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Research in Other Countries => Europe => Topic started by: HughC on Thursday 04 August 11 15:06 BST (UK)
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I came across a newspaper report in 1782 of how an ancestor of mine, a naval commander, had entered harbour with two "prize" vessels. Not sure whether he had arrested them for smuggling or salvaged them after they were crippled in a storm. One was reported to be the Hoogscarpel.
Could that be a corruption of the place name Hoogkarspel?
Or does scarpel or skarpel or scharpel mean something?
It has to be said that either my ancestor's handwriting was almost indecipherable or journalists were every bit as illiterate then as now.
Another of his captures was a French ship said to be Létrebucket -- can only be Le Trébuchet, I feel!
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Google the Battle of Saldanha Bay (1781).
Quote:
and the prizes were the Dankbaarheid, Perel, Schoonkop and Hoogscarspel, most of them armed with around 24 guns.
Hoogscarpel was attacked by a French frigate but succeeded in getting to Mount's Bay where she was escorted.
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That's great! Dankbaarheid was the other ship he escorted into Mount's Bay (now I'm going to have to find out where that is), except that the newspaper report spelled it Daankbarheyd, which I knew had to be wrong.
Apparently the French ship was a privateer with a largely Irish crew.
It nearly managed to wrest the prizes from the Ariel, but was seen off.
Wish I'd paid a bit more attention in history lessons at school
-- except that they seldom tried to teach us anything interesting.
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Doesn't translate properly as far as I can see! (I live in NL)
Spel means game; hoog means high.
Scar and schar are very different sounds - well, in Dutch, anyway! ;D
Might have to ask in the pub tonight!
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Mounts Bay - south coast of Cornwall, near Penzance. Just been there on my hols :)
St Michael's Mount is the bump in the middle of the pic!
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Thanks, Danuslave.
Things are coming together now.
Later that year he was made a freeman of the city of Limerick,
I think in gratitude for protecting the ships trading with the port.
It seems piracy was rife.
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Dankbaarheid = gratitude
Perel = Pearl
Schoonkop = Clean Cup?
Hoogscarspel = literally High Game Cars?!
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Ik kan geen nederlands, but I don't think much of your "translation", KGarrad.
Schoonkop = Fair Head.
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I'll give you kop = head, but schoon = fair?!?!
Schoon = clean whenever I see it.
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Ik kan geen nederlands
online translator gives
I can not Dutch
How about
Ik kan niet spreken Nederlands
We could play this game for days :) :)
Linda
PS Ik kan ook niet Nederlands spreken
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Ik kan niet spreken Nederlands
We could play this game for days :) :)
Linda
PS Ik kan ook niet Nederlands spreken
Better would be Ik spreken geen Nederlands!
;D ;D
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My brother recently returned from a hiking holiday in Italy, armed with this gem:
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The hill of the mountain pen is situated to 800 meters altitude, few below the peak of the homonym mountain that has a height of 982 meters on the level of the sea. On the hill, in 1971 you/he/she has been installed a cross in iron from a group of impassioned of the mountains. This place offers a splendid panoramic sight on the valley. A lot of local associations organize outside you every year parties and lunches.
<<
And you still regard the Google traducer as the highest authority??
Some people just enjoy making fools of themselves ...
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And you still regard the Google traducer as the highest authority??
Some people just enjoy making fools of themselves ...
I don't often use Google Translator for Dutch - as I live in The Netherlands, it's easy enough (if I don't know myself) to ask genuine Dutch people in the office, or bar.
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There is no possible way you can find logic in translating Hoogcarspel to English, as you can't with most given names.
About Hoogcarspel: The village still exists as 'Hoogkarspel' and the name means that it is a village with a church (in old Dutch: kerspel) which lies on a higher spot in the landscape. Due to the floods many villages (or in medieval times: strongholds) were built on a so called 'terp' which is nothing more than an artificial dwelling hill to keep the feet dry. Hoogkarspel was built on a high point of a natural 'sandback', however.
Schoonkop, if you badly need a literal translation the best choice is 'Fair Head'
In old Dutch (or modern day Flemish) 'schoon' means nice, beautiful or fair, if you please. I do not know the origin of why they named the ship Schoonkop. But a 'kop' or 'schuimkop' is also a word we use for whitecaps, like when a wave is blown by the wind so its crest is broken and it appears white on top; that's a 'schuimkop'.
So far for the Dutch class :)
Hope it was of any use.
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Dank je wel, JMVH!
Incidentally, Capt. Fabian's letters to the Admiralty survive, and his spelling seems to have been rather better than that of the newspaper reports at the time.