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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Peeblesshire => Topic started by: hansa67 on Wednesday 01 August 12 02:09 BST (UK)
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She married John Ingles - Banns published July 1, 1785 - OPR 676/00 0020 0262 - Marriage July 10th 1785 - OPR 772/00 0020 0250 in Cockpen, Midlothian. They appear on the 1861 Edinburgh, St. Cuthberts, census and her birth place is given as Eddlestone, Peeblshire c. 1765?. Looking for info on birth and parents if possible.
This information isCrown copyright from www.national archives.gov.uk
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Hi Hansa
Good age of 93 that Helen Ingles/McKay is showing at in 1861. Guess her death cert didn't include her parents' details?
That entry from 1861, to help others:
John Inglis 48, foreman tailor, b. Edinburgh, Midlothian
Janet Inglis 49 b. Edinburgh
James Inglis 20
Helen Inglis 17
William Inglis 14
George S Inglis 12
Janet Inglis 10
Helen Inglis 93, mother b. Eddlestone, peebleshire
Helen Inglis 52, sister b. Temple, peebleshire
Address: 10 Catherine St, Ediburgh
Monica :)
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However, from other people's online research, wonder why mother Helen shows as deceased in 1856? This snippet is from daughter Katherine's death cert that year :-\
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I am just following the steps of other people connected to this line, who have generously added original certificates to their online trees (via Ancestry).
I do not think unfortunately that the 1861 census entry that you mention and is included above is connected :-\
John Ingles and Helen McKay's son John is showing as being born in 1792 in Tweedsmuir, Peeblesshire. The John Ingles showing in that 1861 census entry born some years later in Edinburgh.
John Jnr is showing as having married a Euphemia Thomson c.1818 in Peebleshire. His death shows in 1866 at the Poorhouse in Peebles. His parents from his DC show as:
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Monica - Thank-you so much for your help- I`m going to print this off and follow it through step by step so I don`t miss something and see where it leads me. I`m new at this so sometimes I have to take a minute to understand it all`.
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Take your time :) Really important that you make the right connections and understand how you have made these.
Out of interest, which of their children are you following? Seen a bit now so know some of their names!
Monica
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Hi Monica - 1961 census now gone - really did miss that death document for Katherine and it was on line!. This could also mean that Helen was not born 1865 in Eddlestone! But I`m sure the date isn`t too far off. I`m descended from their son Walter who married Barbara Hall - their son John Ingles married to Elizabeth Haig(Illigitamate -step father Johnstone) Their son Robert Ingles and Elizabeth Baxter to their daughter Elizabeth Haig Ingles ( my grandma) who immigrated to Canada in1908 and married Mathew Baldwin. A year ago I couldn`t have told you my grandmas maiden name!
I have noticed that there are many variations of Helens last name from McKie to mcCay and everything in between.
Cheers
This information Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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There is quite a bit on Walter and family on online trees. Have you seen all of this?
Monica
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Your beautiful grandmother Elizabeth Haig Ingles:
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Monica - that is my beautiful Grandmother when she graduated from Nursing School in Ontario Canada!
I put that on ancestry myself. I have quite a bit on Walter but it is at Helen MacKie that I hit a wall.
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Hi Monical - Guess I should explain the picture - thats my great grandad in Selkirk at the common riding festival - got the picture from my moms sister!
hansa67
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I love photos ;D Thought that might be Elisabeth's father Robert ;)
Re Helen McKay, I have looked many ways but struggle to find any leads for her :-\ I think likely both John Ingles and Helen McKay may have died pre 1841 - can't really see them in the census for that year.
Monica
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MonicaL - Walter also does not appear anywhere on the 1841 census that I can find so it is quite possible that they all passed before 1841. I was hoping that i might have missed a clue somewhere along the way!
I love pictures too! ;D ;D ;D
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From the OPR for the marriage of Helen McKay and John Inglis, the entry does seem to infer that Helen may have been from the parish of Cockpen. Finding relevant Mckay entries there for the relevant period is hard though:
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Monical - I will give Cockpen a try for records but I haven`t found anything there on the I.G.I. yet but have not given up. When you least expect it - something comes along! had no problem finding the Inglis records other than the name spelling changing from Ingles to Inglis and back again.
Once again - thanks for all your help - I really appreciate it.
hansa67
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Hi Monical - found a record on the I.G.I. for a baby girl Mackie born Nov. 25, 1765 in North Leith,Midlothian and christened the same day, - parents Alexander Mackie and Margaret Doig. Is there any way to find out if this Baby girl ever had a name. Seems odd if there was a christening that she didn`t have a name?
hansa
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Re the unnamed baby, you do find these types of entries very occasionally. It is sometimes thought that this type of entry (specially as you noted the birth and christening on the same day) may be that the baby was not expected to live long and went unnamed...
I did wonder about possible parents' names for Helen. Does the family have any more names in birth order for Helen and John Ingles? So far, I have only seen:
Walter 1786
Katherine 1790
John 1792
William 1793
Wondered whether they had followed any form of naming pattern for their children (example here www.halmyre.abel.co.uk/Family/naming.htm). Not always followed to the letter (sometimes not at all) but remarkable how often it was followed in a manner that can sometimes give clues on paternal/maternal grandparents' names.
See from everyone's research so far, that John Ingles' parents are thought to be Walter Ingles and Katherine Pillans who married in 1758 in Kirkurd, Peebleshire. Also, from what you have already, a likely birth for John in 1760 in the same place.
As you say, Helen is the problem. We haven't really moved on from there have we :-\
Monica
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Hi Monica - Just got a notice that my reply didn`t go thru so will try again.
I thought the same as you that the baby may not be well - on the oother hand - there have been christenings with names and the baby has passed shortly thereafter. This seems odd to have a christening with n name ?
Yes, the four children you named are the only children of Helen and John that I have found. Naming patterns are quite common in the family ( especially Walter and John) but every now and then there is an oddity. The four children you list are the only four that I have found. I put Alexander Mackie and Margaret Doig in my tree to see if anything would come up on ancestry that would give a clue but so far nothing of any help. One other tree with those two as parents doesn`t even mention the baby girl born that year so they can`t be relied on.
Yes, this mystry girl Helen is my nexus!