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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Surrey => Topic started by: chocky on Tuesday 06 September 11 02:08 BST (UK)
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Hello I am trying to fill in gaps in my house's history.Can anyone tell me more about the inhabitants between 1915 and 1947(then I will have a complete history from 1876 till present) I believe it was a school for children of parents living abroad in the 1920's.I have read it was a nudist colony!! :o and also that for a short time canadian troops were billeted here as Caterham barracks were just down the road. Its getting quite exciting as I have the original 1876 deeds know a little about the man who built it ' George Sibley' and know somewhere out there is a dolls house which is a tiny replica. Any help will be greatly appreciated. :)
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Re functioning as a school, The Times advertised in the early '20s as follows
SMALL SCHOOL in SURREY HILLS for GIRLS, also boys under 10 years, joyous country home life, health first care, five acres tennis, swimming &c, farm produce, kitchen garden. Moderate inclusive fees. Highest references. Holiday boarders received - The Mount, Whitehill, Caterham.
Read George Sibley's Obituary (Oct 28, 1891) in The Times - quite a character.
regards
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Chocky,
Apologies - forgot to say a very warm welcome to Rootschat
regards
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Thankyou so much Hanes I never expected to hear back so quickly.Still trying to understand how to use this site as I am a novice.How would I find a copy of this advert? Is there a date on the Times.Also do you have any suggestions where I would look to find when the school started and closed and who the headteacher was? Now going to search for the obituary of George Sibley. I have been told that a Miss Pearson lived at the Mound in 1926( local telephone directory I believe) so I need to check her out also. Once again thankyou for your help.
Best Wishes
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Is this your chap?
Dictionary of National Biography, 1885-1900, Volume 52
Sibley, George
by Edward Irving Carlyle Sibly, Ebenezer→
SIBLEY, GEORGE (1824–1891), civil engineer, born on 12 Aug. 1824, was son of Robert Sibley, one of the first members of the Institution of Civil Engineers. From 1831 to 1838 he received his education at University College school, London. After serving an apprenticeship with his father in London, he obtained employment in 1845 as assistant engineer on the Bristol and Exeter railway under Isambard Kingdom Brunel [q. v.], and afterwards under Charles Hutton Gregory. In 1851, through James Meadows Rendel [q. v.], he received the appointment of assistant engineer on the East India railway, and was placed in charge of the Chandernagore district. His promotion was rapid. In August 1853 he was placed in charge of the Beerbhoom district as resident engineer, and in this position designed the two largest brick arch-bridges in India, those over the Adjai and More. In December of the same year he was made a district engineer. About 1857 he was appointed deputy chief engineer under Turnbull, and in 1859 chief engineer of the North-West Provinces division. On the death of Samuel Power he became, in April 1868, chief engineer of the whole line and a member of the board of agency. During his service in the North-West Sibley completed the Allahabad Jumna bridge, then the largest railway bridge in the world, constructed the Delhi Jumna bridge, and designed all the works at Delhi connected with the railway.
In 1869 he was involved in a controversy with the Indian government, which had issued a notification implying that the civil engineers received commissions from others than their employers. The accusation does not appear to have been justifiable, and Sibley, with the other engineers, addressed a strong remonstrance to the government.
In January 1875 Sibley left India on furlough, and shortly after retired. In consideration of his services he was made a companion of the order of the Indian Empire. He resided in England in a house which he built on the summit of Whitehill, Caterham, devoting himself to literary and scientific pursuits. He died of heart disease on 25 Oct. 1891, leaving a considerable legacy for the purpose of founding engineering scholarships and encouraging native students at the university of Calcutta. Like his father, Sibley was a member of the Institution of Civil Engineers.
A brother, Septimus Sibley (1831–1893), physician, was for many years resident surgeon of Middlesex College Hospital, and was the first general practitioner elected to the council of the Royal College of Surgeons. Hee published ‘A History and Description of the Cholera Epidemic in London in 1854,’ besides papers in ‘Medico-Chirurgical Transactions’ (British Medical Journal, 25 Mar. 1893).
[Proc. Instit. Civil Engineers, 1891–2, pt. ii.; Times, 28 Oct. 1891.]
E. I. C.
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Pastmagic thankyou. This is indeed my man as I have deeds with his name on it.This is fantastic.I knew he had been in India and old photos of the house show it to look very much in the indian style of architecture with 13 foot high arched ceilings and 2 foot thick walls.Do you think there may be photographs out there somewhere of him? He was one of 3 brothers who lived in Caterham at the time but I only ever see photographs of his brothers. Are there any avenues I could try to find out who the architect for this house would have been.Its one of the first concrete house built in England in 1876. So many thanks to you
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His Times Obituary describes his father as "an architect and civil engineer" and George went to work for him on leaving school. The house might be an example of "self build"?
Have sent you a Private message
regards
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Spot on there - looks like he did build it himself! No mention of an Artchitect, so probably his own design.
http://www.icevirtuallibrary.com/docserver/fulltext/imotp.1892.20212.pdf?expires=1315333219&id=id&accname=guest&checksum=8DC03A78672AEA12E89E1AF0865B5789
See latter part of this long obit. Might be worth contacting ICE to see if they have more about the building, or a photo.
Institution of Civil Engineers - ICE Home
www.ice.org.uk
See: http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/26226/pages/6416
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thankyou pastmagic.Looks like a busy day tomorrow tracking George down.
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Thanks for the link Pastmagic. The mention of his "wintering abroad" might explain why I am unable to find him on the the '81 and 91 Census.
Agreat site also
regards
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Yes, The ICE on line library has good digital images!
To find out about the period where you have just vague info, you possibly would benifit by going local - maybe a letter to the editor of the local paper- there are probably people around whose family worked in the house.
Also contact the Parish Council etc. The Barracks historian re the Canadians, and so forth Curiously, there seems to be nobody around in the usual places doing a family tree of George and his family. He is also not in evidence in the National Archive.
George does seem an interesting character - maybe you could post a pic or two of the house itself, it might tweak a memory here - some of his work in India is on line, it is quite chunky and practical.
Very basic stuff for other people looking at house history in Surrey
http://www.surreycc.gov.uk/sccwebsite/sccwspages.nsf/LookupWebPagesByTITLE_RTF/How+to+trace+the+history+of+your+house?
They seem to be quite interested in the topic - not usually a high priority, as I know from working in architectural history, so maybe the archivist there might help if you emailed them what you have already?
If you have done all this already, then there are other routes,
Hope you have a lot of fun in search of George!
PM
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I think you will find the naturist colony referred to is slightly further north at The White House, the Mount, Whyteleafe. It is still there and was mentioned in the local paper recently because someone wants to build a tower block which will overlook them.
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Hi Scrabble ,had a look at the news article.You could well be right as this may have been a handed down story which has got itself embedded in articles and local history catalogues. I will keep an open mind when searching for my missing years.For everyone who has helped me so far the really good news is I have a photo of George Sibley now and will be reuniting him with his house by way of a framed photograph taking pride of place in the hall.I would post a photo but I cant understand just yet how to do this as my jpeg is too big? Chocky :)
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Hi Chocky - I’m not sure why I woke up this morning struggling to remember whether my childhood home was built by Sociable, Solitary or Soldier Sibley, but Google answered the question (it was Solitary Sibley) and led me to your post. I lived at The Mound from 1951 to 1978, and have quite a lot of information and documentation about its history, including photographs taken when it was a school. Do you know the story of the German spy who lived there during World War I and the secret underground armoury in the grounds? Sadly, the scale model of The Mound built by my father, a structural and civil engineer, like George Sibley, is no more. I was unable to find anyone prepared to take it when my parents’ last home was sold, so it went in a skip. If I can work out how private messaging works on this site, we can exchange email addresses, if you’re interested. Best wishes Gordon Briggs.
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To Scrabble’s comment about the possibility that the naturist colony was in Whyteleafe rather than War Coppice Road, I can confirm that the story has been passed down over the years, with no original documentary evidence that I’m aware of. I don’t know when the Whyteleafe colony was established, but the War Coppice Road story was in circulation in 1950.
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The Mound has also previously been known as Triton and as Cardinal’s Cap.
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Briggo how tragic that the model ended up on a tip
When
a museum could have taken it
Or a child to play with
What a waste .
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Hi Gordon(Briggo),what an unexpected email I recieved yesterday telling me you had posted on rootschat. I was very excited. We haved lived here since December 1993 and sporadically I try to piece together the history of the house,who lived here and of course George Sibley himself. This will spur me on to get out all my information I have got so far. I was sad to hear about the scale model your father built.I saw it once when the Bourne Society came around to give a talk and the model was on display.Over the years I have mentioned it to my husband quite regularly saying I would have wished it could be united with its larger model. I did take some photographs of it at the time though.You might know the house itself was divided into 3 dwelling places by Dick Johnson sometime in the mid eighties and we live in the middle bit. Luckily most of the inside was left intact with just false walls and ceilings being put up.Over the years I have removed most of the false ceilings to reveal the lovely barrel vaulted ceilings. I know about the German gentleman who lived here but was unaware he was a spy!maybe more rumour? Never heard about the secret underground armoury though. I have one picture postcard of the house when it was a school which I came across on ebay of all places!. I would very much like to see the documentation of the houses history and particularly the photographs you have and will try to work out how to private message you with my email address. Also when we are past this pandemic if you want ,please come on over to have a walk down memory lane. Talk soon Carol.
PS if anyone has any information on the house between 1921 and 1947 that would be great.
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Further to the discussion about whether The Mound was a naturist colony in the 1930’s. When my father purchased The Mound in 1950, there was an elderly sitting tenant living in the stable block. Miss Thick had lived in the property for more than 20 years. According to my father’s notes, she did not approve of The Mound’s period as a nudist colony.
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Hi Briggo I shall add that to my information about the Mound, I sent you my email address did you get that or shall I try again?
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Hello from Cologne! I am sitting in my kitchen with a pile of old photos my father gave me a few days ago. Moreover, the box contains postcards, written to my granmother, who lived and worked in „The Maund“ from 1912 on. I have no idea, when she left. One postcard is written to my granny c/o Mrs. Sonksen, probably her employer... I have a photo of my grandma in the garden of the Maund as a housemate. I am new here, as I found your inquiry online doing some research. Don‘t know yet how to upload pics... Would be pleased to hear back from you... Best, Miss Vee
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Hi, I stumbled on this website while trying to find out exactly where my mother lived as a baby/toddler. She knows it was with her parents and grandparents in Caterham. This was during the late 1930s (possibly 40s - I do not know exactly when the family vacated the house, perhaps during the wartime evacuation of children).
She will shortly be returning from abroad to live in sheltered accommodation nearby and would love to retrace her roots...she happened to give me her birth certificate for safe keeping and I saw that her birth was registered to this address: "The Mount, Whitehill, Caterham, U.D." I have been googling - Google maps does not mention "The Mount" as being on "Whitehill, Caterham". Then I found you all talking about what appears as though it might be her former home.
Is this the same house you are all talking about here? In which case I might have some interesting info on the "missing years" as there is a link in her family with civil engineering and the building of the Indian railways, also mentioned in a previous reply about an even earlier inhabitant.
I would be so grateful for any clues as to whether this is my mother's babyhood home.
Thank you all :)