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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Angus (Forfarshire) => Topic started by: rowanali on Saturday 13 August 11 15:14 BST (UK)
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Hi, my Great Aunt - Margaret Wallace was born in 1895.
I have a photo (attached) of what I think is the childrens home (with assorted children) where she worked. The photo dates from about 1934 -36 (from the age of my father and grannie and great grannie who are also in the photo).
I wonder if anybody can identify the building behind? - I am trying to discover which children's home she worked in. The family did have strong Salvation Army links, and I also remember talk about meetings at Herman Hall which was some bretheren meeting place. Not sure if home might have been linked to either of these organisations.
thanks for any help
Rowanali
PS I have added a second photo, taken much later of Mar with another group of children (she wasn't in the first one, it was her own mother - Mar would have taken the photo)
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hi Rowanali :)
not a lot , but there is a mention of a Hermon Hall Dundee in 1951 -
http://www.scottisharchitects.org.uk/architect_full.php?id=201253
the architect seems to have been involved with a few buildings with religious
connections
ev
PS - also
http://www.flickr.com/photos/serifimdesign/4860975678/
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Hermon Hall in the Nethergate in Dundee is a Plymouth Bretheren meeting hall.
Buzancy18
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Thanks for these responses - I have followed up those from ev and I am intrigued by reply from Buzancy --- you say 'is' a meeting hall on the Nethergate - is it still in existence?
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Hi All
Clement park was a salvation Army children's home in Dundee.(see link below)
Clement park in Lochee and I should imagine that the date you are looking at the surrounding area would all be greenfield as the building there now are all fairly modern.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0EM/
Yours Aye
Bruce
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Bruce
that looks good :)
can't get the link to work but found this
if you click on the photo's you'll get a larger image
an older building with a modern annexe
http://www.scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/search_item/index.php?service=RCAHMS&id=176538
ev
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Hi Ev
Somewhere on this site is a link to the Salvation army records for Clement Park
Someone else was looking for details from here poss a couple of years ago.
Yours Aye
BruceL
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Hi All
Found previous post links don't work but:
Repository: SALVATION ARMY INTERNATIONAL HERITAGE CENTRE
Level: Collection
RefNo: CLH
Extent: 6 volumes and 1 document
Title: Clement Park House
Date: 1950-1990s
Access Status: Partial
ArchNote: Catalogued by Steven Spencer, June 2009
Description
These are the records of Clement Park House, Dundee (CLH), 1950-1990s.
The Dundee Mothers' and Children's Home first openened in 1918, but it was not until December 1928 that the home re-located to Clement Park House. The building was named Florence Booth House at its oficial opening on 30 April 1929. A children's section opened in 1969 and the maternity section closed in August 1970. In 1991 the children's home was closed, and the Army's Dundee Homelessness Project re-opened the home as Clement Park Hostel. In October 2006 the Centre closed, sold and redeveloped as flats with new-build homes in the grounds.
Arrangement
CLH 1. Mothers' and Children's Home
CLH 2. Children's Home
CLH 3. Leaflet for Clement Park House
Admin History
In 1918 the Dundee Mothers' and Children's Home opened at Seafield Lodge, 91-93 Magdalen Green, Dundee. In June 1927 the home was removed to Cidhmore, Perth Road, Dundee.
In December 1928 the home was re-located to Clement Park House, Harefield Road, Lochee, Dundee. Clement Park House was built for famous jute baron James Cox and was completed in about 1862. He named the mansion after his wife, Clementina.
On 30 April 1929 the official opening took place, at which the building was named Florence Booth House, after the founder of the Women's Social Work wing of the Salvation Army. In October 1935 an extension was added for married patients, and the following month an ante-natal clinic started. This was followed on 9 December 1937 by additional extension, this time to provide associates' quarters.
As of 9 April 1951 accommodation at the centre stood at 25 lying In beds, 25 cots, 30 beds for unmarried mothers and 20 cots.
17 July 1969 saw the opening of a children's section. This had the effect of reducing the accommodation available in the maternity section from 30 mothers to 20, while the new children's section could house twelve. The maternity section closed in August 1970, and accommodation was later confirmed as being 24 beds, for girls '6 months to school leaving age' and boys '6 months to under [sic] 12 years'.
In 1991 the children's home was closed, and re-opened with the name Clement Park Hostel, as part of the Army's Dundee Homelessness Project.
In October 2006 the Centre closed and its building were sold. Redeveloped as ten luxury flats by Buddon Homes with 23 new-build homes in the grounds.
Postcode as of 2009 is DD2 3JT.
Yours Aye
BruceL
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Crikey it is amazing what you can all come up with. I will try to access the Salvation Army Intnl Heritage Centre for a few other lines of enquiry too.
However, from what info given here about Clement Park, or Florence Booth House as it would have been in 1930's, there wouldn't have been any children there - just for mothers and children - ie to deliver and aftercare. Homes for children weren't offered there until 1969, which would be too late for my picture.
Also, having checked out the photos of Clement Park on the modern site, I think the roof is a bit more fancy than the one in my photo - although it is hard to tell with the tree in the way and the angle it is taken from.
The hunt goes on....
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Hi rowanali
If you use the link below it will give you an indication what the countryside around Clement park looked like. You have to give the historical map time to load and you have to keep zooming in until it is large enough to give you street level.
http://geo.nls.uk/os6inch/google.html
Yours aye
Brucel
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Bruce - that is got to be one of the most magical tools ever! - fantastic way of finding out where people lived and what it all looked like - especially for towns you aren't familiar with!! Thanks you so much - what an amazing find!
ali
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The Herman Hall was in Tay Street on the corner of Artillery Lane just round from the West port
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My Grandfather was Hall Keeper at Hermon Hall and laterly my uncle did the same job. The church existed from 1914 until 2007. Maggie Wallace is a name I remember being mentioned in my family and she was highly respected by the Christians meeting at Hermon. If you want to know more please post a message and I'll ask around. Possible most folk who knew her have died but my uncle probably knows a bit.
Jim
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Jim/Kay
Thanks so much for your exciting news that your Uncle may remember my Auntie Mar - Maggie Wallace! I would love to know anything at all that he can remember about Hermon Hall - what groups they ran, what they did, did they run a music group?, was there a ladies group? Were there any records or photos kept?
Attaching a photo of a group of Dundee Ladies that may be connected with Hermon Hall..
Front row on right sitting on chair is Maggie Wallace (with glasses). Next to her is a lady that appears in many of our family photos as well as the lady with white hair directly behind her. One or other of them could have been an Annie Brown or Anderson. 2 of Maggies sisters are in the photo - 3rd from left in back row is Annie Wallace, and infront of her is Jessie Wallace (my grandmother). Don't know about woman infront of her but to either side of her on the front seated row is Jessie's sister-in-law (Kathleen Hancock) and in the middle of front is Florence Hancock. This photo may have been to say goodbye to them as they were immigrating to USA. Photo likely taken in about 1930.
Keen to know also if the 'Tiny Tot Orchestra' was anything to do with Hermon Hall - have photos of them too! But much later than this photo.
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My Aunt has the middle name Wallace and we think it is after Maggie Wallace. She was a friend of my Grandmother. My Grandmother died in 1927 so is this possible? Apparently Maggie lived at the top of Arkley Street Dundee.
The photos do not seem to be related to Hermon or any of the folk there..
Hermon was engaged in many forms of Christian outreach including Children's work and open air mission. It was very Evangelical in it's outreach to the community. At it's height probably had about 300 members with a very strong contact between families . it is possible that Maggie would move between Salvation Army and Hermon - perhaps Hermon in the morning and SA in the evening - but no-one around who knew her personally now.
Hope this is of some help
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Thanks so much to Kay Mitchell (Jim) for the fascinating thought that my great aunt Maggie Wallace's name lived on in her friends child. Maggie never married so her name never was passed on so this is a lovely thought for me.
Thanks to everyone for their help with trying to track down the childrens home photo that this post started off with - it turns out it is Balgay School for girls (Approved school) so my mystery is now solved.
rowanali
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very interesting information. I think that where i was born. does anyone know if any records exist for this home ???
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Rosi, hi. If you are talking about Clement Park, I will be watching with intererest. I am 53 and only just recently got a copy of my original bc, it shows my birth place as Clement park. Other than the mothers name and place of birth, I have no other info.
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Hi joy
Have found no records of me there so far. Meeting with a social worker and someone else who are going to try to piece things together for me. Lots of records for Clement park have been destroyed. They may have a note of your mother's name but not yours. I emailed salvation army who did a search for me. Maybe you could try them. My mother seems to have gone by a different name somehow. Good luck in your search. You can email me on (*) if you wish x
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