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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: gillalexrob on Wednesday 05 May 10 22:06 BST (UK)
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Hi,
I am researching the Neilsland & Earnock estates of Hamilton, Lanarkshire which were owned by the Watson family in the mid 1800 to the mid 1900.
In particular, anything on Sir John Watson 1819 -1989 would be of interest. John Watson was a colliery owner in Hamilton and a well known figure in the wider area.
Any info greatly appreciated
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Hi
1819 -1989
Should this read 1889
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oops! yes, thank you!
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Obituary
John Watson
The Late Sir John Watson, Bart. Of Earnock. - A notable man in Sir John Watson, Bart of Earnock , passed away yesterday morning at the ripe age of 79. Up to the last he was hale and hearty. A few weeks ago he proceeded on a short holiday tour in the North, but the heat wave was too much for him. He was prostrated during the passage in the Caledonian Canal and at once returned home. Dr Crawford, his local medical adviser called in Dr Gemmell, who did not consider that there were any alarming symptoms, and on Sunday Dr Heron Watson, on being telegraphed for, on his arrival corroborated the views of the local and Glasgow doctor, and indicated the belief that a rest for ten days would put matters right. Notwithstanding, the patient never recovered his vitality, and he passed quietly away yesterday morning.
Sir John was the architect of his own fortunes. He was born in Kirkintilloch on the 9th of July 1819, and was therefore in the seventh-ninth year of his age. His father was a builder and contractor, but afterwards engaged in mining pursuits with considerable success, in which he was followed by his son. His lot was not altogether a successful one, but by indomitable perseverance he commanded success, and became one of the pioneers in the development of the Lanarkshire coalfields. In a limited sense the heyday of his career was when he was developing the coalfields of Wishaw and Dalziel under respectively Lord Belhaven and Mr Hamilton, now Lord Hamilton. His greatest success was when he acquired in the early seventies the estate of Neilsland, following up this triumph with the acquisition of that of Earnock. Up to that time there were doubts as to whether it would have been possible to have, at the great depths which were then little known in Scottish mining experience, to work the coal at a profit. With his wonted shrewdness Sir John, when he opened up the Earnock - which, it may be stated, is likely to go on tor 150 years at least - laid down the most advanced mechanical appliances. He was the first in Scotland and second in the United Kingdom to introduce electric light as an adjunct of mining. He was nothing if not thorough in all matters relating to his business concerns. He was popular, and deservedly so, in all his private relations. On acquiring the estates of Neilsland and Earnock, Sir John spared no money in the way of planting and improving the farms, the steadings of which were mostly rebuilt. He was twice married, his first wife being Miss Agnes Simpson, daughter of Mr. R. H. Simpson, coalmaster, Rutherglen, by whom he had two sons and eight daughters, all of whom are married. He is survived by his second wife, a daughter of Mr Peter M'Kenzie, editor of the “Reformers' Gazette.” He received the Baronetcy from Lord Roseberry in 1895. He is succeeded by his eldest son, Mr John Watson. [Scotsman 27 September 1898]
http://scottishmining.co.uk/386.html
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There's a memorial John Watson of Earnock Fountain in Muir Street, Hamilton (on the Historic Scotland Listed Buldings Register), the architect of which was my great uncle, Gavin Paterson. A photo of it is here:
http://www.geo.ed.ac.uk/scotgaz/towns/moretpix419.html
Cheers,
Rodeo
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Thank so much for your replys, really helpful
Rodeo, I was especially interested to learn of your connection to the John Watson Fountain in Cadzow Street, I live in Hamilton and pass it often. I knew that the fountain was a memorial for John Watson but now my enjoyment of it will be enhanced knowing also who the architect was...no doubt the kids will groan it the back of the car every time we pass it & I tell them this-lol!
My interest in John Watson is that I am part of a small group in the area who have recently been trying to get the Nature Trail (or 'Naitchie' if you come from here-haha) usable again for the whole community. This was John Watsons land and the grounds of his Neilsland House. It has been used as a nature trail for many years since becoming council property. When I was little it was a beautiful space but like so many areas has been left to decline and vandals and fly tippers have taken over making it unsafe for families to use.
We are just a group of mums who havent done anything like this before, so I have turned to what I love doing (family history) in the hope that the history of the estate and the Watson family will spark some interest and schools and other groups might come on board and realise the benefits of preserving this place in a usable way for the whole area to enjoy...quickly- before they build houses on it!!!
So although I have no direct link to John Watson (apart from my husband's Hamiltonian coal mining ancestors who would have known of Mr Watson first hand) I feel the link that the estate has to our Lanarkshire mining history is worth handing down.
Unfortunately I can't seem to post some photos I took this week including one of a statue of Sir John which once stood in the grounds but now lies broken and graffitied....says it all really.
Wish me luck!
Many thanks once again,
Gillian
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Hi Gillian
Actually, Gavin Paterson was also the architect of Neilsland House as you'll see here:
http://www.scottisharchitects.org.uk/architect_full.php?id=200407
I was in Hamilton for some time last year (on a trip to Scotland from Australia) doing family history research and visited all the schools, churches, monuments, community buildings and villas my great uncle designed. Coincidentally, while there, we stayed in Auchingramont Road directly next door to the home in which Gavin Paterson's son, Lennox Dundas Paterson, lived and just near Watson Fountain. Lennox was a partner in father's architectural firm and carried on the practice until some years before his death in 1983. All my relatives hailed from Hamilton, so it had an extraordinary emotional resonance for me. It was absoluteley fantastic to be there.
I know the nature trail to which you refer adjoining Neilsland House and agree that it's of historical significance as well as of primary environmental/recreational value to the community.
What were the terms of John Watson's bequest relative to Neilsland Estate? It may well be they are being breached if those lands were designated as a public area and the Council hasn't maintained them for that purpose. Congratulations on your crusade. It's well worth pursuing.
All the best,
Rodeo
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That is fascinating Rodeo!
I have a couple of grainy photographs of Neilsland house and by all accounts it was a beautiful place. I have a newspaper article about Neilsland House from 1947 which I would happily email to you if you are interested (although there is no mention of Mr Paterson unfortunately).
He was obviously a prominent figure in Hamilton in his time and how wonderful for you to be able to have his work still here to see and touch, that is some link to the past!
What a satisfying job to do knowing that you were leaving something wonderful behind, although I guess he would never have thought that his descendant would be conversing with a stranger half way around the world about him and his buildings in 2010!!!
Thank you so much for all your info Rodeo,
Let me know if I can help with any Hamilton Info,
Kind regards
Gillian
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I am delighted that interest is being shown in Sir John Watson 1st Bt of Earnock. He was my great grand father and I am now the 6th Bt of Earnock. My own grand parents lived in Neiland and my father was born in the house. I would be more than happy to support any effort to preserve the public right to the glen at Neilsland. I visited it many times so knew it well. I have unlimited information about Sir John. For example I can tell you how many horses or sheep he owned in 1894!
If you wish to look me up on Google put in "Sir Simon Watson Bt" Don't forget to include the inverted commas as this limits the search. It is only one page.
I am happy to try and answer any question you may have. My email address is (*)
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Hi Gillian
I too enjoyed many a football match down the 'Naitchie', and have more recently been through on a mountain bike, it has indeed, in my opinion, been neglected by the local authority to the point where it has been allowed to return to it's natural state..!!
I am afraid that I can't quite remember the house or any statue.
I guess the old railway line (which is now a footpath) was there to support the mining industry.
Anyway best of luck getting the council to take on the Nature trail, but I fear that in the current financial climate it may be well down the list, and your best bet may well be any conditions included in the bequeathment of the land.
If you have a knight of the realm on board that may help.... ;)
Alan Knightshift worker as opposed to Knight...!!
ps I don't think the Watson fountain was a memorial, understood it was a gift to the people of Hamilton by Sir John Watson
see
http://www.britishlistedbuildings.co.uk/sc-34512-cadzow-street-muir-street-watson-fountain
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Hi redted
If you are still in the area, then get down & pitch in next Saturday!
We have organised a Community Clean Up day which we hope will have a fantastic turn out. Local shops have donated refreshments & staff to help, fire brigade & community police coming along as well as all the locals that we have been speaking to. All we need now is some good weather....August in Scotland- not guaranteed-LOL!!!
I been in touch with Wilma Bolton, a local author & historian (Black Faces & Tackety Boots / Pit props & Ponies) who has been a fantastic help with giving me all she has on the Neilsland Estate. I have made up a wee board to display some of the fantastic old photos of the area including the Swiss Cottage & summerhouse which once stood on the land, amazing stuff!
Also, our pestering of the council seems to have paid off (to be fair they have been very helpful- as has everyone that we speak to about helping us). We have had talks with Countryside & Greenspace who are now consulting the community with a view to entering a bid for funding to regenerate the whole Nature Trail- Neilsland & Earnock. We are delighted with this news. I think that we have got things going just at the right time but it does go to show what a small group can achieve if they are detemined enough!
So if you are local and you are intersted inhaving a say then come along next week and speak to the Rangers who will have a marquee set up!
Let me know if you want to see the photos & Ill send them onto you.
Gillian
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Where exactly will the marquee be set up?
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Highstonehall Road.
If you park at Neilsland/ St Peter's primary scool you will see us there at the top of the hill on the football pitch. We are meeting with the Rangers & Land Services at the start of next week to finalise the plans, but we will defo be starting from there.
Hope you can come....and spread the word!!! ;)
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OOOOPS!
Sorry forgot to say Sat 7th August 2010 10am- 2pm!
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Wow my pessimistic thoughts seem to have been misplaced !! :-X
Well done.
I know Wilma, and have both her books..!!
I am afraid I can't be there on Saturday as I am working but best of luck.
Maybe some pictures could be uploaded.
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Ill try...although I couldn't upload before...
You have probably seen these if you know Wilma's books.
Neilsland House was on the open area at the top of the Nature Trail. The terraces, which are still there to an extent, were at the front of the house. Sir Simon Watson Bt has advised that there was once a beautiful fountain at the bottom with a pump room below. As children we used to play at 'dares' running through an underground tunnel, so I am guessing now that this was part of the pump room???
The other photo is the gate lodge. I love this photo, mainly because those pillars I remember well...very little of the pillars remain.
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Hi Gillian
Ive just came across your post, i live in the houses just next to the nature trail and i have been desperate to find out information on the old watson place i love the history that hamilton holds especially in our local area! my dad has fond memories of playing there when he was a boy, and us in the summer months taking walks through to where i would imagine the house once stood. Are you still pursuing the council to tidy the place up ?? do you have pics ??
Tracy
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Hi Gillian
got your pm, unfortunately i cant send a reply back to you until i've posted three times. It's so exciting that people are so interested in the old neilsland estate, it would be amazing to hear from you, can't wait!!
Tracy
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these photos are fab!
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Our Neilsland & Earnock group has moved on a bit since this first post in May 2010....
We are now called NEW ROOTS- Neilsland & Earnock Heritage Group and we meet in Guy Kerrs in Meikle Earnock, new members warmly welcomed!
We dont have a website as yet, we're working on it but you can find us on Facebook (New Roots- Neilsland & Earnock Heritage Group)....Lots of photos & posts there to jog the old memory.
You can contact us there if you're intrested in joining us.
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Well, at least if you're at Guy's the beer is good and the chippie over the road isn't too bad either!
I will mention your meeting to a couple of old Meikle Earnockers (?) who are always looking for an excuse to visit Guy's and their auld granny owned that dilapidated and now derelict ruin of a cottage just at the wee roundabout before Guy's (coming from Hamilton end). They have some very old pictures of that area (and they're in most of them).
When do you meet?
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http://local.stv.tv/hamilton/news/15409-punters-step-back-in-time-at-meikle-earnock-pub/
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we re not smart enough to meet in the evenings but im told that the beer is very good!
Thanks for posting the STV local link Sancti, David is our treasurer and Guy's is fast becoming like a wee museum for all of the area's relects...no not his locals!...who said that?....... but photographs and an ironwork grills as well as his infamous plant pot! He now even has a beautiful plate from the Watson family -courtesy of Sir Simon Watson Bt- who found us thanks to rootschat!!
Sir Simon visited us in May and is now our Honorary Patron, how amazing is that?! He also made available some of Sir John Watson's journals, they are fascinating, a real insight into life on the Watson Estates, well from a coalmasters point of view....Wilma Bolton fills us in on the rest!
Anyway, anyone interested in the history of the area should pay Guy's a visit and talk to David. We are always looking for people who have memories of the area...nothing like hearing it first hand!
We are due to meet early in the new year -exact time & date TBA but contact us through facebook or send me a PM to me if you want to join the group or come along to our conservation days....they are an experience not to be missed! Keep an eye on STV local, they are very good at promoting any events that we hold.
http://local.stv.tv/hamilton/news/19573-community-group-awarded-grant-to-open-up-woodlands/
Thanks everyone for your interest.
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hiya I'm new to here(as you prob can tell) and was wondering if 2012 will there be a repeat of the clean up of the nature trail I'm a little earnock resident and missed last one to work so so sorreeee :'(
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Hiya
It would be great to have another pair of hands, brilliant!
Im not sure if we are going to have a clean up day as such, its too early in the year to have any firm plans as yet but there will definitely be other events depending on how involved you want to be. Our work/conservation days usually involve clearing back the overgrown pathways etc and as the WIAT fund will only cover so much Im sure that we will have to get up there ourselves and get hands on with some bow saws and lopers, if you are up for that then let me know....it is hard work but usually a great day too.
Are you on Facebook? Im not a huge FB user but have found its a great way for people to find out about the Nature trail....whats happening now and about the history of the place too not to mention some brilliant photos..
http://www.facebook.com/groups/240933169303260/
If I don't see you on there then Ill keep you posted here.
Thanks,
Gill
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would be up for it and might even rope the wife in also..lol no dont use facebook twitter is my limit and on here now(multitasking eh?) let me know of the dates I'm in Nevis ave so 2 Min's away
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Will do!
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the nature trail"natchie" was my playground when i was a kid i stayed swisscot walk area i remember the boards with all the pics of the diffrent birds you could see "or not" also remember the crocodile in the playground "long gone" and what of the tunnel?,,,,was good for a hide out till somebody done a job job in it!!! ??? loads of memories of there to many to write about..lol.
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LOL!!! Well the shelter's still there! It was a great dare when I was young to get from one end to the other...now its my own kids doing it! I remember the swing park...just! and most definitely the crocodile! only today someone posted a photo of the park on the FB page, brilliant! Id love to see a park up there again but doubt it would last two minutes, such a shame.
Like you, we are just a bunch of locals who grew up here (I lived in Ness Terrace & my grandparents in Woodhead) and we all have great memories of the place and now we are just trying to keep it in one piece for a new generation to create their own memories....without burning the place down! Luckily the nursery are using it every week and now the schools are realising that outdoor learning is the next big thing.....how great to get up the natchie for some lessons eh? AND when you catch kids young enough and teach them how to use the place properly they will look after it, well thats the hope.
The more we find out about the history of the place the more we are hooked. If you want a copy of the historical photos etc then send me a PM and I can email them to you or drop them off, Im still in LE...just let me know.
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1970
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fantastic picture thank you have been looking for pics i love local history my dads from Blantyre and remembers queen Victoria on the railway line(now the black path-walk) he talks of seeing her from the iron bridge which is now gone above little earnocki used to have a pic looking off of there was when i was into camera work stuff.my parents still live swisscot i went the jungle for a while..lol took my step son a walk ages ago and found what i call the "wee feet" looks like an old statue near the waterfall which i used to climb when frozen with my mate Wolfie "we went to laighstonehall primary" lol told you i would ramble..lol he was kinda impressed i found the little feet again .have to go see if they are still there.
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We really have to rope you in you know! You sound just like us.....we are all reliving our youth and our families all think we're mad. It is still quite magical though, the old statues and the burn and the huge open garden areas its such a special place. Lots of people are put off because it looks so uninviting from the outside....hopefully that will change once the place is managed better.
I have heard the Queen Victoria story too. I heard that the train stopped for an overnight quite close by...some story eh?
Not sure what your 'little feet' statue is....Im trying to attach of the headless statue which sat near Swiss Cottage and is now halfway down the rockery, maybe its this one....it's vandalised now of course, I remember it as a wee girl... I used to think this was John Watson but have since found out it was 'Old Norval' a character from a play. The statue was by Robert Forrest a renowned scottish sculptor. Apparently quite a few statues were on the Estates (Neilsland and Earnock) and thanks to Sir Simon Watson we have quite a few photos of them now.
http://sites.google.com/site/joerocksresearchpages/robert-forrest-sculptor-1789-1752
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the "wee feet" are to your right if you stand looking down the waterfall there is/was a small outcropping where the ground rises will try and take some pics is that statue up on the hilly bit? i remember it being like a fort you could hide in but mind slipping..lol
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i remember that statue when it was further up my step son when he was smaller showed me it as well as a beautifull more complete statue wich is across the road from us further up the burn at lady watson gardens think i defo need to dig my camera out.
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great walk today me and morag enjoyed it big time.
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I was with our group Friends of Udston and Glenlee Woods on invite to Neilsland= Earnock Woods from Gillians Group in May 2011. I was absolutley captivated by the Woodland and it's History. The Rhododendrum was in full bloom in all it's beuaty. The group had pictures of the Swiss Cottage, Mansion House and it filled me with amazement of the granduer of the period and affluence of the Watson family. If you haven't been there yet, set a date in your diary for May 2012.
Joxer 42
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talking of Rhododendron my dad took a cutting from there years ago and now its huge at the bottom of his garden
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Ive always wondered what the house looked lik,, ive rolled down that undulating hill a thousand times when i was a kid,, And yes I remember comimg across the statue down the hill when I was about 10 - 11, great place to run free,, down by the litte waterfall and the flat bit of gardens where the little bridge went over the burn!!!,, I lived in carron court which was built around 1970 in woodhead
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the little underground air raid shelter!!!!
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think it might be a pump house? not sure? but its still there
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Maybe an ice house
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could be but all the ones ive seen were usually round and much deeper and ive seen a few....well two....lol
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We always called it the air raid shelter as kids...and what a dare that was, feerties couldnae do it!!! :o
Now that we know about the fountain I think that the pump room is the most likely explanation.
Jimbo1, my grandparents stayed just round from Carron Court and I have fond memories of it! not least the metal bridge....still cant resist a noisy stamp when I cross it...although the rust is making holes in it now and I aint as small as I was, I suppose I should stop!
The bridge from Woodhead into the NT is due to be restored as part of the WIAT funding, it will be a great day when that part is complete. Ive changed my profile picture to Swiss Cottage (my favourite photo of Neilsland- thank you Sir Simon) this is where the burn is now, can you believe how it looked in 1877?
If youre on Facebook have a look at our photos, you'll be amazed to see the area in its full glory in the late 1800's.
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What era is the fountain and what would have powered the pump?
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there are two openings a main door and what could be a chimney so maybe a steam pump on a small scale? only guessing
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Midstonehall or Neilsland House, as it later became known, was extended around 1891-1893, I would imagine that the fountain went in around then...no idea about powering pumps though.
We do know that pipes were laid over the estate coming from Torlake, behind Torheads Farm.
I did try to post a photo of the house and fountain but unfortunately the file was too large...any suggestions on how to overcome this?
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i have tried also its a pain...lol
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ok sad i know been looking into steam engines of that era dont think that is an option but if the house was fed with water which im sure it was there is the water works further uphill in town hill then the main house would maybe have fed a main tank in the pump house where pressure would have been racked up as its downhill?? again only guessing spill off then being fed down to the burn? any ideas?..lol
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There is a marriage announcement in the Herald 7 Aug 1872 for Oliphant Williamson, esq, of Glasgow and Mary Anne, eldest daughter of John Watson, esq, of Neilsland Lanarkshire