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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Donegal => Topic started by: Elliebob on Monday 13 September 10 14:15 BST (UK)
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Bob and I were at Greenbank Church last year looking for his grandmother's grave. She died in Muff in 1941 but her family home was in Crehennan. There is a grave there with "Brooks" inscribed on it which was her maiden name. We wondered if she may have been buried there so when we got home we wrote to the minister to ask about the burial register, only to be told in his reply that they don't have one but are hoping to start one!
Does anyone know if this is unusual and how we could find out if Frances McConnell (nee Brooks) was buried there?
I shall look forward as always to helful and interesting replies and debate - I love it! Thanks everyone.
Ellen
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What religion is the church? Presbyterian churches usually don't keep burial registers and Church of Ireland registers sometimes didn't record burials for people who were not members of their church (such as Presbyterians).
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Thank you Aghadowey.
It was Greenbank Presbyterian church near Muff. I was not aware that Presbyterians did not keep burial records, I wonder why?
There must be someone who knows who is buried in that grave, as there were the remains of a wreath on it when we visited last.
We shall have to keep trying to find out!
Best wishes, Ellen
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Families generally know where the family plot is located in a graveyard. Some, not all, churches do have a graveyard map which shows the layout of the ground and usually a name for the plots.
Many Presbyterians are buried in the local parish (Church of Ireland) burying-grounds so be sure to chek there just in case.
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Greenbank Pres church has it's own graveyard alongside. There is only 1 grave marked with Brooks on a headstone there.
I have looked in Muff (CofI) churchyard which is the local one also other CofI and Pres churchyards in the area, and there are no Brooks headstones there.
So I will have to keep on trying!?!?
Thanks for your help- Ellen
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Ellen,
I checked Donegal Genealogy Resources & Muff in particular on line to see if I could get any info.for you.
At the end of their page there is a list of researchers & one of them has an address in Muff with an email address & might be a good source to try.
The local paper read in that area is the Donegal Peoples Press.(Larkin House,Letterkenny, fax.= code +74 912 8001)
If you wished to write to them it will be published free of charge if sent to Readers Letters.
Towards the bottom of that page I came across The McConnells Of Donegal & associated families.
The Brooks family is listed :
1 Eliza Jane Brooks, 1868 - 1906
2 Frances Brooks, 1865 - 1941
3 Samuel Brooks,
4 Samuel Brooks, ?? 1901
That would appear to be your Frances.
Thought you might be interested in that.
Maura
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Hi Maura
Thanks for looking for me - I do appreciate all the help given. I think that you have found my website listed on the Donegal resources page! It is a wonderful resource for all of us interested in Donegal and I try to send Lindel anything that may be of interest after I have been to Donegal.
I do have contacts with the Muff Parish Church (CofI) and hope that they will be able to look in their burial register as there is a McConnell grave there where she may be buried.
Meanwhile thanks to all of you who are/have been helping.
Ellen
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I know this posting is old, but i seem to have found the burial place of my Burnett ancestors.
There is a family grave in Greenbank cemetry Donegal.
It says there were no presbyterians buried there.
The grave contains Robert Burnett (Great Great grandfather)
Andrew Burnett (his son)
Kathleen Burnett (I think should be Catherine) his wife.
And a Martha J Burnett. (I think this may be my Grandmother)
Her married name was Foster.
Greenbank cemetry tell me she would not have been buried under
her maiden name of Burnett, and that I have the wrong plot.
But the names all fit here.
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There is a family grave in Greenbank cemetry Donegal.
It says there were no presbyterians buried there.
The grave contains Robert Burnett (Great Great grandfather)
Andrew Burnett (his son)
Kathleen Burnett (I think should be Catherine) his wife.
And a Martha J Burnett. (I think this may be my Grandmother)
Her married name was Foster.
Greenbank cemetry tell me she would not have been buried under
her maiden name of Burnett, and that I have the wrong plot.
But the names all fit here.
Is Greenbank Cemetery attached to a particular church? Are the names you've mentioned from a gravestone or burial records?
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Greenbank Church Donegal.
I think there are burial records kept there, as someone checked for me and told me I had the wrong family.
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What church? Presbyterian? Church of Ireland?
If the details you have came from burial records then it's extremely unlikely that a woman would be listed under her maiden rather than married name.
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the information I have is Cemetary/Burial ground.
Greenbank church. Donegal.
They were a Presbyterian family.
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You still are not answering my question as to what church this is. Do you mean Greenbank Presbyterian Church or the local Church of Ireland one?
Where EXACTLY did you get the information from?
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Greenbank Presbyterian church.
The search came up with Greenbank County Donegal Graveyards.
I scrolled down to the B's and Found four Burnetts.
Martha was there but buried under the name of Burnett, her maiden name, not her married name of Foster. I assumed this was my Grandmother as the three other names fitted.
She was born in 1855 I believe and died in Londonderry in 1924-26. The N. Ireland records office
could find no record of her death. They suggested I try Donegal, where she was born as she may have died there.
No record of her death there either. And I know she didn't die abroad.
I then emailed info [-- at --] kabristan.org.uk. and they told me Martha Burnett nee Foster was not my relative in that particular (I am assuming it was a grave) but I don't know.
The whole family I have found under the B's all came from Drung (Redcastle) Donegal.
I realise I was probably clutching at straws, as there were probably many different churches, there
and it was just a co-incidence that the four I found there were my relatives.
But I am sure you are right, that it is very unusual for a woman to be buried under her Maiden name.
Thank you for trying for me anyway.
Moderator Comment: e-mail edited, to avoid spamming and other abuses.
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Right- think you've gotten yourself into a bit of a muddle and have been given incorrect or confusing information when you tried to get more details.
Firstly there are different types of records-
1) gravestone inscriptions (not always accurate as can often be erected years after an event, may not include all burials in that particular plot)
2) burial records (cemetery records or church burial register/records). What you probably don't know is that most Presbyterian churches that have burying ground did not keep records of burials and also that Presbyterians were at one time entitled to burial in the Church of Ireland graveyards. This was because everyone had to pay tithes to the Established (Church of Ireland) church.
I found this, which is the source you've now given-
http://kabristan.org.uk/kabristan-indexes/ireland-indexes/53-ireland-county-donegal-graveyards-part-i-vii/750-county-donegal-graveyards-b
At the very top is says: Copies of full memorial inscriptions are available for £4.00 including postage. To order please use our order form. Please email * if you have any questions or require more information.
This means that the details in this list are from a gravestone NOT burial records.
If you go down to the Burnet listings it says Greenbank Church County Donegal Ireland which doesn't actually tell you the NAME of the church.
All this tells you is that there is a headstone with these names (or headstones- no way to tell is ALL the names appear on one stone together).
Assuming, and only as an assumption for illustative purposes, that all the names are on one stone it could read something like this- Andrew Burnett died 1870 his wife Kathleen died 1871 their daughter Martha J. died 1888 and her son Robert died 1888. Therefore Martha J. has been indexed under Burnett, as had her son, but she could have been married. Without seeming the actual wording there is no way to know what the names, relationships, etc. are.
I then emailed * and they told me Martha Burnett nee Foster was not my relative in that particular (I am assuming it was a grave) but I don't know.
Your relative would have been Martha Foster nee Burnett.
If you give me a few minutes I'm going to see if I can find Martha's death registration for you.
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Is this your Martha Burnett Foster in 1901 and 1911?
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Londonderry/No__4_Urban__West_Ward/Bishop_Street/1536609
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Londonderry/Londonderry_Urban__4_/Bishop_Street/602810
If so, she was born c1872 rather than c1855.
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Following through with the above Foster family-
Foster James Wilson of 11 Bishop Street Londonderry gentleman died 26 February 1956 Probate Londonderry 8 June to George Burnett Foster sergeant Royal Ulster constabulary and Andrew Foster costing clerk. Effects £4186 7s. 11d.
Which leads to this entry- died 1920 NOT 1924-5:
Probate of the Will of Martha Foster late of 11 Bishop Street in the County of the City of Londonderry Married Woman who died 27 May 1920 granted at Londonderry to James Burnett Joiner and Matthew W. Foster Farmer Effects £285
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So she DID die in Londonderry.
I wonder why they told me she hadn't. The recrods based in Belfast said they had searched all dates from 1914 to 1956 to when James Wilson foster (her husband) died.
Can I find her will anywhere?
I want to thank you for all the information you have given me. This was puzzling me that I couldn't find
anything for her.
Regards
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The probate extract DOES NOT say that she died in Londonderry- please read what it says- her address was Londonderry and probate was granted there but place of death is not mentioned. Her Will should be on file at PRONI, Belfast.
You could check Derry papers for a death notice which might give place of death. If she's buried in Derry City Cemetery they might have place of death in their records but I understand they now charge for lookups.
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Hi,
I'm not sure if this helps but on 5 Dec 1901 James Foster married Martha Burnett in Strand Second Presbyterian Church, Londonderry.
Regards
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Thank you so much for all your help.
Regards
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Since my last posts I have been back to Muff and found that Frances McConnell (nee Brooks) is buried in the CoI churchyard in Muff in the McConnell grave with her husband and in laws. There is a small exercise book which served as a register and is now back in the church office at St Peter's in Derry which serves the group of parishes. My mil and fil's ashes are now scattered there too.
A cousin of Bob's was one time minister of Greenbank Presbyterian church and he confirmed that there was no burial register when he was there in the 1970s.
I haven't been on Rootschat for some time - good to be back!
Ellen
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Great! Thanks for that bit of information.