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Some Special Interests => Travelling People => Topic started by: tracylee on Sunday 15 August 10 16:00 BST (UK)
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Don't know if anyone can help me but I'm trying to find information about my family members Edward Elliott and his son Solomon. I remember my Nan telling me they ran a boxing Booth at fairgrounds.
Solomon was born in Taunton in 1838 and I have a census entry from 1871 which shows them in Christchurch and lists Edward's occupation as 'showman'. It list edward's birthplace as Scotland.
I don't really know much about my Nan's side of the family so I'd be really interested if anyone knows anything about them or has a connection to share.
Thanks
Tracy
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1891 South Mimms Middlesex
Soloman is described as travelling showman/ gypsies. Siblings Thomas and Eliza are also described as showman
Soloman Elliot 23
Eliza Elliot 24
Robert Elliot 2
Thomas Elliot 21
Eliza Elliot 19
Robert Harry 21
Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 1052; Folio 101; Page 26; GSU roll: 6096162.
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Thanks very much for this. Do you know where on line I can look that up? I tried on ancestry.com but nothing came up.
Thanks
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Hi
I got it from ancestry.co.uk Go there and...
When the first page opens on the right select 1891. When the 1891 page loads scroll down and there should be a box labelled census just put the census reference in their from my mail. It will open up the record.
Cheryl
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Thanks for that, I have it.
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Hi Tracy,
Just seen your post about Solomon and Edward Elliott and I think we may have a connection as my great grandmother is Annie Elliott, sister to Thomas & Solomon and daughter of Edward. She married my gt grandfather William Smith in Ipswich in 1896 and they had approx 12 children, one of whom was my nan. They did run a boxing booth stall and gt nan was a feisty little thing who would take on most people in the ring as well. I still have relations who travel with the fair, although the boxing booth has long gone.
I believe that Edwards wife was also called Annie and his mother may have been called Sarah. It can be rather difficult in tracing them and I have hit a wall so many times with this side of the family. Let me know if you want any more details.
Cheers
Alison
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Just logged on to see if I could find anythng out about the Elliott and West travellers and I am very excited to see there is a link to the family in Ipswich in 1896. My great uncle Ernest James Stammers married Louisa Elliott - daughter of Edward - in Ipswich in 1899 - could this link be how they met? In 1901 they are living with Louisa's maternal grandparents in Shirley - by early 1902 Ernest enlists saying he is single and has no children - 1905 he goes AWOL July 5 1907 he dies - no mention of relatives on his death card and no record of his death at Kew. Also can't find out anything about Louisa after 1901. In view of the family links are there any legends which have been passed down about Louisa and Ernest? I'd love to hear from someone - already in touch with Tracy.
Maureen
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A bit more Alison - Edward b c 1832 married Sarah Slack b 1832, their son Edward b c 1852 in Dorset married Hannah Maria West b 1851 on 17 January 1879 in Alverstoke, Hampshire. The children were Thomas b 1871, Ellen b 1874, Edward b 1876,and Louisa b 1877 is the lady who married my grand uncle Ernest, Annie b 1879 - it was the parents of Hannah that Ernest and Louisa were lodging with at 10 Henry Gardens, Shirley at the 1901 census - other members of the gypsy family were nearby in their caravans. Does this add anything for you?
Maureen
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Maureen, it would seem that we are possibly related via the Elliott line as my gt nan is Annie b 1879. She married William Smith from Lavenham, in1896 and they appeared to be neighbours, him at 16, her at 18 Bramford Road in Ipswich. Her father is listed as a licensed Hawker and Williams father is a Horse Dealer. It would appear that Annie was named after her mother as my mum always knew her full name to be Anna Maria and she is listed as that on her death certificate.
On details I have managed to trace I have not seen a Louisa but an Eliza - could the names be mixed up??I know because one of my gt aunts was always known as Kate but her real name was Ellen!!!The details that you have supplied do appear to add up for me as most of the kids were born in the Hants/ Somerset area but as I saied before you do sometimes hit a large wall when investigating travelling families. I sorry I don't have any other details on Louisa or ernest that I can offer to you but we do look like we are looking into the same family.
Alison
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Thanks for the reply - I have Louisa and Earnest's marriage certificate - her father Edward put his occupation as 'briciklayer' which seems strange! My grandparents were witnesses at the wedding (she being Ernest's sister) I have e-mailed Jean Coalport who has loads of info and press cuttings about Solomon - I hope to see she joins this thread. An old aunt who was born in 1898 and died at the age of 96 remembered all her life going to a gypsy funeral and seeing a burning caravan - for some reason she was very put off looking like a gypsy refusing to wear a headscarf or large earrings all her life!!! This would have been around 1902 which is when Louisa and Ernest seem to have had a parting of the ways. There is a Louisa Stammers shown dying tht year in London following childbirth but this is a completeloy different family and just a very confusing happening. Louisa is listed in several of the Elliott family trees but surprisingly no one has heard anything about her - I fear something rather unpleasant may have happened - can't find any trace whatsoever of Louisa after 1901 which seems strange and, as I said - Ernest's death is not registered at Kew. I wonder whether he committed suicide and his body wasn't found but it was known he died on the date shown on his death card.
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Hello Alison
We do indeed have a connection. My Nan Elizabeth was the daugher of Solomon's daughter Edith Elliott so Solomon would be my GG Grandfather. My Nan married a traveller so I still have a strong Romany side of the family but I didn't know too much about my Nan's fairground side.
I was talking to my Dad about my findings so far and he said that he had heard of your Gt Grandmother as taking on all comers in my Nan's tales about the fmaily so i guess the stories definitley got passed down.
I'm desperate to see any photos of them so would be great to know if you have any. I have a couple of my Gt Granny Edie (Solomon's daughter) which I can share with you if you like.
Tracy
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Hi Tracy,
I'm so excited by your reply as I have spent many long hours trying to sort out this side of the family and hitting so many walls. I know there are a couple of photos of Annie lurking around at my mums so have spoken to her to get them and she is also going to speak to her cousin to see if he has any more. Also on speaking to her she confirmed Annie was a hit in the boxing booth and also one of her daughters Kate (Ellen) used to box as well, I don't think my nan ever did though. Also, one of Annie's daughters, my gt aunt Violet is still alive today. She is about 95/96 and lives in Surrey. Haven't spoken to her but may ask my mum to have a word with her at some point. She may even have more pictures which would be great.
Would be interested to see your pics of gt granny edith and I'll get the ones of Annie as well.
I also know that their brother Thomas was living in Southampton as that is where he died in 1935 age 62, sadly Annie died 5 years later in 1940 . He was married to a lady called Mary Ann,and they are shown living in a caravan, in Barking Essex in the 1901 census.
Regards
Alison
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Alison - I feel I may be getting closer to finding out what happened to Louisa and Ernest!! If Annie's daughter was around, albeit as a child - she might perhaps have heard stories about what happened around 1901/2!! Would you be kind enough to include that as a question if contact is made with her? I've contacted Jean C so hope she joins this thread. Louisa's West relatives were also travellers before settling in a house as at 1901 census.
Regards, Maureen
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Hi there!
My Great grandfather was Solomon Elliott. Have not looked at this site for a while. It was a nice surprise finding other people also researching the Elliotts/
My Grandfather was Solomons son Robert. I can send you a photo copy of them both, and any info I may have, I will gladly send to you.
Ann
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I think Alison's gt grandmother was sister to Louisa - the lady I am trying to trace to find out what happened between the census of 1901 and January 1902 when Ernest (her husband) says he is single! About the Ipswich link - traditionally there was always a visiting fair in Bramford Road - it was still going on when I was a teenager - if only I had known then what I know now I would have gone looking for the Elliotts and Wests!!! Jean hasn't joined us yet so I will e-mail her again. Several of you seem to be gt gt grandchildren of Solomon and I know Jean is related too.
Maureen
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Hi Ann,
Nice to hear from you. I'm Annie Elliotts ( married name Smith) great grandaughter. It's so nice to hear of people who are connected to the family after spending ages not getting anywhere. It would be nice to share your pictures and any other info you might have. I'm hoping to get some pictures of my great gran but we don't have much on her brothers and sisters.
Cheers
Alison
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I think Alison's gt grandmother was sister to Louisa - the lady I am trying to trace to find out what happened between the census of 1901 and January 1902 when Ernest (her husband) says he is single! About the Ipswich link - traditionally there was always a visiting fair in Bramford Road - it was still going on when I was a teenager - if only I had known then what I know now I would have gone looking for the Elliotts and Wests!!! Jean hasn't joined us yet so I will e-mail her again. Several of you seem to be gt gt grandchildren of Solomon and I know Jean is related too.
Maureen
How interesting to find out about the fair in Ipswich being a regular thing. Great Grandad Smith was a Horse/ Cattle dealer so one can only assume he met Annie at the fair and they got hitched. Don't know if the Elliotts would have been there when you were a teenager Maureen, but it wouldn't surprise me if there had been some descendants around like children or grandchildren. My mums cousins still travel with the fair as do their children and grandchildren as well.
Regards
Alison
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Hello Alison,
Will be back shortly when I have sorted my documents,, I will make a list of what I have and then you can choose what might be useful to you.
Regards
Ann
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Hello Tracey, my name is Jean, I think Maureen has mentioned me. I think we share the same Elliott ancestors. My great grandfather was Solomon Elliott, married to Eliza Miller. His son
Robert was my grandfather, married to Ann de Courcey. Their daughter Joyce was my mother.
My cousin Ann and I have been looking at the family tree for some time now but have got a
bit stuck at Edward up in Scotland. Her dad was Robert Elliott, son of Robert.
If you have any questions I might be able to help you with, please let me know.
Best wishes
Jean
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Hi everyone - I'm really excited to find this thread (thanks to Maureen). My friend is a great grand-daughter of travelling showman Solomon Elliott b.1868 Taunton. I've noticed other dates on here but that's the one that fits us. On Solomon's birth certificate it says his father's name is Edwin rather than Edward... can anyone shed any light on that? I'll get my friend to sign up here too as she has stuff to share, including a picture of the Boxing Booth!
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Just logged on to see if I could find anythng out about the Elliott and West travellers and I am very excited to see there is a link to the family in Ipswich in 1896. My great uncle Ernest James Stammers married Louisa Elliott - daughter of Edward - in Ipswich in 1899 - could this link be how they met? In 1901 they are living with Louisa's maternal grandparents in Shirley - by early 1902 Ernest enlists saying he is single and has no children - 1905 he goes AWOL July 5 1907 he dies - no mention of relatives on his death card and no record of his death at Kew. Also can't find out anything about Louisa after 1901. In view of the family links are there any legends which have been passed down about Louisa and Ernest? I'd love to hear from someone - already in touch with Tracy.
Maureen
Hmm - I'm a bit intrigued as I have Thomas b.1870 Bridgewater as the son of Edward and Sarah (nee Slack), living with them aged 1 in the 1871 census - then seem to find him in Shirley as the grandson of the Wests living with them and his sister Louisa b.1876 in Shirley... Perhaps both Edward b. 1850 and Edward b.1830 had soms called Thomas b.1870?
Has anyone found Solomon in the 1881 census?
Thanks! Sarah
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Hi,
Solomon and Eliza are my great grandparents . My mother was Adelaide Elliott the daughter of Beatrice Elliott who was the daughter of Solomon and Eliza. I am 61 and Solomon had died before I was born but I clearly remember my g.grandmother Eliza who was known to me as "granny".She died in the 1960's when she was about 92 , I think. When I knew her she was in her mid-late eighties to early nineties and was living with Beatrice her daughter and Bob Braine my mum's stepfather. They were living in a house in Judge Heath Lane Hayes .I am guessing that the travelling stopped when Solomon died.
She was tiny and dressed in layers upon layers of long black dresses in what I assume to be the Victorian style. She had a permanent rag as a bandage over one eye ( which had been lost chopping wood). She took snuff and always had a yellowing handkerchief in her hand or the pocket of her black pinny. I cannot remember her saying much, (although my brother had memories of her telling him ghost stories when he was very young ) she just seemed to move silently around the house on invisible legs. She was VERY scarey ! I have a photograph of Solomon but none of her. I guess we did not consider her photogenic at the time. Shame !
The boxing booth was used in an early Hitchcock film called "The Ring" . I have it on dvd and video. I also have a book with a "still" from the film. Sharon
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:-\ Just recalled something else! A schoolfriend of mine lived at the junction of Bramford Lane and Kitchener Road in Ipswich - Bramford Lane runs parallel to Bramford Road. Her parents, now I think back, must have been of gypsy/traveller stock. Our mothers always exchanged pleasantries and Mrs Baldwin always called my mother 'mam' she had a 'ruddy' complexion and always wore a headscarf also, I feel certain, earrings. The Baldwins had a wood yard and kept a skewbald pony and cart - I think Mr Baldwin must also have had traveller links. Strangely all their children were very fair haired and skinned. Because of the proximity I wonder whether Mrs Baldwin was descended from the folk we've metioned above, she would have been born around 1908-10 I would guess. Sadly long gone. I will endeavour to make contact with my friend and find out whether she knows the maiden name of her mother. In the meantime does the name Baldwin ring any bells?
Maureen
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Hello Tracey, my name is Jean, I think Maureen has mentioned me. I think we share the same Elliott ancestors. My great grandfather was Solomon Elliott, married to Eliza Miller. His son
Robert was my grandfather, married to Ann de Courcey. Their daughter Joyce was my mother.
My cousin Ann and I have been looking at the family tree for some time now but have got a
bit stuck at Edward up in Scotland.
Hi Jean - I've managed to get back to the marriage cert in 1853 of Edwin Elliott and Sarah Slack that says his father was William Elliott (a Pedlar) and hers was George Slack (a Cutler). Haven't yet been able to find any of these folk in the 1851 or 1841 censuses in England or Scotland... if anyone else has achieved this feat I'd love to hear about it!
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I searched the 1841 census for Edward and found him (terrible reproduction) I think with his family, siblings and parents, John and Jane living in Chorlton upon Medlock aged 11 years. The age is right but I'm not sure - what do you think?
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Hi every one
I am after information/photos of my family the elliotts.
My name is James Solomon Elliott I was named after my grandfather Jim, his father was Solomon Elliott b1896 who was a boxingbooth fighter, he had two brothers Robert and Charlie and some sisters, his father Solomon Elliott b1868 ran the boxingbooth.
If anyone as any info please contact me
thanks
Jim
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H Jim - there's quite a long thread on your line on rootschat - just looked and couldn't see your message there yet - I think Edward (see the other threads) was the father of Louisa and Annie - amongst others and Louisa married my gt uncle in Ipswich in 1899 - get full details on line - they are a riddle I would like to solve so if you have any background info on Louisa and her husband Ernest James Stammers I'd love to hear from you! Best wishes, Maureen
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Hi Ann
thanks for the reply
sorry I did not get in touch sooner but I can`t seem to reply direct to your message.
I am after any information/photos you have, I have photos of both solomons and what I was told by my grandfather and that is it.
I will wait for your reply
Thanks
Jim
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Hi Maureen
I am sorry but I don't have any information on Louisa and her husband Ernest James Stammers
Regards
Jim
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some info
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Hello Jim,
My name is Jean and Ann is my cousin. My grandfather Robert was Solomon's
brother and my mother was Joyce born 1927.
Ann and I have been working on the family tree for some time now.
Best wishes
Jean
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Hello Jim
Solomon is my gg grandfather. My Nan Elizabeth was the daughter of Edith Solomon's daughter. If you want to let me have an email address I have a few photos I can share with you.
Tracy
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As already mentioned above Louisa (Elliott) and her brother (Thomas) seemed to visit their maternal grandparents at their house - 10 Henry Road, Shirley, Southampton. Here Louisa and her husband Ernest Stammers were lodging at the 1901 census. The census statess that other members of the travelling family were living nearby in their caravans. I have met a lady who lives quite close to Henry Road and she tells me the land at the end of that road has never been developed (presumably where the caravans were in 1901) There is now an application to build there. I guess anyone who is having problems tracing members of the travelling families of Elliott and West at the 1901 census might be able to find them at the above at the time. I've been endeavouring to draw up the family tree from Edward and Sarah down to Louisa, Solomon and siblings - seems virtually all have some descendants but still nothing on Louisa sadly.
Maureen
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Hi, my name is Wayne crabtree...very pleased to have read this thread, and have found out rather a lot already, regarding my grandparents, and great grandparents. My grandmother was a Margeret Rose Elliott, married Alfred Crabtree Circa 1945....They had two sons Thomas and Ronald, my father being the eldest, Thomas. My grandmother was the daughter of solomon Elliott, born 1896, and her mother Lillian. My grandparents, always lived in Abbeywood, and I myself still live locally...would very much like to recieve more information about my grandmother , as she passed away when I was very young. I have been told of her background, and that she was supposed to have also been a fighter in the booth. All information very much needed. many thanks
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I am trying to research my ancestry and have discovered that my parents were Romany and somehow connected to the fairground. I have discovered that Taylors are mentioned in Solomon and Edward Elliott fairground. My father was Henry Taylor and my mother was Grace. My grandparents were Thomas Taylor and Emily Trout. My Grt, grt grandfather was Plato Taylor.
I remember being taken to the fairground at Wansted Flats as a child and having free rides while my parents went to visit with someone.
Can anyone help me to make the connection?
Lena
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I am trying to research my ancestry and have discovered that my parents were Romany and somehow connected to the fairground. I have discovered that Taylors are mentioned in Solomon and Edward Elliott fairground. My father was Henry Taylor and my mother was Grace. My grandparents were Thomas Taylor and Emily Trout. My Grt, grt grandfather was Plato Taylor.
I remember being taken to the fairground at Wansted Flats as a child and having free rides while my parents went to visit with someone.
Can anyone help me to make the connection?
Lena
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hi Lena,
Plato Taylor is also my gg grand father i come down through his daughter Annie Taylor, i no the Taylor's were on wanstead flats but have not heard of fair ground connections, but there are a lot of people on here researching the Taylor's, maybe you could do this as a new post :)
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Hi Annie
Thanks for your reply. That makes us cousins twice removed, or something like that? I am new to this chat room stuff. Will you please tell me where I go to start a new post? I have a cousin in Oz who is also researching our line and would be interested in what I can find out.
Lena
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hi lena
on the page which shows what or who people are searching for at the top of the page in blue it says start new topic, so it would be looking for info on thomas taylor who married emily trout :)
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Hello everyone. This is my first message on Rootschat - thanks to Mo Studd for introducing me to this thread.
I am a descedant of Edward/Edwin Elliott b.1830 (my gt x 3 grandfather) as follows -> Edward Elliott (b.1850) and Hannah Maria West -> Thomas Edward Elliott (b.1870) and Ellen Mary Morgan -> Annie Elliott (b.1905) and William Daniel Symes -> my mother.
I'd love to make contact with other Elliott descendants to exchange information. I have some certificates to swap, but precious little information about the travelling/fairground life, which fascinates me. I did find a rather grim news cutting a year or so ago, but can't locate it.
Simon
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Hi i have just found out that my ggg grandparents were solomon elliott and eliza miller (the one with one eye) i would love any info that anyone has got about them and their relies. My nans mum was edith elliott married to a herbert james leonard saunders (i think) he left when my nan was young. I have a photo of solomon, but i would love any photos of any of the family if any one has any at all please could you share them with me, also any stories would be fantastic. thank you
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Hello Alison
We do indeed have a connection. My Nan Elizabeth was the daugher of Solomon's daughter Edith Elliott so Solomon would be my GG Grandfather. My Nan married a traveller so I still have a strong Romany side of the family but I didn't know too much about my Nan's fairground side.
I was talking to my Dad about my findings so far and he said that he had heard of your Gt Grandmother as taking on all comers in my Nan's tales about the fmaily so i guess the stories definitley got passed down.
I'm desperate to see any photos of them so would be great to know if you have any. I have a couple of my Gt Granny Edie (Solomon's daughter) which I can share with you if you like.
Tracy
Hi there my Nan is also edie's daughter my nan is margaret saunders elizabeths baby sister i would love a photo of gt granny edie if you have one. i have a photo of solomon elliott if you would like me to send it to you let me know thanks
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Something I found
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https://goo.gl/images/sUWwjq
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I believe Solomon is my great great grandfather and apparently I'm a spit and image of him
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What's your connection Ian ?