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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Derry (Londonderry) => Topic started by: elly40 on Saturday 09 April 11 01:05 BST (UK)
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hi trying to trace family history on my mothers side her father was daniel pyper from limavady found him age 5 in Residents of a house 8 in Distillery Road (Limavady Urban, Londonderry)in the 1911 census
his father was john pyper and mother was mary ann dorherty(she was a widow so her maiden name was mcnamara her father was daniel mcnamara from limavady a carter Residents of a house 47 in Ballyclose Street Limavaddy, Londonderry again found him in the 1901 census) john's father was william pyper farmer from crindle but cannot find him in the census as the marriage was in1893 assuming he must have died between that year and the census was just wondering if anyone here maybe able to throw some on any of the names i have mentioned but espeically on william as he is not on the census guessing he would have been born around 1830ish
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Welcome to Rootschat.
In case anyone else wants to see the census entries- here's 1911 (the child listed in the transcription as Juda Jane is actually Tilda Jane on the original page):
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Londonderry/Limavady_Urban/Distillery_Road/596925
and same family in same street in 1901:
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Londonderry/Limavaddy/Distillery_Road/1525870
The civil registration index is online (free) and there seems to be only 1 possible death entry for William Pyper (unless he died before 1864):
William PYPER, age 78 (so born c1811), Jan./Mar.1889 Limavady registration district, volume 1 page 515. (not sure why you think he was alive in 1893- marriage certificates often don't note whether or not father is dead)
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thanks very much
and i never thought of that he may have already been dead when marriage occurred should have done but new to this, and get a liitle excited when i find something
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High,
The following may help. On 31 Jul 1854 William PIPER married Catherine Allan in Magilligan Presbyterian Church, Limavady. There is a widow, Catherine PYPER in Crindle, Myroe in the 1901 census.
For completeness I can find a William Dogherty who married Mary Ann McNamara on 4 Mar 1886 in Aghanloo Church of Ireland.
Regards
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ok great thanks i had found the catherine in the cenus and was wondering if she was my great great grand mother as she was the only pyper i could find in crindle so that is fanastic i had also found the doherty mcnamara marriage had pieced that together from the cenus as i had found mcnamar's in the cenus and their grandson was there cenus night who was called william doherty so knew i had found great great grandparents on mary anns side i pieced together from that also that daniel mcnamara married roseann lagan 17th nove 1867 limavady catholic church drumachose newtown, just could find no records of william pyper on either emerald ancestors ancestry.com or gene's reunited or the cenus did try google but nothing either maybe you'se could paste a good link as all my grandfathers family seem to orignate in derry thanks again for all help received
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Here are marriages in Myroe Pres Church (including your ancestors).
John Pyper married Mary Ann Doherty 17th July 1893
James Pyper married Jane Simpson on 11th Nov 1890.
Hugh Pyper married Elizabeth Hall on 17th Sept 1896
I also have a John Pyper who married Elizabeth Patton (Bessie). Unfortunately no more details for this marriage but I was led to believe both families lived in Crindle. Bessie's sister, Ruth Patton, married my great uncle. I have details on this line of Pypers which I can send via the personal messaging system if you so wish. From the family tree I have, this John was born circa 1870.
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You will find a William Piper if you search Griffith's valuation. He is living in Crindle, Tamlaghtarde Parish.
http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml
A wider search for the name Piper in County Londonderry gives the names of other Pipers living in the same parish.
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Please ignore my comment about Bessie Patton marrying a John Pyper. I have done a little more research this afternoon.
As I said I had been led to believe both families lived in Crindle. Bessie Patton's family certainly did before moving to Co Down and PERHAPS John Pyper's family did live in Crindle at a time . By 1911, however, John Pyper and Bessie his wife were living in Bryansford, Bangor, Co Down.
So following this John Pyper will not help you. Sorry!
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thank you so much take it that the 3 pypers are possibly brothers so at least it's another lead to follow when you find something that matches it's brilliant but the brick walls can be fustrating as hitting them on both sides at the mom but will get there hopefully in the end again thanks to everyone for all there help
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http://www.casatorossi.net/subs/genea.htm#McNamara
This is my grandfather William Mc Namara of Limavady, may be your missing link.
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thanks for getting back to me I'm assuming william is daniel's father which would make him great great great grandfather or is he daniel's brother.
there was great info in what you sent but only came u in a little box so still letting it sink in surprised alot had settled in the short-stand as my fathers family all orginated round that area also. I have been in touch with one of the mclaughlins whose mother was an anderson from vulcan st think you mention her, can't wait to read this out to mum as she'l be delighted
kindest regards
eleanor
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You're welcome. Sorry about the small box, but at least it has some info for you. I can send you a printed copy if you can send me your address or phone no, I can call you. I'm in the USA I have also been in touch with Danny Mc Laughlin. Una Anderson was my sister in law. He is also working on his family. You can get a lot of info on Belfast Forum. I also heard from Gerard Bell about the Pypers. He lives in Belfast, too. Let me know if you need any further info.
Mary
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New members usually need 3 posts to use PM (Personal Message) system to exchange personal details such as phone numbers and email addresses which aren't allowed to be posted on the boards.
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Here is the post from the 1911 census when my grandfather, William, lived on Sheriff ST., in Belfast. His son, Daniel, was with his first wife who died. You will note that his mother in law from that marriage lived with them.
And also, my grandmother's father. Pretty crowded in those little two bedroom houses.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Pottinger__part_of_/Sheriff_Street/222977/
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There are 5 rooms in total in the McNamara household-
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai002186897/
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hi Mary
i think I've got it was getting abit confused Mary Ann McNamara (doherty) pyper is my great grandmother your grandfather William is her brother i think, of a have attached copy gedcom file you might have to download a family tree builder if you google my heritage.com should be able to download from there
elly
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:)According to the records I have, my grandfather, William, was born on April 12, 1877. He had a sister Mary, but I don't know when she was born. His father was Daniel, born around 1846, and William's grandfather was James, and I don't have a birth date for him either. My grandfather's other sisters and brothers are James, 1872, Matilda Jane, 1879, Daniel 1881, Charles 1883, Henry 1885, Ellen 1887, Rose and Mary. I tried to get into myheritage.com to see the McNamara page, but couldn't. I am also on that site within the Campbell file. I hope this is helpful.
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hi Mary
mary anne was born 1868 married william doherty not sure of date but had a son william age 12 1901 census living with his grandparents in ballyclose street in limavady.
mary anne married john pyper 17th july 1893 but were widowed at the time of marriage mary and john were living in distillery rd limavady in the 1901 census in the 1911 census they had had 9 children of which 7 were still living
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The Mary in the records I have married Vincent Bradford and resided at 23 Spinner St., from 1946 on. I show that Ellen born 1887 married a Mr. Pyper and lived at Malcolmson St., Belfast. Was there also a Mary Anne? I don't show her. Only Mary.
Mary
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hi I came across these posts, while researching. I am Ellen Pypers grandson who was born 1905, John and Mary Annes daughter, nice to know you all :)
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I am trying to prove or disprove my connections with Rathkeel Pyper/ Piper. I have a John Pyper who was born 1846 in County Down to John Pyper and Mary Woodrow. I have not been able to find any information about the parents and it was suggested to me that the family may have come from another area. Has anyone come across this family?
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Hello,
I am looking for information concerning Bessie Pyper, she is my great great aunt. Her sister Helen Maude Neill (nee Patton) is my great grandmother.
Best wishes,
Sarah
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Welcome to RootsChat :)
I am looking for information concerning Bessie Pyper, she is my great great aunt. Her sister Helen Maude Neill (nee Patton) is my great grandmother.
Is this her marriage to John Pyper in 1910?
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1910/09990/5632914.pdf
Elizabeth M Hinch Patton, a schoolteacher living at Hillhall manse. Her father, Alexander Patton a Presbyterian minister.
Here she is in the 1901 census, with her sister Helen M.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Bangor/Downshire_Road/1252787/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai000763227/
KG
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Death of Bessie's father, Alexander Patton, a Presbyterian minister in 1896.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1896/05886/4669753.pdf
KG
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Bessie McHinch Piper with her husband in the 1911 census.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Bangor/Bryansburn_Road/262238/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai002288834/
Birth of son, Robert Alexander in 1916.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1916/01339/1552805.pdf
KG
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Hello,
I am looking for information concerning Bessie Pyper, she is my great great aunt. Her sister Helen Maude Neill (nee Patton) is my great grandmother.
Best wishes,
Sarah
What sort of information are you looking for? The more detail you post the easier it is for us to find information or suggest where you can search next.
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Thank you very much for that information KG! Lovely to see that Bessie and John Pyper were married by their nephew, Gilmour Neill, also my g grandfather.
I am hoping to find some living descendants of Bessie and John Pyper to ask some questions. I know they had a son called John Graham Pyper a surgeon, who retired in Framlingham, Suffolk and died in 1987.
Many thanks in advance for any pointers!
Sarah
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Oops Gilmour Neill was Bessie and John Pyper’s Brother in law, not nephew!
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Bessie McHinch Piper with her husband........
Bessie's second forename comes from her mother's surname.
Marriage of Alexander Patton to Ellen McHinch in 1867.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1867/11482/8220404.pdf
Her father William is also a Presbyterian minister.
Ellen's death in 1921.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1921/05107/4403680.pdf
KG
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Death of Ellen's mother Maria, the widow of William a Presbyterian minister in 1896. #494
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1896/05909/4677287.pdf
The informant was A L Ireland (son-in-law).
KG
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I am hoping to find some living descendants of Bessie and John Pyper to ask some questions. I know they had a son called John Graham Pyper a surgeon, who retired in Framlingham, Suffolk and died in 1987.
This isn't a forum for tracing living people but with the information below you might be able to continue searching for living descendants.
John Pyper was, for many years, principal of Bangor Technical School and there are hundreds of newspaper articles mentioning him in connection with the school as well as a few more personal nits I was able to find.
North Down Herald and County Down Independent (Bangor), 18 July 1936: For thirty years headmaster of Bangor Technical School, and Librarian, Mr. John Pyper, M.A., retires in September next. Daring those thirty years of work devoted to the mental welfare of the youth of the district, Mr. Pyper has ...
Same paper, 5 May 1928 ...Town Clerk said he had a communication to make that he felt sure all present would hear with regret and that was that Mr. John Pyper, M.A., the Principal of the Technical School, was laid up ill and the schools were closed.
Northern Whig (Belfast), 31 July 1947: Death of Mr. John Pyper, M.A. Mr. John Pyper, M.A., one of the known teachers in Northern Ireland and classical scholar of distinction, died ...
Belfast Newsletter, 31 July 1947: PYPER, M.A. The death John Pyper, M.A., Windsor Avenue. Bangor, took place suddenly yesterday at his residence. A native of Belfast, he taught for several years in a school in Holywood, and in 1907 was appointed principal of Bangor Technical School...
Northern Whig, 31 July 1947: PYPER—July 30, 1947 (suddenly), at his residence, 13, Windsor Avenue, Bangor, John, dearly loved husband of Bessie Pyper. House and funeral private. No flowers, by request.
Pyper John of 13 Windsor Avenue Bangor county Down retired teacher died 30 July 1947 Probate Belfast 2 December to Elizabeth McHinch Pyper the widow. Effects £1085 18s. 11d.
Bessie's Will Extract gives details of their 3 sons-
Pyper, Elizabeth McHinch otherwise Bessie of 13 Windsor Avenue Bangor county Down widow died 6 March 1962 at Lurgan and Portadown Hospital Lurgan county Armagh Probate Belfast 8 June to John Grahame Pyper consultant surgeon Robert Alexander Pyper consultant physician and James Bothwell Pyper consultant orthopaedic surgeon. Effects £4841 15s. 10d.
See next 2 posts for details of the 3 sons
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John Grahame Pyper (26 June 1912-15 May 1987), consultant surgeon.
John Graham Pyper, the eldest of three sons of John Pyper MA, a schoolmaster, and of Bessie Pyper (née Patton), was born at Bangor, County Down, on 26 June 1912. His second brother became a consultant physician and the youngest an orthopaedic surgeon. After education at Bangor Grammar School, where he was an exhibitioner, and at Queen's University, Belfast, he graduated in 1935. At university he had a distinguished sporting record, receiving a blue for swimming and a half blue for athletics, and winning gold medals for diving in several university championships. He also represented the British universities at the world student games in Turin in 1933. After resident appointments at the Royal Victoria Hospital, Belfast, where he obtained a gold medal for his MD in 1938, he was a demonstrator in physiology at Queen's, before working at the Radcliffe Infirmary, Oxford. From November 1939 to December 1945 he served in the RAMC as a general duty officer, and as a blood transfusion officer in Malta where he was mentioned in despatches in 1942. He was then a graded surgeon in the Middle East Forces before demobilisation with the rank of Captain. He returned to the Royal Victoria Hospital as a surgical registrar and worked with Robert McConnell, James Loughridge and Sir Ian Fraser, but he also recorded his indebtedness to Russell Howard of the London Hospital.
After appointment as consultant surgeon to the old City and County Hospital, and at Waterside Hospital in Londonderry, he carried an enormous workload of general and traumatic surgery almost unaided. He served as honorary secretary to the planning committee for Altnagelvin Hospital which was the first completely new hospital to be built in the UK after the war. Despite several major heart attacks he continued to work there as senior surgeon until 1973 and was later appointed as a life governor. He was also a founder member and chairman of the Londonderry Swimming Club; president of Rotary 1970-71; a trustee of Magee University until 1973, and chairman of the building committee and a member of the court of the New University of Ulster until 1973. In 1956 he had been appointed honorary surgeon to the Royal Navy in Northern Ireland, and as a magistrate in 1971. He was remarkable for his unstinting service, his skill, and the enormous amount of time which he devoted to care of the sick.
He retired from the National Health Service, mainly on health grounds, in 1973, to become senior medical officer and surgeon to Ascension Island, serving there until 1977 when he retired to Framlingham in Suffolk. In later years he included photography and hill walking amongst his hobbies. During the war he met and married Patricia Brightman when she was serving in the Transport Corps, and they had three sons and a daughter. When he died on 15 May 1987 he was survived by his wife, children and seven grandchildren.
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Robert Alexander Pyper (25 July 1916 Bangor-8 Sept.1963 Lurgan), consultant physician, m. Nessie Campbell
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1916/01339/1552805.pdf
“Portadown Hospital, Co. Armagh, died suddenly on. September 8, aged 47. Robert Alexander Pyper was born at Bangor on July 25,. 1916, and was educated at ...” https://www.bmj.com/content/2/5361/873 (obituary in journal but preview doesn’t show his entry)
Pyper, Robert Alexander of The Lodge Waringstown county Down and Cooldreena Taghnevan Lurgan county Armagh consultant physician died 8 September 1963 at latter place Probate Belfast 14 February to Nessie Campbell Pyper the widow and William Craig solicitor. Effects £18909 16s.
James Bothwell Pyper (1924-2010), consultant orthopaedic surgeon
“James Bothwell Pyper was a consultant orthopaedic surgeon in Northern Ireland. He qualified in Belfast in 1946 and gained his FRCS in 1951. Prior to his consultant appointment, he was a registrar at the Princess Elizabeth Orthopaedic Hospital in Exeter and a senior registrar in orthopaedic surgery for the Northern Ireland Hospitals Authority. He died on 23 March 2010.”
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I know they had a son called John Graham Pyper a surgeon, who retired in Framlingham, Suffolk and died in 1987.
Abstract of will
PYPER, John Graham of New Bungalow Love La Framlingham Suffolk died 15 May 1987 Probate Ipswich 6 October £229966 8751510047G
You can obtain a copy of the will for £1.50 from:
https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/#wills
KG
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Again, another copy of a will you can purchase.
Abstract
PYPER, Patricia of The Bungalow Love La Framlingham Suffolk died 19 July 1988 Probate Ipswich 24 October £508348 8851510900V
KG