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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Topic started by: elmfield on Friday 20 January 12 12:34 GMT (UK)

Title: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Friday 20 January 12 12:34 GMT (UK)
I am trying to find out anything about my G/grandma who was also known as..Long and Alexander. She was a Mohawk and married Angus St.Pierre. Thank you in anticipation.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Friday 20 January 12 15:24 GMT (UK)
births & marriages of some children for Angus (Exedia) St. Pierre and Mary Ann Long ...seems odd that she would switch to Alexander after using Long on earlier docs... http://www.rootschat.com/links/0jw0/
Do you have them on census and if so, which ones and where?  Is she marked as full Mohawk on census or documents, or is this from oral history?

If we are looking for her Mohawk name it may be Noontak tek hah Kwa  ( Strawberry). Where did the story of her adoption come from??  We always keep an open mind regarding oral history, but also remember that it can sometimes get distorted or embellished, or slip forward or back a generation in the passing of the information.... J.J.

I will be modifying each answer of mine, as will elmfield, to remove some banter and try to bare bones to thread related subjects.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Friday 20 January 12 16:03 GMT (UK)
from his death in Frontenac I see Peter/Pierre St Pierr & Marie Lacombe as his parents, and he was born C 1857 
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JK69-J87

1891 census as Stperce both of them say parents born Quebec. They in Ontario. Says C church.
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/census-1891/001081-119.02-e.php?person_id_nbr=1021838


Right above them, also in Hinchinbrooke Addington are Stewart Alexander, wife Margaret and Louise J. age 4, born to mother late in life and don't see any birth for her?
If the same couple ( wife here is Mary) they are the only 2 in household so was she thought to have been married young, to a Long?
http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/Census/household_record.asp?HOUSEHOLD_CODE=1881CN_588608

Some approx dates from census
Angus c.1858, Mary A c.1866, Mary E  c.1886,  Wm J  c.1888, Napolien  c.1889, Francis E c.1891
also adding:Harriett Jane c.1894,  Benjamin Albert 1898, Fred c.1902, Edward Rankin c. 1906, Fred St Pierre,    
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Friday 20 January 12 17:50 GMT (UK)
Thanks for the posts..The family you have identified from the 1891 census is definitely my family. I  have no copy of the wedding certificate and all we have is the oral tradition. My grandfather and his siblings always held that their mother was born a  Mohawk and had been orphaned in a fire...she had then been adopted by the Longs or Alexanders who lived at Golden Lake. I am living in the UK so my family investigations are usually limited to my annual visits.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Friday 20 January 12 18:00 GMT (UK)
1911 I found them as Sampier Lanark North, Lavant Township ...http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census11/SplitView.jsp?id=96032 but no other information for them. 12 visible births...adding Joseph, John & Arthur to above list...and a grandchild Beatrice.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Friday 20 January 12 18:02 GMT (UK)
Thanks...that is my family...I have a copy of the 1901 census.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Friday 20 January 12 19:27 GMT (UK)
I just found this query by a rellie ..I had wondered if Mary/Margaret was a Long?  Marriage not found yet...Although it seems unusual that she wasn't with them in 1881 as she was only 15 or so.
http://genforum.genealogy.com/stpierre/messages/293.html
I also see where the surname Strawberrymay have came from, Wm.J. /Amanda Bridget   Payea...where is THAT marriage in 1913?  http://www.payea.net/payearegister.htm
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Friday 20 January 12 20:10 GMT (UK)
Some of the marriages say Alexander, so am wondering if she found out her true name later in life....Wouldn't she have been using Strawberry?

Edward Rancon StPierre & Sophia Dorothy Bartrow marriage says Long but death Alexander
Fred St Pierre & Alice Hannah - Mary's surname is Long
Mary St.Pierre & James McGonegal  she gave no surname
Harriett as Sampier & Joseph Bedour Mary's surname is Alexander
John Henry St Pierre & Eliza Gertie Kirkham - Mary's surname is Alexander
Edward Rankin St Pierre & Sophia Dorothy Bartrow  - Mary's surname is Alexander
Francis Xavier Stewart St Pierre & Lillie May Hannah - Mary's surname is Alexander
Arthur Cecil St Pierre & Martha May McCoy  - Mary's surname is Alexander

I wonder if the images will have witnesses that will give us clues
 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Saturday 21 January 12 12:48 GMT (UK)
Thanks for all the trouble you are going to. In fact I am a cousin of the John Watson who placed the link and I know Danny Payea( who is also in the UK) from whom the Payea family information is derived....I added some items for him. I think I need to start and try to find some marriage details. Thanks again!
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Sunday 22 January 12 00:18 GMT (UK)
I looked in  Lavant from the info on William and easily found them as Sampere 1901 Lavant Township, Lanark  http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census/View.jsp?id=69504
 
is probably too early to look for newspapers of the day, but news of that fire would help the story along somewhat. Meantime we need proof as to why there were 2 surnames allotted to her afterwards...
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Sunday 22 January 12 00:40 GMT (UK)
This is just too interesting not to have a look at it and see if these people exist otherwise...
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FMJZ-QCV
MARRIAGE 23 Dec 1882
John Sampier  23 Dec 1882   Lanark, Lanark, Ontario  Age: 21 c.1861  / Peter Sampier & Ermeau ( or Ermean)
to Mary Anne Alexander  Age: 17 c.1865 / Frank Stewart Alexander & Margaret P Alexander
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Sunday 22 January 12 12:38 GMT (UK)
Thanks for your suggestions....I have a large, extended, family in Canada but, I have to admit that having lived over here since I was 5  there are some that I don't know.

Believe it , or not, my family in Canada  have all spent time trying to find out more about Mary Strawberry....and that goes for one of them who, in a distinguished academic career, was still unable to find out any more...and he dedicated much time to the search. I have personally researched several Canadian archives for a newspaper item which might have recorded a fire in which Mary's parents died and have been in touch with Church records in both Kingston and TO.

I shall be in Canada later this year ( Hastings County) and shall therefore be grateful for your guidance on where I should look further. :-\
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Sunday 22 January 12 14:12 GMT (UK)

Welcome to rootschat as I hadn't seen that you were new. 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Sunday 22 January 12 18:54 GMT (UK)


 The name Strawberry was related to me by my father...who is now a 90+ year old and remembers his Grandmother, Mary Strawberry; by his surviving brothers and by my cousins...so there would seem to be some evidence of her being known...or maybe wanting to be known, as Strawberry.....as an earlier appeal by John Watson would indicate

PS. I am proud of my descent from Mary Strawberry and of the hard life ,family tradition would have me believe, she lived.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Sunday 22 January 12 22:05 GMT (UK)
The 1911 census said "sected" rather than bothering to fill in pertinent information. 
I couldn't see her as a census stray 1871, maybe someone can find her in a household
 ( Did see Stewart & Margaret as Alxander on FHS site, in Oso 1871, but couldn't find more Alexander in Oso, can't see household) 

This may be Angus as Sampier ...  https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/M473-F5R 
Still have found neither in 1881 under any of the names used I even tried only a few letters with the forename Angus. He might have been missed but both missing?

The name Strawberry can be found in several other Provinces, but hard to say if related or not.
http://www.canada411.ca/search/?stype=si&what=strawberry&where=&Search.x=24&Search.y=14
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Monday 23 January 12 14:52 GMT (UK)
Not the right couple That marriage I found might be this couple...still I am posting what I find because it is hard to find under all these different spellings and some may still offer clues...and at the very least show where not to go, as even though this may all have been found before, we do not have any of this information in front of us.
 http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census/ViewFrame.jsp?id=94759&highlight=40
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Monday 23 January 12 15:07 GMT (UK)
Seeing the image may have helped to solve another mystery as to whose birth I had found in Oso Frontenac 1893, it was perhaps for Harriot as Mary St Pear, parents down as August St Pear & Mary Alexander ...so may have been following the Catholic first name as Mary but perhaps saved the name Harriot for baptism, or hadn't decided yet.    https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/VNGZ-QHN
I could not find an August, but the date fits. Of course I may be wrong
 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Monday 23 January 12 15:40 GMT (UK)
For others searching...I am going crazy with information I find that might be Angus...I cannot find evidence of any other Angus St.Pierre can anyone else?
Here is a death for a Mary Sampris July 4 1884 Lavant, Ontario / Age19 c.1865 /spouse Angus Sampris
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JDB6-H2V
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
and have now found another marriage, his father Peter...and look, SHE is a berry  ( The raspberry ) I don't have access to see what year this was, nor have we investigated his family, so it could be a nephew named after him? Angus Sampieree and Mary Laframboise....

**marriage & death details for above are entered on reply Reply #34 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Monday 23 January 12 16:24 GMT (UK)
Thanks....I  am also getting more than a little confused.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Monday 23 January 12 16:26 GMT (UK)
 *
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Monday 23 January 12 16:32 GMT (UK)

 :)
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Monday 23 January 12 16:56 GMT (UK)
Thank you. At the moment I am overburdened with information...all of which I find interesting and already I can see a few areas which have added to my knowledge but, frankly,  I haven't yet had time to absorb it all...Put it down to my "senior moments". I am truly grateful for all your efforts.

 As I see it Mary could have been adopted by the Alexanders ( who were living next door  according to the 1891 census)  but she had been married to a John Sampier (St.Pierre) in 1882....Could he have been the NWMP of family tradition....If so, and he had gone out west leaving her with his brother Angus,could they have re-married? As Catho;ics this would have been impossible....did she therefore continue to use her adopted name of Alexander? Where does Long come from..?

I am excited about your tracing a Mary Leframboise.....but I think the Mary Sampris is not connected since she died a little too early!Please bear with me and let's not lose our patience.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Monday 23 January 12 17:08 GMT (UK)
 Imagine how I feel, this is all not my family and my head is spinning.  I do not have access to most of those marriages. The actual images have more information. 
 Mary Alexander may have been another Alexander...or another Marie, we have in the past found several in one family ( French Catholic especially) who use the first birth name Marie rather than the given names...making them difficult to sort out in documents

I have found evidence of a Fraise family in Ontario...as the other marriage reminded me to look for French Strawberry as her parents may have come from Quebec.

However, the Strawberry connection may have been from a previous generation...so all needs to be found from the censuses and marriages to see what the Alexander Long connection is before hanging any hats on the Strawberry name for this generation. 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Monday 23 January 12 17:14 GMT (UK)
The only documentary, primary evidence I have are the census for 1891 and 1901. I am sorry I should have made this clear before you posted them. I have no BMD's....I have taken on the search for Mary from my Canadian cousins who, apparently, didn't get anywhere beyond tradition.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Monday 23 January 12 17:16 GMT (UK)
I do have a photo of Mary. I will scan it!
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Monday 23 January 12 17:39 GMT (UK)
I would love to see a photo of her... :)

adding: as I'd said I will post anything I find which slightly relates to the search. I did find a Long child who is "indigenous" living with another family in 1881 Jane Long born 1869 ( not anywhere near the right area, tho, living with the widow Sarah Burning & family) 
 http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/Census/household_record.asp?HOUSEHOLD_CODE=1881CN_771911
Sometimes when we follow some of these webs it can help find the spider....
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Tuesday 24 January 12 11:26 GMT (UK)
 I have now had a chance to compare what I have been told by family and what I know from the census with what you have supplied. I shall ask my Dad, when I speak with him today, about a few queries the information you have supplied raises...to see if he remembers  anything.

 These queries , which are not directly related to the search for Mary,  concern Angus' siblings. I have them as a James, a Frank,  an Abraham and a Phillipa...These names have been "handed down", orally. I am pretty sure the record of a marriage between John St P and Mary Anne Alexander on 23/12 1882 are "family"....Lanark is a small place and the dates fit....but, I wonder, was John another brother or was it Angus' other name( my own father has 3 names and has been known by 2 of them!)

 I think the 1871 census detailing Angus Sampier might be family...his age would be about right....and  with the family coming from Quebec they could well have settled in Crosby.

I think the St P's in the 1901 census for Nipissing are not  my St P's..since we know they were living elsewhere!

Thanks once again....just off to take a couple of Tylenol! :)



Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Tuesday 24 January 12 14:36 GMT (UK)
Tylenol worked!....Just had a look at the actual census for 1871 at North Crosby, South Leeds....as per the entry for Angus Sampier. The rest of the family include his father Peter 60 b Quebec, his mother, Almena? b Quebec and the following children;  Joseph, Francois,Andrew,Angus,James,John,Mary and two young girls whose surname looks like Burgena...  Mary aged eight and a girl whose name I can't make out... Maggie?(4)

Intriguing! I wonder, is this my family and who are the two girls?
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Tuesday 24 January 12 15:58 GMT (UK)
You hadn't said you were missing Angus's ancestry as well. Be sure to post anything else you find so as not to duplicate resources...
I am not pleased with the FHS census entry having everyone out on their own. Only 3 are listed with Peter...they have Maggie's last name as Burgena. Here is their piecemeal version of the 1871.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/records/index#count=20&query=%2Bsurname%3ASampier~%20%2Bresidence_place%3Aontario~&collection_id=1551612
I  also saw a fellow call himself Peter St. Pierre Junior, so there may be another brother for Angus.

Note a Mary with Angline in Addington at page bottom ...so may be connected...brother of Peter, Angus's father?

note:will cross out the 1901 census John & Mary
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Tuesday 24 January 12 16:13 GMT (UK)
I haven't yet searched for details of the marriages you mentioned (20th Jan) but it does seem strange that Mary should have changed her maiden name. I suppose it's possible that, as you suggest, she found, later in life, her real maiden name. It's all very, very confusing.

As for Angus ancestry,  as I have already said, up until now all I had were my cousins notes, copies of the relevant sections of the 1891 and 1901 census' and family recollection....Not really much to go by, especially as memories at times seem to change!

I should have mentioned that my search for the 1871 census was through collections canada:


www.collectionscanada.gc.ca databases/census-1871/001101-119.02-e.php?person_id_nbv=2814763&interv

I am sorry but my PC skills are such that I do not know how to post a copy of the document>

Sorry!

Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Tuesday 24 January 12 16:31 GMT (UK)
The marriage detail should be posted soon... I did not know there were more census images and databases added on the site!!! Here is the image for the St. Pierre family as Sampier transcribed earlier by Elmfield
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/census-1871/001101-119.02-e.php?person_id_nbr=2814763&interval=&i=jpg
To add to the site you can either use their pdf url or shorten the longer url from the jpg reference as I did above so it fits on page. Or to use the long ur, go down to shrink a link at the bottom of the thread page and then paste, click and copy the new link to paste into the thread ( long links distort the page)

I am lost as to the children Maggie Burgena c.1867 and Mary Burgena c.1863 in household
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Tuesday 24 January 12 17:12 GMT (UK)
Now I am wondering if the Stewart & Margaret beside them in 1891 were a red herring? Just as in 1881, nobody else in household in 1871?? If she was in this household then it must have been between censuses.
www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/census-1871/001101-119.02-e.php?person_id_nbr=1099714&interval=46&i=jpg
But then there are no other Stewart, and Angus and Mary did call a child Frances Xavior Stewart so could have been after him ( Frank Stewart Alexander a.k.a. Stewart?)
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Wednesday 25 January 12 03:24 GMT (UK)
Chomping at the bit so poked about and found them on the fhs version of 1861 census as St Peir, the father is called Peterson here, and seems to have wife Eliza, many years his junior http://www.rootschat.com/links/0jyc/

Ontario Census 1861 North Crosby,​ Leeds,​ Ontario,​ Canada

Peterson St Peir 1806   L C ( Lower Canada = Quebec)
Eliza St Peir 1824  L C
Joseph St Peir 1842 U C ( Upper Canada = Ontario)
Xave St Peir  1848 U C
Henry St Peir 1853 U C
Angus St Peir 1855 U C
James St Peir 1857 U C
Eliza St Peir 1846 U C
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: polarbear on Wednesday 25 January 12 04:03 GMT (UK)
Hello elmfield and welcome to RootsChat  :).

My goodness, my head is spinning in both directions!

This is pure conjecture at this point but food for thought?

A bit of a time line:

*Angus marries Mary Lamframboise 01 Dec 1882.
*Mary Sampier (husband Angus) apparently dies in 1884. Above her last name is written 'Rasberry' ('Straw'berry connection, possibly?)
*1st child named in a census with Angus b. 1886. Doesn't mean an ealier child or two weren't lost, of course.
*Angus' apparent brother John marries Mary Anne Alexander 23 Dec 1882. They married in Lanark County but both were residents of Palmerston in Frontenac County where Angus and his Mary lived and were married.

I think you alluded somewhere ? that John may have disappeared and Angus and Mary Anne may have ended up together? These facts may suit this type of scenario but as I mentioned, this is just a theory at the moment. I don't know how you would ever prove it.

Marriage transcripts will follow ....

 
 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: polarbear on Wednesday 25 January 12 04:28 GMT (UK)
1st marriage ...

Angus Sampierre 24 Bachelor Yeoman b. Quebec? (see later) living in Palmerston, Frontenac County
f. Peter Sampierre
m. Armine Lacomb
to
Mary Laframboise 18 Spinster b. Quebec living in Palmerston
f. Jerry? Laframboise
m. Feby Jarbo?
at Palmerston 01 Nov 1882
witnesses Richard Luker and Josephine Laframboise

On censuses Angus states b. Ontario and 3 of his children state he was b in Westport Ont in their marriage records.

2nd marriage ...
John Sampier 21 Bachelor Labourer b. Ont living in Palmerston
f. Peter Sampier
m. Ermean Sampier
to
Mary Anne Alexander 17 Spinster b. Ont living in Palmerston
f. Frank Stewart Alexander
m. Margaret P Alexander
in Lanark Village, Lanark County 23 Dec 1882
winesses Mary Jane Burghknew? and a John with no last name given

Polarbear
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Wednesday 25 January 12 04:57 GMT (UK)
Thank you so much for joining in  Polarbear!
Note Mary Jane Burghknew ( is this Burgenous??) wonder if she might be the Mary Burgena from the household in 1871? Oh the spelling horrors...

adding 1881 census: Note if this is correct family would be the Mary who married Angus 1882, died 1884
Jary & Feby both born Quebec in 1881 Palmerton & Canonto, Addington with ( says all children b. Ontario)Mary, Jarmy, Basil, Adeline, Ferlina, Elizabath ***
Left click to magnify http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/e/e328/e008175453.jpg
and here is page 22 with Joseph Semfier, likely Angus's brother and family in the very next household
http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/e/e328/e008175451.jpg
( on page 20, five houses previous to Jary is Antoine Rosberry )

adding 1861 census : Jeremiah born Grand Bruley LC* in 1833 in Kennebec,​ Frontenac (* Grand Brûlé ?)
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MQ7C-4M1

***Note that John & Matilda are on a later page #26 those are set up wrong!!!

1871 Addington Palmerston, Canonto- Had a tough look because their last name listed as Jeremiah
Jeremiah Jeremiah Feby 38 Adline 1 Calla    3 Jermiah 4  Mary 6 Canonto
also Mary Garbo in household, perhaps mother-in-law?
www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/census-1871/001101-119.02-e.php?person_id_nbr=1099998&interval=20&i=jpg


Now this does not solve the Long and Alexander end of it, but could explain why he was thought to have married a Strawberry. We will continue to post any new information we find that may be related to the thread. Note that there were Payea & Rasberry in Palmerston in 1911 now Frontenac
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Wednesday 25 January 12 17:13 GMT (UK)
Some spelling of St. Pierre in 1901
1901  http://www.rootschat.com/links/0jyo/   and  http://www.rootschat.com/links/0jyp/
In 1911 http://www.rootschat.com/links/0jyq/  and http://www.rootschat.com/links/0jyr/

Will continue to add some spellings I have found: Saint Pierre, Saint Peirie, St Pierr,
St Perre (transcr.Perce)  St Pear, St Purr,
Samfier, Sanfiar, Sampear, Sampare, Sampere, Sampier, Sampeir, Sampir, Sempere, Semper, Sempier
Simpear, Simpear, Simper, Simpierre, Symper, Sympere, Santpier, SanPier, Sanpiar, Sampierre
Lampier, Lampierre ( read on for reasoning)
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Wednesday 25 January 12 18:02 GMT (UK)
Might be Febe in 1851 although Gower township, Carleton
with no father in household transcribed as Gerba, but written Gerbo on image and says place of birth "F" so just marked French ( French Canada or just ethnicity?) http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census52/SplitView.jsp?id=1434
Joseph 23
Febe    18
Mary    58
Dulfuss 29 ( Delphis in 1899 m. of son Francis JARBEAU*, Palmerston http://homepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~maryc/north99.htm )
  Harriot 23
  Harriot 3
  Roselie 2
( Boselle*?)says age 1 but also marked as labourer???
 ( Jeremie LAFRAMBOISE & Euphemie JARBEAU* son Bazile's marriage )

* also used Garbeau, Gerbeau 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: polarbear on Wednesday 25 January 12 20:37 GMT (UK)
Hi again.

You might check if your local public library subscribes to Ancestry Library Edition. This would give you access to all the images of the Ontario BMD records we are turning up. Barring that, if you are near a Family History Center (the familysearch.org folks) they may have Ancestry as well. You can check for locations on their website.

There is a family tree on Ancestry related to the Jeremiah Laframboise found earlier by J.J. It has the marriage of Mary to Angus Sampier (as Lampier) but no record of her death. There are quite a few source citations but the records themselves are not available to view so caution would be advised (I tried to find a few of the cited records but was not successful). Feby is entered as Euphemie Jarbeau. So it looks like Mary Garbo in the 1871 census posted earlier might be her mother.

I think you might also have access to this tree if you are able to access Ancestry.

As mentioned earlier, Mary Burgeno might easily be the Mary Jane Burghknew (oh, the spelling horrors is right!!) who was witness to the marriage of John and Mary Anne. I have tried to trace her and her sister forward without success at this point, both in the next census and for marriages.

Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Wednesday 25 January 12 21:28 GMT (UK)
For anyone wanting to look for the origins of the census stray Mary & Maggie in 1871 household ( images reply #30) other variations for this name are  Birchnough, Berchnough, Birchenough, Berchenough, Berchenow, Burgnew, Bercheneau
~~
Further to polarbear's find... Also saw a birth 1879  Palmerston parents Frank Lampierre & Matilda Laframboise. The capital "S" must look like an "L" ...so this has happened before in the transcription...Ugh... Lampier and Semfiere?? What next?
 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Thursday 26 January 12 09:38 GMT (UK)
Thanks, both of you, for this "sea" of information which will take me a while to absorb.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Thursday 26 January 12 14:39 GMT (UK)
I have now had chance to put some of this amazing stuff down on paper ( I am of an age where paper works better than does a screen)

Polarbear came up with a time line but it would appear Mary Laframboise died before any of Angus's surviving children were born...I have William b 1888 d 1983 as the eldest ( my Grandad). Family tradition has it that one brother had married but left his wife with his brother to go out "West"....It seems entirely possible that with his first wife,  Mary, dead Angus took in his sister-in-law Mary Alexander... whom his brotherJames/John? had  previously married. If that is the case then did Mary Laframboise have any surviving children?

I am intrigued with an apparant Gerbo/Gerba/ Gerbeau connection especially as we have a 74 year old of that name living with the Laframboise's in the 1871 census and could the  witness to John Sampierre& Mary Ann Alexander's wedding...a Mary Jane Burghknew be the Mary Burgera in the St.Pierre's 1871 census for North Crosby?

You have both gone to a deal of trouble for which I thank you. I always knew my family was "complicated" but it's far more complicated than that. :)
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Thursday 26 January 12 16:25 GMT (UK)
My G/Grandma...Mary...Strawberry/Laframboise/Alexander/Long? Photo taken late 1930s


Sorry I am struggling to attach the 'photo!
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Thursday 26 January 12 19:00 GMT (UK)
 Elmfield will try a couple more things and I'll help if need be...Look at the last reply before this one for the image...She will put it in there eventually. Learning curve.

I am going crazy looking for Mary Long/Alexander...Trying to call others in for the challenge.  Mind spinning and too many notes to keep track of.... There is a 6 month old Mary with a Richard and Mary in the right place in 1871, wondering if they got age wrong... and can't find them in 1881, but am too tired to look further into 1891 to see if the couple is there...they may also have moved away. Have looked at most Mary Long and they seem accounted for..but may have missed some...Also looked for Song...
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/census-1871/001101-119.02-e.php?person_id_nbr=1098681
There were Alexanders in Camden Addington, so not a far reach...also methodist, as were the Alexander family


The little Jane long from the 1871 I found living with the burning family...Although out of district she's aboriginal and without family... will try to follow her next so far... i can't see her in 1881. So many avenues to follow.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Thursday 26 January 12 20:22 GMT (UK)
The Patriarch for the Alexanders seems to be a Samuel born circa 1799 Ireland...although I can't see earlier households than the 1871 to confirm this, so may not be related at all... http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/census-1871/001101-119.02-e.php?person_id_nbr=2728287&interval=20&i=jpg
I am wondering if one of the Alexanders married a Long or had a child with a Long out of wedlock (even may have passed away?)...all between 1861 and 1871. Frank Stewart ( Frances?) may turn out be a brother to Stewart rather than one and the same person?
Can anyone please look into 1851 and 1861 census Camden Addington to see the Alexander household

These are the Wesleyan baptisms where there should be some children from the older generations but just one Kennebec Frontenac birth for Samuel Jr. Perhaps not a place of worship nearby back then? Would they have used an Anglican church then?
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~wjmartin/wm-index.htm
Grasping at straws but you never know http://www.lennoxandaddingtonhistoricalsociety.ca/StLukes.html
cemeteries
http://www.archives.gov.on.ca/english/archival-records/interloan/cemetery-lennox.aspx
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: polarbear on Friday 27 January 12 03:43 GMT (UK)
Re: children of Mary Laframboise ....

I would suspect that if Mary and Angus had any surviving children they would have been in the household with the family in the next census (1891). The 1891 census has a Mary E as the eldest child and she is b. about 1886, which w/b after Mary Laframboise died (1884). This Mary can also be found in the family unit in the 1901 census, where her DOB is recorded as 22 Mar 1886. So it looks like your William had an older sister but her mother w/h been Mary Anne Alexander (Long).

I have looked at the Alexander household in 1851 and 1861 censuses for  Camden and did not find a Frank/Francis/Stewart in it so cannot make a certain connection between the two.

I too would love to see a picture of your Mary and hope you will be successful in posting it. You may find some hints in the 'how to use rootschat' or 'technical help' boards or could even ask for help there  :). You may need to shrink the file or something.

PB
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Friday 27 January 12 11:47 GMT (UK)
Good Morning,

Thanks for your latest endevours. I have to confess I am at the limit of my very limited PC skills and have therefore asked a friend to help post the 'photos.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Saturday 28 January 12 00:28 GMT (UK)
An 1891 map of the area in which your ancestor first settled... http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~wyatt/pics/easternontario2.html

If I find any marriages online I will post for you ...

Here is a new transcrpt spelling...
July 1 1872 Westport - Roman Catholic
Joseph JANTPIERRE age 23 occ. laborer- N.Crosby
parents Peter JANTPIERRE & Ermine LeCOMPTE
Adeline FITZPATRICK, 20, N.Crosby, same, d/o Thomas FITZPATRICK & Sylvia TRYON.
Witnesses Henry JANTPIERRE & Jane FITZPATRICK, both of N.Crosby. 

( Note that this is probably the couple transcribed as Sanfier next household from JARY ROSBARY & FEBEY in 1881 Palmerton & Canonto, Addington )
 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: J.J. on Monday 30 January 12 17:19 GMT (UK)
Here are the images that Elmfield scanned & sent to post...The first one of her father "Aged 7 with grand-dad" and the next one is of Mary
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: cat_cat on Tuesday 27 March 12 20:00 BST (UK)
Hi,
I was very excited to find this thread as I've been researching this family for sometime. I'm a descendent of T. Joseph St Pierre, brother of William and son of Angus and Mary St Pierre. Nothing has confused me more in my research then Mary Strawberry/ Long/Alexander. My own grandmother recalls Mary being referred to as 'Mary Moon'. 
I haven't been able to figure out why she has so many names. I've heard the same tales as Elmfield but have found no proof. It's interesting to note on the Payea family site she's referred to as Strawberry.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Wednesday 28 March 12 08:27 BST (UK)
Good Morning,

Well, what a small world we live in...you and I must be related! The Payea clan claimed Mary Strawberry but after I had spoken with Danny Payea and passed onto him some documentation ( we are both living in the UK) that problem was resolved...she was only related to them via marriage!

My grandfather, William St.Pierre married Amanda Bridget Payea whose brother came over to the UK with the First World War Canadian Army Expeditionary Force and settled here! My g/grandfather, Angus, was the St Pierre who married Mary "Strawberry/Long/Alexander /Le Framboise and if I think back I have also heard her referred to as Moon and even Princess Mary Moon.

I'd love to hear more from you as your  Grandfather and mine seem to have been brothers!
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: cat_cat on Thursday 29 March 12 19:36 BST (UK)
It is a small world. William and T. Joseph were brothers. I've seen a picture of William St Pierre in my moms scrapbook, he lived to quite an age. I took a trip this past summer to see several of the St Pierre graves including William and Amanda's.
I've been confounded by Mary of the many names for awhile now. I'll share what I think based on the records I've found.
Angus seems to have married Mary Lafromboise first, she died of what I think was consumption. In the same year a John St Pierre, who I think was Angus's brother, marries a Mary Anne Alexander. Have you found anything about this John St Pierre?
I haven't found a second marriage registration for Angus but I suspect John's Mary is the same as Angus's second Mary.
I have found a registration for another of Angus's brother, Francis St Pierre marrying Mathilde Lafromboise ( who seems to be a sister of Mary L). I also have one for a Mary St Pierre d/o Peter and Ermine marrying an Alphonse Modeste. 
What do you think?
I look forward to hearing from you.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Friday 30 March 12 13:53 BST (UK)
That's more or less where I am! It could well be that the widowed brother 'took on' his brother's wife if...as my family tradition has it...one of them went out west. The changes in Mary's surname is a puzzle... I have no proof but I have a strong feeling that she was adopted by the Alexander's...but latterly changed her name when she found out she was born a Long. I really am uncertain of this but will be back in Canada in a few weeks and hope to put this theory to some cousins. I have to say that much of what I have recently learned...and surmise...has come from JJ, her friends and a deal of trouble to which they went.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: Lyanne Abouatallah on Wednesday 06 January 16 02:06 GMT (UK)
i think i may have information as to the Payea and St Piere family ive attatched a photo of my mothers baby tree and turns out Amanda Payea and J St piere son of Angus St Pierre are my grat great grandfathers
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Wednesday 06 January 16 09:18 GMT (UK)
Good Morning,Lyanne,

Amanda Payea and William J St.Pierre are my Grandparents...I am their son, Angus, Alan, Edward's daughter....so you and I are definitely cousins. I was born and live in the UK although my parents went back to Canada in the 1970's. Dad , sadly, passed away, peacefully, in his sleep on 5 May 2014. He would have been 93 had he lived until 16 May.2014. As it happens, we had just arrived in Belleville to stay with him for a while. Mary Strawberry was my great grandmother!

Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: Lyanne Abouatallah on Wednesday 06 January 16 17:28 GMT (UK)
lyanne abouatallah facebook
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: Lyanne Abouatallah on Wednesday 06 January 16 17:31 GMT (UK)
im so sorry to here about your dad
he lived a long life and the stories he would have told would have been the best im sure
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Friday 08 January 16 12:54 GMT (UK)
Yes, he did have a long life and we managed to produce a small book detailing some of his life stories. He was a WW2 veteran, landing on Juno Beach on D Day itself, was wounded , twice, and lived to tell the tale!

Thanks again.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: Lyanne Abouatallah on Friday 08 January 16 13:46 GMT (UK)
if you dont mind id love to read his story i love to read life stories and especially one of a family member i think he deserves to be acknoledged for his bravery and accomplishments whould you mund sharing the title
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: Lyanne Abouatallah on Friday 08 January 16 13:54 GMT (UK)
im finding your research very fasinating and the history that was all around our family very enlightning I'm quite alot younger then yourself so alot of this is very new to me and you have paved an easy road for me to follow i cant imagine how difficult it was for you to start your search form over seas and I live here so thank you for caring enough to reach out im really excited to have conection with you, its exciting to find family and photos then follow the trails and history, im still shocked to find another family member doing the same as myself

 
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: elmfield on Sunday 10 January 16 18:13 GMT (UK)
Hi,

We entitled the little book: " From Farm Boy to Townie". It was never published but just circulated amongst close family and friends, here and in Canada. I am not even sure there are any spare copies..but I will check. If I find a copy we would have to sort out how we could post it to you.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: Brian St. Pierre on Sunday 27 September 20 22:14 BST (UK)
I am not entirely sure if the is the Same person....

But if anyone could answer this it would be great!!! I am trying to find my families history and learn a lot about it!!

Did Mary Strawberry have decendants named Alfred St.Pierre Married to Doris St.Pierre (keck) and Angus St.Pierre married to Betty St.Pierre??

My uncle was in WWII and was one of the last from what i know to storm Juno Beach. I ufortunatly do not know very much :(

If this is the Case Mary was my Grandmother and I do believe it is either her Kids or Grandkids that would be my Grandfather and Uncle!? Please let me know!

Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: Adam16 on Tuesday 28 March 23 20:24 BST (UK)
Hello,
I cannot believe the story I've read in the last few hours. Thank you all so much for doing all this research, I and most of my family have been trying to trace back our family line back to Mary Strawberry and beyond. I've heard stories from my Aunt and its amazing to see a lot of them written out the same as I've been told. I even have the same photo posted by J.J. and I have another to share. This from what I'm told is Angus.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: droughan on Saturday 20 January 24 06:32 GMT (UK)
Sorry didn't know how to post to group so I just replied to your post, hoping to get the message out

FYI: TO ALL RESEARCHERS OF MARY ANN STRAWBERRY/MOON/LONG/ALEXANDER and whatever other names she goes by.

Her parents are NOT Larry or Jerry Laframboise Rosberry and Feby Larbo or Jarbo (both names spelt wrong as well). They did not die in a fire or on the same day. Everyone is so busy copying other peoples information, but not checking to see if they are facts by verifying them to the records. How do I know? Because this is my husbands line and I have been researching it for 30 years. The following below should help explain the confusion, as there we 2 Marys from 2 brothers who were my husbands gr grandfather and gr grand uncle and their daughters were married to Angus and Frank St. Pierre. Mary Moon Strawberry is second wife of Angus but not related to my husbands side. see below for details of where everyone belongs...

My husband's family...

Nicolas Laframboise 1780-1859
Married
Marie Josephte Fauteau 1792-1859

They had 2 sons that are connected to the St. Pierre’ family

1st son Antoine Maxime Laframboise 1826-1914 my husbands gr grandfather
Married 1st wife
Marie Domithilde Jarbeau Leblanc 1835-1858

Their daughter
Marie Domithilde Laframboise 1853-1893
Was 1st wife of Francois Xavier St. Pierre 1849-1926 This is Angus’ older brother

Their children were…

Harriet Mathilde
Joseph Francis Xavier (Frank)
William Henry
Anna Jane
Edward Cyleste
Frederick Alford
Andrew Napoleon Paul
Ellen Gertrude
Francis Xavier Stewart
Baby

2nd wife Angeline Gervais
-------------------------------
Now, the 2nd son of
Nicolas Laframboise 1780-1859 listed above
and
Marie Josephte Fauteau 1792-1859
was
Jeremiah Laframboise 1830-1904 (aka transcription error Larry/Jerry Laframboise/Rosbery)
Married
Eupheme Jarbeau 1832-1912 (aka transcription error Feby Larbo/Jarbo)

They had a daughter…
Marie Laframboise 1865-1884 died @ 19 of decline after childbirth. Baby Mary died 3 years later
She was 1st wife to
Angus St. Pierre   1857-1934 who is now widowed with a baby.

2nd wife Mary Ann Alexander Moon Long Strawberry Laframboise Mohawk woman 1865-1947
Orphaned bet 4 and 6 years of age so 1869-1871 and brought to Golden Lake by an Algonquin family and then adopted by the Anderson family who were white. Mr. Anderson worked in Renfrew as a logger will have to double check that.

Mary was Angus’s 2nd wife and their children were…
Beatrice
Mary
William
Napoleon
Angus
Xavier
Francis
Harriet
Joseph
Thomas Joseph
Benjamin Alphonse
John Henry
Louise
Fredrick
Francis Fred
Edward Rankin
Arthur Cecil

I’m guessing the story of Mohawk Mary was told many years later as the family was trying to figure out who all of these Mary Laframboise’s were and the confusion may have been because the 2 Mary’s were both related and just happened to marry st. pierre brothers. Not much is known about Angus's 2nd wife Mary Moon /anderson....

My guess is that her father was Paul Long from the Tyendinaga Mohawk Territory near Deseronto based on multiple record searches. Angus's kids records have their mother listed as Long (assuming maiden name as no records could be found of a marriage to a Long, and Alexander (which would have been her adoptive parents surname. One document did list her father as Paul, which would make Paul Long her dad? Just another clue. Pass it on. Good luck to the person who finds Mary Long Moon Alexander Strawberry's parents documented somewhere!
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: droughan on Saturday 20 January 24 06:48 GMT (UK)
Angus St. Pierre/Sampur etc, his parents were Peter St. Pierre and Hermine Mary Lancombe Marriage
29 Sep 1840 • Louiseville, Maskinongé, Quebec, Canada
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: droughan on Saturday 20 January 24 07:01 GMT (UK)
Wondering where Strawberry came from as Laframboise is Raspberry in english.
Title: Re: Mary Strawberry b Desoronto, Ont 1865 d Flower Station, Ont 1947
Post by: droughan on Saturday 20 January 24 08:15 GMT (UK)
Wrong parent connection. Feby and Jerry are not Mary Moon Long Anderson Strawberry's parents. They are parents of Angus St. Pierrie's 1st wife Mary Laframboise. Jerrys brothers daughter Mary was married to Angus's brother Francis. 1st wife of Angus Mary Laframboise died at 19 yrs shortly after birth of their child Mary who died at abt 3 yrs old. Mary Strawberry is 2nd wife of Angus.  See my recent post, explains connection.

Might be Febe in 1851 although Gower township, Carleton
with no father in household transcribed as Gerba, but written Gerbo on image and says place of birth "F" so just marked French ( French Canada or just ethnicity?) http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census52/SplitView.jsp?id=1434
Joseph 23
Febe    18
Mary    58
Dulfuss 29 ( Delphis in 1899 m. of son Francis JARBEAU*, Palmerston http://homepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~maryc/north99.htm )
  Harriot 23
  Harriot 3
  Roselie 2
( Boselle*?)says age 1 but also marked as labourer???
 ( Jeremie LAFRAMBOISE & Euphemie JARBEAU* son Bazile's marriage )

* also used Garbeau, Gerbeau