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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cumberland => Topic started by: Boongie Pam on Sunday 03 April 05 00:12 BST (UK)
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Hi All,
I'm posting this in the hope that someone can see around my brickwall. I've been tussling with this one for about 6 months - I know I know a brickwall can stand strong for many years.
I've got references for certs but I know the info is at the Carlisle RO and I will get there in the summer so am holding off buying certs as it will get very costly and is a possible wild goose chase.
Ok to cut to that chase! ;D
My brickwalls in Longtown are a couple who were earthenware dealers not born in Cumberland (suspicion is Northumberland) called Thomas and Elizabeth ANDERSON
Thanks to Bridget Casson's brilliant Longtown site
http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/longtown19/index.html
I found obituries for both Elizabeth, Thomas and their daughter Mary (my direct).
Since they died before 1851 I've no way of finding where they were from.
So I ordered Elizabeth's death cert thinking that all her known (to me) relatives had died so the informant would be of interest and hopefully break my problem.
She died in 1843 aged 83.
The informant is Robert YOUNG another earthenware dealer. He seems to have been in the papers a lot sadly for the deaths of his children who had a habit of dying young :'(.
I presume his wife is an Anderson but can't prove it with out the certs of his kids.
I can't find a marriage for him in Cumberland on Freebmd, he is listed as married in 1871 but no wife in the house. From the IGI I think Robert's wife is Jane. If I can confirm she is an ANDERSON and find her on a post 1841 census then I'll know where she and hopefully teh other ANDERSONs came from.
So, does anyone have access to birth records post 1837?
The kids I would like to know the mother's name to are...
YOUNG, Mary Robinson
Qtr: Dec Year: 1844
Longtown, Cumberland
Volume: 25 Page: 120
Young, Thomas Anderson
Died aged 3 on the 24th Jan 1846 so born in 1842/3 though this may not have been in Longtown ???
I know Robert isn't in Longtown in 1841 and 1851 census.
Anyone connected with Andersons or Youngs?
Cheers,
Pam
;D
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Whilst looking for some of my mining Andersons, I fell over in the 1841 Arthuret Census, living in Netherby Street:
Thomas Anderson 80 Potter b 1761 ? ( no details given, so probably out of county)
Elizabeth Anderson 80 b 1761 Cumberland
Thomas Anderson 15 b 1821 " " " "
- could these be linked with yours? Hope it's some small amount of help. I know how huge those insurmountable Anderson brick walls can be.
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Hi ThrellfallYorky, can we get a medal for a conversation to take 16 years 😂
Apologies for taking 6 years to answer 😮 for many reasons I’ve dropped my research for quite a while so haven’t logged into my RC account.
To respond though, Thomas and Elizabeth are still very much brick walls. I had the census which gave me the hint they weren’t from Cumberland.
The mystery still stands 😀
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So, does anyone have access to birth records post 1837?
The kids I would like to know the mother's name to are...
YOUNG, Mary Robinson
Qtr: Dec Year: 1844
Longtown, Cumberland
Volume: 25 Page: 120
From the GRO index ;D
YOUNG, MARY ROBINSON Mothers maiden surname ANDERSON
GRO Reference: 1844 Dec Quarter in LONGTOWN Volume 25 Page 120
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/menu.asp
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And son Thomas
YOUNG, THOMAS ANDERSON mother's maiden name ANDERSON
GRO Reference: 1842 D Quarter in LONGTOWN Volume 25 Page 113
John
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Quote:
I found obituries for both Elizabeth, Thomas and their daughter Mary (my direct).
Can I ask when and where Mary the daughter was born and when if she is your direct line.
added, can you supply a ref for the 1871 census for Robert Young
John
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Wow hello Johnhood! And thank you.
Elizabeth & Thomas' daughter Mary Anderson is my 5th Great Grandmother. I do not have records for her birth just the obituary in the newspapers that connect her to Elizabeth as her mother given how close in time they died.
My line is:
Mary Anderson m Thomas Robinson
... Son Thomas Robinson m Margaret Lowther
... Daur Johann/Johnann Lowther m Robert Green
... Daur Margaret Green m Thomas Thomson
... Daur Joan Green Thomson m John Fallon
... Son John Fallon is my grandfather
What is your connection - I'd love to know?
I will dig out my notes for Robert. I remember he was tricky to find at the time. I was trying to go sideways to confirm the Anderson's home parish and I was drawing a blank with Mary as she died so young. I want to try and trace Thomas Anderson who was 15 and I guess a grandson in the 1841 census as he was not born in Cumberland either.
The only recent breakthroughs I have had are finding Thomas Robinson moved to Moffat and Dumfries after Mary's death, where he opened a shop for a short period. Then I lose him again! I have seen records connected to his financial sharp practice on his rented warehouse in Brunstock so I can understand why he moved. These were from Carlisle record office in the old days of paper indexes!
I'll be back later this evening. (Not 6 years :D promise!)
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So, does anyone have access to birth records post 1837?
The kids I would like to know the mother's name to are...
YOUNG, Mary Robinson
Qtr: Dec Year: 1844
Longtown, Cumberland
Volume: 25 Page: 120
From the GRO index ;D
YOUNG, MARY ROBINSON Mothers maiden surname ANDERSON
GRO Reference: 1844 Dec Quarter in LONGTOWN Volume 25 Page 120
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/menu.asp
Thank you!
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Published: Tuesday 29 July 1856
Newspaper: Teviotdale Record and Jedburgh Advertiser
Per an advert in the newspaper above, a Robert Young of Longtown opens a China and earthenware dealers in Jedburgh.
The 1871 census may not be him. There is a chap aged 66 in Longtown living with his granddaughter Ann Tait. There is no occupation to give a connection.
I’ve found a parish record for Mary Robinson Young, who sadly died in 1845. It states her mother as Jane. So at least it gives a clue for sideways searches for a Jane Anderson.
Edit… just found him and Jane in Annan in 1861, High St, occupation China Dealer.
YYYYAAAAYYY Brickwalls can fall!
Jane Young died in Annan a few years later in 1863. I finally have Elizabeth Anderson’s maiden name! WILLIAMSON
Happy days!
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Published: Tuesday 29 July 1856
Newspaper: Teviotdale Record and Jedburgh Advertiser
Per an advert in the newspaper above, a Robert Young of Longtown opens a China and earthenware dealers in Jedburgh.
The 1871 census may not be him. There is a chap aged 66 in Longtown living with his granddaughter Ann Tait. There is no occupation to give a connection.
I’ve found a parish record for Mary Robinson Young, who sadly died in 1845. It states her mother as Jane. So at least it gives a clue for sideways searches for a Jane Anderson.
Hi, just a quick post for tonight, This Mary Robinson Young I believe to be 1 of 4 children born to Robert & Jane
1 Jacob 1837 - 1838
2 Isabella 1840-1846 but cannot find on 1841 census
3 Thomas Anderson 1842-1846
4, Mary Robinson 1844-1845.
Still looking re Andersons/Robinsons
john
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Hey johnhood see the previous post - sorry I edited rather than replied! Beyond excited. That brick wall is 20 years old!
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Jane Anderson
Baptism Date: 9 Nov 1806 at Hexham,Northumberland,England
Father: Thomas Anderson
This looks very positive if the mum was named!
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Well done, I know that feeling of shear elation when finally finding an answer.
Looking geographically at a map a straight line can almost be drawn between Annan/Longtown/Hexham and Sunderland. The below marriage ref may be that of Jane & Robert, timescales would tie in nicely with birth of first child.
Marriages Sep 1837
ANDERSON Jane Sunderland 24 154
FLETCHER Elizabeth Sunderland 24 154
NIXON John Sunderland 24 154
SMITH Edward Oxnard Sunderland 24 154
SPARK Catharine Sunderland 24 154
STOREY Frances Sunderland 24 154
WYLAM Robert Sunderland 24 154
YOUNG Robert Sunderland 24 154
John
Added :This 1851 census ref will be of great interest to you
YOUNG
WILLIAM A
1851
M
18
842/ 6/ 4
Moffat
Dumfries
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.... sounds as if you are starting to get somewhere...
TY
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Well done, I know that feeling of shear elation when finally finding an answer.
Looking geographically at a map a straight line can almost be drawn between Annan/Longtown/Hexham and Sunderland. The below marriage ref may be that of Jane & Robert, timescales would tie in nicely with birth of first child.
Marriages Sep 1837
ANDERSON Jane Sunderland 24 154
FLETCHER Elizabeth Sunderland 24 154
NIXON John Sunderland 24 154
SMITH Edward Oxnard Sunderland 24 154
SPARK Catharine Sunderland 24 154
STOREY Frances Sunderland 24 154
WYLAM Robert Sunderland 24 154
YOUNG Robert Sunderland 24 154
John
Added :This 1851 census ref will be of great interest to you
YOUNG
WILLIAM A
1851
M
18
842/ 6/ 4
Moffat
Dumfries
I followed the nephew William to his family, Berwick upon Tweed. His father being from Tweedmouth. The Robert Young in Longtown in 1871 is also born in Tweedmouth.