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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Argyllshire => Topic started by: RebeccaNZ on Saturday 14 July 12 00:53 BST (UK)
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Hi,
I hope that this doesn't get confusing, but I am trying to trace back the Mclean side of my family.
It starts with Donald Mclean born 1777 Inverchaolain, Bute, Scotland. He married Married Christina Mcphee and they moved to Australia.
From there back I have Donald's parents as John Mclean born 1750, Taunich Inverchaolain. Died 1830, Taunich and mother as Margaret Mcpherson, 1st August 1750, Inverchaolain they married 27 November 1776.
I have John Mclean's parents as Lachlan Mclean born 1714, Taunich Inverchaolian and Christiann White, married 1736 in Glentarsin.
Lachlan Mclean is the so of John Ardfinaig Mclean born 1680's Ardfenaig, Isle of Mull. And Catherine Mclean who married 16th July 1705, Ardfenaig, Isle of Mull.
John Ardfinaig Mclean son of Donald Killean Ross (of) Mull Mclean - born 1665 Kingerloch who married Mary Mclean.
From there back I get confused. I have Donald Killean Ross Mclean's father as John Garbh Mclean, but I am not sure if that is right.
I am looking for other people who might be tracing the same family line of Mclean's or someone knowledgable about the Mclean's from the Isle of Mull and around Inverchaolain. I'm not even sure if what I have so far is accurate so any help is very appreciated :)
Rebecca
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Hi Rebecca
Have you had a look at the information on this site http://mullgenealogy.co.uk/
You have been very successful in tracing back so far :)
Monica
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Hi Monica,
Yes I discovered that site last night, it was very helpful. It seems like my Mclean's left Mull around the 1700's. I would love to find other people who might be researching the same people :) I am not sure if what I have done so far is right or not.
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I am a descendant of Donald McLean and Christina McPhee who migrated to South Australia on the Navarino in 1837. They settled in Strathalbyn and they died there - Donald in 1855 and Christina in 1869.
A big red book (BRB) has been written about their descendants. It has a great deal of information, possibly including your family. Are you aware of this BRB? If not, you can contact the Strathalbyn Museum or I can help you get a copy of the sections you are interested in.
Did you know that this Donald and Christina came from Duisky in Argyleshire - not from Mull.
The question is : Is this the same Donald and Christina you are researching?
If it is the same, then I think you are pursing the wrong line. The parents of the Donald I know were possibly Allan McLean and Rachel Rankine. However there are a few other possibilities - Anna (unknown surname) with Allan McLean, or Margaret McBean with Alexander McLean, or maybe Rachel Rankin with John McLean. I doubt your suggestion of Margaret McPherson with John Mclean of Inverchaolain .
You posted your query 6 months ago, but if you are still interested, I would be glad to hear from you - for our mutual benefit.
From Don Gordon.
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I am a descendant of Donald McLean and Christina McPhee who migrated to South Australia on the Navarino in 1837. They settled in Strathalbyn and they died there - Donald in 1855 and Christina in 1869.
A big red book (BRB) has been written about their descendants. It has a great deal of information, possibly including your family. Are you aware of this BRB? If not, you can contact the Strathalbyn Museum or I can help you get a copy of the sections you are interested in.
Did you know that this Donald and Christina came from Duisky in Argyleshire - not from Mull.
The question is : Is this the same Donald and Christina you are researching?
If it is the same, then I think you are pursing the wrong line. The parents of the Donald I know were possibly Allan McLean and Rachel Rankine. However there are a few other possibilities - Anna (unknown surname) with Allan McLean, or Margaret McBean with Alexander McLean, or maybe Rachel Rankin with John McLean. I doubt your suggestion of Margaret McPherson with John Mclean of Inverchaolain .
You posted your query 6 months ago, but if you are still interested, I would be glad to hear from you - for our mutual benefit.
From Don Gordon.
Hi Don,
Thanks for the reply. This information is what I have got from another family member, so as to it being accurate or not then I can't really be sure of that.
What I have been given is Donald Mclean born 1772, Fort William, Inverness. I have his parents as Alexander Mclean and Margaret Mcpherson. I have always wondered about this date of birth, it seemed werid to me. There is a large number of people on ancestry.com who also have this same information as me.
I have Christina McPhee as born 1791 in Fife.
I am related through their daughter Mary Mclean born 1818 who married Adam Abercrombie in 1840 and died Strathalbyn 1889.
Does this seem to fit with the same Mclean family that you are related to? I would be interested to see what information you have and how it differs from mine. I will send you my e-mail address.
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Good news, we are researching the same family.
INFORMATION
It is worth looking at :-
• The big red book (BRB) “The History of Donald and Christina Mclean and their descendants” – printed in 1995
• “Their Name Liveth” by John Mathews – printed in 1998
I can help you get copies or extracts if you have not already come across them.
DONALD
It is interesting that you say that there is a large number of people on ancestry.com who have his parents as Alexander and Margaret. This might not be correct. The reason I think that they are NOT his parents is that there are no indications that they were living in the general area of Fort William. It is certain that Donald had connections with Duisky which is next to Blaich – both of these are near Fort William, across Lock Eil.
As I see it, the alternatives are :-
• 16th May 1772 - The BRB has Donald born in 1772 but this has not been able to be confirmed. GROS, the General Register Office of Scotland is the government body responsible and they operate a website www.scotlandspeople.gov.au. A search of parish records for Kilmallie, Argyll on this website did not find birth records for a Donald McLean in 1772. Maybe it was never registered. This date might still be correct as, although someone might guess the year, 1772, perhaps based on a statement of how old he was at a certain time, but it is not likely that someone has guessed the 16th May – so where did this come from? We need to check the sources which were accessed by the BRB.
• 23rd October 1774 – Donald McLean, son to John McLean and Christian McLean in Blaich (ref Scotland’s People, OPR births 520/00 0010 0011, Kilmallie, Argyll). This is the one nearest to the BRB. But the family bible indicates that his father was Alan (p6 of BRB).
• 17th September 1777 - Donald McLean, son of Duncan McLean and Catherine McMillan in Blaich (ref Scotland’s People, OPR births 520/00 0010 0029, Kilmallie, Argyll). But again, the family bible indicates that his father was Alan (p6 of BRB).
• 26th September 1779 – Donald McLean to Allan McLean & Rachel Rankon in Blaich (ref Scotland’s People, OPR births 520/00 0010 0040, Kilmallie, Argyll). This is the only one which is consistent with a note in the family bible (held at the Strathalbyn Museum)
CHRISTINA
I have no better indications about Christina McPhee’s birth except, as you say, she was born in 1791. Her father might have been Ewen McPhee and mother Mary. You say she was born in Fife but if so, I wonder how she met Donald as this is a long way from the Fort William area.
MARY
The following is the information that I have put together about Mary. Most of this is from the BRB.
Mary – born 2nd April 1818, baptized 5th April 1818 in KIlmarlie. Her parents were Donald and Christina.
• 1st husband : Adam ABERCROMBIE. Married on 29th Sept 1840 (ref Bev Hofman). It is reported that Mary and Adam were living in Hindley Street Adelaide in 1841. (H, p13) In 1846, when Donald was preparing his will, he named Adam as one of the executors - at this time he was a dealer in timber of Hindley Street, Adelaide. The will left him one of the lots in Hindley Street (maybe the place he was currently living) – it was number 4 and was only 16 feet wide because there were complications due to another road taking part. (H, p17). Adam died on 24th July 1849 – this was before Donald. Indeed there were 4 deaths in Mary’s little family within two years – three children and her husband. Much later she lost two other sons prematurely (at 19 years and 29 years). After Adam’s death, Mary moved to Strathalbyn with the one remaining child, Rachel. Their children were :-
o Christina : born 1841 in Adelaide, died 1849 in Adelaide
o Rachel : born 1844 in Adelaide, married xxxTURNER???
o Adam : born 1846 in Adelaide, died 1848 in Adelaide
o Mary : born 1848 in Adelaide, died 1849 in Adelaide
• 2nd husband : James BYRNE, born xxx in xxxx. Mary and James married on 4th May 1850 in the Holy Trinity Church in Adelaide. This was 9 months after Adam’s death. Maybe James died very soon because Mary married Duncan less than two years after marrying James. [Question : Maybe she never married James? What evidence to we have?]
• 3rd husband : Duncan McRAE. They married 25th Feb 1852. Duncan farmed in Lake Plains and later in Strathalbyn. He was one of the first trustees of the Milang Primary School in 1864. This school is claimed to be the oldest school building in South Australia still being used. Mary and Duncan had three children :-
o Duncan : born 29th Nov 1852 in xxxx, died on 2nd April 1881 in Strathalbyn.
o Catherine : born 1854 in xxxxx. Married William MORRIS in 1874 in Strathalbyn
o Allan : born 16th Nov 1856 in Milang. Married Berthe Aughusta SCHULTZE in 1881 in Port Augusta.
o Donald Hugh : born 9th Aug 1858 in Strathalbyn. Married Mary Ann GOLLAN, nee LAIDLAW in 1884 in Strathalbyn.
o Mary Anne Jane : twin born 7th Aug in 1860 in Kintail, SA. Married George WALLACE
o John James : twin born 7th Aug 1860 in Kintail, SA, died 17th January 1880.
• Mary died 22nd Sept 1889 – She was survived by her husband and four children but she saw the deaths of 5 of her children and two previous husbands.
From Don Gordon
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Thankyou for that. I am related through Rachel Abercrombie - she married Kendrick Alfred Turner, Gawler 1871.
I have found trying to research this family so confusing ... I suppose we wont be able to know for sure who his parents really were. I will try to track down this book that you mentioned and if I am ever in Australia or Adelaide I will go to the Museum.
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There's an error in the link provided above for Scotlandspeople. Try this:
http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk
Imber
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Hi Rebecca,
I have attached a copy of the relevant parts in the BRB. It is in jpeg. Please let me know if you have difficulty opening it (I can email it in pdf if that suits you better.)
I don't know if any of this is news to you.
Unfortunately there is very little about Rachel except that, tragically, she was the only surviving child of Mary's marriage to Adam. In 1848, her younger brother Adam jnr died of falling off a wagon wheel then just four months later her father, older sister Christina and baby sister Mary jnr died of charcoal gas poisoning.
Most of the information is about Rachel's half siblings, the McRaes, the first of whom was 8 years younger than Rachel.
It would be great if you are able to provide any information about the descendants of Rachel and Kendrick - there is talk of updating the BRB.
From Don Gordon
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Hi Don,
Here is my information on Rachel Abercrombie:
She married Kendrick Alfred Turner on 8 Sept. 1871 in Gawler, South Australia. She died 1908 Wokurna, South Australia
Their children:
Ellen 1872
Henry 1874
Catherine 1875
Elizabeth Jane 1876
Mary Abercromby 1878
Rachel 1879
Kendrick Browing 1880
John Henry 1884 - 1956 (my great, great grandfather)
Thanks for posting the attachment, it was very interesting :) Let me know if there is any other information that I can pass on.
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Hi,
I hope that this doesn't get confusing, but I am trying to trace back the Mclean side of my family.
It starts with Donald Mclean born 1777 Inverchaolain, Bute, Scotland. He married Married Christina Mcphee and they moved to Australia.
From there back I have Donald's parents as John Mclean born 1750, Taunich Inverchaolain. Died 1830, Taunich and mother as Margaret Mcpherson, 1st August 1750, Inverchaolain they married 27 November 1776.
I have John Mclean's parents as Lachlan Mclean born 1714, Taunich Inverchaolian and Christiann White, married 1736 in Glentarsin.
Lachlan Mclean is the so of John Ardfinaig Mclean born 1680's Ardfenaig, Isle of Mull. And Catherine Mclean who married 16th July 1705, Ardfenaig, Isle of Mull.
John Ardfinaig Mclean son of Donald Killean Ross (of) Mull Mclean - born 1665 Kingerloch who married Mary Mclean.
From there back I get confused. I have Donald Killean Ross Mclean's father as John Garbh Mclean, but I am not sure if that is right.
I am looking for other people who might be tracing the same family line of Mclean's or someone knowledgable about the Mclean's from the Isle of Mull and around Inverchaolain. I'm not even sure if what I have so far is accurate so any help is very appreciated :)
Rebecca
Inverchaolin is on the Cowell Peninsula. Donalds brother Archibald brings my line down. You have a bit more up line than I but it matches what I have. I live in Canada but have visited Dunoon etc. Mull is further up the coast . There was a MacLean gathering there last summer. Some of the family went and found out that the connection was quite distant. ( But that didn't matter). Of course it is all Argyllshire
Linda. Doran.
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Hi Linda,
Thanks for the reply! I would love to see what you have in your family tree. I can send you my e-mail address if thats ok with you.
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Hi Linda,
Thanks for the reply! I would love to see what you have in your family tree. I can send you my e-mail address if thats ok with you.
Are you on Ancestry? My tree is McLEAN_RUSSELL 2 family tree . Or is there a private way to send emails on RootsChat?
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There is a private way to exchange details which is via the Personal Message service (PMs). Just click on the small note/letter button under someone's username and it will take you straight through. You can also access this part of RootsChat via the 'My Messages' link in the top row of links.
Monica :)
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Sorry I have only just picked up on this thread.
I would recommend www.maclean.org as another possible research tool for you. No promises but you never know.
Regards,
Ian
webmaster mullgenealogy.co.uk and an attendee at the last (and others) MacLean Gathering in 2012.
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Hi Rebecca,
You state that Lachlan McLean (born 1714) in Inverchaolin is the son of John Ardfinaig McLean from the isle of Mull. How do you know that? Do you have seen any records or documents? There are about 30 family trees on ancestry.co.uk stating the same, but none shows a source, so I suspect, they have all copied from each other (as I did....). But isn't it strange that Lachlan staid in Inverchaolin, when is father lives on Mull? So if you have anything to convince me, I would be thankful!
Cheers Marion
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I too am having difficulty in tracing Adam Abercrombies parents. According to shipping docs he came from St Ninians (Scotland). There were two Abercrombie families at St Ninians at the time with several children but none named Adam unfortunately. He may have changed his name becuse I suspect he belongs to one of those families. I to am a direct descendant of Donald and Christian and have only gone back as far as you have Rebecca but I would love to know Christians parents. I am at present starting a memorial for the Abercrombies West Terrace unmarked burial plot.
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Hi
To possibly confuse the issue further - but if anyone knows anything new it’ll be great!
John McLean and Margaret McPherson McLean also had a daughter Margaret who was my gggggrandmother. Her Banns record luckily gives her parents and then a cousin of mine had a dan match with a descendant of one of the known children.
Margaret married Douglas McNuair (Weir) of Glendaruel and proceeded to have four children. One emigrated to Ballarat, Victoria, Australia and they lived there until my grandparents came to Western Australia. Some family is still in Victoria. Maybe we need to map everybody?
Hope some others are over here! :)
Why would Margaret’s birth not be recorded when everyone else was so meticulously done?
Regards
Anthea
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BTW in answer to the question of why would they have left Mull? I’ve just taken it that over time families did need to move to prevent overpopulation.
The clearings also happened in the 1770’s so it could also have been to do with that? Many reasons.
I’d think it’d make sense to move out. The older sons would need to stay on Mull and the younger ones go to other estates. In this case Taunich is a farm on the Glendaruel Estate. Does anyone know who owned it?
Cheers!
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Hi Rebecca,
You state that Lachlan McLean (born 1714) in Inverchaolin is the son of John Ardfinaig McLean from the isle of Mull. How do you know that? Do you have seen any records or documents? There are about 30 family trees on ancestry.co.uk stating the same, but none shows a source, so I suspect, they have all copied from each other (as I did....). But isn't it strange that Lachlan staid in Inverchaolin, when is father lives on Mull? So if you have anything to convince me, I would be thankful!
Cheers Marion
I can confirm that to date there are no records that show John Ardfinaig McLean is the son of Lachlan McLean (born 1714). The Ancestry entries that show this should be disregarded. In addition, I was unable to find a Donald McLean b:1777 marrying a Christina Mcphee. I would love to see any evidence that shows this. There is a Donald McLean (b:1776) in Inverchaolain but he married a Jean McDonald in 1801 and died in Argyllshire. Probably a different person.
Ray
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Hi Rebecca,
You state that Lachlan McLean (born 1714) in Inverchaolin is the son of John Ardfinaig McLean from the isle of Mull. How do you know that? Do you have seen any records or documents? There are about 30 family trees on ancestry.co.uk stating the same, but none shows a source, so I suspect, they have all copied from each other (as I did....). But isn't it strange that Lachlan staid in Inverchaolin, when is father lives on Mull? So if you have anything to convince me, I would be thankful!
Cheers Marion
I can confirm that to date there are no records that show John Ardfinaig McLean is the son of Lachlan McLean (born 1714). The Ancestry entries that show this should be disregarded. In addition, I was unable to find a Donald McLean b:1777 marrying a Christina Mcphee. I would love to see any evidence that shows this. There is a Donald McLean (b:1776) in Inverchaolain but he married a Jean McDonald in 1801 and died in Argyllshire. Probably a different person.
Ray
Hi, yes all the trees on ancestry are very confusing and I have wondered if they are wrong. It would be good to find out the real records for them!