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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Flintshire => Wales => Flintshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: jules67 on Wednesday 28 March 12 19:21 BST (UK)
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Please can anyone help me find a possible birthday for my Grandfather William Thomas Roberts. he was born In Rhyl that was Flintshire at the time possibly between 1864/67. I know from marriage records his father was named Daniel Roberts, but i can not find a match that fits my William Thomas in that time scale.
Many thanks,
Jules x
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Hi Jules,you've no doubt seen the 1881 entry showing the William Thomas given as born in c 1876 son of Daniel and Ann Roberts?I'm not finding the Daniel Roberts in 1871,but the entry in 1881 looks a bit fishy to me with an apparent 12 year gap between David Edward and the William Thomas?
Regards
William Russell Jones.
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Looking at apparently your Tree on Ancestry Jules,I'm wondering how you came by the Williams surname for the Ann who married Daniel Roberts?
I trust you didn't pick it as it was given as a choice for a marriage for Daniel Roberts at St Asaph in 1862 on Free BMD?North Wales BMD gives Daniel Roberts as marrying the Jane Hughes at St Asaph in 1862?
Regards
William Russell Jones.
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Also posted here, WR, with some look ups already done.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,589317.0.html
gnu
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i dont know anymore matie....all you kind peeps tell me u find things here and there but i cant find them...i rely on the help and hints ancesty give me.....my head is spinning with it all now. I dont know...i really feel like giving up. no idea where to go with it anymore. ???
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Hi gnu
thing is....i already had all of that stuff....what i need to know is how on earth i make sense of any of it? I have 3 documents i KNOW refer to my grandad...100%. but his ages dont add up! I dont see how i get around it.
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I'll have a detailed look at the other thread and see if there are any clues at all - remember, I have lots of experience with Roberts - still trying to find a John b.c. 1800 :-X :-X :-X
I'll get back if I find anything worthwhile.
gnu
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Thank you.....at the moment i dont feel im ever going to know.
WR...where did you find the marriage to Jane for Daniel? x
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Don't you worry about it too much Jules.
What I normally do when I hit the wall with an ancestor like this,albeit a troublesome character like your William Thomas Roberts,is to go on to a completely different line.Perhaps returning to the William Thomas at some later stage.
It is often marvellous when you go back to look again,that you notice something different that you missed the first time.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
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I found the marriage of Daniel Roberts and Jane Hughes on North Wales BMD.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
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thanks again. I'll see if i can find them on the census. Sadly there is nobody left to ask anything. My only living aunt was only 8 months old when her father William died and i was the youngest of 40 grandchildren and my grandmother died when i was 7. so i missed out on all the family stories. X
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Whilst of course I wouldn't wish to complicate matters!I'm only seeing the marriage in 1876 at Rhyl Holy Trinity between a Daniel Roberts and an Anne Williams as a possible between the years 1861-1883.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
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??? so what does that mean? (sorry...im soo confused with all this now!) I think someone gave me that the other evening.
He was married to Jane then married Ann at a later date?
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Hi Jules
I think that that was Fairlane and me but it was Daniel's father, William, who was married to an Ann and then a Ruth. (1827 and 1840)
Back to William Thomas - I've been looking at various bits and I think that the William Roberts that you've identified in Heaton Norris in 1901 seems to fit most closely to his occupation, etc. Here he's aged 23 (so born 1877-8 ish) RG13/3288/137/39.
How old was Alice when he married her?
gnu
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40!!!!! Grrrrrr. so thats out by years!!!
it fits with the line i have followed....but NOT the marriage and 1911 census age!!
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Jules - don't get concerned about his parents at the moment - stick to him.
Was Alice 40 or what?
gnu
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William was 40 and alice 28. x
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I found the entry on familysearch
14th august 1905
William Thomas Roberts and Alice Kenworthy
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If your William was the one on the 1881 at RG11/5527/136/12, then his father was still single in 1871 so, unless he came along with Ann, William must have been born after that date:
1871 RG10/5674/51/8 - Daniel in Llannefydd also in 1891 RG12/4626/143/28.
gnu
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yes....but that really seems to indicate i have the wrong family. ???
he wouldnt of added 10 years to his ages to marry a lady he was a similar age to?
and....another thing....it says on his marriage cert to Alice he was a widower....so he was married before!!! But I have no idea where to look for that one...wales..or was he already working away from home then? he really could of been absolutely anywhere!!
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For tomorrow:
Birth
William Thomas Roberts
June q, 1877, St Asaph, 11b 392
(no registration for a William Thomas in the years 1865-1869 in St Asaph RD)
Marriage
Sept q, 1875, St Asaph, 11b 500 with Daniel Roberts and Anne Williams on the same page.
gnu
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yeap...thats what i have.
As i said....i have searched and search between 1864-67 to find him and cant. the 1877 one is the one that keeps coming back.....but people keep telling me that the age on the marriage to Alice and on the 1911 census are more likely to correct...he is more likely to of been fibbing about his age when he married he much younger Sarah.....
I dont think i'll ever find out for sure. x
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just to update this thread. I purchased the birth certificate that seemed the likely match....(William Thomas Roberts
June q, 1877, St Asaph, 11b 392)
but it was not my William.
I also purchased the marriage cert (Sept q, 1875, St Asaph, 11b 500 with Daniel Roberts and Anne Williams) This seems likely to be my Great Grandparents.
The GRO have carried out two searches on my behalf to find a record of William Thomas Roberts between 1870 and 1880 but they were unable to find one whose parents were Daniel and Anne.
Do you think its worth another shot to ask them to search for his birth just using his mothers name? If he was illegitimate will it say so?