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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Topic started by: kaycee on Wednesday 06 April 11 16:55 BST (UK)
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Ethel May Lloyd was born in Hereford UK 17.12.1898. She was sent to Canada as an orphan child. Not sure what year and cannot find her on passenger lists. She appeared on 1901 census in Hereford but cannot find her on the 1911.
Have tried census 1911 and 1916 for Canada but no luck.
Anyone got any ideas what I can try now. Thanks.
Kath Coley
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Do you have any more information? The names of the parents would be very helpful. Many jurisdictions require the parents names on the marriage certificates, and sometimes on the death certificates as well.
James
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You could also try the Home Children postings in the Canada Resources board here on Rootschat.
James
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Thank you James for your suggestions. The parents of Ethel May Lloyd were John Henry Lloyd and Roseanne (or Roseanna), but they both died in UK.
Will try the Home Children site that you suggest. (I am new to Rootschat so am floundering a bit!).
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There is a family tree at Ancestry that has an Ethel May Lloyd born on that date and it says her father died in 1919 and her mother in 1917.
I saw John and Rose Lloyd on the 1911 England census with two children (no Ethel) in an institution in Hereford, Herfordshire. You have to view the image to get a full entry as they are listed individually in the transcriptions.
I can't see a record of her coming to Canada. Are you sure she did? There are a couple of deaths for women named Ethel May Lloyd in England. One in Herefordshire in 1930 - a little older than your Ethel as it says she was 35 but there is also a death for an Ethel May Lloyd that was registered in Bristol in 1974 who has a birth date of 16 Dec 1897. That's awfully close to the date of your Ethel May to exclude in my opinion.
Jacquie
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Thank you Jacquie for your reply. You have the right family. We are only going on family "legend" that she was sent to Canada as an orphan child (think that's what they were called even though technically they were not orphans). We can find no real trace of her after her birth in Hereford on 17.12.1898. I have also read that sometimes not only were their surnames changed but forenames also got changed! We don't stand much chance, I think, but we have to try.
I will go again through UK deaths. See if I can get anywhere with that.
Kath
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You might try the British Isles Family History Society of Greater Ottawa here in Canada. They have six ongoing projects as well as a book about Home Children (children from the UK sent/adopted out to families in Canada). They might be able to either point you to an expert, or resources, or give you some advice about how to track Ethel if she did make it to Canada. Their address is http://www.bifhsgo.ca/index.php.
Luck,
James
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Ethel May Reid LLoyd was apprehended by Barnardo's at the age of 5 and sent to Canada as Ethel May Reid She was placed with a family that insisted she wash dishes all day. She was taken back to Barnardo's and sent to be with the Morton family.
When Barnardo's sent her overseas to Canada in 1909 aboard the Silician she was sent with her mother's maiden name Reid. When she was 18 she was driving a horse drawn buggy and there was an accident and Mrs. Morton, an elderly lady was killed. Soon after she married Sylvester Miriam Holden and they had children. Their son's names Charles Mervin Holden, Douglas Holden, Delmar and one other son. They had one daughter Vivian Manetta who married William Joseph Lavoie. Mervin Holden lives in Richmond B.C. Canada. Doug Holden lives in Kamloops B.C. Canada. Delmar and the other son has passed away.
We always thought our grandmothers name was Ethel Reid not Lloyd until recently when Barnardos sent basic information to my Uncle Charlie in Richmond. My mother was Ethel's only daughter and I'm my mother's only living son. I have two sisters still alive and my four brothers have passed.
The Holden that participated in the last Olympics was a descendant of Ethel May Reid Holden.
The uncovered road block to a search was done by Barnardo's in the UK. assigning Ethel May her mother's maiden name as her legal last name.
What you also might find interesting is when Ethel May sent back to the UK for her birth records she was sent the wrong records that stated she was born in Aldershot. When Barnardo's finally released some records Ethel was born in Hereford to Rose Reid and John Lloyd. When our grandmother Ethel passed away in Burnaby B.C. she died believing she was born in Aldershot. She never knew the truth about her early years in the UK. She always thought she was the only child in her family. Ethel passed away in about 1985.
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You can search the British Home children records for Ethel May Reid. The ship was the Silician arriving in 1909.
Ethel's family tree has been found from her arrival in Canada to the present and we, her living descendants are very interested in learning more about ancestry.
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Hi Kaycee
You can see the death registration for Ethel May Lloyd Holden at this site
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01a0t/
Susan
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Hello MelLavoie. My name is Kathleen Coley and although I am only related to Ethel May, as she is always called here, as an extended family member, I am so excited to get your reply that I think I pressed all the wrong buttons and my laptop went "funny"!! Sorry to be a long time replying. The niece of ethel may is, in fact, my son's mother-in-law. I am seeing her tomorrow as we shall be at his place as it is his birthday the next day. I shall take my laptop with me and maybe we can concoct a reply to you. I am so excited I am in tears, as we have been searching for years. We never thought of trying the name Reid. Isn't that amazing?! I am astounded at myself for ignoring that. Will be in touch with you again with more family information from this end. Kath Coley (On a very big high!!!)
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Hi Susan and Katy,
It looks as though you are distantly related to Ethel May's family here in Canada. We are Holden's from Ethel May marrying into the Holden Family. We also have relatives in England, living near Guildford, Brighton and Aldershot. Could you give us an insight into how you are related to Ethel May?
Karen Holden
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Hi
I'm not related to this family in any way...I'm just a Rootschatter who likes to help folks if I can. I live in British Columbia and am familiar with some of the family history resources available here.
I'm so happy that you are meeting family members via this forum.
Susan
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Hi Susan,
I am new to this site so wonder how would we go about finding Ethel May Lloyd's siblings if she has any? Also her parents brother's or sisters. From information I got she had an aunt gertrude reid and an uncle charlie reid.
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Hi Kbh1
Perhaps Kaycee or MelLavoie will be able to help you with some of that information when they check back on the site.
Susan
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Hi Kbh1 ...welcome to Rootschat! ( I'm not related either) Wonderful that you've found each other
I see that John married Rose ( as Reede) after the birth of Ethel May. Were there other children sent to Canada as well? Just wondering if the Elsie Read on the same voyage ( SICILIAN 1909) had been investigated
http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/discover/immigration/immigration-records/home-children-1869-1930/immigration-records/Pages/item.aspx?IdNumber=69999&
adding*although I don't see her in Hereford on the FreeBMD
If it interests you, the marriage was briefly mentioned in "Ups & Downs" May 1930 (listed under the fourth bear down)
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~tweetybirdgenealogy/may1930wed.html
http://www.bifhsgo.ca/cstm_upsAndDowns.php?page=1&nr=150&scl=sna&sn=reid
REID Ethel M. Marriage 1930 May 2 32
4th Party 1909 - Spouse - Sylvester Holden - Recorded in 1929. Gene CS88 A1 U68, reel 6
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Hi Kath and Susan .. Karen is married to my cousin Bill, the son of Charles Holden. When growing up in East Vancouver we sometimes went to visit with Bill's family. Bill's father Charles Mervin Holden we knew as uncle Mervin. (Just a side note ..when uncle was working for B.C. Tel he was known as one of the most intelligent workers at the telephone company.)
I started hunting for ancestry records for our family early last summer only to discover Karen had also been doing the same thing. Over the past months we've passed records and rumours back and forth trying to help each other discover were Ethel came from. Over the years there have been so many untruths about Ethel's origins in England it was hard to know where to begin. I did find the records of when she came to Canada aboard the Silician as a British Home Child sent here by Barnardo's. at age 10.
Ethel arrived aboard the Silician as Ethel Reid and went to Quebec City from London UK. in 1909.
When Ethel landed in Canada she went to Barnardo's Hazelmere home for girls. She apparently wasn't there very long and was sent to a family with Alice Atkinson, another Barnardo 'orphan'. Ethel told my mother and my sister she could remember being stood on a chair and being ordered to wash dishes all day. She wasn't very tall and the chair enabled her to reach the sink. When Barnado visited her she told them was she was forced to do and she was taken back to the girl's home and then sent to be with the Morton family that treated her very well. They lived in Moria, Ontario. In 1921 she married our grandfather Syvester Holden (born Aug 4, 1891 Died 1939) and the resided in the Kindersley area of Saskatchewan, Canada.
Her son Charles Mervin Holden born 1919 married Shirley Brown of Biggar Sask.
Alvin Holden was born in 1920 and was the postmaster in Stratnear June 16/1946 to May 19, 1947. Alvin married a woman from England and they moved to England.
Douglas Holden married our aunt Bea and they presently live in Kamloops.
Delmar lived in Manitoba for many years.
Ethel's only daughter Vivian Manetta Holden was our mother. She married Joseph William Lavoie and they had six children of which the two two girls Sheila and Annette along with myself are the only survivors ( at the moment).
Ethel came to the coast sometime between 1949 and 1953 when she is on the Canada Census.
I remember my mother telling me that her mother Ethel had just learned that it was her aunt that had raised her in England and put her up for adoption into Barnardos...needles to say she wasn't pleased...this happened about 1984-85 ?
We have been at a loss looking for for her birth records because Ethel sent back to England asking for her birth cert. to apply for pensioner income. The UK gov't sent her the wrong records telling her she was born in Aldershot, UK but last year I Iearned the woman she was told she was supposed to be stayed in England and raised a family. We had reached a dead end were forced to approach Barnardo's for some truth. After all these years of thing we were of Ethel Reid's descendants we now know we are the descendants of John Lloyd
and Roseann (Reid) Lloyd. Quite a shock !!
It's also quite a surprise to learn Ethel May had siblings she never knew of. With each new answer so many new questions appear...even who are we really? Do we have relatives we don't know of? Where are they ?
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BTW we have lots of photos of our grandmother as does Karen.
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I know you have this but will post for those in England... The Manvers Durham area where the two children are in 1911 is filled with children from England, oddly most listed as "boarder" altho some are "domestics" ...we are accustomed to seeing them as listed as household help... :-\ :P
Ethel May and friend Alice are on page 9 with the Langs, I imagine the family mentioned earlier. I wonder how they made so many dishes, perhaps she must have fed many farmhands.
http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census11/EnumerationDistrict.jsp?id=5787
I am soooo happy they moved her away from an unhappy home! Good for them for listening to her.
Not all were so lucky to have an ear...
Alice Atkinson arrived on the SICILIAN 1909 as well...She might be the operator in Toronto 1921
Search can be done here, image available to view for free
http://search.ancestry.ca/search/db.aspx?dbid=8991
it appears she donated twice to the girl's fund while just a girl herself...hopefully she did this on her own terms... They weren't making much money.
http://www.bifhsgo.ca/cstm_upsAndDowns.php?page=1&nr=150&scl=sna&sn=atkinson
Odd that the marriage was recorded so late in the Home children's magazine..., 11 years after the marriage.
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It was the Langs where Ethel was sent and she was taken back. I'm not sure what happened to the other girl. I'm not surprised with her marriage being announced so many years after the fact. It's obvious Barnardo was trying to raise more cash and he was trying to show the good job he was doing. It wasn't enough he collected money from donations in the UK he also got paid from the Canadian Gov't. for each child sent to the new world. This apparently wasn't enough money for him he demanded many of the people he sent overseas had to pay him a good part of their indentures back to Barnardos. Needless to say I have little respect for that organization.
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Hi Kbh1
You expressed interest in Ethel May's siblings and aunts and uncles so I've done a little searching in some UK Census records.
I believe that Ethel May had 2 siblings....John Edgar (born approx 1909) and Beatrice Irene (born approx 1910), both born in All Saints, Hereford.
It was stated that Ethel was the daughter of John Lloyd and Roseannah Reed. It appears that Roseannah was the daughter of Henry Reed and Mary Ann (possibly Jones).
The following Census entries will provide more information about Ethel May's grandparents and aunts and uncles.
1891 England Census
4 Green Street
St. Owen Parish, Hereford
Henry Reed, head, married, age 32, general labourer
Mary Ann Reed, wife, married, age 33
Henry Reed, son, age 10, scholar
Roseannah, daughter, age 8, scholar
Charles, son, age 7, scholar
Gertrude, daughter, age 5
Mary A., daughter, age 3
Mabel, daughter, age 1
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1901 England Census
136 Green Street
St. Owen Parish, Hereford
Henry Reed, head, age 42, General Labourer
Mary A. Reed, wife, age 43
Mabel, daughter, age 11
Albert, son, age 8
Ernest, son, age 4
Sarah A., daughter, age 2
I will continue to look for information and will post if I find anything.
Please understand that this is all speculation until you prove the relationships with certificates. These appear to the the best fit given the information that has been provided on this thread.
Susan
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John Edgar's birth was registered June Q 1908 ....Beatrice Irene June Q 1910...
This is a decade after the birth of Ethel, it seems likely there were more living children in between?
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According to my math when Ethel was born her mother was 15 years old. I don't know when he father was born any help with this is appreciated.
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JJ, I was thinking the same thing; however, it is stated on a census that Rose had 3 children born alive and 3 children living. They were married about 1898/99.
MelLavoie, from ages stated on the Census images (which aren't always very accurate) John Lloyd was born about 1875 and Roseannah Reed was born about 1882.
Beatrice Irene (1910-1992) married Stanley Percy H. Wilsher (1910-1984) in the June quarter 1934 in Hammersmith, London.
Susan
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I have seen Ethel May's birthdate listed as December 28, 1898 on some family trees. There is a birth registration in the first quarter 1899 for an Ethel May Lloyd born in Hereford. It's Vol 6a, Page 546 if you are interested in ordering the certificate from GRO.
http://www.gro.gov.uk/GRO/content/certificates/default.asp
Susan
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It appears that Ethel May's father, John Lloyd, is the son of John Lloyd and Elizabeth (possible Pugh).
The following census information will give some possible information on this side of the family.
1881 England Census
21 Catherine St.
St. Peters, Hereford
John Lloyd, Head, married, age 38, Labourer
Elizabeth Lloyd, Wife, married, age 26
John, son, age 6
Elizabeth, age 4
Alfred, age 2
John Pugh, Father, age 64
Elizabeth Pugh, Mother, age 66
1891 England Census
John Lloyd, head, married, age 46, labourer
Elizabeth, wife, married, age 35
Sarah, daughter, age 7
Alfred, son, age 5
A couple of doors down
Elizabeth Pugh, Lodger, Widow, age 77, charwoman
1901 England Census
John Lloyd (transcribed as Loyde), head, married, age 54, building labourer
Elizabeth, wife, married, age 45
George, son, age 15, news boy
Have some appointments this afternoon so will look at this again tonight.
Susan
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There could very well be some confusion about her real birthday as she was given the wrong birth certificate. The certificate she was issued stated she was the daughter of William Alfred Reid and Eliza Ellington of Aldershot. Ethel May Reid of Aldershot remained in England though and raised a family. Her birthday was Dec 28,1898.
From the info becoming available it's too bad our grandmother never got a chance to know of and communicate with her brother and sister.
Thirty years ago I was told Ethel was found on a doorstep during the Boer War and her aunt raised her until eventually placing her up for adoption. The doorstep she was told was that of her aunt. Her father passed away in the Boer war....what we were told.
Our grandmother always maintained she remembered sitting on her grandfather's lap as a young child but according the info from Barnardo's she was born to in-reputable parents and she was apprehended at age 5.
It may have been she did remember her grandfather but wondering which one.
Is It true her parents were in workhouse in Hereford ?
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Hi MelLavoie
According to a Census I saw, John and Rose Lloyd along with Beatrice Irene and John Edger were in the Hereford Workhouse.
Susan
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According to the 1911 Canada/Ontario census Ethel believed her birth date to be Dec 1898. Kath appears to have more in as she has it as Dec.17 1898
Was she perhaps living with an aunt or uncle for a great deal of her childhood in England? ...It seems a likely truth, as it is odd she is happy to go by the surname Reid. She does not remember the names of parents nor of siblings, only of an aunt and an uncle. This is unusual in older homechildren, but more the case in the very young ones...although goodness knows the trauma must have caused a great deal of confusion for all of them. J.J.
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FYI for those looking in...
This is likely the Morton family with whom Ethel lived after the Langs http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census11/SplitView.jsp?id=140077
http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census/ViewFrame.jsp?id=54086&highlight=32
John Brown Morton & Mary Jane Chapman
Her husband had died in 1912 so perhaps she was assigned as a helper for Mary....Mary died May 3 1917 Hastings, Ontario, Canada
Here's more I found online re: Mary, she deserves some highlighting as she was good to Ethel!
http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=cdn-kemp&id=I19194
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Hello Mel and others also researching Ethel May. I met up with Margaret yesterday. She is a niece of Ethel May and is the mother-in-law of our son, Richard. She, of course, is very, very excited to hear about you all. You have quite a few relatives here in the UK. I would like to ask, does anyone know how we can contact via email, without putting our addresses on this site. Are any of you on the Genes Reunited site? Margaret is happy to share information but would rather not do it on an "open" site. (Margaret is the daughter of the late John Henry born 1908. There was also a sister, Beatrice Irene born 1910).
I look forward to hearing from you. (Margaret does not have a computer, and I am a near 80 rather computer illiterate, so please bear with me.
Kath Coley (in Herefordshire UK)
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Hello kaycee :).
You can use the Personal Message system here on RootsChat to exchange emails. Click on the little circle below the person's name that looks like it has a scroll or page in it.
Kbh1 would need to make one more post to use the system....three posts are generally required to access the PM system. Just saying "Hi" would suffice.
This is such a heartwarming thread. How wonderful that you have found each other!
Polarbear
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Ethel May was not found on a doorstep and her mother was only 16 when she had her. Her father was a coal man. He had a horse and cart and used to go to the Rhonda valley to collect coal. He was, unfortunately, kicked by the horse and suffered severe injury. This is why the family had to go into the Workhouse. (Incidentally, the Workhouse that was is now part of the County hospital in Hereford. It has a lovely old Chapel called St. Guthlac). There were only the three children and we do not know why the long time between births. John Edgar only discovered a few months before his death that he had a sister and tried to find her. He died in 1985 and there was not the help available then to research.
Look forward to hearing more about the Canadian side.
Kath Coley (on behalf of Margaret Rutt (nee Lloyd)
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Thank you Polar Bear. Have done as you suggested. Will see how we get on. Wonderful site. Taken a long time to "find" her, but very impressed.
Kath Coley
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Hi Kaycee
Thank you for posting again and wow ain't this somthin. We got us sum relatives on the udder side of the pond we neber knew of.
I am going to use the private message system and send my email address as well as my facebook link.
For the benefit of other people reading this thread, I'd like you to know that Ethel's ancestry has been looked into by people before. No-one has been able to find the connection to her past in the UK. We have known the frustration of hitting a dead end for a lot of years. Last year I searched through one census after another all over the UK using the LDS site, Ancestry and others. I was able to find her in the Canadian census but no further back in time than when she landed here in 1909. My hunt for her records was for an Ethel May Reid or Reed that was born in the UK. Last summer I spent hours every day on my computer and writing down records in a book. There were at least three women helping me search. They were members of the British Home Children Advocacy Group in Canada. Needless to say my notebook starting to fill page after page with possibilities and now when I see it sitting here in front of me ...I see pages and pages of notes that are all roads to dead ends.
We grew up knowing Ethel's last name was Reid and nothing else. In my search last summer the closest possibility I found was an Ethel born near Newcastle on Thyme. In the end I gave up looking as all possibilities were all too quickly becoming dead ends and Ethel May Reid could not be found. The only place left to turn to Barnardos and it was my understanding they wanted to be paid to release birth records. I'm retired and on a limited income and I simply can not afford their costs of about $150.00 Canadian. After searching for about six weeks I had to give up. All roads led to dead ends and I could not afford Barnardo's fees.
It was then realized by Karen and myself that Barnardos offer basic records for free to Canadians and Australians but, you had to be a direct living descendant of the person being searched. My youngest brother Keith and his twin sister Annette were following my research. We were warned that many other people had tried to search for these records but no-one found any success as record searches led to dead ends.
Doug Holden in Kamloops and his wife aunt Bea sent Annette a copy of Ethel's birth certificate to my sister who sent me a copy of it. At that time I had a copy of her death certificate. I knew when she came to Canada and about the Lang family and the Morton family in Canada. Using family memories and census records I was able to learn some things about her life in Canada. I started a family tree an My Heritage and it has over 250 people on the tree. I reached the limit as a free member. In time Karen turned to Charles Holden, (her father in-law and my uncle) Ethel's son to send to Barnardo's for birth records. It was only then we learned Ethel Reid was in fact Ethel May Reed Lloyd from Hereford UK.
Now we learn we have relatives in the UK that may be able to add to our record search....wow !!
I did a search and stumbled upon this thread and there was Ethel May Reid/Lloyd and she wasn't a Geordie after all. From half way round the world searching, there in the UK not that far from Hereford in Aldershot UK lives relatives to Ethel May Reed Lloyd. The little girl that carried her mother's maiden name at birth due to her parents not being married when she was born. If a young girl of 15 years old was experiencing life and learning then it makes sense some people could judge and brand her as being an unfit parent.
Thank you Karen for your help and yup after all these years Ethel May Reid did come from the UK !!
Please bear with me ...lol ...sorry Barnardo no cash coming from us we don't need you...sorry :P we master the helm of our own ship from here on in ;)
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From Mel in Canada
Hi !!
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I am delighted that you have all met and can now share the stories of the family on both sides of the pond.
Susan
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Thank you Susan and thank you all for your help in searching ...very much appreciated
:) :) :)
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ah, we were hearing about another Ethel May, then, I was getting very confused... :P easily done...
Wonderful that the correct information is now known...Happy outcome...Enjoy!
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I've wanted to say how strange this is after all the searching and finding nothing because of one simple word. The missing word being that of a last name, Lloyd. To the Lloyd family the missing word was Reid.
In our family we never knew either of our grandfathers as they both passed away before any of us were born. Our knowledge of them exists only because of records and of being told about them through our relatives that knew them. We've been told about them and many times with fond memories and I can't but wonder sometimes about we missed from not knowing them. We did know our grandmothers and one of them we knew as Ethel May Reid or as we called her Gramma Holden. Both our grandmothers passed away during the 1980's. Not long after one passed away the other left us. On our father's side of the family there was lots of knowledge of our ancestral history here in Canada and what was once known as the new world to the people of Europe.
Our father's side of the family has been traced back to Normandy in France and it can be traced back further than the early 1600's when the first French settlers were coming here to this new world then called Kanata meaning a village by the natives. Jacques Cartier adopted the name Canada for the world he discovered.
Three hundred years after our father's side side of our family arrived here from France a ten year girl from the UK was put on a ship and shipped to the New World. She was taken from her family with thousands of other young children and sent out to populate this new world for the British Empire. Before she taken and placed on the ship Silician her connection to her past was deliberately severed. She would live her life as many others would, never knowing who she really was or where she was really from. The connection to her past severed with the use of one word, her last name.
My mother handed me a book in the late 1980's. "You should read this." She said. "Your grandmother was one of them." The soft covered book was The Little Immigrants, the telling of orphans shipped from the UK to the New World. Even though Ethel My Reid could not be found in that little book it sparked an interest to find our past that originated somewhere in Britain.
In my living room is a small table with rosewood inlays on it's top. In my closet is a photo album that has within it photos of our gramma Holden, Ethel May Reid and memories of her being severed from her past. She was a stout woman as was my mother who never grew past being five feet and eleven inches tall. Things are different now as that one word we know as a last name has been discovered. No longer is Ethel May Reid severed from her past as we now know she did have a family in the UK. and she was not the only child in her family. But for her it's too late, she has left us and she will never know her beginnings. It feels different here now to as with the discovery of her past a closure ends a search and new chapter begins. I've heard it said you never know who you are until you know where you've been and where you come from. It's so difficult to find the words to describe this difference now to what it used to be. What once was a feeling of being incomplete because of not knowing now is being replaced with new thoughts, new questions and new feelings. It is taking a bit to get used to being not only a Reid but also a Lloyd with living relatives overseas. Additions will be added to family trees with the discovery of new information. The family tree of the Lloyds, Reids, Pugh, Holdens, Lavoies, Sharpe, Sine and many others. I only know a few of them. Maybe in time others will surface. This is the end of an era as as a new era begins. Until then it is a time of transitions and it is taking time to adjust.
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Have read your latest post Mel and we are just as delighted as you to find Ethel May. I have been searching for so long for her that I feel I know her. Although we (that is the Coley family) are only connected to her because our son,Richard, is married to Ethel May's gt.niece we are all very excited and Margaret is certainly very excited.
There was also a sister, Beatrice, who had family but I don't know much about that part of the family. Will see what I can obtain and forward.
An excited, Kath.
PS Just as an aside, my husband's grandfather, William Venables, lived in Alberta for very many years and did, in fact, die there as an old man. Isn't life strange!
!
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Kaycee,
I'm not sure if you've seen this yet or not but in case you haven't this photo of Ethel and Sylvester Holden is on Ancestry.com.
Because it's always nice to be able to put a face to a name I've posted it here. The baby in the photo is Charles Mervin Holden their oldest child and my uncle....also Karen Holden's father-in-law.
As Karen said earlier in these posts we have relatives in the UK and some of them may be not that far from you. She knows them much better than I do.
Mel
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Yes, thank you to everyone that has been looking into this. We are starting to get a clearer picture of the family. I will try to alert the family in England that they have additional relatives over there. Maybe next year, Bill and I will try to visit England and research some of the areas we have heard about in these posts.
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just an update...
for anyone following this post.
As the pieces of the lost records are coming together like a puzzle things are starting to make sense.
Ethel May Reid carried her mother's maiden name when she was born due to the fact her parents were not married at the time. They did get married soon after her birth.
Did Ethel really remember sitting on her grandfather's lap when she was a small child?
She certainly may have because her grandparents (Reids) lived two doors down the street from her.
FYI- Ethel was apprehended at the age of 5 and sent to Canada by Barnardos and Barnardos knew she had living grandparents in Hereford. The grandparents were not informed of what Barnardos was doing with Ethel as they apparently feared Ethel would have been taken back by her grandparents.
In the report recently received by Barnardos Ethel parents were stated as being not reputable people.
In information I've received from the UK, Ethel father was a coal delivery man and he was severely injured when kicked by a horse. The family was thrown into poverty and had to enter a workhouse. They were not reputable people only because of poverty.
The ten year gap between Ethel and the birth of her siblings was likely due to her father's injury.
Sadly Ethel passed away in the year 1986 and she never knew of her brother and sister that were still alive and looking for her.
Ethel May Reid was sent to Canada at the age of 10 years old in 1909 and it's taken until 2014 to learn she was the daughter of Ethel May Reid and John Lloyd. Maybe 105 years is not that long but for this family it has been far too long to learn the truth of her beginnings. Too many people have passed away before knowing the truth about their ancestry including Ethel May Reid/Lloyd.
As this thread comes to an unexpected ending, a thank you must be given to Kaycee for the original post and to each and every one of you that has helped us with our search.
Thank you,
from Mel and the other descendants of the Reids and Lloyds.
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I'm so glad to see that the mystery of Ethel May has been solved. It's wonderful for Karen and Mel to have made a connection to Kaycee after all these years.
Well done Rootschat!
Karen
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Hi
My Grandmother was Beatrice Lloyd and she married Stanley Wilsher in London, UK. She grew up in a convent and married Stanley due to him being stationed in the army in Herefordshire nr Wales. This is where the church/convent was . She never knew her siblings - could these be Ethel ( older ) and a younger brother ? Contact me if you wish ? She was lovely !
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Hi my grandma was Beatrice Lloyd married to Stanley Wilsher - they lived in London and were lovely grandparents. they are both dead now and im 48. Beatrice and Stanley met as he was stationed via the army in Herefordshire and she was brought up in a convent near a church there. Do you think Ethel was my grandma's sister ?
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Welcome to rootschat SMG ( my acronym for your long username ;D ) Wow, another connection...how exciting...that is certainly the marriage that susano found earlier...I wonder if Beatrice put the name of her parents on her marriage info? She may not have known them...but sending for the cert would be the next step!
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I have now talked to my dad - son of Beatrice Lloyd and he said that she always wondered about Ethel, they never met though. However she did keep up her relationship with their younger brother John Edgar. Like Beatrice, John was also an orphan in Herefordshire. John is now dead but his daughter Margot is still living in Herefordshire. Beatrice met Stanley my grandfather as he was stationed in the army in Somerset and met and married Beatrice when she was 17. They had two sons my dad Gordon Wilsher and Brian Wilsher and two daughters Joan and Jeanette Wilsher.
Who knew we had relatives in Canada - Ethel's family !