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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: dumbleton258 on Sunday 09 September 12 08:23 BST (UK)
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This is a strange story. Our Morton family, originally from Hamilton Farm, from 1830s -1850s has a medallion commemorating the opening of the Thames tunnel in 1833. We have no idea how it came into the family, now in Australia. The strange part is that a Rhys Morton, presumably a real person was a "ghostly" character in a book by Victor Canning. In the book Morton was supposedly an assistant to Brunel who built the tunnel. I have tried many avenues to locate Rhys Morton and any asssociation with Brunel without success. A Canning expert told me that Victor would not have made up the connection as he was particular in his research.Perhaps this is just one of those weird situations but I would appreciate any information listers could contribute to solve the mystery.
Geoff
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Query on the address - Hamilton Farm (Rd). Did you mean Hamilton Farm, Rutherglen, Lanarkshire without the Rd? Gray865
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Robert Morton was living at Hamilton Farm Row when he died in 1874. He was born around 1810. His son, Thomas was also living at Hamilton Farm at the time of his marriage in 1855.
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Hi, I realise this was posted a while ago but has just appeared on my radar as I am researching my family and have traced Robert Hamilton Morton and his wife Elizabeth Rennie (Rae on marriage record) who lived there. Could they be related?
Their daughter was named Margaret Hamilton Morton - was that usual ie to be named after the landowner? I thought the Scottish naming tradition would have given Margaret her Grandmother's maiden name or have I got that wrong?
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There are all sorts of reasons why a child may be given a name that doesn't fit the naming tradition.
Margaret is a very common given name for girls in Scotland. Why do you think the child was named after the landowner? Could she have been named after a relative who had just died?
What were the names of her grandmothers?
There is a record of the marriage of Robert Morton and Elizabeth Rennie in Rutherglen in 1844. Scotland's People has no record of a marriage of Robert Morton to Elizabeth Rae. They had at least Robert, 1849; William, 1852; Thomas, 1854; Elizabeth, 1856; Jane, 1858; Janet, 1862; Martha, 1864; Christina, 1866; and John, 1868. There is also a Margaret Hamilton Morton, mother Elizabeth Rae, in 1846.
This family was in Bothwell in 1861. Robert was 34, born in Rutherglen, and Elizabeth was 33, born Tollcross (Glasgow). Margaret is transcribed as Mary in the version I looked at. In 1851 they were in 'Village of Hamilton Farme' parish of Rutherglen.
In 1841 Robert is probably the one at New Farme, Rutherglen, with Robert Morton, 45 and Margaret Morton, 43. If this is your Robert it suggests that his mother, and hence Margaret's grandmother, was named Margaret.
Elizabeth Rennie, other surname Morton, died in Rutherglen in 1876 aged 48. You need to look at her death certificate to see what her mother's name was.
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Farme/Ferme, Farme Cross, Rutherglen, I knew it as Ferme when I worked nearby. The castle is long gone sadly! now just factory units. Hamilton Farm was part of the Farme estate, the Hamilton's acquired Farme from the Flemings, hence the name. Difficult URL just type it up.
https://www.glasgowwestaddress.co.uk/Old_Country_Houses/Farme.htm
Skoosh.
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Seems to be a bit of confusion re Mortons in Rutherglen at 1841 & 1851
2 separate families where the head of the household was called Robert.
Robert Morton age 32 with wife Mary JACKSON 32... (mistranscribed as Margt) 32 lived in Skirnhill at 1841
Children: Robert, Thomas, Jane, Janet and David.
At 1851, this same family was living at Hamilton Farme and have additional children named James and Christina.
Head of household on both returns is an Engineer/Engine Worker.
This family connects to mine.
Son James Morton bc 1845 was married twice and his daughter Christina Morton from his 2nd marriage married into my family.
Interestingly, in 1912, she also emigrated to Australia then moved to NZ.
I would guess that Thomas was part of this family.
MORTON
THOMAS
ROBERT MORTON/MARY JANET JACKSON FR499 (FR499)
M
28/02/1830
654/
30 80
Rutherglen
The other family who are at Farme on both the 1841 and 1851 returns is Robert Morton with wife Margaret.
This man was a Collier, around 10 yrs older than Robert (above) and there's no son named Thomas on either return.
It's likely that both men named Robert Morton worked at Farme Colliery.
Dumbleton states that Robert died in 1874 and his death was registered by his son Thomas.
This record will state this Robert's occupation and should also name his wife.
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Hi, sorry for the delay in replying but I am now wondering whether I have the wrong birth for ‘my' Margaret Hamilton Brown.
I have photos of the family bible which belonged to her and her husband, William Brown in which he gives her name as Margaret Hamilton Brown born 27 March 1846. I now think she was born in Cambroe Lanarkshire as stated on a census and this is also where William was from.
However, I can’t find her birth record in Scotland’s People or Ancestry s far. I will keep looking.
I know her and William married 14 June 1867 in Old Monkland Manse and I believe they had 11 children.
On the marriage record, William is from the Whifflet and Margaret from Coatbridge:
William’s parents are John Brown and Mary O’Brien.
Margaret’s parents are Robert Morton and her mother Elizabeth ?? – see snip. I am not sure of the surname.
Many thanks once again.
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So that snip is Elizabeth Rainey/Rennie. I have that on her marriage to Robert Morton in 1876. There it shows her mother was Margaret Rennie nee Hamilton. So that clears that up but still need to find the birth of Margaret Hamilton Morton born 1846.
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I have photos of the family bible which belonged to her and her husband, William Brown in which he gives her name as Margaret Hamilton Brown born 27 March 1846. I now think she was born in Cambroe
That will be Carnbroe not Cambroe.
However, I can’t find her birth record in Scotland’s People or Ancestry s far.
If it's not on Scotland's People it is not going to be on Ancestry unless submitted by someone who has seen the same family bible. See https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=714261.0
In fact, I think that the baptism of Margaret Hamilton Morton, parents Robert Morton and Elizabeth Rae, on 19 April 1846 is almost certainly your Margaret, with the mother's maiden surname incorrectly recorded, baptised at about three weeks old. There is also a Mary, baptised 26 December 1847. Between them they nicely fill the gap between the marriage of Robert Morton and Elizabeth Rennie in 1844 and the baptism of their son Robert in 1849. Have you actually looked at the original baptism on Scotland's People gives a date of birth? If not, I suggest that you do so now.
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Hi Forfarian, I have the marriage record of Margaret and William Brown confirming she is 21 and living in Coatbridge, and William Whifflet, Old Monkland and her parents are Robert Morton and Elizabeth Rainey/Rennie.
I know my grandfather's family were from Whifflet and Old Monkland area which makes more sense (William was born Carnbroe, Whifflet 3 March 1843 as stated in his family Bible) and their first child John was born 1 Aug 1867, Nelson's Land, Whifflet (again from the bible).
Sorry I am unsure as to which original baptism on Scotland's People gives a date of birth? Do you mean for Margaret Hamilton Morton b 1846?
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I do have the record of MHM born 19 April 1846 which is how I went down the Hamilton's Land track.
I appreciate the link; people like me must be very frustrating :)
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And now I have found Margaret's death cert 30 April 1900. Just wish I could find her birth record or baptism but as usual, SP's parameters rarely produce results for me.
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Sorry I am unsure as to which original baptism on Scotland's People gives a date of birth? Do you mean for Margaret Hamilton Morton b 1846?
Yes.
The original of the baptism, which is indexed on Scotland's People, may state the actual date of birth. It may also name the witnesses to the baptism, which might provide a clue. It may say what Robert's occupation is, or where he resided.
If you got it from anywhere else, it is not a record; it is either a transcription or an index listing.
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Ok I will have to email SP as it just isn't coming up for me.
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Are you looking in Advanced Search > church registers > births and baptisms and searching for Morton, Margaret, 1846?
If you put Hamilton in as her middle name it won't come up because it is truncated in the index to just Hamilt.
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Thanks but I have that cert, but now don't think that's not my Margaret.
My Margaret Hamilton Morton (who married William Brown 14 June 1867 in Old Monkland) - her mother is Elizabeth Rennie on the certs I have. I just cant find MHM birth cert to parents Robert Morton and Elizabeth Rennie.
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Thanks but I have that cert, but now don't think that's not my Margaret.
My Margaret Hamilton Morton (who married William Brown 14 June 1867 in Old Monkland) - her mother is Elizabeth Rennie on the certs I have. I just cant find MHM birth cert to parents Robert Morton and Elizabeth Rennie.
No, because Elizabeth Rennie is probably wrongly recorded as Elizabeth Rae in the register of baptisms.
I am not asking whether you have the marriage certificate - I know you have that. You have obviously not seen the original of the baptism of Margaret Hamilton Morton, daughter of Robert Morton and Elizabeth Rae, in Rutherglen on 19 April 1946, because if you had it would have fully answered your question. You owe me 6 credits :)
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Hi Forfarian, sorry for the delay but I am so confused by this.
I have that record; that's the source of the reference to Hamilton's Land at the start of my thread. Sorry you paid for it too; I'd be very happy to return the gesture.
So are you saying that Margaret's Hamilton's Mother is Elizabeth Rennie (married to William Brown (b 3 March 1843 in Carnbroe) but that in Margaret's birth record Elizabeth's surname was incorrectly recorded as Rae? Or are you saying her mother was Rae? If the former, I am now confused by Rutherglen when they are from Whifflet/Carnbroe area
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Hi Forfarian, sorry for the delay but I am so confused by this.
So are you saying that Margaret's Hamilton's Mother is Elizabeth Rennie but that in Margaret's birth record Elizabeth's surname was incorrectly recorded as Rae?
Yes, exactly that.
I am now confused by Rutherglen when they are from Whifflet/Carnbroe area
Your first post in this thread said they were from Hamilton Farm.
I have yet to find her in the 1871 census, but she should be in the parish of Old Monkland, because that's where Whifflet is.
The 1881 census says Margaret was born in Carnbroe like her husband.
The 1891 census says she was born in Cambuslang.
I see that she died in 1900 which explains why I can't find her in the 1901 census.
So at least one of those birthplaces has to be wrong because Carnbroe is in the parish of Bothwell, not in the parish of Cambuslang.
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It's been a while but just came across this article on the Farme Colliery Engine,
https://www.culturenlmuseums.co.uk/blog/the-mysteries-of-the-farme-colliery-engine/
Bests,
Skoosh.