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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: R. D. Black on Friday 01 April 11 14:50 BST (UK)
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Trying to find detail of Alice Muers when she arrived in NSW in 1814 she was one of 122 female convicts transported on the Broxbornebury history of what happened to her would be useful
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Hi RD Black :)
I've searched convict records and NSW BDMs but can find nothing apart from her name on a list of women on board the Broxbornebury :-\
Do you have any more information about her? Do you know if she had descendants, for example?
Cheers
Prue
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MARRIAGE:
MUERS Alice (MORRIS/MAURICE) ship Broxbornebury married MULLER Mathias (al MILLER) ship Indian 25 Nov 1814 at WINDSOR
REF: (Reel 6004; 4/3493 p.382)
MILLER Matthew m. MAURICE Alice 1814
Parish: Windsor, St Matthew's, Church of England
Ref Number: V18141702 3A
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Children's Christenings:
MILLER Joseph - Christening 1815
Father: Matthew
Mother: Alice
Parish: Windsor, St Matthew's, Church of England
Ref Number: V18153710 1B
MILLER Jane - Christening 1817
Father: Matthew
Mother: Alice
Parish: Sydney, St Phillip's, Church of England
Ref Number: V18174498 1B
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MILLER Matthew - Per "Indian", 1810
1814 Nov 25; Re permission to marry at Windsor (Reel 6004; 4/3493 p.382)
1816 May 29 ;Constable at Windsor. Captured three runaway prisoners from Newcastle with John Millward (Reel 6046; 4/1736 p.80)
1816 Nov 1; Constable. Paid from the Police Fund for apprehending three runaways from Newcastle (Reel 6038; SZ759 p.272)
1820 Jul; Memorial; as Matthias (Fiche 3025; 4/1824B No.496 pp.835, 838)
1821 Sep 8; Constable. On list of all persons victualled from H.M. Magazines; with his wife and two children (Reel 6016; 4/5781 p.60)
1822 ;Signatory to petition from the ordinary constables of Sydney complaining of the diminution of their rations (Reel 6055; 4/1760 p.43c)
1822 Dec 27-1825 Aug 30; On pay lists of constables employed at Sydney (Reel 6029, 4/7016A pp.14-216, 4/7016B pp.6-208 & 4/7016C pp.22-384; Reel 6030, 4/7016D pp.20-386; Reel 6061, 4/1779 pp.154b, 163b & 4/1780 pp.190b, 207b, 222c)
1823 Mar; Ordinary constable. On list of constables in Sydney from Sep 1820 to Mar 1823 (Reel 6056; 4/1764 p.64)
1823 Jun 28; Constable to Judge Advocate John Wylde. Petition to have woman from Factory assigned to him to look after children as his wife had recently died (Reel 6058; 4/1771 p.355). Reply, 30 Jun (Reel 6009; 4/3505 p.598)
1824; On list of constables doing duty in Sydney and its environs requiring slop clothing (Reel 6017; 4/5782 p.94)
1824 May 22, Jun 4,11; On lists of constables doing duty for the town of Sydney and its vicinity who are entitled to a weekly ration (Reel 6061; 4/1779 pp.97b, 119c, 140c)
1824 Dec 31; On list of district and other constables doing duty in Sydney and its vicinity; stationed at the late Judge Advocate's (Reel 6063; 4/1784 p.314c)
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DEATH:
MILLER Alice age 35yrs d. 1823
Parish: Sydney, St Phillip's, Church of England
Ref Number: V18235798 2B
MILLER Alice age 35yrs d. 1823
Parish: Sydney, St Phillip's, Church of England
Ref Number: V1823889 8
MILLER Alice age 35yrs d. 1823
Parish: Parramatta, St John's, Church of England
Ref Number: V18236798 2C
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It appears that Matthew MILLER was nearly executed in 1828 for the murder of his second wife Mary Ann AUSTIN.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0cki/
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0ckj/
Debra :)
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Can anyone tell me more about Alice? Who were her family where did she come from? I know she was in Belford in 1813 and because of what she did she ended up in Australia. Curious to know if she was from Northumberland or Scotland any help most useful
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Poor Alice was sentenced to death ,for larcenry of a dwelling house,
Northumberland ,July 1813,
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Which court, Gillian?
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The entry on A*y (the Criminal Registers) just says Northumberland & in the sentence column it does say death.
This seems to be the same person who was sentenced on 13 August 1813 & transported in 1814 - see the site below. The death sentence must have been commuted, as this site has Alice Muers sentenced to 7 years transportation at the "Northumberland Assizes".
http://www.convictrecords.com.au/convicts/muers/alice/98332
Matilda
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Sorry for got to say Northumberland ,I did see she had been sent to Australia with a couple of other ladies from Northumberland but without seeing the whole court records for Alice I don't know when and why she was given a reprieve,
I cant find any birth details for her in England or Scotland or a possible marriage,saying that I didn't have a lot of time to look last night as it was late,
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There's also ALICE MUERS sentenced to 7 years transportation at the Newcastle upon Tyne Assizes on 19 August 1813.... no mention of a death sentence at all .... that lass arrived in the colonies ex the ship SURREY ... in January 1814
Cheers, JM
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An ALICE MUERS was transported on the "Broxbornebury" in 1814 to Sydney for 7 years, her life sentence commuted to that. An e-book by E.Hook gives her life span c1785-1823. She was aged 28 when given life sentence for "larceny above 40 shillings in a dwelling house" and 29 when she got to Australia. It doesn't say where she came from, but gives occ. as Servant.
Book says she married another convict n/o Matthew or Nathaniel Miller in November 1814.
They had 2 children, Joseph c1815 - ? and Jane c1818 - ?.
Alice died in Sydney on 18 June 1823 aged 38.
As this is before civil registration began, it is doubtful that you would get any other information if you did order a transcript of the d.c. The old ones usually didn't state how long in the colony, or native place. But this might be on the convict indent - have you looked there?
Serendipity - just taking a break from cataloguing CDs for our FH library, and the above is one I have just done!
Dawn M
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Just discovered you have two threads on this topic.
Maybe you should get them merged so people don't spend time looking for information you have already been given?
Dawn M
* Moderator comment: Thanks Dawn - topics merged and put on Australia board :) *
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Alice was sent immediately on arrival, to work as a servant for John Norman a landowner at Windsor, NSW.
Can we please have these two threads merged??
Dawn M
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Yes, agree, need to merge these threads, noting I have found another ALICE MUERS transported on the SURREY arriving Sydney NSW January 1814 ... trial in Newcastle upon Tyne August 1813, sentence 7 years... will mean that care needs to be taken with the Australian searches to ensure there's no confusion between the two lasses...
Cheers, JM
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JM where did you find that? 2 Alice Muers tried Newcastle upon Tyne / Northumberland Summer Assizes, both in August 1813??
I wonder if there's a mistranscription somewhere?
Have asked the moderator on other thread to please merge, but as one's in Northumberland and one in Australia....??
Dawn M
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Extended subscription on a commercial website, sighted the registrar for both lasses .... One sent via Surrey arriving Jan 1814 was sentenced Aug 1813 to seven years (no mention of a death sentence), other was sent via Broxbornebury later that same year, .... trial shows death sentence, but that must have been remitted to transportation.
Cannot find either lass mentioned in the 1788-1825 Col Sec's records, but IF these are two different lasses in Sydney by Dec 1814, with that unusual spelling of the surname and with the same first name .... then there's likely to be much confusion ...
JM
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Alice via the SURREY, tried at Newcastle etc...
trial 19 August 1813 also same date same place trial for a Margaret Gordon .... 7 years.
perhaps the Surrey departed UK Jan 1814, but that is MY view, the index online does NOT specify it it is departure date or arrival into Sydney.
Perhaps same lass, boarded firstly Surrey (perhaps a hulk) then transferred to Broxbornebury BUT the image I am currently looking at does NOT mention death sentence, nor Broxbornebury .... at all ... thus I am suggesting the possibility of two lasses with that very unusual spelling of her surname, or at least suggesting caution ...
JM
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Agh ....
Surry/Surrey and Broxbornebury arrived Sydney one day apart as per Wiki (arriving 27 and 28 July 1814)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surry_(ship)
Surry/Surrey carried male convicts, and Broxbornebury the females... came via Rio, under orders issued by Plymouth Courts in Feb 1814.
For Alice Muers to have been transported after receiving a death sentence, she would have needed to have received a form of pardon from the King.... this would in turn .... usually result in a life sentence, which could have then been remitted to 14 years, and then remitted down again to 7 years. There should be records of those transactions. I have similar story .... trial 1815 in Scotland, sentence of death with jury asking for mercy, pardon issued by George III's signature when at Bath, paperwork arrived back in Scotland day before sentence due to be carried out after having been transmitted back to the Prince Regent for his signature also.
Convict (a female) agreed to transportation for life. By July 1815 that had been remitted to 14 years, and when embarking at Deal (thinking about the methods of transport to get her there from Edinburgh), it was noted on her papers that the 14 years had been remitted further to seven years. That forebear arrived Sydney early 1817, and then married, had several children and was dead by Sept 1825.... It was a very hard/difficult life for females in those days. Without oral history and private family papers it would still be unlikely that I would have found the link between that convict and my own tree, despite online convict records even today.
Cheers, JM
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JM if you go back a few pages to image 67 the lead page is headed "Broxbournebury 122 females" - all the name entries for this ship are indexed as arriving on the Surrey. Sometimes Ancestry makes me want to wash my eyes out with soap!! 8)
Debra :)
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So we can assume ??? that there is only one Alice MUERS tried in Northumberland in August 1813 and transported to Australia (per Broxbournebury)?
Dawn M
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Yes, one Alice Muers...
Don't go washing your eyes out with soap, should be ME doing that.... I usually check, but am having ISP issues so using a wifi connection instead, and it is clunky ....
I apologise for the obvious diversion that I have caused.
JM
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Well, from what Dundee says, it's A**/z!y that's caused the diversion, really!
;D ;D ;D ;D
Dawn M
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Alice married Matthew Miller or Mathias Muller had two children and died. I am a decendant.
Matthew remarried to a person, not of sober habits, strangled her and was again sentanced to death. His sentance was commuted to life enprisonment and was sent to either Tasmania or Norfolk Is (Have not been able to find out. Search on Regina V Miller of about 1828 in www.austlii.edu.au for the court case.
E Hooks book is fascinating in that Alice and her fellow prisoners were sent to NSW on a boat which as captured. They were abandoned at Cape Verde then rescued taken back to England only to be sent to NSW again in the Broxbournebury.
Not a fortnate lady
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Hi,
I am also a descendant of Alice, via her son Joseph Miller. I would love hear from you.
Regards,
Gayle
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I am a descendant of Alice Muers, and her daughter Sarah Jane Miller who married George Cooper.
She had two children and died 18 Jun 1823.
Her husband was named as Mathew Miller but appears to have been a Matthias Muller. He remarried and strangled his second wife, was sentenced to death again and his sentence was commuted to life imprisonment.
I have no information on the descendants of Joseph Miller but a search on BDM for New South Wales may help.
Rob