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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => London and Middlesex => Topic started by: Mangano on Saturday 23 April 11 22:05 BST (UK)
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I'm from America but my great-grandfather came from the Southwark section of London. George James Garrett was the son of Richard and Elizabeth (Maher) Garrett 200 High Street...and of 15 Ewer Street(at George's birth on 23 June 1867).
I have copies of letters from my great-grandfather's siblings: Dick, Bob, Tom, as well as Alice, Lizzie and Sarah.
His mother, Elizabeth Maher Garrett died on 13 December in 1887.
The last letter I have was dated 1890, the year my ancestor married Emma Andersdotter in America.
I don't know if there is family who wonders what happened to our branch. I was hoping to know more of what happened to the family since...
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I should mention that my relatives here have been entered on find a grave...
There are links there to establish relationships, and I have added photos where possible.
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Hi
It looks like children of Richard and Elizabeth were Baptised... do you have details of this?? If not I would be happy to provide them for you.
Also, do you have marriage details for the siblings of George James??
Cheers
Karenlee
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thank you. I don't have dates, et cetera. I'll give you the names as I have and approximate dates of birth. I was just wondering where Richard and Elizabeth were buried. Would love to enter a profile of them on findagrave...
RICHARD GARRETT c. 1835
ELIZABETH MAHER c. 1839-13 dec 1887
RICHARD J GARRETT 1866
SARAH GARRETT 1877
ALICE GARRETT 1880
THOMAS GARRETT 1869
ROBERT GARRETT 1865 ?
ELIZABETH GARRETT 1871
GEORGE JAMES GARRETT 23 June 1867-Dec 6, 1848
ZACHARIAH GARRETT 1873
FREDERICK GARRETT 1875
BEATRICE GARRETT 1881
I found some of these last names(last three) on a census record for 1881. They obviously must have passed away. I assume anyway, because they are not mentioned in the letters...The picture I put up is of my great-grandfather and the first 3 children and his wife Emma...
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Thank you Karenlee for your interest and help.
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Okay... here is what I can see...
Baptism Register
Lambeth St Mary
Lambeth Surrey
Richard Thomas son of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of Webber Street. Baptised 27th August 1865. Father's Occupation Porter
George James son of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of Webber Street. Baptised 14th July 1867. Father's Occupation Porter
Thomas John son of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of Webber Street. Baptised 18th April 1869. Father's Occupation Porter
Elizabeth Matilda daughter of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of Webber Street. Baptised 2nd April 1871. Father's Occupation Porter
Zachariah Robert son of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of 21 Webber Street. Baptised 10th November 1872. Father's Occupation Porter
Baptism Register
Walworth All Saints
Southwark
Sarah Ann daughter of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of 1 Mary Ann Place Guildford Street. Baptised 13th April 1886. Father's Occupation Porter
Alice daughter of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of 21 Mary Ann Place Guildford Street. Baptised 13th April 1886. Father's Occupation Porter
Will see what else I can find for you.
Cheers
Karenlee
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The Garretts in New Jersey before 1940
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Thanks for the information. I guess it doesn't have their birth dates. I know we go by Shakespears baptism records...
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Some Registers do give the birth dates, but not all as evidenced by the ones I sent you.
Marriage Register
Southwark Christ Church
1st April 1893
GARRETT Zachariah Robert 21 Bachelor Corkcutter of 6 Hatfield Street. Father = Richard GARRETT, Porter.
BROWN Sarah Alice 21 Spinster of 3 Isabella Street. Father = James BROWN, Tallow Chandler.
Both Bride and Groom signed
Witnesses were James BROWN and Ellen Jane BROWN
Karenlee
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so this means that Uncle Zachariah Garrett survived then. His mother passed away in 1887. His father was an Iron Safe Porter and had a temper, from what is written...
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I see that Zachariah's middle name is Robert. Could he be the Uncle Bob I hear of? Perhaps he didn't like his first name.
And Elizabeth with Matilda for a middle name....
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It does look like Zachariah was known as Robert....
1901 Census England London Lambeth Church First
RG13/405/44/34
38 Colwyn Street
GARRETT
Robert Head Marr 28 Cork Cutter London Southwark
Sarah A Wife Marr 29 London Bermondsey
Robert J Son Unmarr 7 London Southwark
Thomas J Son Unmarr 5 London Bermondsey
Florence A Dau Unmarr 3 London Camberwell
Frederick Son Unmarr Under 3 Mths London Lambeth
Karenlee
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Birth for a Beatrice Louise GARRETT 1881 St Saviour... death 1883 St Saviour.
Frederick GARRETT could well have been with family in 1891.... there is one possible, occupation Porter ( like his father ) living with WARBURTON family.
Karenlee
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With the letters that you have.... are any of the girls married and give their married names??
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My grandfather is the small child in middle of that one picture...
His name was Alfred Garrett 1892-1985
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With the letters that you have.... are any of the girls married and give their married names??
They are known as Alice, Sarah and Lizzie. The letters were from between 1886 to 1890. I don't know if there were more letters later. These are the ones that survived.
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picture
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The Garretts on a picnic...
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Okay, thanks for that.... the girls are still at home in 1891...
1891 Census England London St Saviours
RG12/342/35/22
Mary Ann Place
GARRETT
Richard Head Wid 56 Porter London Southwark
Thomas J Son Unmarr 22 Pattern Card Maker London Southwark
Elizabeth M Dau Unmarr 20 Dressing Gown Maker London Southwark
Sarah M Dau Unmarr 13 ?? Leather Curler London Southwark
Alice M Dau Unmarr 11 Scholar London Southwark
Karenlee
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There is a UK Census for 1911 that is searchable on the net, but you pay for images. It would be worth your while to check out who is still alive then, Robert and Sarah Alice are most definately there.
Karenlee
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thank you Karenlee.
I can't go on because I'm budgeting right now. Was out of work for awhile. Your looking is appreciated.
I was wondering, would you know the cemetery where Richard and Elizabeth Garrett are buried? Elizabeth died, as you may know, on 13 Dec 1887.
Perhaps a relative might see this query who may want to know where we are...
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Sorry, not seeing anything for their burial.... will keep trying for you
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It's odd how well my family preserved the old photographs but we seem to have nothing from the London/southwark days. From the letters it is said that George Garrett sent them photos and that his siblings were fighting over them.
I love these photos and even though time has passed it seems so close to me....
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Okay... here is what I can see...
Baptism Register
Lambeth St Mary
Lambeth Surrey
Richard Thomas son of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of Webber Street. Baptised 27th August 1865. Father's Occupation Porter
George James son of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of Webber Street. Baptised 14th July 1867. Father's Occupation Porter
Thomas John son of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of Webber Street. Baptised 18th April 1869. Father's Occupation Porter
Elizabeth Matilda daughter of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of Webber Street. Baptised 2nd April 1871. Father's Occupation Porter
Zachariah Robert son of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of 21 Webber Street. Baptised 10th November 1872. Father's Occupation Porter
Baptism Register
Walworth All Saints
Southwark
Sarah Ann daughter of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of 1 Mary Ann Place Guildford Street. Baptised 13th April 1886. Father's Occupation Porter
Alice daughter of Richard and Elizabeth GARRETT of 21 Mary Ann Place Guildford Street. Baptised 13th April 1886. Father's Occupation Porter
Will see what else I can find for you.
Cheers
Karenlee
[/quote Odd, my great-grandfather George James Garrett's place of birth(or address) is given as 15 Ewer Street, Southwark, on his birth certificate...
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Looking at it again... it looks more like Wood Street actually.
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Odd...they are all near the London Bridge, I'm told. Addresses for them have been 15 Ewer Street, 200 High Street and 1 Mary Ann Place...
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When my great-great grandmother Elizabeth (Maher) Garrett died on 13 December 1887, the address is given as 1 Mary Ann Place, her age 48, from Chronic cerebritis coma and the informant was her son Thomas John Garrett who was present at her death, of 1 Mary ann Place, Union Street, Southwark, when registered....14th of December 1887...
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Well Webber street is a reasonably long road in Lamberth that crosses Blackfriars road. No really near the Bridge though.
Union street runs parallel to Webber.
Borough High street is also close and leads onto the Bridge so they were right about that bit... so they don't seem to have move too far. All addresses in a few blocks actually.
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The Garretts in New Jersey before 1940
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Hi All.
Zacharia Robert Garrett was my Great Grand Father on my dads side so I am very happy top have found this post. It certainly helps fill in a few birth dates for the family.
To my family, Zacharia was always known as Robert, and they were most baffled when I dug up his birth cert.
I am looking for information on his wife - Sarah Alice Brown, born 1872 - I have hit a brick wall with her so any info would be great.
I would also love to know more about the mother of Zacharia, Elizabeth Maher 1839-1887. Was she born in the UK or Ireland as my Aunts seem to believe?? Any info would be amazing. . .
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Hello J Garrett,
I guess you and I would be 3rd cousins. Z. Robert Garrett was my great-grandfather's brother. My great-grandfather was George James Garrett(1867-1948). You can see some photos of George that I have posted here.
I'd like to know, too, if Elizabeth Maher Garrett was born in Ireland as well...
I have transcribed letters that your great-grandfather wrote to my great-grandfather before 1890. We've always wondered how the family did after those dates. I'm sure my ancestor kept in touch with yours.
I should note....my great grandparents named their first child Robert Garrett(1890-1967), and then my grandfather, Alfred Garrett(1892-1985) named his first child Robert Thomas Garrett(1915-2001)....you know how the saying goes, "Bob's your uncle"!
John Mangano
p.s. I too, was surprised to hear that Robert Garrett's first name was actually Zacharia.
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Hey Mangano,
They are great photo's indeed and I am trying to see if there is a physical resemblance between any one in the photos and myself:) Not that I can see - maybe the chin my Wife informs me:)
I would love to see a copy of the letters, such a link to the past!
I don't think the name Robert carried on down my line, but James and Thomas certainly did.
I will do some digging into Elizabeth Maher and see what I can dig up, the older generation certainly believe that she was, or her parents came from Ireland, but with no factual evidence - only suspicion and speculation!
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I see on the blogs here that your great grandmother, Sarah Alice Brown, was the daughter of James Brown, a tallow chandler and that she was born in Bermondsey, that she married Zachariah Robert Garrett on 1 April 1893 at Southwark Christ Church....
would love to know where they are buried, Richard and Elizabeth Garrett, it might give us clues...
I got the date of death of Elizabeth Maher Garrett from the letters. I also got a copy of the death cerificate from England.
also, the second witness for the marriage of your great-grandparents is Ellen Jane Brown....could be the mother, could be a sister....turns out to be younger sister
by the way, my mother's maiden name was Lowell Mae Garrett(1927-2003)....there are lots of Garrett cousins in the states....
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Nice Pictures!
Richard Garrett married Elizabeth Maher in 1864 in Lambeth. If you would like to buy the certificate:
Dec q 1d 621
Alice Maud Garrett married William Bevins (a Manchester warehouseman) in 1905 in Southwark. They had two daughters I can find (but can't give details of possible living people).
The youngest daughter (Alice Maud N Francis nee Bevins - 1912-1987) married in 1933 and had a son and a daughter.
Alice Maud Bevins died in 1968 in Greater London.
You have the family in the 1881 census where Elizabeth is a chair caner. She gives her POB as Southwark - so she's not the Irish one!
I have an ancestor as well, born in 1859 and the family always said she was Irish. However, she was born in Strand and her parents were Irish so maybe it's the same with your Elizabeth.
1881 census
117 Snowsfields, Bermondsey, Surrey
RG11 0558/16 26
BROWN
James, Head, M, 44, born Hertford, Tallow Sampler [probably meant to be chandler]
Charlotte, Wife, M, 45, born Worcester
Sarah A., Daur, 9, born Bermondsey
Ellen K., Daur, 6, born Bermondsey
Alfred J., Daur, 4, born Bermondsey
Plus two boarders: George Harrington, 52 and John H. Fudger, 19 - both unmarried general labourers.
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thank you so much CV-S....I know my cousin J Garrett will appreciate that information....as to Elizabeth Maher....I'd like to know more about her...she was 48 when she died. Some of her children may have been named after her parents...perhaps her parents were the ones from Ireland.
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200 High Street
Boro London
L. E.
18/11/(18)90
Dear George,
I write these few lines to you hoping to find you in good health as it leaves us at present not one but all am I am sorry to say Tom firm as gone wrong and that he has got the sack on Sat the 15th the instant after a time of eight years but I think that all the others are all right and I don't see why you should want father out there in fact I think that he would be afraid to cross the sea but never said anything about it.
father is all right in health and Tom the same Liz, Alice, Sarah and myself all right.
I'll tell you that Dick is come back after being away for 1 year and a half but you need not say anything about him in the next letter. Aunt Alice is queer and not able to work uncle Sam is all right and so is his wife which both send to you their respects and best wishes for Christmas Aunt Alice the same that's all we know about the family for the others because they have a fw togs or cloths and go to church don't think they are to speak to the likes of us but that wont hurt me.
I'll give you my word. that is all I have to say for the present hoping the this history and writing will please you and not offend you. I must conclude with a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year from all her.
Good Bye
R. Garrett
I thank you very much for your last letter.
The letter above is one of the last correspondances between George James Garrett and (Zachariah)Robert Garrett in 1890.
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My Great-Aunt Alice Garrett lived to be 100 years and 11 months. She married Selah P. Garrett on 7 November 1917 here in America. She died on her wedding anniversary in 1995. She idly said when visited her years ago that she would like to live 100 years. Perhaps her husband heard her. He must have called her back on their anniversary.
They raised 3 children, Ruth, Doris and Bobby Addison.
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In 1940, my great-grandparents George James Garrett and Emma Andersdotter celebrated 50 years of marriage.
As my great-aunt, Anna Elizabeth Garrett Sheppard wrote in her diary...Saturday 2 March 1940....Rain & Snow....All folks got to Mother's. I went over in afternoon. Mother spent day with Dot. Ruth down lots and Got Joe over. 25 of relations at supper of Turkey & fixings. Got table & chairs from Hall. (?) & Doris trimmed with yellow crepe paper. Bernard brought up wedding cake.
Business poor at shop & Joe felt down in dumps. Al & Emma went home after party. Selah & alice stayed at Bob's. Dorsi went with Oxley. Bernard sick after party. Arthur Collins took 2 pictures of family!.
The anniversary was actually Febraury 28th but the party was given on the 2nd of March...They were married in 1890 possibly in Tarrytown, New York but I don't have exact documents...
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another letter from Southwark.....
Aug 13th (18)88
1 Mary Anne Place
Union Streett
Boro S. E.
Dear George,
We received your Letter after it had been wandering about for a week owing to your not putting Union St. after Mary Anne Place but better late than never. Mother died of "Chronic Terebriums accelerated by coma" so the Doctor's Certificatte said, since then I have learned that coma means dropsy, what the other is I don't know.
The reason I did not write my second letter as promised: owing so to the unsettled state of home affairs which is not settled yet.
I am sorry to say the other reason is we are very busy at the shop. I have not left work some evenings before 11:15 sometimes 11:30; Saturdays at 6:30 Although so busy I have not had a rise this year the govenor says that though there is a lot of trade there is no profit.
I have just finished my fortnights, holiday which I spent at home looking after the bookstall business. Unfortunately there was only one auction which was held last thursday for the sale of a Lawyers library which is being all the law books was of no use to me. I met Bloodsworth up the Cut on Friday When I gave him your address he said he would write to you.
Bloodswork
No. 3 King St.
Lambeth Walk
London
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March 18, (18)89
Dear George,
I saw your letter complaining about not receiving any news. This letter was started by me on Aug 13th when I asked Liz to finish it and post it. You can imagine my surprise when I found that she had not done so. Things at home are not quite right. Father got out of work through Mr. Dick giving him a black eye, just a month after mother's death. Since then we have been humbugged about by him, he has had 1 sentence of 3 months, 2 separate months, and now he is committed to take his trial for stripping the lead off a warehouse roof, with three others.
Miss Liz threw herself out of work when mother died and has only just got a job.
I have kept the above troubles from reaching you through any of the previous letters; because I thought you might have enough troubles yourself and I only write you this now because you wish to know.
Wishing you every success
I remain yours truly,
T. Garrett
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Another letter written to George J Garrett from T(Thomas)Garrett in March of 1889
The book man up the Cut has 6 barrows, which himself two Sons & two strange men look after. I shall have another try this week down Chancery Lane in my dinner hour. Mr & Mrs. Singleton send their respects & hopes you are jogging along alright. They have been very good to us in lending us money to pay the Rent so I hope you will remember them in your next letter. All other friends and relations seem so sheer clean of us like rats deserting a sinking ship.
Dear George I now write to let you know how we are getting on father is still looking for work but can't get any I have none myself as everything seems so quiet in the city, Bob is still at the same place and seems to work hard and please don't forget your photograph in your next letter.
(March 19th 1889-Some more ill luck-Bob was sacked this morning).
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From what I've heard, Richard Garrett and Elizabeth Maher were married at St. Mary's in Lambeth the 30th of October in 1864. Not certain though.
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So from what I understand, Richard Garrett, who was born in 1835 and married Elizabeth Maheron 30 October 1864, was the son of
John Wells Garrett 1802- and Caroline Matilda Pask1807-1881,
and the grandson of Francis Luke Garrett1780- of Southwark, and Elizabeth Wells 1780- also from Southwark....seems to suggest that my ancestors remained in Southwark, England for generations.
Incredible is the history!
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Hi (Merry Xmas)
Garrett transcribed as GARROTT ............
1861 RG9 / 314 / 62 / Surrey / Southwark St Saviour / District 3 / Page 62
52 Ewer Street
John W Garrott Head 59 Bootmaker
Caroline M Garrott Wife 53
Richard Garrott Son 25 Dock Labourer
Elizabeth J Garrott Dau 11 Hat Tanner (?)
Thomas Garrott Son 15
Susan Garrott Dau 11
All born Southwark Surrey
Ewer Street SE1 is still there ("just")
The real interesting bit is this family, a few doors away ................
10 Ewer Street
Michael Maher Head 51 Lambeth
Sarah Maher Wife 50 Southwark
Alice Maher Dau 23 Southwark
Sarah Maher Dau 18 Southwark
Samuel Maher Son 14 Southwark
1871 the Garrett family are still in Ewer Street
Richard, Eliz, children = Richard, George, Thomas, Elizabeth AND Caroline (Widow)
1851 Garrett transcribed as Gunnell, all born Southwark
52 Ewer Street
John Gunnell Head 49 Shoe maker
Caroline Gunnell Wife 43
Francis Gunnell Son 20
Richard Gunnell Son 24
William Gunnell Son 14
Elizabeth Gunnell Dau 4
James Gunnell Son 5
Thomas Gunnell Son 3
Susan Gunnell Dau 1 Mo
Murtha Bettuford Lodger 53 Southwark
John Ward Lodger 60 Southwark
Ann Hughes Lodger 48 Southwark
1841 in Ewer Street (where else?) with a perfect example of age rounding (!)
All born Surrey
John Garrett 35 Shoe Maker
Caroline Garrett 30
John Garrett 10
Francis Garrett 10
Caroline Garrett 10
Richard Garrett 10
William Garrett 5
Regards
Ray
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thank you so much....they really misspelled back then.....
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The Maher Family?
1841 HO107 / 1088 / 5 / page 11
Surrey, StSaviour, District 11, Page 6
Norfolk Street
Robert Maher 30 Chairmaker Surrey
Sarah Maher 30 Surrey
Robert Maher 7 Surrey
James Maher 5 Surrey
Alice Maher 4 Surrey
Elizabeth Maher 2 Surrey
John Maher 9mo Surrey
1851 HO107 / 1588 / 40? / Page 43?
Surrey, SouthwarkStSaviour, District 15, Page 43
20 Ewer Street
(Maher transcribed as Macker)
Michael Maher Head 41 Southwark Labourer
Sarah Maher Wife 40 Southwark
Robert Maher Son 17 Southwark
Alice Maher Dau 13 Southwark
Eliza Maher Dau 13 Southwark
John Maher Son 12 Southwark
Sarah Maher Dau 3 Southwark
Henry Maher Son 6 Southwark
Samuel Maher Son 4 Southwark
1861 RG9 / 314 / 139 / Page 37
Surrey, SouthwarkStSaviour, District 4, Page 37
10 Ewer Street
Michael Maher Head 51 Lambeth
Sarah Maher Wife 50 Southwark
Alice Maher Dau 23 Southwark
Sarah Maher Dau 18 Southwark
Samuel Maher Son 14 Southwark
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1/11/1838 St.Mary Lambeth
Robert Maher bach. Chair maker father Patrick Iron Founder
Sarah Ware both of Carlisle Street both Full age father ? Ware Coal Porter Deceased
Witnesses Henry Williams & Alice Hill
Jennifer
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So, 3 children before they decided to get married?
Was this a second marriage for either?
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So, 3 children before they decided to get married?
Was this a second marriage for either?
and was anyone born in Ireland....Patrick Maher? Patrick is a good Irish name....
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1871 Census 10 Ewer Street indexed as Maker
In the same house as a John & Ann Hullett
Robert Maker 61 Chair cainer St.Saviours
Sarah 60 " " "
Allice 33 " " "
plus 3 boarders
Could this be Sarah?
1901 census 45 Marks Road Romford
Boarders in the household of a Frederick & Rose Dorrington
Sarah Maher 89 boarder own means born London
Elizabeth Maher 37 boarder Gen.Serv.Domestic Woolwich Kent
Jennifer
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1871 Census 10 Ewer Street indexed as Maker
In the same house as a John & Ann Hullett
Robert Maker 61 Chair cainer St.Saviours
Sarah 60 " " "
Allice 33 " " "
plus 3 boarders
Could this be Sarah?
1901 census 45 Marks Road Romford
Boarders in the household of a Frederick & Rose Dorrington
Sarah Maher 89 boarder own means born London
Elizabeth Maher 37 boarder Gen.Serv.Domestic Woolwich Kent
Jennifer
Robert and Sarah Maher's grandson George James Garrett(my great-grandfather) was born at 15 Ewer Street on 23 June 1867. They being at Number 10, it must have been great having them just a few doors down the street!
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Mangano Hi, Jennifer C found me at Ancestry and directed me here. I am a decendent of my gggrandmother Sarah Maher, sister of your Elizabeth Maher/Garrett.
My family tree is posted at Ancestry and online at www.treetracer.plus.com/p154.htm
I don't think I have any additional information to what has been posted by Jennifer et al but now the Maher line has been brought back to my attention I'll have another look and see if I can find any more.
And if you ever find anything about Michael Robert Maher do let me know as he has been our brickwall for many years.
Regards
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Mangano Hi, Jennifer C found me at Ancestry and directed me here. I am a decendent of my gggrandmother Sarah Maher, sister of your Elizabeth Maher/Garrett.
My family tree is posted at Ancestry and online at www.treetracer.plus.com/p154.htm
I don't think I have any additional information to what has been posted by Jennifer et al but now the Maher line has been brought back to my attention I'll have another look and see if I can find any more.
And if you ever find anything about Michael Robert Maher do let me know as he has been our brickwall for many years.
Regards
thanks for writing....
I guess we're third cousins, once removed? I'll have to see how that works....
Fourth cousins, it looks like...We have the father of Michael Robert Maher as Patrick...
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Been trying to find out more on my ancestor FRANCIS LUKE GARRETT(1780-1843). On ancestry.com, I've found that some have listed his year of birth as 1775 instead of 1780.
Looking up where he was interred, discovered that the church was damaged, if not completely destroyed during the Second World War, circa 1943.
Would love to know the names of his ancestors....He was married to Elizabeth Wells(1780- ? ) and I'm related to them throught their son, John Wells Garrett(1802-1864)
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Been trying to find out more on my ancestor FRANCIS LUKE GARRETT(1780-1843). On ancestry.com, I've found that some have listed his year of birth as 1775 instead of 1780.
Looking up where he was interred, discovered that the church was damaged, if not completely destroyed during the Second World War, circa 1943.
Would love to know the names of his ancestors....He was married to Elizabeth Wells(1780- ? ) and I'm related to them throught their son, John Wells Garrett(1802-1864)
Since my last query, I received information that the parents of Francis Luke Garrett were Francis Garrett and Mary Mason. Also, he had a brother named William Albin Garrett who married the daughter of James Stephen, the great abolitionist of Britain!
There's also some discrepancy as to the year of birth of Francis Luke Garrett's birth....1775, 1780 and 1783!
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On line info. gives Francis & Mary both die 1808.
Francis died Wren House Clapham buried 1808 Old Churchyard St.Pauls Clapham.
Other children besides William Albin Garrett. Google William Albin and more info. comes up.
Jennifer
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Familysearch-
Francis Garrett born 31/8/1783 bapt. 28/9/1783
William Albin Garrett 19/4/1782 bapt. 18/5/1782
Both at St.Michael Crooked Lane London Parents Francis & Mary Garrett
Jennifer
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Hi, I have a funny feeling that Francis Luke Garrett who married Elizabeth Wells is not the same Francis Garrett who was the brother of William Albin & son of Francis & Mary.
I don't know where you got the link from, but I will try to trace the other Francis, brother of William A. You seem to be going out of area and from very wealthy to very poor in a very short space of time.
Jennifer
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St.Michael Crooked Lane London Marriage-
Francis Garrett to MaryAnn Linde 17/1/1810
Jennifer
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Looking at the copy of the parish records it says-
Francis Garrett Esq. & Mariann Linde both of the parish of Clapham
although they were married in London they were married by the Rector of Clapham by license from the Arch. of canterbury.
Witnesses were William Albin Garrett, Elizabeth Garrett, Robert Maclaurin?
Jennifer
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Looks like he could have retired down to Devon in his old age.
Francis Garrett 1841 & 1851 census Ellacombe House Torquay Devon
1851 widower aged 67 born City of London Landed proprietor/landholder and proprietor of houses.
Jennifer
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I guess he is not yours, but if you are still interested his will is on line £25000 - death 15/7/1860 Totnes Devon.
Jennifer
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Burial Christchurch Southwark 26/2/1843
Francis Garrett of Cross Street aged 68 born c.1775
Jennifer
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William Albin Garrett died 13/11/1858 Sussex will on line £8000
Jennifer
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On line info. gives Francis & Mary both die 1808.
Francis died Wren House Clapham buried 1808 Old Churchyard St.Pauls Clapham.
Other children besides William Albin Garrett. Google William Albin and more info. comes up.
Jennifer
A cousin from Australia has Mary Mason(b 1760....dying in 1806) and then Francis remarrying in 1810 to Mariann Linde at St Michael Crooked Lane.
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William Albin Garrett died 13/11/1858 Sussex will on line £8000
Jennifer
William's father in law was James Stephen, the great abolitionist. His brother in law was Sir James Stephen.
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Francis the son marries 1810.
Jennifer
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Yes he did marry James Stephens daughter, but I do not think William is your family.
Jennifer
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Re-checked
Mary Garrett spouse Francis Garrett Esq.died 1806 Francis Garrett Esq 1809 both buried Holy Trinity Clapham
Jennifer
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Sort of confusing, I have the other Francis Garrett marrying Elizabeth Wells in 1801 with their first child, John Wells Garrett being born soon after....and there were several generations of children being born with Wells, included with their middle names....
some of the Garretts also used the alternate spelling of Garratt. One of the aunts/cousins, Ada Wells Garrett 1883-1934(daughter of Samuel Wells Garret), married one John William Garrett in 1910, according to a cousin.
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There seem to be two Francis Garrett, if I am right your one is in Lambeth with middle name Luke you give birth 1780. He marries Elizabeth Wells in 1801 and John Wells Garrett was bapt. St.George the Martyr 23/2/1802.
The other Francis is bapt. 1783 and married in St.Michael Crooked Lane to Mariann Linde 1810.
Francis the father married 28/5/1781 St.Margaret Lothbury London
Francis Garrett of St.Michael Crooked Lane and Mary Mason of this parish witnesses Wm.Albin, JW.Garrett & JC Carter.
They were not even married when your Francis was born.
Jennifer
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Hi,I have come across yr chats by chance.I am also a descendent of John Wells Garrett a d Caroline Matilda Pask.My grandmother was Pamela Wells Garrett.I have been tracing the Garretts for some time.I got stuck with Francis Garrett did not know his middle name was Luke.Can recommend an excellent site Pask Family History,it has a lot of details on the Garretts.Family history is fascinating especially the old family stories.Our story was that our Garretts were related to the famous Garretts of Leiston which Elizabeth Garrett Anderson.I have found no such connection,another family myth.Be happy to supply any missing info.your ancestorRichard Garrett married to Elizabeth Maher was. Brother of my ancestor John Wells Garrett born 1828.I live in New Zealand.Cheers
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Where does Pamela Wells Garrett fit into the family? Who was her father. I'd like to include her with my tree, too. I was told that that branch of the family kept Wells as part of their name to keep some good luck in the family. From what I've seen, it seems to have worked well.
My ancestor Richard Garrett(1834- , seems to have disappeared from London after the death of his wife Elizabeth Maher in 1887. I saw some things that suggested he may have followed one of this sons to Canada.
Our Garrett branches seem to have gone to America, New Zealand, Australia and Canada.
John
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I just found the branch....Pamela being the daughter of Francis Wells Garrett and Mary Ann Lucock, and that she married in 1912 to Walter Shoubridge. I think I had skipped Francis Wells Garrett because of the other Frank Wells Garrett who had died in infancy....perhaps circa 1877.
If you are David Cotty, then we are 4th cousins....
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Hi,
Yes. I am David Cotty.Family history is absolutely fascinating,especially the stories which mainly turn out to be myths,which throw you of course.The Pask Family History site fills in many missing bits,however cannot get beyond Francis Luke Garrett and Elizabeth Wells,have no idea where they came from,with the myths about the connections to the Garretts of Leiston,Suffolk have wasted hours looking for a possible Suffolk connection.Nothing found.However some years ago we found a possible connection to Church Stretton,Shropshire, a long way from Southwark and Suffolk.However recently found on the Mormon site a Francis Garrett born 8.3.1776 in Maddington,WiltshireCantconfirm either record as being our ancestor.My Cotty ancestors have been much easier all dirt poor,got back to 1650.Cheers
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Did your Garrett marry Tutt early 1900s Peckham? If so their children are cousins to my dad aged 97. He often talks of the Garrett boys
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At present, I don't know if those names come in our Garrett tree. Further investigations would have to be done.
Thank you.
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Do not have any knowledge of a Tutt in our family tree. However I do know that Francis Wells Garret lived in Peckham in 1915, because when his son Frank was killed in January 1915 near Ypres Francis was listed as his next of kin living in Peckham.Sorry cant help any further at present.Cheers Dave
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HI
My name is Louise Wells-Garrett - daughter of Thomas, born 1943 (Southwark) who is the son of Thomas (see below) and Daisy Wells-Garrett (nee Daisy Dillion) also of Southwark. I know my father is the cousin of Arthur Wells-Garrett (who lives in Dulwich, London). I know my grandfather had connections to Bear Lane in Waterloo and also had relatives in Bognor, E SUssex but this is really all I know. Sadly my grandfather died in service in the Second World War and never got to see his son, my dad. I'd love to know the history of the Wells-Garretts and who put Wells and Garrett together.
Thomas Wells Garrett (my grandad)
ca. 1912
United Kingdom Death December 03, 1942 Burial / Funeral Salcombe (bonfire Hill) Cemetery Sec. 5. Grave 173., Military Service Service number: d/kx 129243
Rank: Stoker 1st Class
Regiment: Royal Navy
Unit/ship/squadron: H.m.s. Penylan Gender Male
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My great grandfather George James Garrett 1867-1948, son of Richard Garrett and Elizabeth Maher had a brother Thomas John Garrett born 1869.
A cousin was named Thomas Wells Garrett 1848-1934. A number of our cousins used Wells as a middle name as good luck. Another Garrett's maiden name was Wells.
This Thomas Wells Garrett seems to have gone to Canada.
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I should say my grandad Thomas, was the Son of Arthur and Ellen Wells-Garrett of London.
Yes - I had heard there were relations in Canada.
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And we definitely seem to be the Wells-Garretts that had hatters and a hat shop in Walworth Road as I recall my dad, Tom talking of this.
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Being that you've got Wells in the name suggests strongly that we are related.
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Hi, It's great to hear from a Wells- Garrett, I thought the name had died out.My Great Grandfather was Francis Wells-Garrett. His occupation was listed as a journeyman hatter. My mother said he worked with other relatives, and made military hats such as the Guards Regiments bearskin hats. That's interesting about a shop in Walworth, it seems to make sense. From what it's worth another family story was that a Wells was the ships doctor on H.M.S Warrior which was the first ironclad it is now at Portsmouth across from Nelsons H.M.S Victory. Visited Warrior a few years ago and checked this story out, and sure a Wells was the Doctor, unexpectedly got a private trip around the ship when the guides found out we had a possible connection. Checked this Wells out it seems he was born in the West Indies, no idea if there is a connection to our Garretts Cheers Dave
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Hi, just noticed that that Lou,s Grandfather who was sadly killed in WW2 was a Royal Navy stoker. My Great Uncle John Wells Garrett a son of Francis Wells-Garrett was a regular Royal Navy stoker. Loved visiting him as a child, loved his story's and better was the half crown he always gave me when we left.He was on Admiral Beattys flagship H.M.S Lion at the Battle of Jutland in WW1 and had his nose broken in Hong Kong, great story's, was fascinated by the beautiful honourable discharge certificate which hung on the front room wall. In those days the front room was today's lounge, but only used for visitors etc, funny. He lived in Dagenham near the Ford factory. Cheers Dave
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In my tree I have an Arthur Edwin Wells Garrett, son of Richard Wells Garrett and Catherine Pearson, who married Ellen Eliza Moss....he would be my second cousin, twice removed. There was a mention of being a hatter.
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Wow - well from what I can make out I believe Arthur Edwin Wells -Garrett to be my grandad's father (ie my dad's grandad). It seems he was a private that died in battle and I found a war grave (a tomb) in Picardie, France that seems to be him.
Do you know what became of Ellen? And did they have a Thomas as a son, ie my grandad? Be good to be sure.
CottyD - it seems my strain of Wells-Garrett's were around Southwark, Waterloo, and not really educated so I'm not sure the Doctor is connected...
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Lou, my Wells- Garretts came from Southwark and were poor as well. The Wells connection is very tenuous with regard to the ships doctor. In fact I should not have used the title doctor. In those days ships carried a medical person who was unqualified and frankly was more apt at cutting of arms and legs during action. I have found no connection to our family with this Wells, its probably another family myth.As my Wells-Garretts were hatters and resided in Southwark during the 19th century I think we are probably distantly related.The difficulty I have found in trying to trace Wells-Garrett is that the Wells gets dropped in some records, and at other times is counted as a middle Christian name, and sometimes hyphenated other times not.I hope I have not confused you. Cheers Dave
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Hi there - not at all. So have you managed to do a family tree? Be good to find out more about this hat shop/trade.
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From what I understand, Francis Luke Garrett 1783-1843 married Elizabeth Wells 1780-1847 in 1801, London. Francis was from Southwark.
Their son, John Wells Garrett 1802-1864, is also our common ancestor who seems to have been the first to use Wells as a middle name.
It appears that Louise and I would be 4th cousins, once removed, from what I see.
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I just recently found the year of death for my ancestor RICHARD GARRETT. He was born 29 October 1834 to John Wells Garrett and Caroline Matilda Pask. He married Elizabeth Maher of Southwark on 30 October 1864 in Lambeth. The year of death is given as 1903....nothing exact. Was wondering if I can find more and perhaps the place of burial.
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Hi, Been a long time. Have joined Ancestry and probably have got more confused about the Francis Luke Garrett ancestors.
Many family trees have a connection through a Francis Garratt or Garrett and a Mary Mason I believe this to be totally wrong as has already been pointed out on this RootsChat.Its impossible to be living in the slums of London whilst a supposed brother John Garratt is The Lord Mayor of London.
So lets put that connection to bed.
The other concern I have is regarding the birth date of Francis Luke Garrett, his marriage to Elizabeth Wells and the subsequent children can be confirmed by the records.
Francis and Elizabeth's first child John Wells was born on the 23.2.1802 which was only six months after they married nothing unusual in that, but Francis would have been only 17 nearly 18 when they married. Would he have been allowed to marry at that age if the birth date of 1783 was correct. I noticed that on one family tree they had a guesstimate of 1775 as a birth date which seems more logical.A researcher did some work for me many years ago and could not identify with certainty the parents of John Wells Garrett.I know this does not help, but prefer to have certainty. Cheers Dave
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Hi, it's me again. I have looked through various records and found a death record for a Francis Garrett on the 26th February 1843 at Christ Church Southwark it must be our Francis Luke Garrett as same dates. It gives his age as 68, thus birth around 1775. Found a Francis Garrett born on the 8th March 1776 at Maddington, Wiltshire. There are no other records for a Francis or Francis Luke around this time.Its not certain that I have the correct person, but it's a possibility. I am visiting England next week if I get a chance will try and delve further. Cheers Dave
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I have read with interest all of these messages and I don't think anyone had given the full details of the following, unless I have missed it?
St Mary's Church Lambeth
Richard Garrett full age of Webber St occ Porter father John Wells Garrett Shoe Maker
to
Elizabeth Maher full age of Webber St father Robert Maher Chair Maker
witnesses W Garrett and Jane Wilkes
all signed their names
Louisa Maud
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Hi, Again and Again. You can tell I am on holiday!!
In the birth record of Francis Garrett in 1776 in Maddington it states that father was Francis and mother was ELizabeth. There is a marriage record for a Francis Garrett and a ELizabeth Moore on the 23rd July 1772 in Shrewton and residence as Maddington.This appears to fit, also a record in 1781 of a Francis Garrett Wheelright of Maddington having an apprentice. All of foregoing cannot be proved they are Francis Luke Garrett,s parents, but believe its the best lead we have, as the dates etc are logical. Also middle names are often omitted. As previously mentioned a researcher did comment that there was a possible Wiltshire connection. Frankly I ignored this as the family believed it came from Suffolk and was linked to the Garretts of Leiston, another family myth bites the dust!! When I get back home to New Zealand will check out the researchers emails etc, might find more info.Cheers Dave
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Hi, I just stumbled across this from a google search.
reading the posts it would seem I am the Great,Great,Great,Great Grandson of Richards father (John Wells Garrett b1804)
CottyD are you there? in one of your posts you mention my Great Grandfather John who was a stoker in the Royal Navy. Do you know why he was medically discharged?
And did you know his children and maybe his grandchildren (ie my mum Jacqueline) ?
Please reply
Stephen
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I'm interested, too. Important to get records correct. Richard Garrett was my great-great grandfather. 2 of his sons (Francis and James Garrett) ended up in San Francisco around the time of the big earthquake. One of them married a girl from Mexico, thus we have a branch of Garretts in Mexico.
My branch of the Garretts were mostly in New Jersey, USA. My great grandfather, was George James Garrett (1867-1948)
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Have you managed to trace further back from Richards Father (John Wells-Garrett b.1804)?
I think he married Caroline Matilda Pask, was a shoe maker and had a number of children (Francis, Caroline, Richard, William, Elizabeth, James, Thomas, Susan and John).
His Son John being the eldest and apparently its a 'Garrett' thing that the eldest son is named after his father. Which has held true all through our branch.
I must confess I am not a Garrett by name, but my mother was, and tells me I'm the image of Garret Generation.
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My mother was Lowell Mae Garrett (1927-2003) born in Alabama and dying in Somers Point, New Jersey. Francis Luke Garrett is my 4th great grandfather …. My grandparents had 32 grandchildren in all....many as Garretts.
Francis Luke Garrett ….John Wells Garrett 1802-1864....Richard Garrett 1834-1903....George James Garrett 1867-1948....Alfred Garrett 1892-1985.....Lowell Mae Garrett 1927-2004.....me
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That's a lot of Garretts!
Please tell me about when and why (and who) Richard moved to America, this is so fascinating.
I think one of your earlier posts suggested a link between our Wells Garretts and a Garratt, which you discounted because of a disparity in wealth... I spoke with my mum last night and she mentioned that apparently there was MONEY in the family but it was handed down to the wrong part of the family, which caused a little bad blood to the point that caused one particular Garrett family to adopt/add the "Wells" name to create some sort of separation.
If this was true, could it be your previous link may be correct. Just a thought.
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Richard stayed in London. His son George James Garrett 1867-1948 came to America....in the 1880s. It is said he had something to do with the navy. Something exploded on ship near New York. The British Navy left him behind and he decided to stay. He wrote to his family in London, and they back to him. He married a Swedish girl named Emma Andersdotter 1866-1955 in 1890. He had 5 children.
As to the cousins who kept Wells as part of their name, they thought it good luck and used it for generations as a middle name. Some of them moved to Australia.
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In my tree I have an Arthur Edwin Wells Garrett, son of Richard Wells Garrett and Catherine Pearson, who married Ellen Eliza Moss....he would be my second cousin, twice removed. There was a mention of being a hatter.
Hi - its been a few years and I've picked this up again trying to find out a bit more about my grandfather's dad Arthur Edward Wells-Garrett.
I had thought I was related to Arthur Edwin Wells-Garrett but I'm not so sure. The mystery seems to be that Arthur Edward also married an Ellen Wells-Garrett (my grandad's mum). This is what Teresa Pask Kindly passed on:
My grandad was Thomas Wells-Garrett.
>
> At https://www.gro.gov.uk, we found your grandfather's birth registration 1912/Q4 GARRETT, Thomas Wells MOSS Southwark 1d 19.
>
> At findmypast.co.uk, we found his military information - son of Arthur Eward Wells-Garrett and Ellen Wells-Garrett of Southwark London; husband of Daisy Wells-Garrett, of Southwark.
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> In the 1939 Register, he was listed at 6 Banks House, Southwark, London., living with James H. WALTERS, and Eliza A. WALTERS. His date of birth was given as 16 October 1912 (this coincides with his birth registration).
>
> In Ancestry.co.uk, we found his baptism. See attached. This confirms his date of birth.
>
> Also in Ancestry, we found the marriage of Ellen WELLS-GARRETT, Ellen
> Wells-Garrett aged 20 born 1906. She married 1 Aug 1926 at St. Paul's
> Southwark. Her father was listed as Arthur Edwin Wells-Garrett
> (deceased). A witness was J.H. WALTERS (the same as in the 1939
> Register?)
>
Can you shed anymore light on who Arthur Edwin Wells-Garrett and if he had any cousins/brothers ? I believe my grandad Thomas had a sister Ellen.
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Found an Edwin Arthur Wells Garrett married Rosina in 1971 but it looks as if they were together for years before, although not sure he is your man
Louisa Maud
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Found an Edwin Arthur Wells Garrett married Rosina in 1971 but it looks as if they were together for years before, although not sure he is your man
Louisa Maud
It appears that Arthur Edwin Wells Garrett died during war times on 27 May 1918 and is buried in France....Soissons, Departement de l'aisne, Picardie, France.
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As to siblings of Arthur I have these:
Richard Thomas Wells-Garrett 1881-1957
Alfred Henry Wells-Garrett 1884-1967
Catherine Annie Wells-Garrett 1888-1922
Lillian Wells-Garrett 1891-1977
Arthur Edwin Wells-Garrett(of course is 1886-1918
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Hi
What seems interesting is that Arthur Edward Wells-Garrett also married a MOSS - Ellen Moss? Did Ellen have siblings?
Arthur Edwin also married an Ellen Moss? Confused!
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Was wondering if there is any newspaper or other items that tell the story how Richard Garrett received sentences or other in the beginning of 1888? His wife died in December of 1887, he had problems after that....Thomas was a son of Richard Garrett and George was another. George was my great grandfather, living in America most likely at this time in 1888/89
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Hi, fascinated by your thread. My great Grandad was a hatter- surname Wells-Garrett. Walworth Road. I'm aware he had a number of sons. My Grandad was his son, William.
:) Sue.