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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Staffordshire => Topic started by: bookaddictau on Thursday 26 May 11 14:55 BST (UK)
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Hi!
I am trying to go further back in my tree from Mary Ann Haller born 1881 in Staffordshire, England to her parents Charles Haller and Susan Ezekiel. I cannot find any birth, death,marriage, census or other records of either of her parents.
I hope someone can help with any clues that can help me get past this stumbling block.
The only other info I have is Susan was a Jewess and Charles a potter. He was sent to India with the army and their daughter married in 1904 in Poona, India. The daughter eventually emigrated to Australia and we have all the records from then on.
Many thanks in anticipation,
Robyn (Sydney)
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cannot find any birth of a mary haller in staffs between 1879-1883
what source do you base your info on regarding this birth?
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Like Wozzle, I can't see any sign of Mary Ann's birth in England, or her parents on any census... Could she have been born in India?
FamilySearch has a birth record for a Susan EZEKIEL, daughter of Henry EZEKIEL and Caroline, born 8 Nov 1854 and christened 17 Nov 1854 in Bellary, India. (Also several siblings.)
There are a few entries on the UK census for EZEKIEL families with connections to India, but no sign of Susan as far as I can see. ???
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The marriage of Mary is on the new Familysearch site 31 August 1904 where she is Mary, not Mary Ann - it does confirm the father's name as Charles. The register should give her age.
https://www.familysearch.org/
The parents' marriage is on the British Library site India Office collection (as transcribed by FIBIS) as 1866-1870 Charles August Haller & Susan Ezekiel - it doesn't give any indication of location, though.
http://indiafamily.bl.uk/UI/Home.aspx
The BL does have a research service, so you may be able to obtain more details via this (India records have less information usually than British ones). The FIBIS site has the same details, but also includes the LDS film reference if you want to look at this at a local family history centre.
http://search.fibis.org/frontis/bin/aps_detail.php?id=225547
The FamilySearch site has a baptism for a Susan Ezekiel - the dates are add - they have birth as 17 Nov 1854 but baptism earlier at 8 Nov 1854 - parents Henry Ezekiel & Caroline at Bellary (seems to be in the Madras presidency) - if this is her she seems to have married at a very young age. There are baptisms of several other children with the same parents on the site also. Henry's marriage to Caroline Palfrey is also there.
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Wow! Thank you so much everyone. I am amazed at the help and what you have found - and so quickly :) Can't wait to share with all those waiting to hear. I am off to view all the links you have provided and will let you know how I go. Thank you so much once again, Robyn
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Hi - I just wanted to say thank you again. I have found leads to many more generations in the Ezekial tree.
I am still having trouble with the Haller family, both Charles and Mary Ann. Mary Ann's birth at Staffordshire is what the family believes but I don't have documentary evidence. Her spouse, Herbert Goodwin Mellor has Staffordshire listed as his birthplace on his death certificate ssued in Australia.
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herbert was indeed born in staffs
birth index
name; herbert goodwin mellor
y.o.r. 1875
qtr; jul/aug/sept
dist; wolstanton
vol; 6b
page; 157
still cannot see mary's birth though?
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Hi - I really think the best chance of finding more about Charles & Mary is to see the marriage register entries - as I said before these are normally less detailed than those in England or Wales of the same period, but I'd expect father's names (though not occupation) and ages of the couple (though could just be "full" - ie 21 or over). Particularly for Charles it would help in giving the period to look for his birth.
As I see wozzle has confirmed Mary's husband's birth it is possible someone has assumed they were both from the same area and hence the family story - like many it may be a mixture of truth and fancy.
I had another look on the BL's India Office index & Charles marriage is their earliest Haller entry - there's a marriage for a William Henry Haller in the 1871-1875 period - perhaps a relative of Charles? These indices are not complete, so there could be others or under variations of the name.
I Googled the name & found this link from 1875
http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/24228/pages/3627/page.pdf
He's given as a "Telegraph signaller" and below him is Henry Maximillian Haller, a "clerk in the Times of India office" - a relative?
His name to me has echoes of a German name - I'm from the Manchester area & the founder of the local orchestra, Sir Charles Hallé, had anglicised his name from Carl (or Karl) Halle - which pronounced the German way would be nearer Haller - also August seems more of a "continental" name. Entering Charles August Haller on Familysearch produces several variants on Charles/Carl/Karl etc - mainly from continental Europe. That's all pure speculation and may well be a large red herring. I suspect it is a surname which derives from more than one source - there seem quite a lot of Haller births in Yorkshire, though none as Charles August that I found. I did find a Charles Augustus Harley, registered in the March quarter of 1850 in Lambeth.
This all may just be leading you up the garden path - best is to try & see the marriage entries - if you've a LDS Family History Centre near you can order the films at a cost & view them there; otherwise the BL have a research service - you got an exact date & place for one and a date range & LDS film for the other which should help keep their charges down. You could try asking for a look up on here (perhaps on the Common Room board with a link to this thread) - I don't get the impression many RootsChatters go to the British Library, but you could be lucky.
Good hunting!
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Thank you so much again. I was not aware of the British in India Office site before so that helped me enormously with the Ezekiels. I will pursue your suggestions of name variants and I also thought it may be that Mary was assumed born at Staffordshire because her spouse was. Again, a BIG thank you from down under. Robyn
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Robyn - best of luck with the search. I'm just adding that as far as I'm aware there is no complete source online for Indian records (as in the British in India) & even using the various sources there are gaps - my OH has an ancestor born there in the 1850s - his baptism is on the films, but not so far online on any site I've checked. I was lucky as he appears on several censuses here & was able to work out the place of birth from those.
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Hi Robyn, have only just logged onto this site today and a little unfamiliar
I am a descendant of the Haller's - my ancestor Mabel being the sister of your Mary
As you may have found out all the siblings were indeed born in Poona, India
My father Leslie Steele (born in Poona) son of Mabel went back to Staffordshire with his mum and dad (Edward Steele) as Edward originated from Staffordshire. Leslie met my mother and they married then later emigrated out to NZ around 1963. I had little information as my father passed when I was 12 yrs, though heard from mum that one of his aunts had emigrated to Australia. Both my parents were only children so have little information. Only found Charles Haller through familysearch recently and did not know a surname for Susan
I was born in NZ and still living here. Would love your contact, hopefully you receive this...
Amanda
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Hi Amanda, I am researching this family for my best friend who would be your 2nd cousin. We were both recently in NZ for a cruise!
I have 2 of Mary's siblings only known as Female 1 Haller and Female 2 Haller.....Mabel must be one of them as I don't have her name. I only have Mary Ann, Ada and Elizabeth. Could you please tell me her date of birth? Are you on Ancestry.com? I have photos of Susan and Mary Ann Haller/Mellor there. How could I help you further? Robyn
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Hi Robyn. Lovely to hear from you. Re your cruise, most likely passed through Auckland then where we live!
Mabel's birth date is abt 1889 do not have birth cert, though have other certs that suggests this year
I am not on Ancestry yet, have manually been recording info that has grown and currently loading onto Family Tree Maker then planning to go to Ancestry and online.
Started in 2014 and hit some walls that have since been broken through using the LDS site. Stopped for a few years and have picked up again.
New to Rootschat and keen to private message, make contact and share some information, photos I have - though there appears to be a minimum amount of posts as a new user before I can send you a private message?