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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Northamptonshire => Topic started by: Twojugs on Tuesday 08 February 11 14:44 GMT (UK)
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My Great-grandfather was Robert Goodliffe who was born in Wakerley c1861 and lived in Wakerley, Weekly, East Carlton and Kettering. However, I can find no evidence of him before his marriage in 1887 to Eliza Glithero.
I would welcome any information about him, particularly his parents, to be able to continue the tree.
Thanks
Tony Johnson
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His marriage certificate will have the name of his father (unless he was illegitimate)
The witnesses may be family members.
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Thanks
Its a little more dificlut to get originals as I now live in Canada, but I guess thats the only way. I will look into it.
Thanks again.
Tony
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Hi
This needs some going into but the only Robert I could see born about 1860, Waverley, in the census was a Robert Charity with parents John Charity and Catherine. Looking for a marriage although there was quite a few children with them in 1861 census was in 1859 John Charity to Catherine Goodliff, Uppingham. Will get you references shortly, have to rush out now.
evie
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Hi Tony
The marriage was Uppingham District Q3 7a 389 for John and Catherine.
The census was 1861 living Wakerley
RG09 piece 2310 folio 49 page 2
John Charity 43 Ag Lab
Catherine 29
Elizabeth 11
Mary Ann 8
Fanny 7
Ellen 6
Robert 1year 10 month
All born Wakerley
As the census was taken April and Robert is 1 year 10 month that should bring his birth to about June 1859. I can see no Robert Charity born then but there was a Robert Goodliffe Uppingham 1859 Q2 which includes June. Ref 7a 255.
evie
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Thanks Evie.
The plot thickens!!!
I now have Robert's birth certificate, which give his mother as "Catherine Goodliffe", but no father. The d.o.b. is 27 May, 1859 in Wakerley.
I can find no trace of either of them in 1861 census or even of Catherine in 1851? In fact, I cannot race a Catherine Goodliffe of the correct age anywhere.
It is odd that the Charity family have both a Catherine and a Robert of the correct age, or am I reading too much into this?
Seems to be the classic brickwall. I will be in the UK in May. Would there be any other records I might look for while I am there?
Tony
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Hi Tony
This is what I believe.
Robert was the illegitimate son of Catherine Goodliff.
Catherine married John Charity sometime in July, August or September 1859.
As he was a baby he has been given the surname of John (Charity)
I have followd them through to 1881 census and he stays with the name Charity. However I can find no Robert Charity in 1891.
Cathrine Goodliffe is on the 1841 census for Wakerley born about 1831 so I think this is her.
Ref HO107 Piece 797 Book 21 Folio 5 Page 35 Line 17
It looks like John Charity dies in the April, May June quarter of 1891.
In answer to your question I am not familiar with local records for Northamptonshire but I will see if I can find anything for you.
evie
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Hi Tony
On the Northamptonshire resource board, Sandy (seahall) has put up a good link. If you were to visit anywhere I would suggest here.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/06jm/
There is also another Rootschatter northants1841 who may be willing to do a look up for you for the marriages, as the family don't seem to move away from Wakerley as far as I can see. The only problem he was last on line 30 Dec 2010 but it might be worth you asking him by sending a PM with a link to this thread.
You will find him here
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,191473.0.html
evie
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The marriage is in the Northants 1837-1860 marriage index
John CHARITY otp, age 41, bachelor, labourer, father Wiliam, labourer
Catherine GOODLIFF otp, age, 29, spinster, father John, shoemaker
21 Aug 1859 Wakerley
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Hi
Thank you mgeneas that is a fantastic help.
Were there any other marriages for John as I thought he was living with a Harriet in 1851 but I need to check again.
Have to make dinner now ::)
evie
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Yes, there was a previous marriage - and this time he claims to be a widower
John CHARITY otp, age 28, widower, labourer, father William, labourer
Harriet MITCHELSON of Fineshade (extra parochial) age 23, spinster, servant, father William, labourer
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The marriage is in the Northants 1837-1860 marriage index
John CHARITY otp, age 41, bachelor, labourer, father Wiliam, labourer
Catherine GOODLIFF otp, age, 29, spinster, father John, shoemaker
21 Aug 1859 Wakerley
Good that confirms the 1841 census for Catherine as mentioned above.
evie
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Thanks you guys, this is brilliant!!!
I don't suppose there is any away of tracing Robert's father? Or could we guess that it was John Charity, as he married Catherine soon after he was born?
Any idea what the convention was in those days?
Thanks again, everyone.
Tony
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Hi,
I do not know if you are aware but there are still a lot of Goodliffe families in Northamptonshire today.
Jac
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I was able to visit Wakerley a couple of weeks ago, but found that none of the headstones in the churchyard were readable. :(
Time and weather has taken its toll.
I did get some wonderfull photos of the church itself. :)
Thanks again for eaveryones help.
Tony
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Hi All.
Tony, Catherine was baptised at Wakerley to John and Charlotte
on the 01 07 1832.
Does it state where Robert was born, if not at home it could be possible
that Robert was born in a workhouse if the family could not care for
Catherine.
Sandy
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Hi again Tony.
Whilst in the Library today I looked at Wakerley Parish Records.
Wakerley Parish Church Baptisms.
Pg. 77 No. 612 Nov 15th 1874
Left Hand Column states Adult.
Robert to John & Catherine Charity, Wakerley, Labourer
Also 3 other children
John No. 613, Louisa No. 614, Kate noted as Nov 16th No. 615
Sandy
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Thanks Sandy.
Robert would have been 15 at the time. I think Kate was just born, and they had a mass baptism for the family!!
May I ask which Library you found these records?
Robert's birth cert. shows 'where born' as Wakerley, but no father's name. I think they were living with John Charity at the time, and feel sure that he was Robert's father.
Tony
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HI Tony.
I looked at the records at Northampton Library although they
would also be able to viewed at Northamptonshire Record Office.
Well it would certainly hide the fact that Robert was illegitimate.
Glad to have helped.
Sandy
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Hello Tony,
I have only just seen your query. I have the same Goodliffe line in Wakerley.
Your Catherine was the daughter of John Goodliffe and Charlotte Green (his second wife) as others have mentioned. My ancestor was James, a son by his first wife, Sarah Scotney. I visited Wakereley churchyard a few years ago and ther was a clear gravestone for Sarah.
The Goodliffes came to Wakerley from Morcott in Rutland about 1750 and before that Gretton in Northants about 1710. The earliest record I have found is 1581 in Gretton withe a daughter to Lion Goodliffe, who is already married. I do not know where he came from but there were Goodliffes nearby as early as 1521 and Lion (not Lionel) is a locally used name at this period.
A direct link can be shown for this line and I can supply more details if you are interested.
Peter Rolfe
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Hi Would you be Tony Johnson son of Betty Johnson of King Street Kettering. I am the daughter of Tony Plant whose mother was Evelyn May York, daughter of Mary Ann Eliza York, whose mother was Eliza Clithero. I believe Eliza married Robert Goodliffe and went on to have daughters Beatie, Lil, Alice and Esther. I have just started work on the family tree and sorting old family photos. Any information you have would be appreciated.
Thanks Sue Plain