RootsChat.Com
Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Merionethshire => Topic started by: Retpara on Tuesday 11 January 11 11:12 GMT (UK)
-
Hi Rootchaterss,
Is there some kind person out there from the Tywyn, Llanegryn and Llangelynin areas that could possibly help with the names of two churches in these areas. On my Gt Gt Grandparents marriage certificate shows them as being married at the Parish church in the Parish of llanegryn in 1843 but no name of a church, curate at the time was a Thomas Jones (don't know if this helps).
The other church was where my Gt Grandparents were married and was recorded on their marriage certificate as the Parish Church in the Parish of Llangelynin in 1872, also the rector shown at that time was a J.E. Davies.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Retpara.
-
St Mary & St Egryn, Llanegryn
St Celynnin, Llangelynnin
I think those are what you want. From the Diocese of Bangor website, which lists the parishes under their deanery. Both have photos, very picturesque.
http://www.churchinwales.org.uk/bangor/diocese/
A [far from Wales]
-
Hi Ainslie,
Many thanks for your help it really is appreciated, the one St Mary's Llanegryn confirms my feelings for my Gt Gt Grandparents, but slightly confused about St Celynin,s church. Would you happen to know if St Celynin's in Llangelynin is different from the St Celynin's in Llwyngwril which is about a mile from each other as they both have the same name.
Many thanks,
Retpara.
-
Sorry, that's beyond my compass.
A
-
The church at Llangelynin is disused but is open to visitors. The one at Llwyngwril is now the main church for the area.
see http://www.visionofbritain.org.uk/gaztext_page.jsp?u_id=10226119
David
-
Llwyngwril is/was the largest village within the Parish of Llangelynin and the Parish Church was situated there.See;
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0b8n/
Regards
William Russell Jones.
-
I can't resist mentioning members of my own families!Three members of my Stephens family married at the same church post 1900.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
-
Hi Everyone,
Many thanks to all for your input, on one of the links I see the church in Llwyngwril was opened in 1846, would anyone know the date the other church became dissused, as the date my Gt Grandparents were married was 1872 and as they lived on a farm in Rhoslefain it would have been closer to them.
Many thanks,
Retpara.
-
Well Retpara,the piece quoted in the Genuki page for the parish which I gave you the link was written in 1868.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
-
Hi Retpara
The church of Llangelynin is nearly halfway between Rhoslefain and Llwyngwril, and I think it makes sense that this is the one you're after. Services are held there monthly. If you ever get a chance, it's worth visiting- It's so special.
D'you want me to upload a photo of the place? I go there quite often for a bit of peace. ;)
-
I have a booklet on the old church at Llangelynin but can't find it. I believe that all services took place at the new church when it opened, except for some burials which, I think, carried on into the 20th century.
What was the name of your family?
On the 1861-1871 censuses, only the Thomas family is at Rhoslefain. In 1881, they are at Rhoslefain Farm and another Thomas family at the smithy. The parish is Llangelynin, so baptisms and marriages may have taken place there, although Llanegryn is nearer.
The 1881 census gives all birth places as Llangelynin but Llanegryn, Towyn or Llangelynin in 1861-71.
David
-
Hi all,
Once again many thanks to all for your inputs, I will try and answer all questions firstly thank you Manonros that would be very much appreciated as I believe there was a pew inside with the old family name of Angel on it.
The other names all together was my Gt Gt Grandparents were Angel these were married at St Mary's church in Llanegryn and then my Gt Grandfather by the name of Lewis married into the Angel family belived to be married at St Celyin's church, Llanegryn. They all lived together at Tycroes farm, Rhoslefain, near to Castell Fawr.
Any other assistance would be greatly appreciated.
Retpara.
-
I have found the booklet about Llangelynin church. This is a quote, which also mentions a church at Rhoslefain: -
"... Another new church, this time at Llwyngwril, was built in 1842. Yet another church , much smaller, appeared at at Rhoslefain in the late nineteenth century, and Fairbourne acquired a substantial stone church of its own in 1927.
The church at Llwyngwril effectively replaced the old church on the cliff which was already, by 1842, inconveniently removed from the centre of population. Thereafter, the old church was used only for occasional burials. It was virtually abandoned for some seventy years and became severely decayed. It was preserved by careful restoration in 1917 and further work in 1972 ..."
There is an annual service held there, in August, and was licenced again for marriages in 1972.
Each pew carries the name of a land owner and his properties. Ty-croes is the only one which seems not to carry the owner's name. Castell Fawr was owned by Griffith Jones.
The attached extract from a photograph shows the Ty-croes pew.
-
Hi dcbnwh,
Many thanks for the information and photograph it all helps. By the dates you have given it seems this church would have been closed when my Gt Grandparents were married in 1872, so it seems they would have probably been married in the one in Llwyngwril, but now a spanner has been thrown in the works with a church in Rhoslefain (lol), which would have been really close to Ty-Croes Farm.
So back into research mode also have just checked on my Gt Gt Grandfather Hugh Angel 1841 census and it appears he was working for a Hugh Jones at Castell Fawr Farm, who was Griffith Jones father showing him to be 6 yrs old at the time.
Once again many thanks for the info,
Retpara.
-
John Lewis married Elizabeth Angel in St Celynnin Llangelynin in 1872 ( see http://www.northwalesbmd.org.uk/bmd_welcome.html)
-
Many many thanks Dolgellau for your input, this proves we were right all along, which will help us to put some finishing touches to my family tree so I can arrange a visit to North Wales knowing where to go.
Many thanks,
Retpara.
-
I should have looked this up before.
The chapel at Rhoslefain was built c1890
http://www.churchinwales.org.uk/bangor/diocese/parish_details/ystumaner/stmairrhoslefain.html
David
-
Something else that I should have looked at.
On Ancestry.co.uk, there is a tree which gives the precise details
Marriage of John Lewis to Elizabeth Angel
15th June 1872
St Celynin's Church, Llwyngwril, Merionethshire
Hugh Angel married Gwen Pugh
28th march 1843
St Mary's Church, Llanegryn, Merionethshire
The tree then gives the descendants of Gwen Ellen Lewis, born 22nd September 1886 in Blaenau Ffestiniog, but none of the other children.
David
-
There is also a tree for David Owen Lewis, Gwen's brother, which includes a photograph of him and his wife.
This tree has Hugh, David, Evan and Mary but none of the other children shown on the 1901 census - John, Gwen and Richard.
David
-
Hi David,
Many thanks for that information, this seems to be part of my family tree. You didn't happen by chance to notice the name of the family tree did you as I also have my family tree on the same site, (with the surname of Winter), but no photographs and all help is greatly appreciated to complete the family tree.
Once again many thanks for help,
Retpara.
(P.S. By chance would anyone know how to get burial details of St Mary's/St Egryn's Church, Llanegryn, as I am almost sure this is where my Gt Gt Grandparents Hugh and Gwen Angel would have been buried).
-
This is the link to David Lewis
http://trees.ancestry.co.uk/tree/8389580/person/-956655065?ssrc=
Also
http://trees.ancestry.co.uk/tree/11812851/person/-392640181?ssrc=
and
http://trees.ancestry.co.uk/tree/18439010/person/659771337?ssrc=
The best places to find the burial, and other, records would be at The National Library in Aberystwyth or the Records Office in Dolgellau. It is often useful to try both because the National Library is mainly Bishop's Transcripts and Dolgellau the Parish Registers.
Getting decent prints can be a problem, particularly in Dolgellau where they are quite expensive.
The Gwynedd Family History Society has some records but not, I think, the ones that you want.
David
-
http://www.scribd.com/doc/9147119/Tonfanau-Farm-Tywyn-MerionethshireWales
I go through Rhoslefain when we go motorcycle racing at Tonfanau, about 1 mile down the lane. I was interested in the old derelict farm and buldings and so decided to do a bit of research on it.
Absolutely no help with your request but someone might find it of use. :)
Just spotted a Margret Angel in my doc.
-
Just a thought. You may have seen these already.
There is an 1843 will of Mary Angel, spinster of Towyn, who mentions a nephew Hugh Angel. There are also other wills or bonds for Angels in Towyn. The records for Towyn, held in Dolgellau, have been transcribed and so much easier to search.
see http://cat.llgc.org.uk/cgi-bin/gw/chameleon?sessionid=2011011313222729233&skin=profeb&lng=en&inst=consortium&function=EXTERNAL_CONTENT&externalurltype=856u&externalurl=http://dams.llgc.org.uk/integration/behaviour/llgc-id:708243/fedora-bdef:zoom/llgc-id:708242/86.129.248.161/en
David
-
Hello again David,
Thank you very much for your help it's been invaluable to me. I'm sorry to be a pain but the links that you have placed won't allow me to view them even though I have credits in my ancestry account. Would one of the trees be a Lloyd family tree, as when I do a search of my own, it won't let me view this tree either, yet I can search for individual people and view them, so I don't know what is happening with my searches.
Many thanks,
Retpara.
-
I am not sure why you can't see the trees but it might be because they are American and you need world membership, which I have.
They are Lloyd trees and Gwen's husband, Richard Lloyd, was born in America, although the rest of the family were born in Wales.
There are two other Lloyd trees but Gwen has no surname.
However, Gwen Angel married John Jones in 1866. See: -
Note that this link might not work directly and it might be necessary to copy and paste it
http://www.ukbmdsearch.org.uk/certapp.php?type=marriages&data=ANGEL|Gwen|JONES|John|Dolgellau,%20Civil%20Marriage|Gwynedd%20-%
20Meirionnydd%20Area%20Register%20Office%20(Dolgellau)|1866|1866||EA:DOL/04/E99|A|758|northwales|EG&lang=
Alternatively go to http://www.northwalesbmd.org.uk/marriages.html and search on Gwen Angel in 1866
And there are matches for Gwen Jones on the censuses
John And Gwen Jones in 1871
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=7618&iid=MERRG10_5687_5690-0413&fn=Gwen&ln=Jones&st=d&ssrc=&pid=3504633
John And Gwen Jones in 1881
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8059&iid=MERRG11_5477_5480-0446&fn=Gwen&ln=Jones&st=d&ssrc=&pid=12954208
John And Gwen Jones in 1891
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=6897&iid=MERRG12_4640_4642-0295&fn=Gwen&ln=Jones&st=d&ssrc=&pid=1411947
I can't find them in 1901, although there is a possible match for Gwen in 1911 but I don't have full access.
It sounds as thought the Lloyd trees may be incorrect and that Gwen Angel married John Jones, Living at least until 1891
This is Richard Lloyd 1871
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=7618&iid=MERRG10_5690_5694-0460&fn=Richard&ln=Lloyd&st=d&ssrc=&pid=3514181
It is possible that Gwen married again before 1871 but I can't find a record. The other problem is that, from 1871, Gwen Lloyd gives her birth place as Llandderfel, although her age is correct. In 1871, she is described as the daughter-in-law of John and Elizabeth Jones, who could be the parents of her first husband.
Gwen Lloyd 1871
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=7618&iid=MERRG10_5687_5690-0097&fn=Gwen&ln=Lloyd&st=d&ssrc=&pid=3500141
Gwen Lloyd 1881
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8059&iid=MERRG11_5540_5544-0992&fn=Gwen&ln=Lloyd&st=d&ssrc=&pid=12966623
Gwen Lloyd 1891
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=6897&iid=MERRG12_4640_4642-0249&fn=Gwen&ln=Lloyd&st=d&ssrc=&pid=1367825
Gwen Lloyd 1901
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=7815&iid=MERRG13_5251_5255-0255&fn=Gwen&ln=Lloyd&st=d&ssrc=&pid=33164333
Regards,
David
-
Hi David,
Sorry for the slow response, bit under the weather today think, it;s the flu bug just checked these links are working fine, thank you very much. Gwen Jones who married John Jones was my Gt Grandmothers eldest sister. So this can be added to my family tree all the dates correspond exactly, but as you say the Lloyd family is the wrong family. There seems to be a fault with Ancestry.co.uk at the moment, as I can now access the census forms and it allows me to save to shoebox, but won't allow me to save the image to my computer, so not sure what is going on.
Best regards,
Retpara.
-
http://www.scribd.com/doc/9147119/Tonfanau-Farm-Tywyn-MerionethshireWales
I go through Rhoslefain when we go motorcycle racing at Tonfanau, about 1 mile down the lane. I was interested in the old derelict farm and buldings and so decided to do a bit of research on it.
Absolutely no help with your request but someone might find it of use. :)
Just spotted a Margret Angel in my doc.
I HAVE A LOT OF aNGELS AS ANCESTORS, INCLUDING GWENDOLINE, NEE HUGHES,llo again David,
Thank you very much for your help it's been invaluable to me. I'm sorry to be a pain but the links that you have placed won't allow me to view them even though I have credits in my ancestry account. Would one of the trees be a Lloyd family tree, as when I do a search of my own, it won't let me view this tree either, yet I can search for individual people and view them, so I don't know what is happening with my searches.
Many thanks,
Retpara.
[/quote]