RootsChat.Com
Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: jdslemish on Monday 27 June 11 02:27 BST (UK)
-
Hi am trying to find out information on my cousins and am hoping that someone out there can help. I have tried the various search links, which I greatly acknowledge, posted by other users, I am also aware that sometimes the key lies in how the question is asked and I have met a dead end each time so am hoping that all you more knowledgable people can help me. The question starts with,
My uncle Thomas Dobbin born here in N. Ireland November 1900 went to America (unknown). I always knew he had two daughters one of whom died trgaically at a young age (this is confirmed by a tiny newspaper article). I know a very remarkable lady (still living but sadly memory not good) who went to America in 1938 and knew the daughters of Thomas, she thinks that Thomas was dead by '38. This lady was unable to return home again as war broke out, she came back to Ireland in the late 80's. The newspaper article which came to me via Thomas's sister Margarets family things (I never knew her she left for America at 17 (born 1896) and never returned home) reads as and I quote every word..
Bronx Girl is Drowned on vacation in Vermont.
Arrangements are being made today for the funeral of Jane Dobbin, 11, daughter of Mrs Alice Dobbin, 537 E. 148th St, who was drowned on wednesday at lake Iroquois, Vt.,where she was vacationing with a sister, Betty 9.
Jane and Betty were the guests of a family at Shelbourne, Vt and had gone swimming in the shallow waters ofthe lakewhen Jane suffered a cramp and sank. Efforts to revive her with a pulmotor failed.
On my searches I have yet to find the marriageof Thomas to Jane (presumably new york) or the births of their daughters or indeed the death of Jane.
Any leads on how to search this greatly welcomed.
Cheer
John Dobbin
-
What is the date of the Newspaper article ?...
this would give us the year of Janes birth - 11 years previous - thus probably the year of the marriage around about 12 months earlier ....
allan
-
Think the problem is that the article is undated. John- any clues from the back of the article?
Only thing I could find is a death for a Thomas Dobbin (age 36) died 11 Dec.1938 Bronx, N.Y.
http://www.italiangen.org/VRECLIST.stm
-
On my searches I have yet to find the marriageof Thomas to Jane (presumably new york)
Shouldn't you be looking for the marriage of Thomas to Alice (mother of Jane?)
Or am I reading this wrong?
dollylee
-
Many many thanks for your responses
Only thing I could find is a death for a Thomas Dobbin (age 36) died 11 Dec.1938 Bronx, N.Y.
Have followed this link and appears to be the most accurate piece of information to go on so will continue with this data unless something else comes to light. As regards to the article it really is tiny, postage stamp size and also not the original as the back is blank.
Shouldn't you be looking for the marriage of Thomas to Alice (mother of Jane?)
Correct a typo on my behalf I meant the marriage of Thomas to Alice, I don't think they ever moved too far away from Bronx but again I can no info or record of this marriage.
i just remembered something
Also have a memorial card for an Alice Dobbin on the back it says wife of Thomas
it simply reads
Alice Dobbin entered into eternal life september 9 1966. (after the prayer) V. Scozza funeral home inc. 1822 westchester avenue, bronx, new york ty 2-7238
Havent resesrched this yet as not sure if it will give any more info on Betty.
Many thanks for helping so far.
J.D.
-
The date of September 9, 1966 does give you a very good time frame to see if an obituary can be found. An obituary might give you a married name for Betty or even her place of residence.
Do you have a second name for Thomas? There is a marriage for a Thomas G. Dobbin to an Alsie M. Hazel in 1927 in Manhattan. Perhaps a mis-transcription?
dollylee
-
Oh my word.. My Thomas had the second name of Gerald.. so Thomas G..??
Many thanks dollylee
-
Hi Guys many thanks for all your help so far, if I could bother you with another question please as I am unfamiliar as to what information can be gained from social security death indexes.
I did a search in familysearch.org (a link I kindly followed by folk provided on this site) and found an Elizabeth Dobbin born 26th Feb 1933, this was under u.s. social security death index. It says place of issuance Pennsylvania, death date July 1969. My questions are...Is place of issuance where the individual died? Could this be the betty mentioned in the newspaper article? (born approx 1933 in New York)
-
Now children are issued with a Social Security number but that wasn't always the case. She would probably have applied for one after starting work.
Issued in Pennsylvania merely means the person was living in Pennsylvania when the number was applied dor and issued. Sometimes the online record gives a death locality but this one doesn't.
Without you knowing Betty's date of birth it's impossible to say if this is a record for her.
-
If you have a person's Social Security number, you can also order (for a fee) their original Social Security application, as explained towards the bottom of this webpage: http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~rwguide/lesson10.htm This application typically gives parents' names and place of birth, among other information.
-
Was the father of Thomas Dobbin, William Henry Dobbin of Randalstown,Co Antrim. If so then
Thomas went to New York on the 15 april 1923 on the "Carmania" his age was 21 and he was a stone mason.His last permanent residence was Athlone.
Cheers Sue
-
Hi everyone many thanks for all your help.
Sue..Thomas father was indeed William-Henry, good find on this information. I will keep researching Thomas and keep you all posted if I find anything else..
Cheers J.D.
-
Was Thomas' name mistranscribed on that passenger list? I don't see him anywhere on that ship.
Sometimes, the passenger list will have markings about naturalization, and, if he was naturalized, the naturalization papers may list dates of birth for his children.
-
Was the father of Thomas Dobbin, William Henry Dobbin of Randalstown,Co Antrim. If so then
Thomas went to New York on the 15 april 1923 on the "Carmania" his age was 21 and he was a stone mason.His last permanent residence was Athlone.
Cheers Sue
Just a small snippet. It also states on the Boston Passenger List that Thomas was going to Uncle John Dobbin, 410 East, 135 th Street. New York. Duration of intended stay was 1 year. Port of arrival:- Boston
There are some manifest markings as Shelly suggested - 218652 or 2/8652 - and possibly Oct 6 1928
Sandra
-
This could possibly be the Uncle John living 135 East Street in 1920
John Dobbins 53 Born Ireland. Immigrated 1882. NA 1890. Bed Rubber at marble works.
Alice F Dobbins 53 Born New York.
Children:-
Ester aged 22, Margaret aged 20 years, Alice Dobbins aged 19 years
William aged 17 and Thomas Dobbins aged 11 years.
Sandra
-
Uncle John in East 136 Street 1910 Bronx Assembly District 32, New York, New York
John Dobbin 43 Born Ireland., Immigrated 1882. Marriage 1 for 12 years. Marble Worker. Yard.
Alice Dobbin 44 Born New York. Had 7 children and 5 survive.
Estha J aged 13 - Margaret Dobbin aged 10 years - Alice V Dobbin aged 8 years
William N aged 7 and Thomas Dobbin aged 1
Sandra
-
This was the daughter of Uncle John - Alice married with husband, child and sibling living with her in Hasbrouck Heights, Bergen, New Jersey in 1930
Thomas F Colligan. aged 30 Born NY. Married at 26 yrs. Estimator for Telephone Co.,
Alice V Colligan aged 29 Born NY. Married at 24 yrs.
Alice M Colligan aged 2 years and 7 months
Esther Dobbin aged 31 Sister-In-Law. Milliner for Hat Company.
Margaret Dobbin aged 30 Sister-In-Law. Clerk. Telephone Co.
William H Dobbin aged 29 Brother-In-Law. Book-keeper. Engineers.
Thomas Dobbin aged 21 Brother-In-Law. Polisher. Marble Co.
Sandra
-
Esther Dobbin
Born 18 April 1897 and died January 1971
Last Residence: 10458 Bronx, Bronx, New York,
SSN was issued in New York (Before 1951)
Esther Dobbin. Born 18 April 1898 Bronx. New York and single, aged 35 years appears on a New York Passenger List, travelling Liverpool to New York - arriving 21 November 1933 on SS Laconia.
Elizabeth was going to 326 Roosevelt Avenue, Hasbrouck Heights. New Jersey.
Haven't come across her journey from New York to UK yet. Would be interesting where she went or who she visited !!
Sandra
-
Uncle John and Alice in Stony Ford Road. Wallkill, Orange, New York in 1930
John Dobbin aged 66 years. Born Ireland. Immigrated 1882. NA. Married at 28 years. Rent Free
Alice Dobbin aged 66 years. Born NY. Married at 28 years.
Sandra
-
Hi Sandra
Have been trying to search the "carmania" and the information you kindly provided, but have so far not been able to find it. I am very keen to find out if Thomas was with his brothers Hugh and Arthur. Is it possible for you to get any more information or send me a link, please?. Many thanks to you also for making me think of passenger lists, have managed to find most of Thomas's sisters that went to usa, via ellis island, even though i knew snippets about them it was very interesting to see who they travelled with and have discovered many thing I didin't know!
Cheers J.D.
-
Hello J D,
The Boston Passenger List was on a subscription site.
Hugh Dobbin. Born about 1898 Randalstown. Ireland and aged 26 years travelled Ireland to st Johns. New Brunswick on the Metagama arriving 30 March 1924, Occupation:- Stone-Mason. religion:- Catholic. The object in going to canada was to gain employment. He expected to remain in Canada for sometime. Had never lived in Canada before. Was destined to a friend in Montreal. Difficult to read but looks like Mrs Gingons. 314 Aqxxxxx ??? Montreal. Father was William H Dobbin. Athlone. Randalstown. Ireland.
Sandra
-
Arthur was also listed travelling on the Carmania - Liverpool to Boston on the 15 April 1923. Single. Aged 22 years. Occupation:- Farmer.
Last residence Athlone. father William Henry Dobbin. Randalstown. Going to Uncle John Dobbin - 410 East 135 th Street, New York.
Sandra
-
Arthur Dobbin. Born about 1900 Ireland. Aged 49 years. Travelled Cobh. Ireland to New York arriving 4 November 1949 on the SS Washington.
Going to 495 East 138th Street. New York.
Also Arthur Dobbin. Born about 1900 Northern Ireland. Aged 52 years. Single.Travelled Cobh. Ireland to New York on the Britannic, arriving 9 August 1952. Going to 495 East 138 th Street. New York.
Sandra
-
Hi J D,
Maybe there may be more to find on the Dobbin family in the USA and it is worth asking for this thread to be transferred to the USA board so that others may help in the search.
Quite possibly that address that keeps cropping up was Alice (Thomas's wife)
Sandra
-
Possibly death record for:-
Arthur Dobbin. Born 28 June 1899 and Died August 1972
Last Residence: 10461 Bronx, Bronx, New York,
SSN was issued in New York (Before 1951)
Sandra
-
This looks like Arthur living with the Jeffrey family in East 136 Street. Bronx, Bronx, New York 1930.
Samuel Jeffery 50 Margaret Jeffery 50
Dorothy Jeffery 17 William Jeffery 14
Auther Dobbin 29 Born Northern Ireland. Immigrated 1923. Chauffeur. Taxis Co.
Sandra
-
There is also a US WW2 Army Enlistment for Arthur Dobbin. Born about 1900. Irish Free State. Resides Bronx. New York
Enlistment Date: 1 Jun 1942. Fort Jay Governors Island. New York. Single.
Private.
Sandra
-
Margaret Dobbin. Born about 1874 and aged 27 years. Last residence:- Randalstown. Travelled Liverpool. England to New York. Arriving 8 May 1901 on the Majestic. Single. ladies Maid. Going to brother John Dobbin. 170 Street., Cretona Park ???
Sandra
-
Hi Sandra and everyone else involved in helping so far.
I have come a long way and discovered so much since my original post mainly thanks to rootschat and it's posters.
Susan your last post mentioned Margaret Dobbin, she went on to marry Stephen Jeffries and so is linked to my uncles Arthur and Thomas, she was sister to the uncle John so frequently mentioned in their passageway to America.
I have also learned to take nothing for granted....
my grandfather was William-Henry brother to the John and Margaret already mentioned but thanks to, "Sandra Sue and Shelly" and their mention of boats and passages to america, I spent a great deal time looking into ellis island and discovered that, a great aunt (Annie sister to above) that I had presumed died as an infant simply because she never was mentioned by relatives or I had no record of her apart from baptism, now turns up having passed through ellis island no less than four times possibly five. On one of these occasions she was taking her niece with her (my aunt whom I knew). On starting out I thought the only missing relative was Thomas and I now know so much more but also so little.....
Sandra you are so right I now need to research the addresses mentioned on thse passages but can I also ask if Hugh Artie or Tommy were accompanied by the aforesaid "dead" Annie, I am intrigued by this woman.
Cheers JD
-
Hi Guys
Been a while now since my last post and was hoping that perhaps someone might have another angle of approaching this?. I have taken on board and followed all leads suggested, these leads whilst interesting and enjoyable (historical sense) always take on a new new tangent and direct myself away from the main goal. I am still hopeful that perhaps there is information out there and that your goodselves can perhaps guide me to finding it.
Many thanks to anyone who reads this and gives it consideration.
Slainte
J.D.
-
This appears to have the death record for Jane:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-17871-90093-5?cc=1784223
The mother's name of Alice Hagel seems like a likely match for the 1927 marriage that dollylee found above.
-
I found an article in the Lowell (Mass.) Sun dated 13 Aug. 1942 that reads as follows:
American Tragedy
Burlington, Vt., Aug. 13
(UP) - Jane Dobbin, 12, of New York city, one of a group sent to Vermont by the New York Herald fresh air fund, drowned yesterday in Lake Iroquois at Hinesburg. Her father, a brother, and a sister have died within the last three months.
-
Many Many thanks to everyone for their input into all the information provided. Especially to shellyesq. I must admit that shellyesq last few posts left me feeling a little bit empty and a realisation dawned that perhaps it's time to give up the search, this is what I feel I have to do in the case of my Uncle Thomas, but I hasten to add that thanks to everyone who posted, Iam in fact not really giving up merely resigning to the fact that there is not enough information out there. Sandra your posts were very informative and I enjoyed all thatthey showed me, I appreciate all the time and effort you spent, thank-you from the bottom of my heart.
Shellyesq your last posts made me realise that I was chasing a family line that no longer existed, and again I need to thank you for not only your efforts but dilligence in the answers you uncovered.
-
Weird thought, and perhaps just to show how family trees go on forever, anyone like to hazzard a guess as to my age? Uncle Tommy was born inNovember 1900, he was my daddy's brother, there were 17 children. As far as I can make out myself and siblings are the only descendants of these 17 still to have the surname Dobbin. But not to digress, anyone gonna guess my age?
Kindest Regards
J.D.
-
I'll guess 21, since it sounds good. ;) Considering this story about 2 of Pres. Tyler's grandchildren still living - http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/former-president-john-tyler-1790-1862-grandchildren-still-191230189.html - just about any large stretch of generations seems possible.
Now that the 1940 Census has been released, you might be able to find some of this family on there. http://1940census.archives.gov/ It hasn't been indexed yet, but I know there are people working in it. At least that might narrow down if the 1938 death for Thomas is a possibility.
My thought on the newspaper article was that maybe it meant the relatives died over the last three years (or so), rather than months. I can certainly imagine some confusion occurring when getting the facts from either a grieving mother or a second-hand source. The italiangen.org death index has a Richard Dobbins, age 1, who died in the Bronx on 28 Apr. 1938.
-
I was thinking about this old thread, and in case you haven't seen it already, I found the family in the 1940 Census. http://www.rootschat.com/links/0nm3/ That seems to fit with the 1938 death found for Thomas.
-
This is so sad
Margp
-
Betty is my grandmother. Feel free to message me.
Anthony
-
JD has not been on roots since April so have sent a PM to say someone has replied with good interest for him/her
Regards Jeanette
-
Hi everyone & thanks for the message..been a while since I was on, had given up on the search..my goodness what a bit of news...have sent you a message Anthony
-
JD I don't know if there are still the same rules but think you have to post 3 times before sending/receiving messages re anthony, just in case you do not receive a pm from antony
Regards Jeanette
-
No wonder why I could not message you back. :) Yes my grandmother is your cousin.
-
Anthony Do one more post on here, that will be your third and then you should be able to private message JD.
Kind regards Jeanette
-
Anthony Do one more post on here, that will be your third and then you should be able to private message JD.
Kind regards Jeanette
Let's see if this works now.
-
RESULT
Thank-you thank-you &thank you again
Cannot believe the outcome of this story....wee tear-in-the-eye there..
Whilst the internet is a powerful thing it is only as powerful as those that press
the buttons on the keyboard....thanks
auntynet, shellyesq, *sandra*, sue21757, aghadowey, garstonite & dollylee for
pressing those buttons...I do believe that a great result has been achieved here, I am now in contact with the family of Betty and am soooo looking forward to sending a Christmas card to Betty herself this year.
:) :) :) smiley faces all round I hope.
J.D.