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General => Armed Forces => World War Two => Topic started by: GuyMassey on Thursday 25 November 10 21:11 GMT (UK)
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I am looking for other pictures of 620 Squadron Short Stirlings designated QS- My father flew in QS-H through to 1945. Picture of the a/c & crew attached. Most published pictures of Stirlings carry the ML- serial.
Crew:
George, Jonnie, Vic, Phil Dale (Pilot - awarded the Croix de Guerre for services to the resistance), Gus, Snowy, Barry (my father) QSH Nov 1943 (RAF Keevil?)
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Guy,
Nice photos - reminiscent of an Airfix boxtop.
No obvious source of 620 Sqn photos, though.
Dave
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Operation_Market_I_-_02.jpg
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Thanks for the wiki link, I have devoured that one before. On checking my dad's logs I see that the crew were with 299 for both D-Day and Market Garden. Log page attached. On 28.10.44 there is a reference to an op called "Bluebottle" Was this in support of the land forces?
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search images on google
ask for 620 Squadron Short Stirlings
there are a lot of photos and info
sylvia
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Thanks for the tip Sylvia. I have already done that and nearly all the photo's are from just two publications which I already have on my bookshelf.
I am hoping that through this forum some more unpublished pictures like the ones that I have posted may surface.
:)
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Hi
My Sgt is really interested in 620 Sqn. He has some medals from someone on that Sqn. I am not sure who but you never know there may be a connection. In the meantime if you havent already found it you might like to contact:
620 Squadron Register Flt Lt A T Gamble RAF(Retd) 31 Fairfields, St Ives, Cambridgeshire PE27 5QG: tel 01480 464212 which I got from the RAF Register of Assns...
Might be worth trying the Air Historical Branch at Northolt (dont have their contact details to hand).
Have you discovered the Stirling books yet? I started with Michael Bowyers the Stirling Story.
Please let us know how you get on cos those are fab photos.
Dee
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Guy, I believe that "QS-" were the codes for the squadron's "C" Flight. You could do a lot worse than contact the historian Steve Smith, who is a proper "gen man" on the Short Stirling squadrons. I will PM you his email address.
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I notice on the 17th Sept, he says "ex Stoney Cross" which is/was just up the road from here in the New Forest. According to the local history booklet, the Americans vacated the airfield at the beginning of the month and it was then used as a base for the Heavy Glider Servicing Unit.
Although the Forestry Commission took up the concrete runways years ago, the area is still completely open and we spent many happy hours up there as kids in the '70s picking up bits and pieces. The post war roads run along the length of the runways.
Fred :)
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Guy
QS was the designation for both 192 Squadron and 620 Squadron, would you like me to supply the full details of the squadron from formation to disbandment? post a reply here if you do.
BTW QS-H was designated from 6.43 to 9.46 to the Halifax VII PP365
Mike
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Hi Mike,
Yes please! I would be fascinated to see any information that you may have.
It is my understanding aircraft squadron codes were often duplicated across several different aircraft during WWII. My father tells me that they had one Stirling that flew several missions with different codes on each side until some erk noticed. It was the aircraft number that was supposed to be unique. However aircraft were frequently repaired from major parts of others and as a consequence even that unique number could be confused between more than one airframe. A sort of "cut and shut" out of wartime necessity. This led to some vary varied flying characteristics between otherwise identical models.
Regards
Guy
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Mike,
I am not sure about 192 Squadron using QS. As you probably know they were part of 100 Group (electronic countermeasures).
Guy, I have used the Mark 1 eyeball to go through the codes listing, looking for QS-H, in Air Britain's The Stirling File.
This throws up Stirling MkIII BF503 (previously coded U with 620 squadron).
BF503 was from a batch delivered between March and May 1943.
The aeroplane's record is 149 Sdn > 620 Sdn > 1665 Conversion Unit. It survived the war and was Struck Off Charge 28/03/46.
Dave
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Lots of log entries for BF503 one in particular as follows;
8.10.43 Ops BREMEN, Double fighter attack, ME110 & FW190 on bombing run. In all 7 enemy a/c sighted tonight in target area. Slight damage to a/c. Fighters engaged. No hits claimed. 5hrs 40mins
Father has noted in the margin "Goodbye 503, struck of charge 4/3/46 after two stints at Heavy Conversion Unit 1665"
Well done for tying this a/c to QS-H. Thank you.
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Dave
I have a 'bible' with information of just about every RAF flying unit that has been in existance since 1912 giving their ancestry, formation and disbandment which is where I get this info from. It states that 192 Squadron were only allocated the QS designation for the period April to September 1939, but it was still allocated to them. I can give you any info you want from this bible which was bought for 50p from a library sale and is a great help for the research I'm currently doing for a still living bomber pilot from 44 Squadron whose just celebrated his 90th birthday.
Guy here's the info for you:
620 SQUADRON
TF Allocated for the period April to September 1939.
Formed 17th June 1943 at Chedburgh from 'C' Flight of 214 Squadron.
QS (6.43-9.46) Stirling III EF197 QS-Z, IV LJ566 QS-L; Halifax VII PP365 QS-H.
D4 (3.44-9.46) Stirling IV LJ566 D4-Y; Halifax VII NA458 D4-A.
Also used Stirling I W7465; Halifax III MZ682, IX RT769;
Dakota III KG344, IV KJ939; Horsa I LH403.
Disbanded 1st September 1946 at Aqir, Palestine, to become 113 Squadron.
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I am looking for other pictures of 620 Squadron Short Stirlings designated QS- My father flew in QS-H through to 1945. Picture of the a/c & crew attached. Most published pictures of Stirlings carry the ML- serial.
Crew:
George, Jonnie, Vic, Phil Dale (Pilot - awarded the Croix de Guerre for services to the resistance), Gus, Snowy, Barry (my father) QSH Nov 1943 (RAF Keevil?)
I now believe that these pictures were taken at RAF Chedburgh, the aircraft is a MkIII and it was taken when he was with 620 squadron. Father later flew MkIV's from Keevil with 299 squadron during D-Day and Arnhem.
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Have you thought of speaking to the RAF Museum at Hendon and the Imperial War Museum.
They have a huge number of photographs. They won't probably be able to pinpoint a particular crew but they will be able to search under 620 Squadron. A friend of mine went to the IWM and got links to about 30 x 75(NZ)Sqn photos!
Dee
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The Royal Air Force at Arnhem.
http://www.aviationmegastore.com/img/prod/full/4/9/85827_0.jpg
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Please find some photos of 620 SQN My Dad James Read severed with them from 1943 to 1946.
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Hi Mike,
Yes please! I would be fascinated to see any information that you may have.
It is my understanding aircraft squadron codes were often duplicated across several different aircraft during WWII. My father tells me that they had one Stirling that flew several missions with different codes on each side until some erk noticed. It was the aircraft number that was supposed to be unique. However aircraft were frequently repaired from major parts of others and as a consequence even that unique number could be confused between more than one airframe. A sort of "cut and shut" out of wartime necessity. This led to some vary varied flying characteristics between otherwise identical models.
Regards
Guy
Aircraft Battle Damage Repairs they call it today. It is a very important part of Military engineering.
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Good Afternoon Guy,
I stumbled across this post whilst doing some research on 620Sqn for a friend of mine whose father was a photographer during the 2nd World War. Whilst going through his barn in France he stumbled across 16 pictures of 620 Sqn taken just before D-Day by his father. Some aircraft were displaying invasion stripes on their wings. We believe they are probably taken at Fairford but there is at least one picture with the QS registration.
He has an appointment to show the pictures to the IWM in London this week.
To his knowledge these pictures haven't seen the light of day since 1944/45 and certainly have never been published. I hope to be able to digitise them for him next week and put them on-line so if you are interested I'll keep you posted. Do you happen to know the name of the photographer(s) who took the pictures you have? It may well have been the same chap.
Regards, Mick Bannister
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Hello Mick,
I have no idea who took the photos. Sadly my father died in November 2013, closely followed by my wife in December. I have only just picked up my family history again after that double-whammy!
I will have to double check but I think father had transferred to 299 sdn by D-Day, he was certainly with them for Arnhem.
I am most interested in seeing the photos that you mention, I want to model my father's aircraft and any reference material would be useful.
Regards
Guy
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Hi Guy,
I have permission of the owner of the photos to show them to you.
We have put them on a webpage - hope you get some new information from them.
The IWM are going to feature them so you are getting a private showing of some very rare photos not seen by anyone for over 70 years, so please they are for your eyes only.
Thank you
Mick on behalf of David Hare
http://www.davidharephotography.com/
Moderator comment: Password removed as you state in your post they are for Guy's eyes only. Internet robots index this site very quickly. The password has been sent by personal message
http://www.rootschat.com/help/pms.php
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A friend from my family history group has contacted me to tell me that his father Flight Sergeant Ken Hillier served as a tail gunner in 620 Squadron.
Ken contributed to the book 'Stirlings in Action with the Airborne Forces' by Dr Dennis J Williams published by Sword and Pen 2007. Amongst the many photos of 620 Squadron's machines is one of Ken Hillier.
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I am responding to the picture with the aircrew standing in front of the Halifax. It was posted some time ago so I hope contributors are still active on the thread. The airman second on the left is my dad, he was in 620 squadron at Chedburgh and then at Fairford. Sadly he passed away in 1969 before I was old enough to be interested. If anyone knows anything about this photograph or my dad I would love to hear from you.
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Hi Mike,
Enjoyed reading about 620 sqn as my father Flight Sgt Frank Edward Reed was a member of Sterling EH945 That was shot down over Hanover 27th Sept 1943.
only 2 years ago his grave was located at Hanover where i stood next to his grave for the very 1st time.
Like you i am some one who enjoys marathon challenges however mine are through walking see
www.walkyourowntalk.yolasite.com
Next year i plan to walk from Chedburgh to Hanover in memory him and his crew.
Flight Sgt F Emery, Flight Sgt H R Kerslake, Sgt W Howes, Sgt W Ewanko,Sgt Cavey and Sgt J L Perry.
I currently livein NZ but will be coming home Jan 25th next year.
Any advise would be welcome
NIGEL.
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I was wondering if anybody had any pictures of Stirling III BF 576?