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Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: supercub1957 on Wednesday 24 August 11 23:20 BST (UK)
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Good Morning :)
I have come to a big dead end researching GG Grandparents. Donald Taylor 1832-1917 and Mary Jane Jarvis 1837-1929. I do know where they are buried in Auckland. Donald was a Racehorse trainer based at Ellerslie, Auckland. I have found 2 small references to him in Papers Past re race results. I think another relation, Thomas Taylor, was a jockey at the time.
I have had little luck finding any other information for him through NZ Racing. Does anyone have any ideas how to approach researching this area.
I have also been unable to find any info on Mary Jane other than birth and death dates and place.
Any ideas would be so gratefully recieved.
Kind regards
Neroli
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Hi Neroli :)
Can you expand on the type of information you are wanting to find, please ?
i.e. are you going back in time ... looking for parents / siblings of Donald and Mary Jane ? (Or are you wanting information from your gg grandparents lifetimes ?)
~ Lu
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Hi
NZ Marrriage
Donald TAYLOR - Mary J. JARVIS -- 1859
[Note: NZ Marriage records for this era don't contain a lot of information unfortunately: Birthplaces of bride and groom / names of their parents ... are not shown. Names of marriage witnesses are though, and these can sometimes be helpful to a search. See "NZ Resources & Offers" section of this board > scroll down to "A Guide to info contained in NZ BDM certificates" ]
~ Lu
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Hi Lu
Thanks for your replies.
I have some information relating to their daughter (my great grandmother) who was Elizabeth. See an earlier post titled Elizabeth Taylor. However I have no idea where either Donald or Mary Jane were born, parents names etc and my trail stops with their birth, death and now (thank you) their marriage date. I would like to know if they were NZ born, if not where they came from.
Also the horse gene seems to have been very strong, as my grandfather Charles Reginald was also a trainer/ jockey/trotting driver and my daughters and I have always been keen horsewomen. I would love to know about his life training horses, especially as they were very different times to today.
I am not sure where to begin researching the racing history?
Thank you again for your help
Neroli :)
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Hi Neroli
Here is the previous thread
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,539499.0.html
Cheers Janette
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Hi again Neroli,
The funeral directors records for C Littles are kept in the Auckland City Library,you may find more info on Donald in these.
Cheers Janette
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I have no idea where either Donald or Mary Jane were born, parents names etc . I would like to know if they were NZ born, if not where they came from.
Hello...
Do you have their death certificates. Place of birth and names of parents are usually mentioned, assuming the informant knew.
1917/2070 Donald TAYLOR - aged 85y
1929/371 Mary Jane TAYLOR - aged 92y
https://www.bdmhistoricalrecords.dia.govt.nz/Search/Search.aspx?Path=%2FqueryEntry.m%3Ftype%3Ddeaths
Regards
Beg
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Hi again Neroli
Yes, given that an 1859 Marriage record won't offer you a lot of info, my next suggestion would have been to purchase the death records - which Beg has now mentioned. [Be sure when ordering these that you request a "printout" - as this offers the maximum amount of information available - and happily, is the less-expensive option.]
Re: "researching racing history" - you should be able to locate information by doing a "google" search.
PapersPast too should be a big help - just try puddling about on that site using different search terms ... perhaps exploring further details of people who may have been associated with Donald, and that type of thing. ;)
~ Lu
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Not sure whether you saw this Neroli ?
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz
"Daily Southern Cross" (Auckland)
- 3 April 1857 -- page 2 Advertisements - Column 4
This looks like your Donald - newly-arrived (maybe) and about to set up in business ?
[Extract] The undersigned has taken the Crown Hotel Stables where he intends carrying on the business of BREAKING in HORSES for Ladies and Gentlemen, riding, or any other purpose ...
Signed: Donald TAYLOR
[Obviously the emphasis was on BREAKING in HORSES. :D ]
~ Lu
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Hi Neroli,
The Auckland City Library website has
Auckland Area Passenger Arrivals 1838-1889
Name TAYLOR, D
Vessel JOHN WESLEY: Oct 5 1850
Notes Title: Mr
Cheers Janette
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Lots still to explore at PapersPast. ;)
[Some useful info also sometimes appears in the guise of "advertisements " - so be sure to check those out also.]
"Auckland Star" - 18 December 1876 - Page 2 / Col. 3
Notes from the Course: ... talks of a horse named Tui .... who does credit to Donald TAYLOR's tuition.
'Auckland Star" - 14 May 1883 - page 3 / Col. 5
A Bankruptcy Notice - Donald TAYLOR of Epsom, near Auckland, Horse Trainer
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More ....
(... and this one gives helpful family information -- Jockey WOOD, his 85-year-old grandfather Donald TAYLOR and his uncle Dugald TAYLOR, all mentioned.)
"Observer" - 9 June 1917 - Late Racing
~ Lu
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Hi neroli
It might even pay to contact The Auckland Racing Club
http://www.aucklandracingclub.ellerslie.co.nz/history-of-auckland-racing-club.html
Cheers Janette
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Hi Neroli
I see you are in Hamilton so maybe have access to old Auckland / Waikato, newspapers ?
Given the ripe ages that Donald and Mary Jane lived to, it's quite possible that obituaries for them were published (Donald TAYLOR, especially.) Worth checking for. ;)
~ Lu
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... and harping on Donald's longevity again ... it's possible he may have been made a life member of a racing club ?
PapersPast will probably give you an indication of where (the area), he spent most time and a better idea of what associations / clubs you could approach.
~ Lu
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I have just spent an interesting couple of hours looking through Past Papers. Was supposed to be washing windows but this is much more interesting :D
Such a lot of information. Seems he lived in Napier, Thames, Whanganui, Australia and Auckland for the majority of the time. Interesting that there is mention of my grandfather Reg Wood as a young jockey :)
Thanks for all your help this has got me fired up to keep looking!
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Yes, forget washing windows ... and stay fired up ! Family history is far MORE important. :D
Glad you've had some luck.
~ Lu
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Purchase their death certificates and lots more information will be revealed.
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Hi Neroli.
I have got the info from C Littles invoice for Donald's funeral,I have taken photos of it.
Donald Taylor,horse trainer aged 85,died 5th June 1917 at 37 Arthur St Ponsonby,he was born at Barrhead Scotland and had been in NZ 75 years,he married Mary Jane Jarvis in Otahuhu at aged 20
Children alive at time of his death
Males. 55yrs 36 yrs
Females. 50yrs,48yrs,42yrs,40,yrs,38yrs and31yrs
Father Dougald Taylor
Mother Mary Johnson
His daughter Mrs Wilson lived at 47 Arthur St Ponsonby
If you PM me your email I will send the photos to you.
Cheers Janette
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Donald is buried at Purewa with
Surname TAYLOR
First Names Thomas
Age 42 Years
Gender Male
Date of Death 10 Nov 1907
Religion Not Listed
Serial No 3676
Date of Service and/or Interment 12 Nov 1907
Funeral Director C Little & Sons, P O Box 26-003, Epsom, AUCKLAND
What Buried? Body
Casket Size
Casket Depth
Cemetery Purewa Cemetery
Location Block E Row 47 Plot 074
and
Birth
1881/2236 Taylor William Alexander to Mary Jane and Donald
Surname TAYLOR
First Names William Alexander
Age 30 Years
Gender Male
Date of Death 27 Jun 1911
Religion Not Listed
Serial No 4575
Date of Service and/or Interment 29 Jun 1911
Funeral Director C Little & Sons, P O Box 26-003, Epsom, AUCKLAND
What Buried? Body
Casket Size
Casket Depth
Cemetery Purewa Cemetery
Location Block E Row 47 Plot 075
Cheers Janette
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A little more info about the Taylor family
Best wishes
Elli
William Alexander TAYLOR - died 27 June 1911 aged 30 years, buried Purewa Cemetery
The newspaper death notice states: he died at his residence, Railway St, Ellerslie; husband of Ellen; third son of Donald Taylor [NZ Herald, 28 June 1911, p1a]
Thomas TAYLOR - died 10 November 1907 in his 42nd year, buried Purewa Cemetery
The newspaper death notice states: he died at Auckland Hospital; husband of Annie; of Ellerslie; second son of Donald and Mary Taylor [NZ Herald 11 November 1907, p1a]
The funeral left his father's residence: Woodbine Ave, Ellerslie [NZ Herald 11 November 1907, p1a]
Another article states that he died as a result of a horse racing accident. He was riding 'Pohutu' in the Great Northern Guineas at the Auckland Racing Club's Spring Meeting. The horse was owned by his sister, Mrs George Wright. A native of Auckland, he left a widow and several children. [NZ Herald 11 November 1907, p4]
The 'Sporting Life' column produced an obituary which stated that he had started riding as a jockey in 1877. A public contribution list was established for his family. [NZ Herald 13 November 1907, p4]
ELECTORAL ROLLS:
1905-06 Parnell:
TAYLOR Donald (trainer)/Mary Jane (home duties) living at Green Lane
TAYLOR Thomas (trainer)/Annie (married) - living at Ellerslie;
WILSON Robert (compositor)/Jessie (home duties) living at Vincent Road
1919 Auckland West
WILSON Robert (compositor)/Jessie (married) living at 37 Arthur St
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Hi Elli
Thanks so much for your help. This will keep me busy :)
I can't believe all the fantastic help people on this site give, especially to the new researchers.
Best wishes
Neroli
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Hello Janette,
Thank you for your reply. I have been searching through Papers Past and I did see the two clips you sent about Thomas's death. The first link below is tp two more clips, posted a year later by Annie and contain two sweet poems. Also, thank you for the information on Florence's birth and the other children. Do you know if these four are all of Thomas and Annie's children?
You may already be aware of the book in the second link below. Howevr, if not, on page 428 you will see a picture of Thomas and a write up.
I see you live in NZ. Are you related to the Taylor family?
George
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=AS19081110.2.70&srpos=4&e=10-11-1908-10-11-1908--10--1----0thomas+taylor--
https://books.google.com/books?id=K0wDAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA427&lpg=PA427&dq=Jockey,+Thomas+Taylor,+New+Zealand&source=bl&ots=JKVB9c0dkN&sig=Cs9-AIm5duy3ApFiaWjB7KTvoQs&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiV28WX0cvKAhVG4SYKHcSrD5MQ6AEIMjAE#v=onepage&q=Jockey%2C%20Thomas%20Taylor%2C%20New%20Zealand&f=false
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Hi George and Welcome to RootsChat,
Here is Florence's birth
1897/11417 Taylor Florence May to Annie and Thomas
Other children
1896/19026 Taylor Thomas Walter Fabuliet /Annie /Thomas
1903/22570 Taylor William / Annie /Thomas
1906/8762 T aylor Hilda Lillian /Annie /Thomas
Cheers Janette
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You may have read this but just incase you haven't
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=NZH19071111.2.21&srpos=97&e=-11-1907--12-1907--100--1-byDA---0thomas+taylor--
Death notice
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=NZH19071111.2.2.2&srpos=95&e=-11-1907--12-1907--100--1-byDA---0thomas+taylor--
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&cl=search&d=NZH19071112.2.2.1&srpos=117&e=-11-1907--12-1907--100--101-byDA---0thomas+taylor--
Cheers Janette
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Surname TAYLOR
First Names Thomas
Age 42 Years
Gender Male
Date of Death 10 Nov 1907
Religion Not Listed
Serial No 3676
Date of Service and/or Interment 12 Nov 1907
Funeral Director C Little & Sons, P O Box 26-003, Epsom, AUCKLAND
What Buried? Body
Casket Size
Casket Depth
Cemetery Purewa Cemetery
Location Block E Row 47 Plot 74
The invoice records for C Little & Sons are held at the Auckland public library
Cheers Janette
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Janette,
Hello again. I am having a difficult time locating anything concrete on my great, great, great grandparents, Dougald and Mary Taylor. In your below post you mention to Neroli that you took photos of the invoices of Donald's funeral. If you still have those photos and wouldn't mind sending, I would love to have them. My email address is (*).
Thanks,
George
Hi Neroli.
I have got the info from C Littles invoice for Donald's funeral,I have taken photos of it.
Donald Taylor,horse trainer aged 85,died 5th June 1917 at 37 Arthur St Ponsonby,he was born at Barrhead Scotland and had been in NZ 75 years,he married Mary Jane Jarvis in Otahuhu at aged 20
Children alive at time of his death
Males. 55yrs 36 yrs
Females. 50yrs,48yrs,42yrs,40,yrs,38yrs and31yrs
Father Dougald Taylor
Mother Mary Johnson
His daughter Mrs Wilson lived at 47 Arthur St Ponsonby
If you PM me your email I will send the photos to you.
Cheers Janette
(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail removed in accordance with RootsChat policy, to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
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Hello Niroli,
It appears that we are distant relatives. My GG Grandparents are also Donald and Mary Jane Jarvis. My Great Grandfather is there son Thomas Taylor, the jockey, who died in 1907. I would love to correspond with you directly and share what we know about our lineage. My email address is (*)
I look for to hearing from you.
George
(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail removed in accordance with RootsChat policy,
to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
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Hi George,
The photos are long gone sorry they were taken almost 5 years ago.
Also it is against RC policies to post personal information like emails,we use the PM system for that
http://www.rootschat.com/help/pms.php
Cheers Janette
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Janette,
Thanks for you reply and I apologize for breaking the rules.
George
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George / Ellen Louisa Wright are my Mother's (Valerie), Mother's (Melba Louisa Wright) parents. They were married in 1886 in Ellen's father's (Donald Taylor) house in Ellerslie / Green Lane, and they had four daughters - Adelaide (b 1897), Hilda Gladys (b 1888), Irene (b 1895), and Melba Louisa (b 1902). Ellen Louisa Wright (Taylor) was Donald / Mary Jane's third child (2nd Daughter). Can anyone help me with the names of the Donald / Mary's other seven children, or any other info regarding the Taylors and the Wrights.
Thanks, Kevin
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Hello Kevin,
I wish I could send you my email address, so that we could correspond directly with each other. However, putting email addresses on RootsChat is not allowed. There is such a thing as private message on RootsChat, which might allow for the entry of email addresses. However, I would need to look into that further. I actually live in the United States and have been digging into my family's past for couple of years. I can't verify the below information, but it does sound reasonable. I recently joined Ancestry and stumbled across a family tree and found the following children listed.
Ellen Louisa Taylor 1847-1935
Dougald Taylor 1862-1941
Thomas Taylor 1865-1907 (My Grt Grandfather)
George Taylor 1867-
Mary Jane Taylor 1869-
Elizabeth (Ettie) Taylor 1871 -1905
Emily Taylor 1874 -
Jessie Taylor 1876-
Maud Taylor 1878
William Alexander Taylor 1881 -1891
Emily Taylor
If you can figure how to send me your email address, I would like to share a little website that I built with you that contains some more information about the Taylor family.
George
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Hi Kevin and welcome to RootsChat
According to BDM's
1862/5293 Taylor Dougald /Mary Jane /Donald
1865/25273 Taylor Thomas /Mary Jane /Donald
1867/12446 Taylor George /Mary Jane /Donald
1869/13503 Taylor Mary Jane /Mary Jane /Donald
1871/15977 Taylor Elizabeth /Mary Jane /Donald
1874/24799 Taylor Emily /Mary Jane /Donald
1876/16721 Taylor Jessie /Mary Jane /Donald
1878/17963 Taylor Maud /Mary Jane /Donald
1881/2236 Taylor William Alexander /Mary Jane /Donald
Cheers Janette
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Hello George
The PM system on RC is very useful in stopping spammers who would otherwise take great delight in using posted emails for their own gain here is the information on how to use it,Kevin will need to post a couple more times before he can use it (another safeguard)
http://www.rootschat.com/help/profile05.php
Cheers Janette
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Thanks Janette!!!
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Hello,
I don't know if this information has already been provided, but a little about Ellen Louisa.....
Marriage:
1886/292 Ellen Louisa Taylor George Wright
Newspaper notice....
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/NZH18860306.2.15?query=donald%20taylor
Minniehaha.
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Hello George, Janette and Minniehaha
That's perfect. Thank you very much.
Kindest regards
Kevin
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Hello George
I wonder if you have this record... 1871 UK Census for George Wright and his family... he married Ellen Louisa Taylor in 1886 in NZ. I am now trying to find out whether George travelled to NZ alone, or with his family. George doesn't appear in the UK 1881 census.
With this, my third posting, we should be able to PM each other.
Kindest regards
Kevin
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Hi Kevin,
This looks to be the family arriving in NZ in on board the Soukar in 1876,they left the UK 5th Oct. 1875 Alexander gave his occupation as a cooper
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6MCF-8D?mode=g&i=24&cc=1609792
Cheers Janette
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The family have some burials here
http://heritage.christchurchcitylibraries.com/Cemeteries/
Cheers Janette
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Thanks Janette
The immigration info is spot on... ties in with the 1871 census details of the family. Many thanks.
Not so sure about the deaths in Christchurch, because George (at least) moved to Auckland to become a well-known race horse trainer and marry the daughter of one of the best in the business. Having said that, I have no confirmed info re his death, but the NZBDM show a George of the right age dying in 1934 at the age of 72. Looks like I need to order (yet another) printout from the NZBDM. His wife Ellen Louisa is a bit of a mystery... there doesn't seems to be a NZBDM record that ties in with her birthdate (1867/8). The NZ valuation rolls don't help either, But I'll keep on searching!
Kindest regards
Kevin
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Could this be the obituary of your George Wright?
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/NZH19341122.2.162?query=george%20wright
Burial:
Record ID2369
SurnameWright
First names George
Age72 Years
Date of interment19/11/1934
Place of deathKawhia
Cemetery Kawhia
SectionKBLII
Plot number40
AreaBlock
Minniehaha.
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Thanks Minniehaha. Unfortunately, that's not the right George... he wasn't a saddler in Kawhia but a horse trainer in Auckland (a long way from Auckland), and his family is right either. But Hey... you just saved me from going down a blind alley.
I've since found a record for the death of a GW in Auckland in 1906 at age 43 (which is right), and buried at Purewa Cemetery, which is the same place that his father in law and family are buried. The Cem Rcd doesn't give any other info. I'll try to validate that through obituaries etc.
Thanks again
Kindest regards
Kevin
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Maybe Ellen Louisa remarried?
1911/7915 Ellen Louisa Wright George Powell Phillip Williams
Minniehaha.
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Looks like doesn't it. I'll follow up through the Valuation Rolls. Many thanks
Kindest regards
Kevin
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Yes that's her... Ellen Louisa Williams was buried in Purewa Cemetery 30th Oct 1953, aged 85 years. I guess she is in the family plot!?.... with her dad Donald.
Many many thanks.
Cheers
Kevin
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Hello Kevin,
Thank you for your lengthy PM,I'm sorry but I can't help you any further and as I said to George the 2011 photos are long gone.
Looking at Google maps there are property numbers up to at least 46 Arthur Street.
Rather than send queries by PM it is better to post here where a lot of people may be able to help ;D
Cheers Janette
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I am trying to find out how Donald Taylor, who died at 37 Arthur Street Freemans Bay, Auckland, at the age of 85 in 1917, and who is buried in Purewa, arrived in New Zealand.
Apparently C.Little and Sons notes associated with his death record (now at the Auckland Public Library), say that he had been in NZ for 75 years, which would place him arriving NZ in 1842; I am chasing that record through the Auckland Public Library. There is a Donald Taylor working / living in Field Lane (near widow Mary Taylor living in Chancery Street) in the 1845 Police Census. However, this conflicts with the arrival of a "D. Taylor" on the John Wesley in 1850.
His parents may be Dugald (a calico dyer) and Mary Taylor who were onboard the Duchess of Argyll in 1842 with four children: Thomas(10), James (5) and Dougald and Catherine, the latter two died during the voyage. I can't find any record (in NZ or the Scotland 1841 Census) for Thomas Taylor born 1832.
Donald married Mary Jane Jarvis in 1859 in Otahuhu... I have the marriage doc.
None of the sources like passenger lists 1839 - 1841, Police Census 1845, cemetery records, papers past and present etc have the info... or at least I haven't found it.
Any advice / sourced info etc gratefully received
Kevin Morris
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Just when you think you have the tree all sewn up....
Mary Jane Jarvis, the wife of Donald Taylor, I thought had travelled to NZ with her family Samuel and Mary Jarvis in 1852 on the Berwick Castle, and lived at Otahuhu - where she married Donald.
HOWEVER, it now transpires from the BC records that Samuel and Mary did not have a child named Mary Jane, and that although MJJ's marriage certificate says that she married in Otahuhu at the home of her widowed mother Mary, her Death Certificate says that her mother's name was Caroline.
Her obituary says that she was born in Woolwich to an English Army Officer. I found such a family living in Woolwich in 1841 (UK Census) - same name and occupation, but with no Mary Jane. Birth and Baptism records show a family with the same parent names (Samuel and Mary Jarvis) had a daughter named Mary Jane in December 1841. They didn't feature in subsequent Censuses.
So my question is, does anyone have records that show Samuel and Mary (Caroline) Jarvis with a daughter Elizabeth b1837, Samuel b 1839, and Mary Jane b 1841, who was an army officer and who travelled from Woolwich to Auckland 1842 - 1859.
Here's hoping
Many thanks
Kevin