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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cheshire => Topic started by: mike1979 on Tuesday 05 June 12 07:35 BST (UK)
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Hi All
I'd be grateful for some advice if any of you have experience in tracing farming households back from 1800 ish (other than parish records).
I have the SHAW family of BOSLEY who in the 1840ish Tithe Map occupy Swans Lake Farm in Bosley. The family had been there in 1819 (Elizabeth dau of Samuel Shaw was born there according to the Bosley parish register). In 1804 Samuel Shaw's mother Sarah (nee Goodwin) left him her tenement in Bosley so one may assume that this is the same Swans Lake Farm but how could I confirm this?
The Shaw family are in the Bosley parish registers back to 1728 so I know they are in the area.
Are there any tax or landowner records which would give a clue to the location of farms etc between 1600 and 1800? I think there was a Poll and Hearth tax in 1660 and 1664 - are these records available?
thanks for any suggestions you can give
M
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Mike - my suggestion would be to keep searching archive catalogues and asking staff when you visit for their ideas - particularly Cheshire's but also the National Archives and A2A If you try names of people, property and places you may find some holdings that could provide more detail:
http://archive.cheshire.gov.uk/calmview/
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/default.htm
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/a2a/
I was lucky to find a local landowner's listing of his tenants and their plots in Staffordshire c 1810 that included one of my ancestors - I found that by asking staff what they had on that village as there were no surviving tithe maps.
Archives often have collections from a major landowner in the area - the tithe maps will have given you the landowner at that time, so this is another name you could search on & see if the estate records have been passed to a public archive.
Good luck!
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Have you looked at Cheshire mapping on line?
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Thanks both - Im not sure what Cheshire Mapping online is?
thanks again
M
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Type 'Cheshire mapping' into google and you will be given options, this is all I do to look at it!
Jx
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I think elzabels is referring to the online tithemaps site which also has maps from later dates - as you've mentioned the tithe map in your OP you've probably already been there, but in case:
http://maps.cheshire.gov.uk/tithemaps/
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I presume you've looked through the Wills? Potentially a lot of info in there.
Findmypast has been saying 'soon' for Cheshire land tax records for while, hopefully they will have them soon!
The tithemap site is another useful thing, but I think you have the family at that point, although it does tell you what land they had.
If you can find the landlords name on either the land tax or tithe, then you can look to see if their records survive.
I just had a look at the Land Tax Redemption for 1798, and there is a Matthew Shaw in Bosely, with the land owned by the The Earl of Harrington. Not sure what records survive, but it's a suggestion.
Hope some, or any, of that helps,
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Another really useful source which one should never overlook are old newspapers. I've found masses of information on the various farms that I've researched.
If a tenant farmer died or relinquished the tenancy there's a good chance you'll find a sale of his property at that particular farm.
Jayson
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Ashbrook, Jayson - thanks, great suggestions.
Jayson - any particular newspapers you know for the Cheshire region?
M
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Hi Mike,
Your local library may have access to the Gale Newspaper collections - otherwise it is possible to get access with a subscripton.
A couple more ideas for you:
Leases - I have copies of leases both 3 life and counterpart from some of my farming families. The 3 life leases are especially interesting as they are often amended with births and deaths of the named leasees.
MI's - sometimes mention the name of the farm
Oaths of Allegiance 1723
Poll Tax
Hearth Tax
There are a number of societies who published collections of information during the Victorian period, often taking earlier historical documents as their source, for example:
"Cheshire Notes and Queries - a quarterly journal of matters past and present connected with the County Palatine of Chester"
"The Cheshire Sheaf"
"Transactions of the Lancashire and Cheshire Antiquarian Society"
If you go to http://archive.org/index.php and put Cheshire in the Search with media type text you will see a large number of books. I've found some real gems in here such as a list of tithes from 1710 showing my 7xggrandfather Roger Bankes in Runcorn.
Parish Records - I don't mean the register, but the notes in the register about parish officials, pew seat allocations etc - and also the records of the parish such as paying for someone to catch rats, administration of funds to the poor etc.
These are all sources where I've found information to really make the family history live.
Hope this helps,
Jean
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Hi Mike
The paper that you should focus on is the Chester Chronicle as this covers farm sales for the whole county.
The sales are really easy to find and usually cover no more than one page so you don't have to go through pages and pages. I found a sale yesterday for a particular farm I'm researching.
Papers are a real gold mine of information. Quite often when someone leaves a farm they will sell all or most of their household furniture too.
The Chester Chronicle is available on MF at the Cheshire Record Office.
Good luck - Jay :)
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Thanks Jayson
I can see the Cheshire Chronicle online from 1806 - do you know if it was published before then? I'm trying to trace the farm in the C18th.
Thanks again
M
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In my previous post I mentioned the Gale Newspaper Collections - these have the 17th - 18th Century Newspaper collection which appears to have the Chester Chronicle from 1775 - 1784.
It's best to leave your search fairly open and then discard things that don't match rather than the other way round otherwise you might miss something - for example, Adam's Weekly Courant is also a Chester paper and included in the above collection
Also try searching for the placename as you may pick up peripheral references.
Jean
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Thanks again all - quick question, are the Gale Newspapers available online? From the website it seems that it is only available in libraries etc? I Iive in Singapore so do most of this stuff online you see.
M
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Hi Mike,
It's available here via either pay per view or subscription:
http://www.britishnewspaperarchive.co.uk/
Jean
PS. If you state on you profile where you are we will be able to give you more realistic information
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Hi Mike
The Chester Chronicle was first published in 1775. The Adams's Weekly Courant much earlier - about 1730ish
Jay :)
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Hi Mike please can I enquire about your interest in Swans Lake Farm. I understand the house burnt down in a fire some time ago and only a barn remains. The property/remains are on some land co-owned by a friend. I am looking for any information about the farm and if any pictures are available. thanks Martin
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Hi Martin
I don't have any pictures and haven't looked into this part of my family for a while. My Shaw ancestors lived at Swans Lake farm in the 1700s - Samuel and Sampson seem to be common family names. I do remember finding a list of burial plots in the Bosley register from 1566 which includes; 'Samuel Shaw for Swans Lacke' so the family may have been there many generations earlier than I have been able to find in the registers.
I also have some old tithe maps of the farm and surrounding fields.
Would be great to share any information of common interest - I'd love to visit one day. I grew up in South Manchester so not far away but now live in Vancouver.
Thanks for getting in touch
Mike