sisters that you mention - Emma, Bessy, Rebecca and Clara - I am not sure if this is correct. There is a photo which I have attached - and the caption should read - Back row (L-R): John Edwin Campbell, Robert Perkins Campbell, Frederick Foster Campbell Second Row: Emma Enoch, Bessie Burke, Rosy Campbell with daughter Syliva in her arms, Rebecca Campbell, Clara Thomson. Boy in sailor suit is Les Thomson. Front row: Charlie Campbell, Bob Campbell, Fred Campbell. The photo includes the wife of Robert Perkins Campbell, Rose, and includes the majority of her children. Her daughter, Rebecca sistting beside her is my great grandmother.
Hope this helps you...
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Hi
The family trees information does seem to indicate that John and Temperance were from the US (although one tree has John being born in Nova Scotia) but marriage dates all see to correspond.
You need to have a subscription to Ancestry to access the member submitted family trees which explains why you are not able to access them unfortunately. Do your state libraries have the Ancestry library access that perhaps you could take advantage of?
Would the family have come through the UK before heading off to Australia? Would they not have sailed directly there from the US perhaps?
If I can give you some suggestions. It might be worthwhile putting up two new posts here on RC. One on the Australian board and the other in US board. This way, people with access to more relevant resources could hopefully find more on the family. If you put links on any new post to any other related posts, such as this one, then people can see what has been found to date and work from there - always helps :)
Monica
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Hi There,
I'm a descendant of Robert Perkins Campbell and (son of John & Temperance Campbell) and Rosey Gonzalles.
There is much information available about Temperance Perkins Stevens but very little about John (known in Australia as "Tinker" as a way of distinguishing him from the many migrants of the same name. My family's records show:
John (Tinker) Campbell
b. 1808 Westbrook across the bay from Portland (Maine) USA, the son of a Scottish emigrant named John Campbell
1821 migrated to Halifax in Nova Scotia, Canada. (As he would have only been around 13 years of age it is likely that the family migrated to Nova Scotia)
NB As there was a branch of the Perkins family in Liverpool, NS, it is likely that John met Temperance through visiting her second cousins living there.
m. 1833 Married TEMPERANCE PERKINS STEVENS At Cape Elizabeth near Westbrook, Maine, USA, on Oct 29. She was the daughter of Thomas & Elizabeth Stevens. Thomas Stevens' parents were Jushia Stevens, B. Townsend, Maine, in 1743, died Kingsborough, Maine in 1817. Mother was Mary Lawrence of Groton, Maine, daughter of Thomas Lawrence b. 1720 d. 1758 at Lake George in French/Indian war & Sarah Houghton. Elizabeth Stevens was b. Mar 8 1772 the daughter of John & Phoebe Perkins.
1833 John Campbelll purchased two brigs the Micmac and the Elizabeth Palmer
1834 John & Temperance's first son John born May 1 in USA.
1834 The Micmac arrives in Sydney from Liverpool (NS) on Sept 15.
John Tinker Campbell was a well known character whose exploits post 1834 have been well recorded. He wrote his memoirs later in life.
:) Coonungi.
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Link for google books
http://books.google.co.uk/books?q=John+Tinker+Campbell+&btnG=Search+Books
Regards, Steve :)
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Hi Steve, Thanks for the link. Most of the items offer superficial or erroneous treatment of the facts in the interests of controversy. Aside from that, can you tell me more about the thumbnail image "Capt. Bob" that you provided? :)
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For people researching John and Temperance Perkins Campbell, the following was found at the Maine Historical Society in Portland.
Marriage Intention - obtained on 13 July 1833 - John Campbell of Halifax and Temperence Stephens Marriage on 14 August 1833 - John Campbell of Nova Scotia and Temperence Stephens.
Sources found in Vital Statistics Brooksville Main 18217 - 1837
Therefore the 29 October 1833 date used by some as the marriage date is incorrect. The marriage certificate and marriage intention have recorded that John Campbell is from Halifax in one, and Nova Scotia in the other.
There are no records of John 'Tinker' Campbell being born in
* Cape Elizabeth (checked at the South Portland County Clerks Office - no records)
* Westbrook (Westbrook Historical Society - no mention of any Campbell family in the area until the 1900s.)
Researchers should note this in their records and concentrate on other potential places of birth.
As for records relating to Nova Scotia (ie emmigrating, the purchase of two brigs, Mic Mac and Elizabeth Palmer, birth of John Edwin Campbell), then I have no further information on these. I daresay Coonungi may have records to confirm these.
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The evidence collected by BT shows that the information sourced from Perkins, Thomas Alan (1947) Jacob Perkins of Wells and his Descendants, Haverhill, Mass, p. 20 is unreliable. This may be the case also with the other information - i.e., the dates for JTC's birth, migration to Nova Scotia, the purchase of the brigs, and his arrival in Australia that I have provided, as it all came from the same informant ...
So we are back to square one.
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mygirlbill
After reading the emails that you have sent me on here I will contact you directly from here in relation to the family tree and we can continue our conversations from there.
Talk to you soon KM!
BT
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Hi Ben! Could you please contact me on my private addy as I now finally have received heaps of new information regarding the Campbells. (I've lost your email addy) Talk to you soon. Regards mygirlbill
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Hi mygirlbill
Just getting into John "Tinker" Campbell. This is for the reason that he apparently convinced my great-great-grandfather, Increase Robinson Bell, and one George Balser, to accompany him on a voyage to Sydney, Australia. Campbell is listed as a merchant and together with his wife and boy child they had a cabin on the Brig "Mary" from Rio de Janeiro via Capetown and Hobart. Increase and George were in steerage and there were 35 boxes of tin listed as belonging to the Campbells. Increase and George were trained whitesmiths specialising in tin. :) The "Mary" arrived in Sydney on 26th July 1835. All 3 had connections with Nova Scotia and New England. Increase left a verbal history that they struck severe weather and crew illness between New England and Rio. This may account for the change to a "commercial" brig at Rio. Have more if you are still needing it
Dolphinrim
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Thank you for all that great information received by email!!!
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My Great Great Grandfather, Richard Power Cummins (Cummings) arrived in Port Jackson aboard the brig Mary on 26 July 1835. He travelled steerage with among others, Increase Robinson Bell plus Mr and Mrs Campbell and child travelled in cabin.
The only information I have on R P Cummins' place of origin is via his marriage certificate which states he came from British America. No knowledge of his parents or specific birth date ( approx 1812)
Increase Robinson Bell was a witness to his wedding and I can only assume they struck up a friendship on the voyage to Sydney. He wasn't involved in tin industry.
I have seen press reports that the Mary commenced her voyage to Sydney in Reo de Janeiro. But I also have found where that ship also visited the ports in Baltimore and Norfolk-Portsmouth, Virginia about same time (i.e. Jan 1835).
I am looking for any leads which may direct me to the port where R P Cummins may have commenced his journey.
I have seen somewhere that some of the passengers on the Mary originally started their voyage aboard the Micmac but it ran into trouble at/near Reo de Janeiro and they then had to swap to the Mary.
Would appreciate any help you may be able to offer.
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Hi! Not sure that I can help you all that much however, if you PM me your email addy, I will send you the files that I was send regarding John Campbell's journey to Australia. I notice that you have only done the one post so far. I believe that you have to make at least 2/3 before you can PM. So to be on the safe side, do another 2. and then PM me your email addy.
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Thanks for that offer mygirlbill.
I have now done 3 extra posts on another family member so will now learn how to send private message with contact details
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Hi obyone
I am a great-great-grandson of Increase Robinson Bell and my brother has extensively researched his origins. It is of great interest that he was a witness at your relative's marriage. I will send supporting documents if you can send me your e-mail as to mygirlbill. In essence it appears that John "Tinker" Campbell came from Halifax Nova Scotia, to Sydney via Hobart in the MicMac in 1834, financing his trip by selling his cargo of American clocks. Apparently clocks were in very short supply in Australia. He 'sussed out' the new colony and found that land was to be had for very little or nothing at the outskirts of the new colony. My understanding is that he returned to Halifax or Boston and sold the MicMac. He had obtained the patent to a tin plate pressing machine and so came back to Australia to arrive on the Brig Mary on 26 July 1935.
John Campbell is said to have come from USA - Westbrook Maine. It is not clear that he was born there. He relocated to Halifax, Nova Scotia but often visited in the Boston, Massachusetts area. He was a man of great ideas which did not always work out. In the first trip he had discovered that
tinwork was in short supply and had in his possession on arrival the patent and pattern for a tin pressing machine. The hold of the brig Mary was said to hold 36 hundredweight of tin and in steerage were at least 4 qualified tinsmiths that we know of - John Smith, Increase Robinson Bell George Balser and James Green.
On arrival these chaps +/- a few worked for Campbell who plied their works in Sydney town. (Hence "Tinker" Campbell. This appears to have continued for 2-3 years and then Campbell took up land at Maitland, then at Severn River on the Queensland border, then on the advice of Arthur Hodgson, squatted at a property he named Westbrook (after his home town) near Toowoomba. This still exists today
Given the high percentage of the ship's passengers associated with John Campbell, it may be that he was associated in some way. Certainly if he came all the way from Halifax he must have known him. I wonder in Cummings' case whether, if not a whitesmith, then was he a clockmaker?
As to the trip. Oral tradition as told to Ignatius, Increase's son says that their ship from Halifax/Boston to Rio de Janeiro nearly foundered and the passengers had to man the ship in part as there was serious illness of the crew and extreme weather. Whether that was the reason for taking the Mary from Rio or whether it was pre-arranged I am not sure. There are several brig "Mary"'s around and this led to initial confusion. However, this brig did a regular run from Liverpool, Rio, Capetown, Hobart, Sydney. On this trip it did not return to Liverpool but took on passengers at Rio. The route was dictated by the winds.
MicMac" is the anglicised name of a NovaScotian/Labrador aboriginal tribe (previously called red Indians")
Hope this is of some help - happy to send further info re Campbell and Increase Bell via e-mail
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Many thanks for this information Dolphinrim as it fills in a few blanks. I will communicate via PM with email address
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I am new at this game and for some reason I dont appear to be able to send Private Message
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I received the one you send me 5 days ago with your email addy.
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I'm conducting some family history research for my wife, who's a descendant of Tinker and Temperance. I haven't visited this forum for some years, and the new information about the Mary sounds very interesting. If I organise a few more posts so that I can make use of PM, would I be able to request more information by email from you, dolphinrim and mygirlbill?
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Hi there. Almost all the information that I have was given to me by Dolphinrim so he would be your best bet. However, I was able to obtain some other bits besides which I will be happy to share with you also. I will PM you my email addy.
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Hi. This is an interesting thread. My 2x Great Grandmother (Jane Elizabeth Campbell, aka Jane Elizabeth Kellett, b. 1832-1835?) was related to this Campbell family and came to Queensland with them in the 1840s/50s. I have not been able to find much about her, I would like to know more about who was the child that "Bbyone" (in post 8) mentions on the ship with John & Temperance.
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The child was John Edwin Campbell, born 1 May 1834 in Halifax, Nova Scotia :)
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I am trying to find out more about the Campbell family and Stevens family in USA and Canada.
I think my connection may be to one of the siblings of either John Campbell or Temperance Stevens.
Also I would be interested to know if it is possible to find the ship record/ passenger list for the brig Mary in 1835. Many thanks for any suggestions.
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There are newspaper reports including passenger lists here: http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article12852742 and here: http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/31716775. I think the passenger lists are available on Ancestry.com, but I don't have a subscription.
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Neale1961,
Temperance's mother, Elizabeth, was a Perkins so you might like to check out this site as well: http://www.wilsonmuseum.org/johnperkins.html.
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Thanks for your reply Mrluigi. I had the newspaper reports. The museum link was interesting, however, still no lead to the "needle" I am chasing in the "haystack". I will continue to look into the Campbell family.
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Hi,
I'm unsure if there is still activity in this chat stream, here goes. I'm trying to find a little more about John Campbell and his brother-in-law John Stevens early years on the Darling Downs, 1841 to about 1845. I thought perhaps someone in the family might have more information. One of my own my family crossed paths with both men around the same time.
Cheers
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You might find the following interesting / useful:
1. His book which is available to download on line: "The Early Settlement of Queensland" by John Campbell published in 1936 by the Bibliographical Society of Qld.
2. Article printed in the Brisbane Courier over 2 weeks starting on 25 May 1918 (available on Trove): "Passing of the Pioneers. Robert Campbell of Amity Point; Interesting Family Record" by Thomas Welsby
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Thanks Neale, I've seen the latter, unfortunately I've found with some of this early story telling in newspapers, its usually only the beginning and there is quite a way to go teasing fact from fiction.
I've looked for the memoirs previously, title helped this time.
Thanks again
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The only information that I have is that John Tinker Campbell sold Westbrook pastoral run to John Stevens. It would appear that John didn’t have this for long as the property changed hands a few times from around 1843.
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Just following up on this old post and re-reading some of the unanswered questions.
Neb1975 & Yarramunda
For John Stevens, it appears that this would be John Tinker Campbell's brother in law; brother to Temperance. After purchasing Westbrook from his brother in law, there appears to be a few business ventures around Ipswich (Limestone) and Redbank Plains that John Stevens was involved in.
As well, it appears that John was successful in sugar cane farming. You may need to google Ageston Plantation, Logan River, Brisbane. It appears that in later years Tinker set up a saltworks, sugar cane and other farming exploits on Macleay Island, Moreton Bay. Ageston Plantation is at the mouth of the Logan River, not too distant from the island so it would be reasonable to believe that they could have been working together (or at least closely).
There are some records for John who may have had the middle name Perkins.
Neale1961
Not too sure about any information on Jane Elizabeth Campbell, aka Jane Elizabeth Kellett, b. 1832-1835?) What was the connection to the Campbell or Stevens family?
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Hi Neb1975,
In response to your PM. I don’t have any information about John Stevens. If you are looking for information about John “Tinker” Campbell, I would recommend the sources I have posted in reply #34.
At the time I dropped into this thread some 6 - 7 years ago, I was researching the various Campbell men who were involved with the early pastoral runs on the Darling Downs. I am now fairly sure that Jane Elizabeth Campbell was not related to John Tinker Campbell.