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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Inverness => Topic started by: Uist1911 on Sunday 21 August 11 15:04 BST (UK)
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I am researching the Beaton's from South Uist
Neil Beaton Born 1885 married Mary Mackay born 1891
Can anyone tell me anything about the of them ?
Ie Who Neil's mother and father were
Surnames interested in:
Beaton
Macinnes
Macsween
Macrury
Macdonald
Macrae
Macmillian
Currie
Also the Beaton family from the isle of Skye
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Hi Scutty
Welcome to RootsChat. To narrow this a little, do you have the names of their children?
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Hi
There Children are
Lachlin Beaton
Ranald Beaton
Mary ann Beaton
Donald john Beaton
Murdo Beaton
Donald Beaton
Angus Beaton
Patrick Beaton
Angus Beaton
Mary Beaton
Catherine Margaret Beaton
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Hi Scutty
Have only a moment for this and have to run. Back later.
I see in 1901 census as Donald Beaton (60) and Maggie (56) with 2 children Neil (16) and Kate (18). they are at 13 Rhughaisinsh, South Uist. Is this a possibility?
I also see a marriage for Neil Beaton & Mary Mackay, Howmore, South Uist, Sept 11, 1911. Their marriage certificate, available through Scotland's People, will likely give you parental names.
Cheers,
NOTE: Mis-typed the name of the bride. I have corrected it now.
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Hi
Thank you. Donald was married before his first wife passed away
He is from Skye but moved to Howmore just don't know when
Cheers
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Hi Scutty,
I have to admit, you've stumped me. Let's see if we can't get a few others on here with more expertise than I have. ;)
Have you got the marriage certificate by chance? It should note the names of the parents.
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No sorry I haven't got it yet
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My Beaton's/Bethune's were originally from Skye - sad to say I am stuck on the Black Isle with my family and can't get any further back to Skye
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would this be your family in the 1891 census
1891 Scotland Census about Niel Beaton
Name: Niel Beaton
Age: 6
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1885
Relationship: Son
Father's Name: Donald Beaton
Mother's Name: Maggie Beaton
Gender: Male
Where born: So Uist, Inverness Shire
Registration Number: 118/2
Registration district: Howmore
Civil parish: South Uist
County: Inverness
Address: Rughaisirnish
Occupation: Scholar
ED: 3
Household schedule number: 38
Line: 13
Roll: CSSCT1891_34
Household Members:
Name Age
Donald Beaton 50
Maggie Beaton 46
Angus Beaton 17
Lauchlan Beaton 13
Kate Beaton 8
Niel Beaton 6
Source Citation: Parish: South Uist; ED: 3; Page: 10; Line: 13; Roll: CSSCT1891_34; Year: 1891.
there is a tree on ancestry saying neil born 1881
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another family only this time neil born 1872 - this one also lists a donald john
1891 Scotland Census about Neil Beaton
Name: Neil Beaton
Age: 19
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1872
Relationship: Son
Father's Name: Donald Beaton
Mother's Name: Margaret Beaton
Gender: Male
Where born: South Uist, Inverness Shire
Registration Number: 118/2
Registration district: Howmore
Civil parish: South Uist
County: Inverness
Address: Lochskipport
Occupation: Light House Letter Carrier
ED: 8
Household schedule number: 15
Line: 6
Roll: CSSCT1891_34
Household Members:
Name Age
Donald Beaton 54
Margaret Beaton 46
Flora Beaton 20
Neil Beaton 19
Ann Beaton 17
Donald John Beaton 16
John Beaton 13
Kenneth Beaton 11
Christina Beaton 6
Catherine Beaton 4
Alexander Beaton 1
Source Citation: Parish: South Uist; ED: 8; Page: 5; Line: 6; Roll: CSSCT1891_34; Year: 1891.
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Hi Weemary
The first one is mine but Neils Father was married before and was from skye his
first wife died thank you
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this is neil son married Mary Mackay 1911 - the tree doesn't go any further back on ancestry
Donald John Beaton
Birth 13 SEP 1917 in Rhugasinish South Uist
Death 23 SEP 1976 in County Hospital Oban P.C.
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when did donald die
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Donald JoHn Beaton died age 59 in 1976
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no Neil's father it should(death cert) list his 2 wives names - I have some spare credits at SP
was Neil's father alive at the time of his marriage in 1911 is his mother Margaret and is she listed on the marr cert
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I can't find Donalds first marriage but he also had children with the first wife
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Hi
Yes Donald was alive at the time of the marriage between Neil and Mary
and his mother is down as Peggy
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Sorry, I had meant to clear this one up way back but, as Red Mystic knows, I had a wee accident in August and the stream has only just come back to the surface.
The marriage of the first Donald Beaton that has not been found took place at Nunton in Benbecula 14.8.1873. The wife Maggie of the 1891 Census was Margaret MacMillan, my first cousin twice removed from 12 Torlum, Benbecula, daughter of Neil [mac Aonghais 'ic Dhomhnaill 'ic Chaluim] MacMillan and Catherine MacPherson, daughter of Donald MacPhersonn, the maor or ground officer of Iochdar at Kilaulay Farm but from a Benbecula family, originally of the MacMhuirich bardic line. There are descendants still in Benbecula.
The other Donald Beaton was also from a Skye family, his father John, a shepherd, being noted in Alexander Carmichael's Gaelic collection, Carmina Gadelica, as having a great knowledge of medicinal herbs and flowers as he was descended from the doctors employed by the MacDonalds of Sleat. There is quite a story to this family but I imagine it is the first one that is of interest.
I do have greater detail, especially about the first family above, if you wish to email me directly.
Angus Macmillan
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Hi Angus
I have just sent you a message
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I'm interested to know if the Beaton families under discussion are related in any way to the Beatons, Howmore (ex North Uist) i.e. John Beaton b.Abt.1760 m. Marion Monk, son Kenneth b.1788 NU m. Mary Munro. Children : Christina (1821), John (1821), Ann (1822), Marion (1826), Mary (1827), Donald ( 1831), Catherine (1834), Flora (1836). Christina (1821) married James MacSween (b.1820 Dunvegan,Skye), their dau. Catherine m. John Cameron, & their dau. Catherine m. Donald MacFarlane. My 1st cousin Archie is married to their granddaughter Catriona. Marion Beaton (b.1826) + Archibald MacLean had a dau. Catherine who married (1865 Howmore) my g.grandfather Donald MacLellan (b.1830 NU). I don't know why my g.grandfather was living in Howmore but they returned to North Uist by 1866 where their first child was born. Marion Beaton married (1856 Drimore) Finlay MacLellan (ex North Uist) --- Finlay's 2nd wife. Their dau. Catherine m. 1887 Alexander MacIntyre 'Straileaneach'. Certainly confusing! Are these Beatons connected to the Beatons under discussion? Thank you, Sandy MacLellan
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I don't know whether they are all the same Beaton family But my GGGrandfather was married before his first wife died.
I am not going home to Uist until August but I could try and Ask my cousin's for now if that helps.
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The answer is that it is not possible to say that the two families were not related but there is no sign of a connection, as far as I can see, since records began. I would need to check but I have a feeling that the Howmore folks, like those MacLellans, came from North Uist in the 1700s to make up a congregation for the Minister, the Rev [George?] Munro when he transferred from North Uist. There was a third apparently quite separate line of Beatons in South Uist that ran through two notable seannachies, John Beaton and his son Farquhar. They originated with Farquhar, a schoolteacher, who came to South Uist about 1800, fathered an illegitimate child, John, and beetled off home to Skye. The mother and child followed and John was brought up there among the residual medical Beatons, where he picked up a lot of plant lore. He and his mother then returned to South Uist and he figures a number of times in Alexander Carmichael's Carmina Gadelica. He was a shepherd most of his life before finally getting a small croft out on the east coast but his son Farquhar was in the Geirinish area.
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Thank you Angus
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Yes, and many thanks to 'scutty' and 'angusm1939' for your speedy responses to my query which are much appreciated. Rgds, AMM
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Sandy,
I've just read your email on the Beatons but I was actually more interested in your MacLellans! My mother is a MacLellan from Benbecula but who I have traced back to Howmore. Our connection is to Donald brother to your Finlay. Donald married into the Crawfords & the line goes to Loch Carnan. I've been trying to to link our early relatives Donald & John MacLellan who Lawson claims came down from Paible to Howmore in support of Rev MacLean. Have you managed to pin them down??
Willie
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Sorry, I had meant to clear this one up way back but, as Red Mystic knows, I had a wee accident in August and the stream has only just come back to the surface.
The marriage of the first Donald Beaton that has not been found took place at Nunton in Benbecula 14.8.1873. The wife Maggie of the 1891 Census was Margaret MacMillan, my first cousin twice removed from 12 Torlum, Benbecula, daughter of Neil [mac Aonghais 'ic Dhomhnaill 'ic Chaluim] MacMillan and Catherine MacPherson, daughter of Donald MacPhersonn, the maor or ground officer of Iochdar at Kilaulay Farm but from a Benbecula family, originally of the MacMhuirich bardic line. There are descendants still in Benbecula.
The other Donald Beaton was also from a Skye family, his father John, a shepherd, being noted in Alexander Carmichael's Gaelic collection, Carmina Gadelica, as having a great knowledge of medicinal herbs and flowers as he was descended from the doctors employed by the MacDonalds of Sleat. There is quite a story to this family but I imagine it is the first one that is of interest.
I do have greater detail, especially about the first family above, if you wish to email me directly.
Angus Macmillan
Hi Angus
I have found Donald Beaton's first wife and his Mother and Father
John Beaton a shepherd from Strath in Skye born abt 1792 Married a Catherine Macleod born abt 1794 Donald's was Angus Beaton son of John his Mother was Mary Mackenzie Angus was born abt 1812 and d1878 that is as far as i have got and was just wondering if you have any information on this
Kind Regards
Jo
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Thank you and well done Jo. That is another slot filled. Incidentally, I notice an error in my ow message immediately above. Donald MacPherson the maor at Kilaulay was the uncle rather than father of Catherine who married Neil MacMillan at 12 Torlum. Her father was Neil MacPherson, who was noted by Alexander Carmichael in old age for the number of his descendants. It makes no difference, of course to the MacMhuirich descent. Angus
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Sorry Angus i missed a bit out
Donald's first wife was Mary MacDonald Nunton, Benbecula.
Donald's father Angus move to North Uist
Jo
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I'm interested to know if the Beaton families under discussion are related in any way to the Beatons, Howmore (ex North Uist) i.e. John Beaton b.Abt.1760 m. Marion Monk, son Kenneth b.1788 NU m. Mary Munro. Children : Christina (1821), John (1821), Ann (1822), Marion (1826), Mary (1827), Donald ( 1831), Catherine (1834), Flora (1836). Christina (1821) married James MacSween (b.1820 Dunvegan,Skye), their dau. Catherine m. John Cameron, & their dau. Catherine m. Donald MacFarlane. My 1st cousin Archie is married to their granddaughter Catriona. Marion Beaton (b.1826) + Archibald MacLean had a dau. Catherine who married (1865 Howmore) my g.grandfather Donald MacLellan (b.1830 NU). I don't know why my g.grandfather was living in Howmore but they returned to North Uist by 1866 where their first child was born. Marion Beaton married (1856 Drimore) Finlay MacLellan (ex North Uist) --- Finlay's 2nd wife. Their dau. Catherine m. 1887 Alexander MacIntyre 'Straileaneach'. Certainly confusing! Are these Beatons connected to the Beatons under discussion? Thank you, Sandy MacLellan
Hi there,
Have you managed to track down anything further about these N.Uist Beatons? I am a descendant of Kenneth & Mary, via their daughter Mary.
I am guessing that Kenneth's family probably went from Skye to N.Uist at some point, but I'm not sure. (There were quite a few Kenneth Bethunes in Skye and not many Bethunes at all in N.Uist from what I can tell.)
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Hello Starrymum,
No, I haven't progressed on this topic but mainly because I have not been doing much family research over the last year or so. I've recently resumed so no doubt will return to this subject later on. Rgds,
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Hi Starrymum
I haven't got any further than Angus Bethune /Beaton at the moment
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Thanks...scutty, I'm not sure if we are from the same line, but ammac, looks like we might be! If you find anything further back, I'd love to compare notes.
I am also interested in the other family of Beatons mentioned earlier (John the shepherd and his son Farquhar who went from Skye to Howmore, and who are mentioned in the Carmina Gadelica.) Farquhar of the Skye Beatons (b.1830) and Mary of the N.Uist Beatons (b.1827) had a child together, who was my ancestor. Confusing to say the least!
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My Angus moved from Skye to north uist I do have a tree on ancestry if you would like to have a look
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Thanks...scutty, I'm not sure if we are from the same line, but ammac, looks like we might be! If you find anything further back, I'd love to compare notes.
I am also interested in the other family of Beatons mentioned earlier (John the shepherd and his son Farquhar who went from Skye to Howmore, and who are mentioned in the Carmina Gadelica.) Farquhar of the Skye Beatons (b.1830) and Mary of the N.Uist Beatons (b.1827) had a child together, who was my ancestor. Confusing to say the least!
Hi Starrymum
I have found Angus Bethunes parents they were Catherine Macleod abt 1794 and John Bethune abt 1792 My 3x Great-grandfather Angus was born in the parish of Strath isle of Skye
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My 4 great grandfather was John Bethune/Beaton a crafter from strath isle of Skye born about 1792 married a Catherine Macleod
There son Angus Beaton moved to North uist he married a Mary Mackenzie
I can't find anything on John and Catherine.
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There son Angus Beaton moved to North uist he married a Mary Mackenzie
When was Angus born and where
When did he marry? If it was 1855 onwards are his parents shown as deceased?
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Hi Carole
Angus was born about 1812 and married Mary Mackenzie in 1833 his parents are named on his death certificate
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Perhaps this thread could be merged with the other threads on this topic?
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Perhaps this thread could be merged with the other threads on this topic?
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=641690.msg5964878#msg5964878 - reply 76
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=440666.msg5180166#msg5180166
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I don't know how to merge them.
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Hi Uist1911, I have just merged your topic.
Regards
Sarah
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John Bethune/Beaton a crafter from strath isle of Skye born about 1792 married a Catherine Macleod
I would think this should be 'Crofter'?
Annie
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Hi Uist1911, I have just merged your topic.
Regards
Sarah
Thank you Sarah
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John Bethune/Beaton a crafter from strath isle of Skye born about 1792 married a
Catherine Macleod
I would think this should be 'Crofter'?
Annie
Yes it is meant to say crofter
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Angus was born about 1812 and married Mary Mackenzie in 1833 his parents are named on his death certificate
Where were they married?
The reason I ask is I haven't managed to locate the marriage.
Can you tell us exactly what info. you are looking for now please?
Annie
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A possible for Angus & Mary...
1841 SP
BEATON ANGUS 30
113/ 10/ 1 North Uist, Inverness
From the transcription I have the household (at Paible) contained..
Angus 30 Shepherd
Mary 30
Catherine 7
Donald 4
Flory 3m (likely short for Flora)
Elliot MacKinsee (sic) 5 (recorded as Female)
SP Entry...
MCKINZIE ELLISON F 5
113/ 10/ 1
North Uist, Inverness
Elliiot/Ellison not exactly a 'Heilan' name but the variant of McKenzie would point to the correct family I think & a relation of Mary?
Curiously there's another entry with that forename ???...
MCAULAY ELLISON
1841
F
11
113/ 11/ 5
North Uist, Inverness
No sign of the family in Paible in 1851
Annie
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There Children are
Lachlin Beaton
Ranald Beaton
Mary ann Beaton
Donald john Beaton
Murdo Beaton
Donald Beaton
Angus Beaton
Patrick Beaton
Angus Beaton
Mary Beaton
Catherine Margaret Beaton
Can you please attach dates/places of birth to make it easier for researching as these names are aplenty on Uist?
Annie
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I am researching the Beaton's from South Uist
Also the Beaton family from the isle of Skye
Can you please post details of names/dates/places of birth/parents details for the 'Skye' Beatons to make it easier for researching?
Annie
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From my transcriptions but with nothing to go on regarding names/dates...
1881 (Kildonan, South Uist)
Beaton (Skye)...
John (Head) 58 Shepherd b Snizort, Skye
Ann Wife 56 b Bracadale, Skye
Christina Dau 22 b S/Uist
Niel Son (note spelling as opposed to Neil) 20 b S/Uist
John Son 18 b S/Uist
1881 SP Entry...
BEATON JOHN 58
118/2 7/ 4
Howmore, Inverness (Kildonan is an area within Howmore Parish)
Kildonan Museum area ;)
Annie
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1891 Scotland Census about Neil Beaton
Name: Neil Beaton
Age: 19
Father's Name: Donald Beaton
Mother's Name: Margaret Beaton
Registration Number: 118/2
Registration district: Howmore
Civil parish: South Uist
County: Inverness
Address: Lochskipport
Occupation: Light House Letter Carrier
ED: 8
Household schedule number: 15
Line: 6
Roll: CSSCT1891_34
Household Members:
Name Age
Donald Beaton 54
Margaret Beaton 46
Flora Beaton 20
Neil Beaton 19
Ann Beaton 17
Donald John Beaton 16
John Beaton 13
Kenneth Beaton 11
Christina Beaton 6
Catherine Beaton 4
Alexander Beaton 1
Source Citation: Parish: South Uist; ED: 8; Page: 5; Line: 6; Roll: CSSCT1891_34; Year: 1891.
To add to the above from my transcriptions...
1881 (Loch Skipport)
Beaton...
Donald Head 46 Lighthouse Post b S/UIst
Margaret Wife 32 b S/U
Flora Dau 11 b S/U
Niel Son 10 b S/U
Donald J Son 5 b S/U
John Son 2 b S/U
Ann MacLellan Sis-in-Law 25 b S/U
I haven't looked them up on SP!
Annie
Added.....Dark Island,
"I was actually more interested in your MacLellans! My mother is a MacLellan from Benbecula but who I have traced back to Howmore."
Could the above MacLellan be your connection?
Added...I have also found a marriage in my collection....
Donald MacLellan (28) Peninerine married Penelope Beaton (26) Stoneybridge, 30 Jan 1872 Bornish, S/U
Parents of Donald - Gilbert MacLellan (Farmer) & Mary MacKay (Dec)
Parents of Penelope - Alexander Beaton (Farmer) & Mary O'Hanly (variant of O'Henley)
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I have scores of Beatons in my wee archive, far too many to post without more info. on names & dates i.e. I will wait until there's more to go on.
Annie
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A possible for Angus & Mary...
1841 SP
BEATON ANGUS 30
113/ 10/ 1 North Uist, Inverness
From the transcription I have the household (at Paible) contained..
Angus 30 Shepherd
Mary 30
Catherine 7
Donald 4
Flory 3m (likely short for Flora)
Elliot MacKinsee (sic) 5 (recorded as Female)
SP Entry...
MCKINZIE ELLISON F 5
113/ 10/ 1
North Uist, Inverness
Elliiot/Ellison not exactly a 'Heilan' name but the variant of McKenzie would point to the correct family I think & a relation of Mary?
Curiously there's another entry with that forename ???...
MCAULAY ELLISON
1841
F
11
113/ 11/ 5
North Uist, Inverness
No sign of the family in Paible in 1851
Annie
Hi
This is my 3x great grandfather on the Beaton side it is his father John and mother Catherine I am looking into which are my 4x great grandparents
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John Bethune/Beaton born abt 1792 Catherine Macleod born abt 1794 Angus was from strath isle of Skye but moved to north uist his wife Mary MackenZie was born in 1803 There son Donald is my 2xggreatfather and Margaret Macmillan is my 2 X g grandmother in the late 1850's Angus Beaton and family removed to Malacleit
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John Bethune/Beaton born abt 1792 Catherine Macleod born abt 1794 Angus was from strath isle of Skye but moved to north uist his wife Mary MackenZie was born in 1803 There son Donald is my 2xggreatfather and Margaret Macmillan is my 2 X g grandmother in the late 1850's Angus Beaton and family removed to Malacleit
What is your last sighting of John & Catherine?
Have you found them on any census', when/where?
I can't find Angus & Mary in N/U in 1861
Annie
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Hi Annie
Mary died in 1861
Angus remarried in 1865
To a Margaret Macpherson
From Orasay,North Uist, Scotland.
I have never been able to find John and Catherine On anything other than Angus's death certificate although I have found a John Bethune and Cathe Macleod with two other children that fits the dates of my 4x great grandparents
Shonnag
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Ah, found Angus in Malacleit 1861 as Bethune.
Angus (Head) W 48 Grasskeeper b Caternish (Unsure where that is, possibly a transcription error but I haven't seen the original)?
Catherine Dau 24 b N/U
Flora Dau 19
What ref. do you have for Angus b Strath?
Annie
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Hi Annie
I have the North uist croft history book.
Paiblisgerraidh
Cottar at Druim Dubh
Angus Beaton 1825-78 [mac Iain] shepherd from Strath Skye
= Mary Mackenzkie 1803-1861
1.Kate 1835-77
2.Donald 1837-1919 ( my 2x great grandfather)
3.Flora 1841-1905
1. Mary 1865 = Donald Macintyre
This is where Strath came in as I also thought they were all from south uist
Shonnag
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Angus Beaton 1825-78 [mac Iain] shepherd from Strath Skye
I wonder if Strath actually refers to John/Iain?
When I get time I will have a look for Angus in earlier census' as his occ. in 1861 was 'Grasskeeper' i.e. could he have been a Shepherd prior?
What was Angus' occ. on marriage, when/where did he die & what was his occ. given as on death?
Annie
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I think 'Caternish' could be Callernish :-\
http://scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/record/hes/171580/north-uist-callernish/rcahms
Such a pity the records for N/U are sparse.
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
On angus's marriage certificate to Maragaret Macpherson he was a cow herd I will pm you the death and marriage certificate
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
The information on the marriage certificate states Angus was a cow herd same as on his death certificate.
On his marriage and death certificate his father's name is John Bethune Crofer
and his mother is Catherine
Bethune
m.s Macleod
He died in Malcliet north uist
Shonnag
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Shonnag,
I have been through this whole thread & was aiming to do a timeline but I'm confused as to who are descendants of your John Bethune & Catherine Macleod.
Can you please list the names/dates/places of birth for the children of this family & any info. you have on where they were/when from census' please as there are so many names floating on here which are all the same & I can't pick who belongs to who to search for them ;D
Dates/ages/occs are important to differentiate as the forenames are all common Uist names ::)
Annie
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Angus Bethune/Beaton 1814 -1878 strath Skye
= Mary Mackenzie 1803-1861 (I think north uist)
Children
Catherine Beaton 1837-1877 nm
Donald Beaton 1837-1919
Flora Beaton 1841-1905 ONE daughter Mary MacDonald 1865-1924 northuist
Donald Beaton = Mary Macdonald _ 1844-before 1873 Nunton Benbecula
1 Daughter Mary Beaton 1867-
His first wife died
He married Margaret Macmillian 1845 Torulm
14 Aug 1873 - Nunton Benbecula
Children
Angus 14 July 1874 Nunton Benbecula
Lachlan Beaton 1878 Rhudhgashernish south uist
Carherine Beaton 27 July 1882 Rhudhgashernish south uist Nm
Neil Beaton 20 October 1884 -19 Febuary 1971
Rhudhgashernish south uist
Neil Married Mary Mackay 16 April 1891 - 13 April 1967
Marriage date is 12 September 1911 Howmore south uist
Children
Lachlan Beaton 25 May 1912-1987
Ronald Beaton 20 November 1913 -1988
Mary Ann Beaton 11 April 1916-1965 died in Greenock
Donald John Beaton 13 September 1917 -1976 died in Oban
Murdoch Beaton (My granddad) 22 May 1919-7 October 1989 lived at Kenneth drive lochboisdale
Donald Beag Beaton 8 May 1920-1999
Angus Mor Beaton 16 Jan 1925-1992
Patrick Beaton 1926-1991
Angus Beag Beaton 13 May 1928-2012
In the north uist croft book it stated Angus as being born in 1825 I worked it out that he was born in 1814
Shonnag
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Hi Shonnag,
Thanks for the info....years would have been fine to separate them.
"In the north uist croft book it stated Angus as being born in 1825 I worked it out that he was born in 1814"
When I read it I could see how easy it would be to make the error, fingers one space too far to the right on the digits.
Sorry not much help but a couple of things…
Donald Bethune/Beaton & 1st wife Mary MacDonald married 30 Oct 1866 Benbecula
They appear to have had a dau prior to Marys’ death?
Mary Bethune b 2 May 1867 N/Uist
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XYGY-54Q
Father Angus remarried to Margaret MacPherson 21 Feb 1865 N/Uist
Couldn’t find anything at all on his existence prior to arriving in N/U & he gives 3 different places of birth nor did I find anything on his parents.
I found Angus (Beaton/Bethune) in the other census’ & it looks as though Shepherd/Cowherd are much the same…
1841 – 30 (1811) Beaton, Shepherd b Inverness-shire
1851 – 39 (1812) Bethune, Cowherd b Strath, Skye
1861 – 48 (1813) Bethune, Grasskeeper b Caternish & Vaternish (Waternish) from 2 different transcriptions but Waternish looks most likely as it’s Skye
1871 – 56 (1815) Bethune, Herd b Durinish, Inverness-shire (likely Duirinish)
In 1871 there’s a granddau Mary MacDonald aged 6 b N/U & although her age is out a bit this may be Donald’s 1st born
ED 12, Schedule no. 36, LINE 14, Roll CSSCT1871_21
So for Angus’ pob 3 place names are on the Isle of Skye which doesn’t help…
Strath, Waternish & Duirinish (I haven't seen any originals)
Strath & Duirinish are opposite ends & Waternish is beyond Duirinish on this link but you need to look at the smaller map on the right of the pic which shows Waternish;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duirinish,_Skye
There doesn’t appear to be much in the way of OPRs for Skye sadly which is the same for N/Uist.
Not sure what you have regarding Mary MacKay, wife of Neil Beaton but I can fill some gaps there if you need. A coincidence, her g/mother was an Ann Beaton although I don't know if she's connected to your Beaton direct line.
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I have found a John Bethune and Cathe Macleod on family search from Skye I was wondering if this could be them.
John Bethune
Sex Male
Wife Cathe. Macleod
Son Nord. Bethune
Nord. Bethune
Gender Male
Birth Date 26 Jun 1845
Birthplace SNIZORT,INVERNESS,SCOTLAND
Father's Name John Bethune
Mother's Name Cathe. Macleod
It is the only John Bethune and Cathe Macleod I have found.
I have got to Mary Mackay's Great grandparents on my tree I don't know much about Mary
Shonnag
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I have found a John Bethune and Cathe Macleod on family search from Skye I was wondering if this could be them.
John Bethune
Wife Cathe. Macleod
Son Nord. Bethune
Nord. Bethune
Birth Date 26 Jun 1845
Birthplace SNIZORT,INVERNESS,SCOTLAND
Father's Name John Bethune
Mother's Name Cathe. Macleod
It is the only John Bethune and Cathe Macleod I have found.
Shonnag,
I saw that but the date is far too late to be a sibling of Angus.
The info. I have for Mary is siblings, marriages etc.
Annie
Add...
This was another child Alexander to the same couple in 1851
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XBSZ-384
Angus born between 1811 - 1815 & assuming his mother was at least 16 yrs old she would have been born latest 1799 i.e. by 1851 she would be 52 & although not impossible, I think it improbable?
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Hi Annie
I agree it can't be them.
I ah e Mary's siblings but not marriages I know about her brother Murdch Mackay he died in the war.
Shonnag
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Hi Shonnag,
I have to get ready to go out but there was a brother Donald who died WW1 too.
I don't have dates for more recent ones but...
Brother Alexander married either Mary or Margaret MacLennan & they had 4 girls;
Mary, Margaret, Dolina & Isabella.
Can post more bits when I get time.
Annie
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You've probably seen this but helps others too...
http://outer-hebrides-ww1.blogspot.co.uk/2013/12/murdo-mackay-eochar-south-uist.html
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you for the information
I think I have seen something like that about Murdoch Mackay before
Shonnag
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Hi Shonnag,
Have you seen the family MIs at Daliburgh Cemetery?
I wasn't sure & didn't want to post a link incase it would upset you?
Annie
-
Do you have dates for Mary's siblings, if not I can give you approx. dates?
Annie
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Hi Annie
I have the dates for Mary's siblings I think I got them from the croft book.
I looked on the cemetery website a while back and again on Monday.
Shonnag
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This is the ref. for Mary who was born 1855 (1st year of Statutory Registration) & will give you an enormous amount of further info. i.e. worth the purchase if you don't already have it as it will contain far more info. than on an earlier Baptism which would only give minimum info...
MCPHERSON MARY
1855
118/ 120
South Uist
Annie
P.S....I've been having probs for days with comp/net cutting off all the time.
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Hi Annie
Thank you I will order it today
I have her death certificate on my family tree
My computer does the same
Shonnag
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Marriage for Mary's g/parents;
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XT5N-2Z2
I haven't seen the original i.e. I don't know who her parents were.
The strange thing is her birth has been given as both Skye & Ireland ::)
I haven't checked census' yet to find out what they say.
Annie
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1861 - Jessie Montgomery gives her pob as Dublin
Children Ronald & Alexander were obviously born prior to the marriage as Ronald is 4 & Alexander is 1
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I have them all on my tree but never thought about looking in to Jessie
Shonnag
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Shonnag,
This is confusing...
Ranald/Ronald was born as Rory Donald which is actually Roderick & not Ronald!!! ??? ::)
MONTGOMERY RORY DONALD
1860
112/1 16
Kilmuir (Inverness)
There is no corresponding entry with surname M(a)cKay i.e. possibly there may be an entry of 'RCE' attached whereby the father (Donald) admits paternity but that will only be known from the original download?
Annie
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Ohh.. ;D
Mackay Or Montgomery (no forename attached although probably Alexander) ??? ::)
Birth Date 18 Jul 1859, SOUTH UIST
Father Donald Mackay
Mother Janet Montgomery
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XYYH-44X
I think that relates to Alexander who would (in effect) still only be 1 yr old in 1861 census (c Apr) as he wouldn't be 2 yrs old until the July.
Strangely, there's no entry under either surname on SP ???
I searched under the 4 obvious initials which may have been mistranscribed i.e. M, H, W & N with absolutely nothing & I didn't input a forename initial :-\
So... where did the IGI (familysearch.org) find that info. ???
It's well into the 'Statutory' period whereby it was law to register all BMDs so it's a complete mystery indeed although I also searched the OPRs.
Annie
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I have them all on my tree but never thought about looking in to Jessie
Just wondering if you have the birth registrations of the children or at least Ranald/Ronald/Rory/Roderick who is actually your ancestor in order to proceed back a generation?
This is where it is important to find the actual roots when illegitimate children are found as the descending surname may be taken from a step-father' i.e. not the true ancestry.
Annie
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Further thoughts...
MONTGOMERY RORY DONALD b1860
The 1861 census gives a Ronald/Ranald aged 4 years, they couldn't possibly get that wrong surely i.e. is it 4 months rather than 4 years ???
Annie
Add...Birth Date 18 Jul 1859, SOUTH UIST (no forename)...surely can't be the same person as the 1860 for Rory :-\
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Hi Annie
Thank you
In the croft history book it states
Ranald/Ronald being born 1859 and his brother being born 1860 I don't have the birth record I will try and order it.
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Hi Shonnag,
I've had a look through SP & I can only find one other possible birth for Ranald/Ronald but it's Harris rather than Skye;
MCKAY RANALD
1860
111/1 82
Harris
Annie (tired & confused) :-\
-
I'm going to check the census' to find out where he was born ???
Annie
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1861 gives both Ronald & Alexander as born S/U but there are no corresponding births registered in S/U under M(a)ckay or Montgomery.
This looks good;
MACKAY ALEXANDER
1860
113/ 97
North Uist
but it's Ronald we need to find ::)
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I will have a look on sp in the morning see what I can find
Shonnag
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Shonnag,
It's an enigma as Ranald/Ronald looks to have been born prior to the marriage although if he was 4 months rather than 4 yrs on the census it would be possible but the youngest rather than the eldest of the 2.
Annie
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Huh...Just checked 1871 census Bualadugh (sic) & Janet/Jessie has pob as Gibralter (sic)!
Ranald is aged 13 & Alexander aged 9 i.e. not an error on 1861 & both stated as b S/U still yet no births to be found :-\
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I received a message yesterday about Jessie I will pm it to you
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
I have found the marriage cretifciate for Ronald Mackay and Mary Macpherson which states Ronald was 19 when he married in 1875 which would make his year of birth 1856.
Shonnag
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I have found the marriage cretifciate for Ronald Mackay and Mary Macpherson which states Ronald was 19 when he married in 1875 which would make his year of birth 1856.
Shonnag,
It would depend on what month his birthday was e.g. if he married Mar 1875 aged 19 & his 20th birthday was Jul that would make his birth year 1855 so it's hard to tell.
Annie
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Hi Annie
Just checked the marriage date and they married in October 1875
Shonnag
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Hi Shonnag,
I have checked every scenario with spellings & can't find him b 1855 - 1856 anywhere in Scotland i.e. there may have been an error on the indexing, who knows?
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
Will keep searching see if I can find anything on them
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
I was just checking the croft book for Donald and Jessie
I think I missed this the first time.
Entry:
cottars at Buaile Dubh
Donald Mackay 1825-1883
=Jessie Montgomery 1826-1879
Ranald =Mary Macpherson
Alex
House passed to stepson Archie Macpherson 1849
Does this mean Jessie had an other son
Shonnag
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cottars at Buaile Dubh
Donald Mackay 1825-1883
=Jessie Montgomery 1826-1879
Ranald =Mary Macpherson
Alex
House passed to stepson Archie Macpherson 1849
Does this mean Jessie had an other son
Shonnag
Hi Shonnag,
That does look very likely...
'Gilleasbuig Saor mac Seonaid Mhicgumraid''
My interpretation would be (he was illegitimate as his mother's name & surname are used rather than his father's 'MacPherson') ...
Archibald, Joiner/Carpenter son of Janet/Jessie & although I haven't ever come across Montgomery in gaelic the 'Mhic' (I think) may be 'daughter of' & 'Gumraid' just seems to be 'Gomery' but maybe someone with more gaelic knowledge can help as I'm only used to 'Mc/Mac' surnames where it means 'son of' or 'nighean/n'in' (daughter of)?
Annie
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Archibald's marriage will give details of his parentage (mother at least) but hopefully he gives his father's name too :-\
MACPHERSON ARCHIBALD
CAMERON MARY
1872
118/2 4
Howmore
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
Will see if I can find a birth record tomorrow
Shonnag
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Shonnag,
I searched for a baptism on SP but nothing showed up hence why I posted the ref. for the marriage.
I will check the census' to see where he was born but it was pre statutory registration which depends on Church Records & the islands were very patchy with info. sadly.
Annie
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1881 - Buailedhu (transcription)
MacPherson - All b S/U
Archibald Head 32 Joiner
Mary Wife 30
Angus Son 8
John Son 5
Malcolm Son 3
Margaret Dau 2
Janet Dau 2m
Janet Ferguson 14 Serv
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you, I will have a look now on sp and see if I can the marriage
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
I have just found the marriage certificate for Archibald Macpherson and Mary Cameron 1872
Father
Angus Macpherson
Mother
Janet Macpherson
M.s Montgomery
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
I also have the marriage cretifciate of Donald Mackay and Jessie
Which gives Jessie's parents names I can't make the first name out For her father her mothers name was Catherine Macleod (if I have read it right )
Jessie was a widow when she married Donald in 1860 she was 34 years old
Shonnag
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I have just found the marriage certificate for Archibald Macpherson and Mary Cameron 1872
Father
Angus Macpherson
Mother
Janet Macpherson
M.s Montgomery
Shonnag,
Does the marriage indicate Angus was deceased?
How old was Archibald when he married?
Annie
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Hi Annie
It doesn't say that Angus has died.
I am trying to find the marriage between Jessie and Angus
Shonnag
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I also have the marriage cretifciate of Donald Mackay and Jessie
Which gives Jessie's parents names I can't make the first name out For her father her mothers name was Catherine Macleod (if I have read it right )
Jessie was a widow when she married Donald in 1860 she was 34 years old
Shonnag,
I have put in all the details as it may help in your research if anyone recognises the names.
Marriage 07 Sep 1860 CoS, Iochdar, Howmore, S/U
Donald MacKay, 36, Carnan, Iochdar, Farm Labourer, Bachelor
Parents: Donald MacKay (Farmer) & Catherine MacDonald
Jessie Montgomery, 34, Carnan, Iochdar, Domestic Servant, Widow
Parents: Alexander Montgomery (Pensioner, Deceased) & Catherine MacLean (Deceased)
Witnesses: John Nicolson & Angus MacMillan
As Jessie/Janet was only 34 in 1860 (b c1826) there's a chance her parents deaths may be in statutory records?
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I will see what I am find on her parents
Shonnag
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Shonnag,
The DC for Jessie/Janet Montgomery/MacKay may have her 1st husband named if the informant knew those details?
Annie
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Hi Annie
I will have a look now to see if I can find her death certificate
Shonnag
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I see the croft book has Jessie/Janet's father as Angus :-\ from Skye
Could this be father Alexander;
MONTGOMERY ALEXANDER
63
1855
110/ 96
Duirinish (Skye)
I can't find a death for Catherine her mother with surname Montgomery but she may have died pre statutory & not recorded?
Annie
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I'm getting '503 Sorry, the service is currently unavailable' on SP are you getting the same?
Annie
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Death for Janet;
MONTGOMERY JANET
53
1879
118/2 17
Howmore
MACKAY
JANET
53
1879
118/2 17
Howmore
Annie
Add...They will both contain exactly the same info. as married women in Scotland are registered by both surnames.
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Shonnag,
This thread has had an enormous amount of views "Beaton family (Read 18823 times)"
Such a pity there's not been many contributors :(
Annie
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Hi Annie
I have the death cert for Jessie
I was getting error on sp left it for about 10 mins then went back on
7 May 1879
Janet Mackay (Montgomery)
Married to Donald Mackay farmer
Age 53
Donald Mackay widower present nothing on her first husband Angus
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
There are a least three Beaton families in Uist I am not even sure they are all related so could be the other Beaton researches looking
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
I haven't found a anything in the croft book on Jessie's parents unless I have missed it.( been trying to keep busy day)
Shonnag
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This looks very suspect...
1851 Inverness-shire (INV) Strath
MONTGOMERY William Head 28 Drainer IRL
MONTGOMERY Jessie Wife 26 SUT Assynt
NICOLSON Margaret Servnt 21 House Servant SUT Assynt
There was a John Nicolson as a witness to her marriage to Donald MacKay :-\
Annie
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Hi Annie
That looks as tho Jessie got married 3 times if it is the same Jessie in strath
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
I just looked on the census and William is from Ireland
So this may be Jessie this would have been the first wedding unless she married more than 3 times
Shonnag
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I don't think she married the father of Archibald :-\
I haven't checked on that William Montgomery to find out when he died.
MONTGOMERY ALEXANDER
63
1855
110/ 96
Duirinish (Skye)
1841 - I have found an Alexander Montgomery 45 in Duirinish with a wife Flory (Flora) 40 with 3 children, Catherine 10, Murdoch 8 & John 3.
If Catherine (mother of Jessie/Janet) died young then did Alexander remarry or were Alexander & Catherine ever married?
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ko6/
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I couldn't find a marriage for Alexander and Catherine
I also have no idea where to start with Irish records
Shonnag
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This looks very suspect...
1851 Inverness-shire (INV) Strath
MONTGOMERY William Head 28 Drainer IRL
MONTGOMERY Jessie Wife 26 SUT Assynt
NICOLSON Margaret Servnt 21 House Servant SUT Assynt
There was a John Nicolson as a witness to her marriage to Donald MacKay :-\
1841 - I have found a William Montgomery (IRE) 'M' (Married) 25 'Gunner, Royal Artillary' :-\...
If this is the same William, he hasn't aged much in 10 yrs (not uncommon I may add)! :-\
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ko7/
Shonnag, please be cautious & don't assume any of my posts are fact unless I/you find evidence to support my thoughts as I'm only trying to help & using names/dates/places etc. which could match! ;)
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I will do as this may not be the same Jessie as I have been searching through records and there is a few Jessie Montgomery's ( they can't all be her)
Shonnag
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1841 - Inverness-shire (INV) Strath
It would be interesting to know whether this Janet was a widow...could this be g/mother?
If Jessie/Janet was 1st born to Catherine & the naming pattern used then she should have been named after her g/mother :-[
Janet Montgomery 60 (c1781) although ages were rounded down.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ko8/
If only we could find proof of everything ::)
Annie
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Shonnag,
I have found a William Montgomery b Drumcree, Armagh
Served in Royal Artillery
Discharged aged 33 which was somewhere between 1837 & 1852 (which is the duration of the records) i.e. no exact date.
The William I found was on the 1851 census as a 'Drainer' i.e. if it was him he would have been discharged between 1841 & 1851.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C8866843
It may be worth putting a request for info. for that William on the Armed Forces board (not sure what info. they need) but there's a 'Reference: WO 97/1251/116' which may be what they would need?
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/armed-forces/
Annie
-
1851 Inverness-shire (INV) Strath
MONTGOMERY William Head 28 Drainer IRL
1841 - I have found a William Montgomery (IRE) 'M' (Married) 25 'Gunner, Royal Artillary' :-\...
If the William on the National Archives page is the same man he should have been around 33 in 1849 (b c1816) which narrows things a bit to when he was discharged :-\
Annie
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Hi Annie
I just searched Alexander on My tree and came up with the following ( the tree is the person who messaged me)
Alexander Montgomery 1780
Argll Southend
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
Thank you
William isn't much older than Jessie is it possible he could be a brother and married someone else called Jessie
Shonnag
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Yes Shonnag for sure but it wasn't uncommon for relatives to marry (small populations on the islands & Uist is a prime example) or for illegitimate children to be brought up by their father's surname if that was the case.
My thought is that Montgomery is not a 'Highland' name & if there were a cluster of them in the same place at the same time there's a good chance of being connected/related?
I'm just looking at 'possible' scenarios with names/dates/places which could fit & put in the 'maybe' folder for later.
Sometimes we need to go round the houses to find things & sometimes some of our finds are quite surprising & I just hope I'm not throwing in any spanners ;D
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I will search on the tree see what I come up with
Shonnag
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Just for ref...
MONTGOMERY ALEXANDER
ROBERT MONTGOMERY (Parent)
13/01/1780
532/10 32 Southend
Annie
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Hi Annie
I saw that one when I searched for the birth haven't put Robert in tho incase it's wrong
Shonnag
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I don't see the name Robert carrying forward down the line but then again not everyone used the traditional naming pattern.
I've just been going over a few things & going back to Reply #76...
'1861 - Jessie Montgomery gives her pob as Dublin'
It's the 'Irish' link which I wonder about although Dublin & Armagh are miles apart but could they be related & a lot of the family in the Army?
It does seem a bit of a coincidence ???
Annie
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Shonnag,
Have you found anything on Alexander MacKay?
There's absolutely nothing on him in the croft book strangely ::)
Annie
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Hi Annie
I haven't found anything on him yet will search him now see if I come up with something
Shonnag
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Hi Annie
If Alexander was in the army and posted to Ireland that could explain Jessie being born in Ireland
Shonnag
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I did wonder that as it does seem a strange coincidence & possibly he like William was Irish too?
As I said, Montgomery is not a 'Highland' name at all...
Just did a 'google' search...
"English, Scottish, and northern Irish (of Norman origin): habitational name from a place in Calvados, France, so named from Old French mont 'hill' + a Germanic personal name composed of the elements guma 'man' + ric 'power'. In Ireland this surname has been Gaelicized as Mac Iomaire and in Scotland as Mac Gumaraid"
The croft book gives the spelling as 'Mhicgumraid' which I thought/think (may be) 'daughter of' rather than 'son of' but I'm not sure at all as my experiences are as I posted earlier re Mac/Ni'n'?
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I can't find anything on Alexander Mackay will keep looking.
I never thought to google the name.
Shonnag
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Confusion over...looks to have probably been a 'typo', no wonder I was confused as it was in relation to Janet i.e. should have read either 'ni'n or 'nic' so the 'Mhic' appears to have meant to be 'NIC' which would relate properly with how I would have read it ('daughter of')?
Annie
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Hi Annie
It might be daughter of ,
I still haven't managed to find anything on Alexander Mackay will search the member connection on my tree see if I come up with something
Shonnag
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I can't find Donalds first marriage but he also had children with the first wife
Shonnag,
I have located & downloaded that marriage & not surprised you couldn't locate it as it's indexed as Belton ::)
I will email it to you.
Marriage 30 Oct 1866 Benbecula
Donald Belton (Farm Tenant) 28 (Nunton)
Parents: Angus Belton (Grass Keeper) & Mary MacKenzie
Mary MacDonald (Farm Servant) 22 (Nunton)
Parents: Archibald MacDonald (Fisherman) & Mary MacLean
Witnesses: N MacDonald & Jessie MacDonald
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I have been on sp this morning there is a death record for a Alwxander Mackay in 1879 age 20
Will check to see if it's Roanlds brother
Shonnag
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Hi Shonnag,
I have been digging further over the last couple of days…
Born 30 Nov 1848 Archibald (Natural Son) to Angus MacPherson & Janet or Jessie Montgomery, Benbecula/Kilmuir (Skye), Bapt. 04 Mar 1850 (Ardkenneth)
A side note on the above transcription gives;
Angus MacPherson ‘of Malcolm of John’ (Son of Malcolm who was Son of John)
Janet was ‘of Alexander of Murdoch’ (Dau of Alexander who was Son of Murdoch)
MCPHERSON ARCHD - ANGUS MCPHERSON/JANET MONTGOMERIE
30/11/1848 4/3/1850 Ardkenneth, St Michael's Inverness
Born 29 Jul 1851 Mary (Natural Child) to Angus MacPherson & Janet Montgomerie, Lionaclet/Isle of Skye, Bapt. 16 Nov 1853 (Ardkenneth)
A side note on the above transcription gives (for Angus);
‘A Joiner’ & ‘A Tailor’
I am assuming the ‘Joiner relates to Angus himself & ‘Tailor’ to his Father
MACPHERSON MARY - ANGUS MACPHERSON/JANET MONTGOMERIE
29/7/1851 16/11/1853 Ardkenneth, St Michael's Inverness
Meanwhile (Transcriptions)… (I haven’t checked any originals). Keeps it all together.
1851 Liniclete (sic) (Prior to dau Mary’s birth)
Angus MacPherson (Head) M 57 (c1794) Carpenter & Joiner – S/Uist
Janet Montgomery W 29 (c1822) – Ireland
Allan MacArthur (Stpson) 8 (c1843) – Skye, Inverness-shire (Another son of Jessie/Janet)?
Archibald MacPherson (Son) 2 – S/Uist
1861 Carnan
Donald MacKay (Head) M 64 (c1797) Farmer – N/Uist
Catherine W M 64 – N/U
Donald MacKay (Son) M 34 – S/U
Jessy MacKay (D in L) M 35 – Dublin, Ireland
Ronald MacKay (Grnson) 4 – S/U
Alexander MacKay (Grnson) 1 0 S/U
Ann MacKay (Dau) U 30 Domestic Servant – S/U (Sis of your Donald)
Looks like Alan MacArthur & Mary MacPherson have died?
1871 Bualadugh (sic)
Donald MacKay (Head) M 49 Grasskeeper – S/U
Janet MacKay Wife M 46 (C1825) – Gibralter (sic)
Ranald (Son) 13 – S/U
Alexander (Son) 9 – S/U
A possible for Janet/Jessie’s Father Alexander…
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C8755091
Annie
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Shonnag,
I posted a query on the Forces board regarding Alexander Montgomery (potential father of Janet/Jessie) & have had 2 very exciting replies...
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=778877.msg6329042
If we could find a marriage for him &/or a birth for Janet that would either confirm or eliminate Alexander.
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
That's a lot of information on the Macpherson's and Mackay's
That is exciting information on Alexander Montgomery I thought he may have been in the Army it's just proving its the right Alexander Montgomery.It's strange the black watch being mention my adopted dad was attached to them int wh 80's ( he passed away few years ago)
Shonnag
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Shonnag,
Although the 'Croft' books are not 100% accurate & have flaws at times (forgivable) they are really good probably 99% when you consider the info. there.
The baptisms I found are from the Parish Records transcriptions (not the 'Croft' book) & the 'side notes' I have put in blue may not be visible on the downloaded bapt. (& not on the index)!
I'm 99% sure that the Alexander & Murdoch in the 'Army' records are correct as it's too much of a coincidence.
Whether Janet/Jessie was illegitimate is another matter but regardless....why would she give her place of birth as 2 of the very places Alexander was posted to as it's not just something anyone could make up.
The 'Croft' book has her father as Angus (I pointed that out earlier) but that info. was written more than a century after those events & as Angus MacPherson was the father of Archibald & a good bit older than her (J), it may have been an error.....well obviously :D
The baptismal records where the added notes are to be found would be info. from Jessie/Janet herself i.e. the 'Army' Alexander would be a good candidate & whether or not she was born abroad, how did she know where he'd been stationed?
The theory works with all the info. so far....
Her father named as Alexander & his father named as Murdoch on the baptism transcriptions of her children with Angus MacPherson (I haven't seen any originals), her places of birth on census' (where Alexander was posted), father named as Alexander on her marriage.
Alexander died in 1855, son Murdoch was the informant, all children to the marriage with Flora recorded although no mention of a previous wife nor of Jessie/Janet.
Is it a coincidence that the dates/ages of the children from that union do not overlap with the circa dates for Jessie/Janet's birth?
From what we have with age on marriage/census'/death she would have been born 1821 - 1826 (when Alexander was in the Army in both places she gives as her PoB)
The children named on Alexander's death with ages/birth yrs begin 1830!
I have no idea when Alexander signed up or when he was discharged but the dates are 1817-1828....1st child born to that marriage 1830 i.e. was he married to Jessie/Janet's mother or a home-coming fling :-\
We just can't put a nail on it....you need to get your DNA done & hope some descendants have done the same :D
It's been an interesting one for sure ;D
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I was looking in to doing a Dna test as maybe that way I would find information on Jessie M and Could possibly find some information Jonn Beaton/Bethune and Catherine Macleod.
I found a Alexander Montgomery last night with a son Murdoch but wasn't sure I had the right one as Janet / Jessie was not mentioned in the tree will go back and check that one for the marriage.
Shonnag
-
We just can't put a nail on it....you need to get your DNA done & hope some descendants have done the same :D
I'm looking for a thumbs-up symbol. :)
Please don't be despondent when you're related to half of Prince Edward Island and other parts of Canada and it seems too confusing! You never know what might pop-up.
On a couple of DNA segments I'm getting many Canadian matches whose ancestors emigrated prior to the 1841 census and they don't know where their Scottish ancestors emigrated from. Matching on the same segment are people with more recent Scottish connections from Invernesshire or Nairnshire (so they left later so are on the census, or never left).
Considerable numbers left the area as things became more and more difficult for crofters.
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Hi Annie
I have found one Marriage for
Alexander Mintgomery
In Portree
Alexander Montgomery
Spouse's Name Catharine Mcinnes
Event Date 08 Oct 1816
Event Place Portree,Inverness,Scotland
Shonnag
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Hi Hurworth
I have Maclellans further back that emigrated to Prince Edward Island Canada.
So far they are the only family I have found that did emigrate.
Shonnag
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Hi Shonnag,
I did see that marriage to Catharine MacInnes & forgot about it in my eagerness to find out about Alexander ???
It is a coincidence with the forename as Janet's mother was a Catherine & if her mother died young it's quite possible Jessie may have been brought up by someone else i.e. with a different surname not knowing her mother's maiden name?
It does look perfect for the date but where & when did she die, it would be interesting to know?
I didn't find a marriage for Alexander & Flora.
Annie
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Suspense was too much so I downloaded the baptism for Archibald MacPherson ;D
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
So Jessie is from the isle of Skye on her son's batism record
Shonnag
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So Jessie is from the isle of Skye on her son's batism record
Shonnag,
I think that may possibly refer to her abode prior to living on Uist?
It's hard to know what the Priest was meaning but it seems to be a general sort of background thing as he obviously knew she wasn't a 'local' as everyone knows everyone else in those places & still do to this day ;D
You will find (on Uist at least) it's a common thing when people refer to another, that 'other' person is referred to by their own name then their father's name & sometimes the g/father's name!
My g/mother was always known as 'Sine, Gilleasbuig 'Gobha' which is Jean dau of Archibald the Blacksmith & no surname ever mentioned but that's the same with everyone, the surname seems irrelevant ::)
Annie
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I have found 'J' at last in 1841 :o
The child on the 1851 posted earlier (we didn't know about previously)... "Allan MacArthur (Stpson) 8 (c1843) – Skye, Inverness-shire"...
MCARTHUR JANET
1841
20
112/ 8/ 9
Kilmuir
Inverness
The PoB given is Inverness but whether 'J' herself gave that info. we don't know :-\
Large household...
Janet Mcarthur 20
b abt 1821 Inverness, Scotland
Parish Kilmuir, Inverness
Address, Balymenach (https://scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/search/results?st=Balmenach)
Parish No. 112
Murdo Gilles 40
Flora Gilles 40
Effy Gilles 20
Archibald Gilles 15
Ellis Gilles 15
Catherine Gilles 14
Marrion Gilles 8
Flora Gilles 2
Jessie Gilles 6 Mo
Susannah Gillies 14
Mary Nicolson 65
Janet Mcarthur 20
Allan Mcarthur 4 Mo
Curiously the census has Allan born 'Scotland' ::).....Where ??? ;D
It's definitely 'J'!
Annie
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This looks like it could be Alan in 1861...
MCARTHUR ALAN
1861
20
551/1 2/ 3
Tyree, Argyll
Alan isn't a common name at all & as we are into. statutory periods it may be worth trying to track him down as his info. could be very significant regarding his mother's maiden name!!! ???
'Fancestry' have him born Tyree but I haven't searched for a possible father, I would be more interested in Alan later but there were no hints on a later census for him so where has he gone ???
Annie
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Not finding a marriage or death for Alan in Scotland :(
Of course... he may be under MacPherson by now?
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you
I just added Allan to the tree and searched him
Found this
Archibald McPhere
Age: 2
Estimated birth year: abt 1849
Relationship: Son
Father: Angus Mcpherson
Mother: Janet Montgomery
Gender: Male
Where born: South Uist, Inverness
Parish Number: 118
Civil Parish: South Uist
Town: Liniclate
County: Inverness
Address: Liniclate
ED: 5
Page: 9
Household schedule number: 33
LINE: 19
Roll: CSSCT1851_28
Household Members:
Name Age
Angus Mcpherson 37
Janet Montgomery 29
Allan Mcarthur 8
Archibald McPhere 2
Jessie still states on this census she was born in Dublin Ireland.
She has been both interesting and confusing with all the different PoB
Angus is down as a carpenter on the above census
Shonnag
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Shonnag,
I posted the details for that 1851 census in Reply #143... ;)
"Allan MacArthur (Stpson) 8 (c1843) – Skye, Inverness-shire"
Annie
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The freecen version for 1841 gives both Janet & son Allan as born 'Outside Census County'!
Annie
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Hi Annie
I didn't realise it was the same one as the one you posted sorry.
Most census I see for Jessie have Dublin on it for where born.
I have only searched Allan once as there are a lot of Allan MacArthur's coming up for Scotland.
Shonnag
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Hi Shonnag,
From a personal point of view, I would want to look into that marriage & check the original for 2 reasons...
To find out if by chance an occ. is listed i.e. a possible mention of 'Army' & the coincidental fact that Janet's mother was named Catherine albeit with a different surname but if the mother died young it is possible Janet wasn't sure of her mother's maiden name as she would only be referred to in conversation by her forename :-\
Annie
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Most census I see for Jessie have Dublin on it for where born.
A recap of Janet's given PoB...
1841 - Outside census County (1841 never gave specifics of where outside)
1851 - Ireland
1861 - Dublin, Ireland
1871 - Gibralter (sic)
I haven't seen any of the originals.
Annie
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Shonnag,
I should have been more specific ;) where I have '1841 never gave specifics of where outside' as that was the norm for anyone recorded in 1841 i.e. not only in relation to Janet.
Annie
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Been searching for a Janet with variants & had to look twice when I saw this...
Wrong Regiment :(
Jean Montgomery
British Nationals Armed Forces Births 1761-2005
Country Gibraltar
1820
Regiment 26th Foot
I need to give up ;)
Annie
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Hi Annie
thank you
I will look in to the marriage of Alexander to see what I can find out
Shonnag
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Annie and Shonnaig You were both trying to trace Janet Montgomery,b 1820 in Dublin or Gibralter.
Janet was my Grandmothers Aunt and I have all her history, including her time in South Uist.
If you contact me I will be delighted to pass on any information to both of you.
Jonathan Campbell.
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Annie and shonnaig You are looking for information om Janet Montgomery I have all the information
for you if you get in touch with me.
Jonathan Campbell.
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I have all the information on Janet Montgomery, she was my Grannies aunt. I'll gladly pass on all you need to know.
Jonathan Campbell
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Hi Jonathan & welcome to Rootschat ;)
I'm sure Shonnaig will be delighted with any info. you have as it's been a long thread so this is very exciting & a connection with a relative!
Annie
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Annie. I received your message. This rootschat is all new to me so I am trying to learn the procedure.
I will send you a email with some attachmants, hope they arrive and also your telephone number would help. Your number will be safe enough with me
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Hi Jonathan,
To reply to a PM is the same as it is on here, just press the reply button ;D
I was curious as to whether we have the same Campbell ancestry, mine are South Uist & as you have links there too then it would be interesting to find out but I don't want to take up space on this thread ;D
Annie
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Annie, mo, I have no Uist connections in my family sENT YOU AN EMAIL WITH ATTACMENT,, DID YOU RECEIVE ANYTHING.
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Annie sent you an email with attachment yesterday no reply from you so I don't know if you received it or not. email reply saying your address is invalid,
Jonathan,
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Hi Jonathan,
No sorry I didn't receive an email, will check & PM you it.
Annie
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Jonathan,
I checked the PM I sent you & my email address on it is correct i.e. the error is at your end ;)
Annie
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Annie and Shonag, I have sent several replies and don't know if i am getting through or not.My email address is (*). Try and contact me there. also (*) .Jonathan
(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail and phone no. removed in accordance with RootsChat policy, to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
See Help-Page: http://www.rootschat.com/help/pms.php
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Hi Jonathan,
I have received your email although I haven't looked at the info. yet but you need to edit your post with your details to remove them as a Mod will remove them, they are not permitted.
My status may have the green light showing which says I'm online but I'm not always at my computer & I have to log in to emails on my comp.
I will get back to you when I've had a wee look & thank you for the info!
Annie
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Annie, I have nothing from you. I'm confused as how to reply to anything. Don't know if you are receiving anything I send. It would help if you replied by ordinary email, which i understand.
Jonathan
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Hi Jonathan,
Hopefully you have received my 2 replies via RC & email ;)
Thanks for the info. you sent as it's very interesting!
I've enjoyed researching this family :)
Annie
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Annie, at last I received a reply from you/ Glad you got my information. PLEASE SEND ME ANY FUTURE INFO BY EMAIL ONLY. I find RC totally confusing AND DIFFICULT TO USE, EMAILS ARE EASY.
JONATHAN.
CONTACT ME AFTER THE NEW YEAR.
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Annie and shonaig.
I have not heard from you for six months. do you still want information on Janet MONTGOMERY
born Dublin or Gibralter?
Jonathan Campbell
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Annie and shonaig.
I have not heard from you for six months. do you still want information on Janet MONTGOMERY
born Dublin or Gibralter?
Jonathan Campbell
Hi Jonathan...
I'm really sorry but I haven't been on RC in many months but yes, if you have my email address then I will welcome any info. you have?
Edit...I will send you my email address as I think it will be easier for you?
Regards,
Annie
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I was reading through another post/request which reminded me of this thread.
I have read over some points again & now have an addition...
From Reply #143
"1861 Carnan
Donald MacKay (Head) M 64 (c1797) Farmer – N/Uist
Catherine W M 64 – N/U
Donald MacKay (Son) M 34 – S/U
Jessy MacKay (D in L) M 35 – Dublin, Ireland
Ronald MacKay (Grnson) 4 – S/U
Alexander MacKay (Grnson) 1 0 S/U
Ann MacKay (Dau) U 30 Domestic Servant – S/U (Sis of your Donald)
Looks like Alan MacArthur & Mary MacPherson have died?"...
I think I've found Allan in 1861?
Allan Mcarthur 18 (b c1843)
Born Skye, Inverness
RD NO. 487
Polmont
Vessels
Stirlingshire
Occupation Ordinary Seaman
ED Industry
Household schedule number 1
LINE 3
Roll CSSCT1861_150
Hopefully this is a lead to something else?
Annie
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A possible death?
UK, Registers of Births, Marriages and Deaths at Sea, 1844-1890
Allan McArthur
Birth abt 1843
Death Age 25
Death 29/11/1868
Vital 29/11/1868
Ship Toscana or Tuscana
Official No. 58318
Drowned at sea
Annie
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Annie and shonaig.
I have not heard from you for six months. do you still want information on Janet MONTGOMERY
born Dublin or Gibralter?
Jonathan Campbell
Sorry Jonathan
I took a bit of time out from researching my family tree due to illness I would like the information on Janet Montgomery please if you still have it sorry for the delay
Shonnag
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Thank you for your help so far Annie
Shonnag
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Neil Married Mary Mackay 16 April 1891 - 13 April 1967
Marriage date is 12 September 1911 Howmore south uist
Children
Lachlan Beaton 25 May 1912-1987
Ronald Beaton 20 November 1913 -1988
Mary Ann Beaton 11 April 1916-1965 died in Greenock
Donald John Beaton 13 September 1917 -1976 died in Oban
Murdoch Beaton (My granddad) 22 May 1919-7 October 1989 lived at Kenneth drive lochboisdale
Donald Beag Beaton 8 May 1920-1999
Angus Mor Beaton 16 Jan 1925-1992
Patrick Beaton 1926-1991
Angus Beag Beaton 13 May 1928-2012
Hi Shonnag,
I've discovered another child in my collection to Neil Beaton & Mary MacKay...
Mary Jessie Beaton died 18 Nov 1924 aged 1 yr (Epilepsy) at Lochcarnan, S/Uist
Annie
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Hi Annie
Thank you i don,t know how i missed that one