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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Denbighshire => Wales => Denbighshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Morganllan on Thursday 03 June 10 16:30 BST (UK)
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Hello
I wonder whether anyone can help me find a connection between 2 John Hanaby/Hannaby families in the Rhos/Johnstown areas please?
First John Hannaby was born around 1823, and married Sarah Price in Ruabon district in 1848. they had 2 sons John and Thomas before Sarah died. John remarried Mary Roberts in 1861 and went on to have several more children.
The other John Hannaby was born in 1819 and married Hannah Jones at St Mary’s Church, Ruabon in 1842. Their children were:
Joseph born 1847 married Ann Morgan in 1872.
Daniel born 1849 but died 1856
John born 1853
I wonder whether John 1823 and John 1819 could be related, maybe cousins?
Many thanks
Morgan
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I guess the easiest way would to check the marriages for the fathers names and work back from there.
Both took place at the same Church, St Mary`s Ruabon.
North Wales BMD.
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Hi Morgan
Received your PM about this :)
Just turned up one John Hannaby~
Ruabon Baptism:
27 June 1819 John s/o Joseph Hannaby (collier) and Mary. Living Rhos. Joseph is also recorded as his father in his marriage to Hannah in 1842.
This is the only Hannaby baptisms in the parish registers 1893-1853.
Joseph's marriage to Mary:
25 Dec 1815 Joseph Hannabe and Mary Bellis. Both otp. Both made their mark. Witnesses William Jones and Sarah Edwards.
No other Hannaby/variation marriages that I can see in the first half of the 19th century. I'll check the earlier register entries and also burials and get back if I find anything.
Gadget
It might be that the families were non-conformist and thus might appear in the Blackwell Index. I think William and Heather both have copies.
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Hi again
I've just checked this site:
http://www.namesfromclwyd.org.uk/
and see that there were Hannaby/variations in Wrexham, Gresford, Holywell, Halkin, St Asaph, Minera, Llandelgla, Connah's Quay and Caerwys, in addition to those in Ruabon and the later Rhos registers.
Joseph and John seem to be mentioned in Wrexham as well so it might be worth finding someone who has access to those registers.
Gadget :)
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:)
This might give you something to go on - I've found another marriage ~
Ruabon 27 January 1810 William Hannaby to Ann Williams . Both otp and both made their mark. Witnesses John Davies and Ann Taylor
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and a burial:
Ruabon 27 May 1817 Sarah Hannabe, infant, of Morton Above
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I think this might well be Joseph on the 1851:
HO107/2503/323/27
Rhos
Hannaby
Joseph, hd, widower, 54, collier, b. Brymbo
Josiah, son, unm, 27, b. Brymbo
Mary Edwards, 19, servant, b. Ruabon
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his family looks interesting - also 1851:
HO107/2503/303/47
Rhos
Hanaby
Thomas, hd, m, 50, Coal miner, b. Wrexham
Ann, wife, 63
Sarah, d, 19, ? at home
Elizabeth, d, 16, house servant
Robert, s, 13, coal miner
Edward, s, 11, coal miner
All but Thomas b. Ruabon
Did the second John name any of his children with these names?
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Just going through the Hannaby/variations households in Denbighshire for the 1851 in addition to the ones above:
Samuel - HO107/2503/262/54
John - HO107/2503/819/7
and your John b. 1818/1891
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his family looks interesting - also 1851:
HO107/2503/303/47
Rhos
Hanaby
Thomas, hd, m, 50, Coal miner, b. Wrexham
Ann, wife, 63
Sarah, d, 19, ? at home
Elizabeth, d, 16, house servant
Robert, s, 13, coal miner
Edward, s, 11, coal miner
All but Thomas b. Ruabon
Did the second John name any of his children with these names?
Thanks for all your help Gadget. I think this is my lot as, from my notes, in 1861 my ancestor John was a widower living with his mother Ann. Brothers Thomas and Edward and sister Elizabeth were there too. Also John's 2 sons John and Thomas by his 1st wife Sarah Price. Later in 1861 John remarried to Mary Roberts, and went on to have Sarah, Joshua, Edward, Ann, robert, and Mary.
Morgan
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HI Morgan
I think father Thomas was there as well in 1861:
RG9/4283/4/27
I think Thomas's age has been mis-interpreted as 40 when it should be 60 - it's overwritten on the original. Ann is down as his wife and your John is 'son' Here they all seem to be born Rhos, although it is 'doed' from the previous household.
Gadget
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::) ::) ::) :-[ :-[ :-[
Just seen that there's a Thomas Annaby in Ruabon. I'll report back
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Here's the first bit~
Marriage Ruabon
28 April 1821 Thomas Anaby and Anne Parry both otp. Banns . There is a with consent of parents so ...
:)
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:D
Baptisms Ruabon 18 Aug 1823
Samuel and John Anaby sons of Thomas Anaby (collier) and Anne, Moreton above
So your John had a twin by the looks of things
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More Baptisms ~
16 Aug 1824 Josiah s/o Joseph Anaby, collier, and Mary. Morton Above
25 Dec 1826 Robert -do- (I think he died the next year)
20 Aug 1827 Mary d/o Thomas Anaby, collier, and Anne, Morton Above
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1851 ~ looks like it could be John's brother
Street Isa, Rhos
HO107/2503/262/54
Hannaby
Samuel, 30, coal miner
Elizabeth, 30,
Samuel, 5
All b. Ruabon
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::) ::) ::) :-[ :-[ :-[
Just seen that there's a Thomas Annaby in Ruabon. I'll report back
By 1881 my John Hannaby and family were living at Bonc Ddu, Ponciau, Rhos, but listed as Annaby. Must have had a habit of dropping the aitches ;D
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Thank you very much Gadget, you're a Star :D
In summary, my ancestor John (and his twin Samuel) were born 1823 to Thomas Hannaby and his wife Ann (nee Parry). Thomas and Ann married 1821 with parent's consent.
the other John was born 1819 to Joseph Hannaby and his wife Mary (nee Bellis). Joseph and Mary married 1815
so I need to find out if there's a relationship between Thomas and Joseph, which may be in non-conformist indexes or outside Ruabon Parish, e.g. Wrexham or Bersham?
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Hi Morgan
Think that I left a bit off my last message to you as I was on the phone to someone beginning with P ;D - was it here or via pm ::)
Anyway, I'm not sure (now that I've found more in the oprs) if the non-c records would have anything but it's worth trying. Also maybe pm Paul with link to this thread to see if he might find anything on Thomas* and Joseph in the Wrexham/Brymbo oprs. It looks like they might have been born in the 1780s-1790s.
* Thomas would be circa 1802 ish
Gadget
PS - at least they weren't Uses ;D ;D ;D
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PS - at least they weren't Uses ;D ;D ;D
grateful for small mercies
;D ;D ;D
Thanks, Gadget :)
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Hi Morgan
Some finds for your Hannaby families
Wrexham Baps 1800-1812 no burials
ANNABY, Catharine, Dec 23, 1810 b Nov 16, d/o William & Ann of Broughton
HANABU, Samuel, Jun 13, 1801 b May 15, s/o William (occ Coll=collier?) & Sarah of Broughton
HANABY, Robert, Jan 4, 1807 b July 4, s/o William (occ Collier) & Sarah (no abode listed)
HANNABY, Edward, Oct 9, 1803 b___, s/o William (occ Coll) & Sarah of Broughton
HANNABY, Sarah, Aug 26, 1810 b Mar 26, d/o William (occ Lab.) & Sarah of Broughton
Wrexham Baps 1789-1800 no burials
HANNABY, John, July 1, 1792, b 8th, s/o William (occ Coll) & Sarah of Brn (= Broughton?)
HANNABY, William, Feb 21,1790, b ____, s/o William (occ Lab) & Sarah of Broughton
The IGI has a submitted entry at Wrexham for a Thomas HANABY supposedly baptized Feb 24, 1799 s/o William & Ann or Sarah. The Clwyd FHS transcripts have no Wrexham PR entries transcribed between Sep 1796 to December 1799. The Blackwell Index doesn’t appear to have any HANNABYs or variations either.
There is also another submitted entry at Gresford for a Joseph HANNABY bap Nov 14, 1790 s/o John Hannaby & Mrs. John Hannaby.
HTH
Heather
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Thank you, Heather. That's great. :)
I think Thomas Hanaby (from the submitted entry) may be John's father who married Ann Parry as he's the right age. Sounds as if William and Sarah were productive in Broughton ;)
The other submitted entry for Joseph, son of John at Gresford, would rule out Thomas and Joseph being brothers. Unless there is a Joseph in Wrexham OPR 3 year gap, any relationship would be even further back in 18th Century.
Do you know whether the 1796-9 records exist elsewhere (e.g. in Bishop's Transcripts)?
Many thanks again
Morgan
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Marriage Ruabon
28 April 1821 Thomas Anaby and Anne Parry both otp. Banns . There is a with consent of parents so ...
:)
this means they were both under 21 and needed consent?
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Do you know whether the 1796-9 records exist elsewhere (e.g. in Bishop's Transcripts)?
I don't know but in other instances/parishes where BT's were available the Clwyd FHS has included them in their transcript. Perhaps William could advise on that question.
this means they were both under 21 and needed consent?
Yes I believe it does.
BTW I looked in Minera, Llandegla & Halkin but couldn't see any entries in the right time frame pre 1800. I think you need to buy or find access to Gresford PRs
Heather
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Marriage Ruabon
28 April 1821 Thomas Anaby and Anne Parry both otp. Banns . There is a with consent of parents so ...
:)
this means they were both under 21 and needed consent?
Hi Morgan
From the later censuses, it looks as if Thomas was born circa 1803-ish and Ann might have been 10-14 years older. I was hoping that something might come up in the neighbouring parishes for him but so far de nada :-\
I'm interested in the Ann Parry because of my Parrys in that area :) Heather and I are convinced that we are all related so I'm happy for you to join the family ;D
I'll have a look for her over the next few day but I'm busy over the weekend sorting out the country ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)
Gadget
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Other thoughts - I still think that Joseph and Thomas might well be brothers. They are both coal miners and, in censuses, say that they were born Wrexham, Brymbo, Ruabon, Rhos. Why would the both end up in Rhos if there was no connection and with a very unusual surname?
Gadget
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thanks Heather and Gadget
I was hoping they'd be brothers, don't know why really :-\
We probably are all related ;D ;D I have a John Parry in my tree already - born around 1811, quarry man / stone cutter in Cefn. Interestingly his and his wife's birthplace interchanged between 1871 and 1881
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Are you still looking for these ?
ebay
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Many thanks for this link Wilcoxon :)
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have sent a PM