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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Topic started by: Janice M on Monday 06 September 10 18:44 BST (UK)
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I really hope someone can shed some light on this. ???
I will tell you what I know, and then possibly someone can figure out what happened.
Henry Carson Johnston (my relative) married Lillian McKinley on July 13, 1888 in Blythswood, Glasgow, Scotland. The first "strange" thing that happened, (and of course I just noticed) was that she must have already had "problems" with the law back then. It states on "Scottish Marriage Certificates" - "If a regular Marriage, signatures of officiating Minister and witnesses. If irregular, Date of Conviction, Decree of Declarator, or Sherrif's Warrent."
On the 1891 census it shows them having 2 children and living together.
44 Bardowie St.
Henry C Johnston head married 32 yrs Photographist Artist employed born Ireland
Lilley wife m 22 England
William son 21 months Lanarkshire Lanark
Jane dau 2 months
In 1905 (Lillian Johnston) Henry's wife supposedly arrives in Canada. (I can't find her passenger list.)
In 1906 (Jane or Jean) Henry's daughter, supposedly arrives in Canada. (I can't find her passenger list).
In 1908 (Henry Johnston) arrives in Canada. (I have his passenger list and his wife, daughter and son, are not on it).
In 1909 daughter "Jane" gets married in Canada.
Groom: Harry Alderton
Profession: Mechanic
Marital Status: Bachelor
Age: 28
Religion: Presbyterian
Usual Residence: Owen Sound
Father: Henry Alderton
Profession of father: - (just a hyphen written in space)
Name of mother: unknown
Bride: Jeanette Johnston
Profession: -
Marital Status: Spinster
Age: 19
Religion: Presbyterian
Usual Residence: Owen Sound
Father: Harry Johnstone
Profession of father: -
Mother: Lilian McKinley
Married on the 10th of June, 1909, at Owen Sound, by License, by Thomas A. Rodgers.
Witnesses: Chas. Ed. Huggins and Mary C. Randall, both of Owen Sound
Date of Registration: July 19th, 1909
In November of 1910, Lillian Johnston (m/s McKinley) attempts to cross over the border to the U.S. with a Samuel Grimason. They are "Debarred".
On the 1911 Census it shows Jane living with her family in Owen Sound.
Address: 481 - 13th Street West, Owen Sound, Ontario
Alderton Harry
Male
Head
Married
Birthdate: Dec 1881
Birthplace: England
Occupation: Chairmaker (Chair Factory)
Age: 30
Alderton Jean
Female
Wife
Married
Birthdate: Feb 1891
Birthplace: Scotland
Age 20
Alderton Lilean E
Female
Daughter
Single
Birthdate: Mar 1910
Birthplace: Ontario
Age: 1
In 1912, Lillian Johnston (m/s McKinley) is attempting to go to Cleveland, Ohio with a Samuel Grimason. They are rejected.
In May 1915 Henry Johnston travels from Canada to the U.S.
I will post other images on the next post
Janice
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Could someone possibly tell me what they could have done? I could not find them in the 1911 Census living in Toronto like they said. (Lillian McKinley & Samuel Grimason).
Janice
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There could be yet another twist to this story.
I can't see this, but there is a birth for a "John McKinley Grimason" in York with father Samuel Grimason and mother Lily McKinley.
(where would he have been, when they were trying to move to Cleveland?)
Still can't find them on the 1911 Census. Looked under Grimason - McKinley - Jones - Johnston
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Hi Janice M
The details of the birth of John Mckinley Grimason in the County of York and Division of Toronto are as follows:
Date of birth: August 30, 1908
Name of father: Samuel Grimason
Maiden name of mother: Lily McKinley
Residence of father: 270 Westmoreland Ave.
Occupation of father: Grocer
Name of person making return: A. Montgomery
Address of person making return: left blank
Date of registration: September 3, 1908
Susan
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There is a Form 30A for Lily Grimason, 50, b. Bedlington, England returning home to her husband, Samuel Grimason of 80 Smith St. Winnipeg, Manitoba. She had returned to England for a visit. She left Montreal June 30, 1922 and arrived back Sept 2, 1922 on the Saturnia.
On the 1916 Canadian census at 1523 Victoria Ave. Regina, Saskatchewan is Samuel Griemson, b. 1873 England, 43, Shoe salesman in a store with wife Lily Griemson,45, b. 1871 England with both showing an immigration year of 1905. Living with them is a lodger, John See, 24, bookkeeper.
If you google Immigration Act of 1903 or the same for 1907 for the US you will find reasons for refusing to admit people into the US. If you could not read a language they could refuse you entry - I guess their reasoning was that at some point you wouldn't be able to look after yourself in gainful employment? If you were epileptic you could be refused. If you were a contract labourer you could be refused entry and the list goes on..........
Immoral character (immigration judgement not mine) does enter into the picture and the fact that these people were not married and were travelling together to set up house might have been a factor in their debarrment.
Debbie
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Thank you both so much!
This has been the "most exciting" thing to hit this side of the family. ;D
Everyone needs a little scandal in their family history. ;)
I truly appreciate this information.
Thanks again.
Janice
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Hi
If you search the following sites, there appear to be death registrations for both Samuel and Lillian in Vernon, BC.
http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#p=collectionDetails&c=fs%3A1538285
http://search.bcarchives.gov.bc.ca/sn-145F5F9/gbsearch
I can check the details of these on my next trip to the family history library if you like.
Susan
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Hi Susan,
Thank you so much! I truly would appreciate any information you can gather. I had always wondered what had happened to her, as she seemed to disappear from Henry's and her daughter Jean's life. Her son William Johnston probably died in Scotland, but I really have no way of knowing.
Thank you again.
Janice
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Hi Janice M
I was finally able to get the look-ups done so if you would like to send me your email address via pm I will forward the information.
Sorry for the great delay....life just got a little hectic lately.
Cheers,
Susan
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Thank you so much. I have sent you my email address through personal message.
Janice
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Hi Janice,
My name is Sue and Jean and Harry Alderton of Owen Sound were my grandparents and I actually lived with them as a child.
Any questions you need answered please feel free to contact me--I can fill you in on about 4 generations of the family still living here in Ontario and across Canada. I have pictures that we can scan and send to you including ones of Sam and Gramma Grimason--her second husband. At one point while Gram was in a nursing home before she died there was 5 generations living--I am sure there is picture somewhere but I do not have one but I am sure someone in the family has it.
This is really exciting--hope to hear from you
Sue
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Sue
This is very exciting.
I have a photo of your great-grandfather's sister, who was my great-grandmother and I would love to share information and photos.
I am sending you a personal message with my email, as we don't like to put it on the main pages.
Hoping to hear form you.
Janice
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Hi Janice,
Re Samuel Grimason and Lillian McKinley.
Note the birth place of Samuel as being, England.
So looking at the Births index for Samuel Grimason's born in England prior to 1908 when John McKinley Grimason was born I find only one entry that could be your man.
Samuel Grimason was born in 1872 ( RG Births Index 1872 Sep Quarter, Hartley Wintney Vol: 2c, Page: 177 ).
His father would be Thomas James Grimason and His mother being Isabella Morris.
Thomas James Grimason was born in 1850 based on information given in the 1881 Cencus of England & wales "1881 Cesus England:
Name Thomas J. GRIMASON Relationship Head Condition M Gender M Age 30 Occupation Racquet Instructor Birthplace Woolwich, Kent, England Address 14 St Marys Villas, New Windsor, Berkshire, England PRO ref RG11/1323 Folio 140 Page 26 FHL film no. 1341321."
Plus his death being registered in 1905 "RG Death index 1905 Sep Quarter, Windsor, Vol 2C, Page: 235 Age: 55"
I do have Thomas James Grimason's siblings recorded as well.
This Family will go back in to county Armagh, Ireland that I am sure of.
As for the townland that again is another matter.
This is part of my Grimason One Name Study by the way.
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Hi Sue,
It has been quite sometime since I was on Roots Chat hence a tad out of the loop.
From what I understand you have an interest in Samuel Grimason who was born in 1872 at Farnborough, Southampton, England and Lilly Johnson nee Mc Kinley.
I see you have been in contact with Janice so you may now be on the same page regarding the children that we know that these two had.
Namely;
Samuel Grimason born 1907 and died 1907 in Haileybury, Nipissing, Ontario, Canada
John McKinley Grimason born 1908 in York, Yorkville, Ontario, Canada
As of to date no progress in finding any further information on John McKinley Grimason maybe you could have some information that may help in locating further information on him as he was not with his parents when they tried crossing into the USA in 1910 secondly he does not show up in the next census either so that leaves only two possibilities.
1. He died prior to 1910 and we have yet to locate the record of his death if it was recorded.
2. He was adopted out as his parents were not married at that time and Samuel was living in a bigamist relationship.
So I do not miss your reply could you please email me at grimason@one-name.org