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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Northumberland => Topic started by: Jolt on Tuesday 19 October 10 22:14 BST (UK)
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I've been struggling with this for some time and hope that there's someone out there that might think of a new direction to take.
I can't find either a birth or death for my 3xg-grandfather Richard Embleton, but here's what I do know about him.
He was married to Elizabeth McKnight on 17 Nov 1812 at St John, Newcastle by licence. The licence states he is " age 21 and upwards".
They proceeded to have 11 children, all baptised at St John, the last being baptised 14 April 1829, and there is nothing in the transcript about Richard being deceased.
The death of their eldest son, Thomas, was announced in the Newcastle Courant 20th July 1833 and states that he is "Thomas, son of the late Mr Richard Embleton, tanner".
Richard makes the newspapers on several other occasions, mostly to do with his bankruptcy! It is announced in the London Gazette on 12 Dec 1828 and describes him as "now or late of the Town and County of Newcastle" and continues to do so until 1 Dec 1829 when he is described as just "late".
I can't find a burial for either him or Thomas at any church in Newcastle or for any other Embleton children for that matter.
Would a bankrupty be pursued against someone who was dead?. Two of the assets sold as part of the bankruptcy were two life assurance policies for £1000 each, and these were advertised to be sold on 31 July 1829. Would he be alive or dead at that point?
I should point out that the parish records I've been looking at are the Bishop's Transcripts on LDS.
Anyone got any bright ideas of where to look next??
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Would you like to post his childrens names to save me time searching, as you already have their details,please
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Hello jolt! I don't know if this will help, but I have a fiche of the 1828 Pigot's Business Directory for Northumberland. There are a number of Embletons listed and some could be YOUR Richard who may have actually been involved in more than a tannery business:
Ann Embleton, shop-keeper and dealer in sundries, 6 Pilgrim Street
Richard Embleton, tanner, Westgate
Richard Embleton, Forth Bank, Brass foundry and copper smith
Richard Embleton & Co., Iron foundry, Forth Bank
Richard Embleton & Co., Iron Merchant, Forth Bank
From this set of directory listings it is impossible to tell if your Richard may have been this "other" Richard, too. I have a set of parliamentary registers for Newcastle for 1836 but this might be too late for your needs. If you would like me to check that for any Embletons, please ask!! ;D Pat
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Hi Radcliff,
Thanks for the quick reply. The children are:
Elizabeth bap 25 Jun 1813
Ann bap 14 May 1814 (on 1841 census)
Thomas bap 13 Aug 1816 died 15 Jul 1833
George bap 11 Feb 1818
William Henry bap 21 Oct 1819 died 23 Jan 1879 ( my g-g- grandfather - I know quite a lot about him)
Ellen Maria bap 16 Mar 1821 (on 1841 & 1851 census)
Eleanor Maria bap 22 Apr 1822
Richard Edward Heaton bap 29 Aug 1823
Charlotte Faulkner bap 3 Jun 1825 (on 1841 census)
John McKnight bap 18 Sep 1826 (on 1841 census)
Charles James bap 14 Apr 1829 (on 1841 & 1851 census)
Where I've indicated that they are on the census that means that they are living with their mother at Dean Court in Newcastle on the census in those years.
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Hi Pat,
In answer to your query, yes, all those Richard Embleton's are the same man. The real reason I want to find out where he is buried is so I can dig him up and throw stones at him for losing ALL that money!!! ;D
What do the parliamentary registers tell you? Are they like electoral registers? If so, I doubt it's worth looking for my Embletons - they'd have been too poor to vote by then. :-\
Thanks for replying,
Jo.
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Richard is still listed as a tanner in 1829 Newcastle ,
There is a death recorded for a Richard,Castle Ward June 1845,I don't no his age or how to look it up sorry ,I think you would have to find the burial or order the certificate
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Hi Ratcliff,
Thanks for that, but I'm pretty certain that Richard died at some point between 1828 and 1833. I did wonder if he committed suicide and might not be buried in a churchyard. Is that likely, do you think?
Against this theory is that the suicide of a bankrupt industrialist would surely have made the papers, and it still leaves the problem of where Thomas is buried.
Thanks again for helping,
Jo.
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Even if Richard did commit suicide he would still be recorded in the church records as being buried ,but it would state by his own hand,I have seen a few records for other people stating this ,they couldn't just put his body in a hole in a field,Thomas I will have a look for this afternoon,I did look over in Durham last night ,but I didn't find any thing positive,
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Jolt,
What do you mean by " too poor to vote by then" ?
Michael
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I was thinking that you had to be a male landowner to vote at the time, but, having just looked in my British History book, it was that Reform Act of 1832 that extended the vote to men paying more that £10 a year in rent. A female house holder wouldn't have had the vote at any rate.
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From snippetts in the newspapers, it would appear that Richard or his company Richard Embleton & Co was not just rich, but very rich !.
Although described as a "tanner" he had an iron foundry, several houses and property, at least two keel boats ( to take coal from Newcastle to ships lying in deeper water nearer mouth of the Tyne)
The Newcastle Courant of 12 Dec 1829 describes him as " late of the Town and County of Newcastle upon Tyne". Taking this on face value, he must have died before 12 Dec 1829.
Have you searched for his death/burial in the records of Newcastle Parish Churches and Cemeteries ( eg Ballast Hills, Westgalte Hill) ?
Michael
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I checked the Canterbury Prerogative Court Index to Death Duty registeres. One looks promising in that it probably involves this family
1825 February
Edward Embleton, administrator Richard Embleton, Newcastle upon Tyne vol 1 folio 51
I also checked for burials in surrounding parishes:
Longbenton, Wallsend, Gosforth, Newburn and across the river--Heworth, Whickham, Winlaton, Jarrow, and a little further out-Tynemouth and South Shields. Sorry I don't have Gateshead.
I also checked the national burial index.
Janis
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The Newcastle Courant of 12 Dec 1829 describes him as " late of the Town and County of Newcastle upon Tyne". Taking this on face value, he must have died before 12 Dec 1829.
Michael
Wouldn't this phrasing just mean that he used to live in Newcastle? :-\
If he was dead, wouldn't it have said "the late Richard Embleton"?
:-\
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Ruskie,
You could be right. I am not an expert in " journalese" of the 1820s and some of their reporting used quaint expressions.
Michael
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Hi folks,
Thanks for you hard work! Michael, I've searched all the parish cemeteries but not Ballast Hills. I didn't realise there was a municipal cemetery around at the time, so that's got to be my next port of call.
Janis, the Canterbury Prerogative Court Index looks very promising; I haven't come across an Edward before, so he would be a new piece of the puzzle.
As regards the use of "late of the Town and County of Newcastle", there is a usual terminology used in the London Gazette to announce a bankruptcy which starts " Whereas a Commission of Bankrupt is awarded and issued forth against X of the town of Y and County of Z"; in Richard's case, however, it states "Richard Embleton, now or late of the town and county of" as early as 12/12/1828 which to me indicates he might already be deceased.
Janis, thaks for your hard work. I've checked Gateshead and also Ryton (they had a country estate there), and every parish in Northumberland. I'm now determined to get in my car and drive up to Tyne & Wear Archives next week. Thanks to everyone for giving me a more precise avenues of enquiry.
Jo.
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Jo, Today I had opportunity to browse Trade Directories in Newcastle Library.
The earliest entry I saw for Richard was in the 1811 directory
"Tanner. Richard Embleton Westgate"
No sign of him connected to other trades such as Iron, Brass etc
In Wilkinson's of 1821-22& 1823, he is listed as Tanner at West-gate and Iron Founder at Forth Banks
Pigot's 1822
The Brass Foundry ( Forth Banks) Brass Foundry ( Forth Banks) and Iron Merchants ( Forth Banks) are listed under " Richard Embleton and Co )
Ann listed under Shopkeepers/Dealers at 6 Pilgrim St.
Richard listed under Tanners at Westgate
Humbles of 1824 has Richard as Tanner at Darn Crook( adjacent to St Andrew's Parish Church) and West-gate. And the company as Iron Foundry at Forth Banks.
Pigots 1828-1829. Brass Iron and Iron Merchants a;; Forth Banks, under company nam, Ann still at 6 Pilgrim St, and Richard listed individually as Tanner at westgate.
The Ihler directory 1833-34 has Ann with Eating House at 22 Pilgrim St
Pigots 1834 has Ann as shopkeeper at 6 Clayton Court, Pilgrim St.
No mention of Richard, but the only Iron Foundry in Forth Banks is " Robson Riddell and Co" Did they get the company then ?
Michael
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Hi Michael,
It's very interesting that Robson Riddell got the iron-foundry as he's mentioned in one of the London Gazette announcements which, basically, sets a date for arbitration between Richard, Robson Riddell and John Wailes concerning the matter of the iron-foundry at Skinner Barn in Newcastle, which was being run by Richard Embleton and Robson Riddell in copartnership as Richard Embleton & Co. Riddell obviously bought Richard's share.
Thanks again,
Jo.