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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Nairnshire => Topic started by: HughC on Sunday 27 November 11 17:38 GMT (UK)
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Does anyone know whether Elizabeth Rose is still alive?
If not, who is the current Chief of Clan Rose?
I do know that she made over Kilravock to a religious order.
Possibly a castle is more a liability than an asset these days,
but I still find it sad that the laird has to live in the gate lodge
or gardener's cottage.
Not even quite sure where Kilravock is:
should I be posting this on the Inverness forum?
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As far as I know she is in a care home.
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kilravock castle is situated between the village of croy and clephanton. I do beleive baroness rose is in a nursing home in nairn. I worked in the castle for 7 years under various managers and it was a lovely place to work, hope this helps you.
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Thanks, Theresaw.
I appreciate that you joined RootsChat specially to send me that reply.
Hope you get something out of it yourself!
____ Hugh
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Hi Hugh,
I have been trying to find out the same thing for while now.
It is true that she gifted ‘Kilravock’ to a Christian charity, and it is now being run as a Bed and Breakfast, although the guests are annexed, and access to the main Castle is limited. I had heard it suggested, that her nephew DAVID HUGH HERIOT BAIRD, had added his mother’s surname of ROSE to his and is (or will become) the new Chief of the Clan.
If you wish to find more on ‘The Rose Clan’ click the world icon below left on this reply. The Title of Chief, has been handed down in an unbroken line, since Hugh, 1st of Kilravock in 1250, until now. This is unique in Scottish history.
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Thanks, heedrapper.
I'd also heard that David Baird was the heir designate, and had changed his name, but wasn't sure whether Elizabeth had had second thoughts, and whether he inherits anything at all (except perhaps the title).
My connection is via Elizabeth's mother, maiden name Guillemard.
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I saw that in your 'interests'. There are lots of Guillemards in my Kilravock tree.
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We visited Kilvarock Castle in 2008. At that time Anna Elizabeth Guillemard was still alive but in a care home in Nairns, as stated above. She since died (in 2010). I have not been able to confirm who would become the 26th Baron of Kilravock, but David Hugh Heriot Baird Rose (*1946) looks like the next in line, accepting that the title can pass on via female heirs (as it clearly does). I believe it was Elizabeth Rose (1747-1815) who fought a prolonged legal battle to be awarded the title as 19th Baroness, the first lady in the line of Kilravock.
Can anyone confirm a) the rules for passing on the baron title in the Rose of Kilvarock line and b) whether David Hugh's accepted the title?
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Hi mjbecker,
I’m sad to hear of the death of Anna Elizabeth. And thank you for joining rootschat to tells us.
I’m sure you are also correct about David Baird (Rose)
This is taken from my rootwebs page......
http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=heedrapper&id=I3473
Heir-line versus Heir-male.
An important question of succession now arose. There was no doubt that issue of the last Baron having failed, the nearest male heir of line was Dr Rose of Broadley, whilst it was equally clear that Mrs Elizabeth was the nearest heir whatsoever, and the question the courts had to decide was whether it was Dr Rose's first born son James by Margaret Russell or his second wife Elizabeth Rose and her son who were entitled to the estates. Litigation was at once entered upon. It was the great 'causa celebre' of the time. The Rev. James Rose of Oakham, near Ripley, in Surrey, as uncle and tutor to the children of the first marriage, took up their cause, and Mr Francis Russell, of Westfield, Advocate, as tutor dative, pursued it still more actively. Poor Mrs Elizabeth records that she entered on the contest to maintain her rights of succession, "without friends or means against a powerful opposition." She was a brave woman, and was animated and sustained all through the prolonged litigation by the feeling that she was seeking to preserve the ancient heritage to the rightful heir. In 1783 the Court of Session decided practically in her favour, to the great joy of the district. When the tidings of the decision arrived, there were bonfires, dancing, and general rejoicing at Nairn and Kilravock. The case was appealed to the House of Lords, but four years later the decision in her favour was confirmed. The old lands and barony of Kilravock became hers, but Geddes, which stood on a different footing, fell to James Rose, as nearest heir male. It turned out that in creating a faggot vote on Kilravock Barony for his brother Lewis, the old Laird, her father, had whether intentional or not is not clear made the property to revert on his brother's death to himself, "or his nearest heirs whatsoever in fee." The fortunate clause enabled Mrs Elizabeth, with her son and her mother, to return to the home of her forefathers, where for the remainder of her life she ruled and reigned, not only as mistress of Kilravock, but as Queen of Nairnshire.
Bill Rose
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Thanks, mjbecker, for telling us of Elizabeth's death. Do you happen to have a more precise date? She was my mother's 2nd cousin.
I'm afraid I'm not in touch with David or his brothers (two of whom stayed on in Australia when their parents returned to the UK circa 1983).
____ Hugh
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Anna Elizabeth is alive and well and celebrated her 88th birthday just a few weeks ago. I obtained that information from Kilravock Castle just five minutes ago.
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Thank you, Imber.
Age is right, and if "a few weeks" means a fortnight then birthday too.
Perhaps mjbecker will now tell us the source for the news of her death.
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Baroness Elizabeth Rose, 25th of Kilravock, passed away in December 2012.
Her maternal nephew, David Rose was confirmed by the Lord Lyon in June 2013, as The Chief of Clan Rose and the 26th Baron of Kilravock.
Chief David will be visiting California in October 11 - 13 at the Ventura Seaside Highland Games, and also Stone Mountain Highland Games in Georgia October 18 - 20th.
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Im not sure whom i should be talking to but i am a descendant of the Rose's of kilravock.
If somebody could contact me in regards to this i may be able to give information towards the family tree.
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After the Battle of Culloden in 1746 it seems that a lot of the Scots lost their properties and positions and some emigrated to Jamaica, West Indies - Does anyone have information on the Roses who went to Jamaica?
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Would this book help?:
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3318574-a-genealogical-deduction-of-the-family-of-rose-of-kilravock
Imber
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You can download a pdf version from here
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ger (http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ger)
Edward
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Hi
I have a fascination for the Rose clan.. I've often wondered if I was part of the clan. My father left when I was very little and my mother would drop hints but never talk about my other family. My name is Elizabeth Ann Rose.
In1984 my biological father Christopher Leslie Rose wanted to meet me but I was pressured not to.
I still haven't met him to this day...
After all this time why was it so difficult to find the next direct successor to kilrarock Castle?
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I'm trying to find out if anyone connected with the late Anna Elizabeth Rose. who died in 2012 in Nairn, have any old photographs of her ancestors.
My late husbands aunt worked for Miss Rose and stayed in one of the cottages on the castle grounds.
When her house was cleared after she died, we found an old album with sepia photographs and I think it may belong to the Rose family.
If anyone can provide photos I can compare them and gladly hand over the album to it's rightful owner
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I have a Rose family bible.
Contact me
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I understand that the heir is her nephew David Rose (né Baird) of Nairnside Farm, Croy.
I think his brother John Timothy ('Tim') Baird lives at Kilravock, but probably not in the castle which Elizabeth gave to some religious community.