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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Anpet on Friday 17 February 12 09:18 GMT (UK)

Title: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Anpet on Friday 17 February 12 09:18 GMT (UK)
We are looking for Frederick George Cole- we know when he died and how in 1902. We know he was married to Fanny Peapell in 1887 and that they lived in Blunsden Wilts. We know Fred joined the  militia in 1881 and was working for J Russell in 1881. However his marriage certificate and militia papers say that he was born in Dauntsey wiltshire in 1860 and his father was George Cole. We can find no evidence of his birth in Dauntsey nor can we find him in the 1861 or 1871 census. If anyone can shed some light on this we would be exceptionally grateful-

 :)
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: KGarrad on Friday 17 February 12 09:29 GMT (UK)
We know Fred joined the  militia in 1881 and was working for J Russell in 1881.

Is this not Fred in 1881?
Reference RG11, Piece 2015, Folio 4, Page 1
Road, Rodbourne Cheney

Peaple, George  Head  M  34  Farm Labourer  b Rodbourne Cheney
Peaple, Unis  Wife  F  34  Farm Labourer  b Lyneham
Peaple, Henry  Son  M  5  Scholar  b Rodbourne Cheney
Deacon, William  Lodger  M  26  Labourer for Boiler Smith  b Rodbourne Cheney
Keen, Maurice  Lodger  M  44  b Rodbourne Cheney
Cole, Fred  Lodger  M  21  Farm Labourer  b Dauntsey
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Anpet on Friday 17 February 12 09:35 GMT (UK)
Yes we know about the 1881 census and we also found Joseph Russell who he worked for- but he is not in the 1871 census and having trawled through the Dauntsey records we cannot confirm his birth at all
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: janan on Friday 17 February 12 10:09 GMT (UK)
Hi

Welcome to Rootschat :D

I'm wondering if he changed his name

There is a Frederick George Skull born Dauntsey 1860 father Barnabus mother Harriet in 1861
RG9/1277.61 Pg3

Frederick Scull born Dauntsey 1860  with siblings  father George mother Harriet
RG10/1258/102 Pg16

Widowed George and children matching those in 71 but no Frederick is Cull in 1881 RG11/2018/46 Pg24


I think I'd change my name if it was Skull ;D

Jan ;)
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Anpet on Friday 17 February 12 10:12 GMT (UK)
Yes so would I! However I believe this Fred Skull can be traced forward and marries a different lady...you can see why this gent is causing me a mega headache!
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: janan on Friday 17 February 12 10:17 GMT (UK)
Hmm ??? I can't see him in 81/91 but yes he does seem to reappear as Scull in 1901 born Dauntsey 1863 married to a Laura Emily, is this what you found? Or can you see this Frederick in 81/91? Puzzling

Jan ;)

OK can see him indexed as Shull still born 1863 in 1891. Still can't see him in 1881. Ooh but I have found him in 1871 still born 1863 father Abraham mother Susanna again indexed as Shull ;D

Field now wide open for Frederick George Skull born Dauntsey 1860 to be yours :D

Yes definitely two of them
Frederick Skull Oct-Nov-Dec 1862    Malmesbury    Wiltshire

Frederick George Skull Oct-Nov-Dec 1860    Malmesbury    Wiltshire
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Jebber on Friday 17 February 12 10:43 GMT (UK)
You appear to have his marriage certificate, yet you do not say what his father's occupation was, that should help locate him in the earlier census.

Jebber
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Anpet on Friday 17 February 12 10:47 GMT (UK)
Nothing exceptional for the area or the times  George Cole was a farm labourer!!
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: MargP on Friday 17 February 12 10:49 GMT (UK)
 Hi Anpet and welcome to Roots

On the marriage certificate for Frederick, who are the witnesses and does it give his fathers occupation, and if he is deceased, also I would widen my search area for Frederick, on numerous occasions in my tree, I have come across this, when the children leave home they usually give there place of birth as where they lived, but are actually born somewhere else.

Margp
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: janan on Friday 17 February 12 21:37 GMT (UK)
Hmm ??? I can't see him in 81/91 but yes he does seem to reappear as Scull in 1901 born Dauntsey 1863 married to a Laura Emily, is this what you found? Or can you see this Frederick in 81/91? Puzzling

Jan ;)

OK can see him indexed as Shull still born 1863 in 1891. Still can't see him in 1881. Ooh but I have found him in 1871 still born 1863 father Abraham mother Susanna again indexed as Shull ;D

Field now wide open for Frederick George Skull born Dauntsey 1860 to be yours :D

Yes definitely two of them
Frederick Skull Oct-Nov-Dec 1862    Malmesbury    Wiltshire

Frederick George Skull Oct-Nov-Dec 1860    Malmesbury    Wiltshire


Hi Anpet
 
Did you miss this? What do you think  knowing  there are 2 Frederick Skulls born Dauntsey? Possible Frederick George chose Cole rather than Cull like his father?

Jan ;)

Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: MargP on Friday 17 February 12 22:28 GMT (UK)
That looks very promising Jan

Margp

Edit It may be worth checking all the other children of George and Harriet to see if they changed there names
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Anpet on Saturday 18 February 12 09:34 GMT (UK)
thanks Guys this is really helpful

 ;D
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: MargP on Saturday 18 February 12 09:58 GMT (UK)
Hi Anpet

Can you tell us who the witnesses were on Frederick and Fanny's marriage certificate, also a list of all there children's names to see if there are any similarities with George and Harriet's children.

Marg
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: MargP on Saturday 18 February 12 12:05 GMT (UK)
Hi

Can anyone see Frederick on the 1901 census, I have found Fanny but he is not with them??
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: janan on Saturday 18 February 12 15:40 GMT (UK)



Edit It may be worth checking all the other children of George and Harriet to see if they changed there names

Of the male children I can't find definites for Edward G and William G but Francis George becomes Cull like father George. Will see if I can spot any of the girls

Jan ;)

Just found a William Cole (indexed as Cale) born Berkshire Eaton Hastings c 1871 in 1891 birthplace and age matches William Scull in 1871. There is a 1894 marriage for William G Cole in Highwood District Wiltshire, Francis G Cull also married in Highwood.  On the 1901 census a  William G Cole married to a Rosanna (one of the partners for th 1894 marriage is a Rose Hannah) gives birthplace as Inglesham Wiltshire . In 1881 the Cull family have an Edward who was born Inglesham so they must have lived there at some point.
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: MargP on Saturday 18 February 12 16:15 GMT (UK)
Brilliant work Jan, I have not been able to do much today with hubby at home.

Margp
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Anpet on Saturday 18 February 12 18:17 GMT (UK)
You are amazing! ON the certificate the witnesses were Selina Jane Peapell - Fannys sister- and a William Greenaway.
He is listed as a batchelor and worker as a labourer in Moredon and his dad George was a labourer. They married 13 Aug 1887 in Rodbourne Cheyney
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Anpet on Saturday 18 February 12 18:25 GMT (UK)
Frederick Cole 30
Fanny Maria Cole 23
Lillian Fran Cole 5
Chs Freack Cole 3
William G Cole 1
Selina Elith Cole 4/12

this is the family in 1891
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Ladyhawk on Saturday 18 February 12 19:02 GMT (UK)
George CULL's daughter Mary J age 5 (1876) Gloucester from 1881 census

Could this be her?

Did George have a sister named Pamela?

1891   RG12; Piece: 1901; Folio: 128; Page: 4
Charles Kynastone 60 Sparksford Grocer
Pamelar 57 Dauntsey
Mary J SCULL Niece 15 Gloucester

1901 RG13; Piece: 2303; Folio: 121; Page: 5.
Mary J SCULL 25 Farmington Glouc. still with Charles & Pamila

Looks as if Pamela married twice

Charles Kynaston married Wincanton 1868 Pamela Knighton 

John Knighton married Dec 1853 Cricklade Pamela SCULL


1861
RG9; Piece: 1273; Folio: 103; Page: 17
John Knighton 26 Pamela 28
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: alydoodle on Thursday 10 May 12 20:03 BST (UK)
Hi, Just been reading your messages as I'm looking for George Cull (or Skull or Scull and also was originally Barnabas Skull, married to Harriet Skull). My great grandmother was Mary Jane Skull but was shown on 1881 census as Cull due to a mis translation by the census enumerator.

Her father, Barnabas, appears to have changed his name to George in the 1871 census, possibly his middle name?, his father died that year and he was called George too. What I'm struggling to find was is Barnabas/George's death and wondered if you have come across it. He is last known living in Swindon with a family called Baxter on the 1891 census, aged 50 and then I can't find him any more.

Incidentally, my great gran thought her name was Cole when she got married to my great grandfather, Henry Sadler. She needed her birth certificate and couldn't find it under Cole and apparently said "Oh, I might be called Scull). Her brothers all called themselves Cole I think (Frederick being one of them). Dauntsey was full of Skulls/Sculls and many of them called their first sons the same name, i.e. George, William etc.  Very confusing to trace the right one!

Harriet died just after giving birth to my great grandmother which is why Mary Jane was farmed off  out to an aunt in Sparkford.

Any help on locating George's death gratefully received.
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Mabel Bagshawe on Thursday 10 May 12 20:34 BST (UK)
How about

George Cole
Birth Year approx 1838
Date of Registration Jan-Mar 1894
Age at Death 56
Registration district  Highworth [ie includes swindon]
Volume 5a, page 1
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Mandyrouse on Thursday 23 March 17 10:11 GMT (UK)
His date of birth was 5th Oct 1860.
I have him in a family bible which shows Frederick George and Fanny Maria plus thier children.
Also listed are Hubert Charles page and his wife Mary Christina.

Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Anpet on Friday 24 March 17 07:02 GMT (UK)
Hi really interested to know your links to Frederick Cole where he was born and his parents names....been trying to get birth cert for years. What side of the family is the family bible from?
Thank you
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Mandyrouse on Friday 24 March 17 07:17 GMT (UK)
Sadly I can't really tell you much. The bible has names of Frederick George Cole, Fanny Maria, thier children and then a couple named Page born around 1915.
Had it for years and just thought I would try and work out how they are connected and a bit more about them.
Title: Re: Frederick George Cole
Post by: Anpet on Friday 24 March 17 08:40 GMT (UK)
totally fascinated- where did you get the bible from- Fred is my husbands great grandfather and the family- Cole and Peapell- lived in and around Swindon. Fred died in early 1900's coming back from Boer War but we have quite a lot of history for all the other linked families but Fred was always the stumbling block