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General => Armed Forces => Armed Forces Resources => Topic started by: seaweed on Tuesday 06 November 12 18:08 GMT (UK)
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I have on file the Movements of all British Troopships from 1939 until 1961. Ships that were lost as a result of enemy action or marine causes are not included.
Thee documents are copies of the originals in the National Archives pieces MT40/142 to MT40/149.
When I get round to it hopefully they will be published online. Meanwhile if anyone needs a look up, just PM me.
SW
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Hi Seaweed,[Duluse ;D] have you got the "Empire Ken" Southhampton to Cyprus 1957? B/B
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See attached
sláinte! SW
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thanks seaweed, just saw my 10 day cruise left southampton 12th july arrived Limasol 22nd 1957.sure brings back memories. :) :)
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Might you have any info on SS Nevasa please?
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I am away from home at the moment. Will get back to you on this one.
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Hi Seaweed,
I`m also interested in the Nevasa do you have any details
for June/July 1961 please?
Dovecote
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NEVASA Sailed Port Said 1/June/1961
Arrived Gibraltar 6/6 sailed same day
Arrived Southampton 9/6 sailed after voyage repairs 30/6
Arrived Tobruk 7/7 sailed same day
Arrived Port Said 8/7, transit Suez Canal, sailed Suez 9/7
Arrived Aden 13/7 sailed same day
Arrived Columbo 18/7 sailed same day
Arrived Penang 21/7 sailed 22/7
Arrived Singapore 23/7 sailed 24/7
Arrived Hong Kong 28/7 sailed 29/7
Arrived Singapore 2/August/1961
Gene Genius, if you can give the dates your interested in, please
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Thank you so much,
I was on this voyage as a child, celebrating my eleventh birthday at sea. Attending
lessons aboard - all ages together.
My brother caused mayhem for my mother by swimming out to the Shark safety nets
at one of the ports. I vividly remember people throwing coins to into the water at
Port Said for a young local boy to dive in and retrieve , his cheeks bulging.
I experienced my first very wet Trishaw ride in Penang.
Arriving in Singapore was magical, mysterious and exciting, a palm fringed shore, strangely
dressed people but most of all Dad was there to meet us after a long separation.
We were lucky to have experienced this journey as children, it was great fun.
Once again Thank you Seaweed, I now have exact dates for family photographs.
The only one I as sure of was that we are at sea on my birthday!
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I have on file the Movements of all British Troopships from 1939 until 1961. Ships that were lost as a result of enemy action or marine causes are not included.
Thee documents are copies of the originals in the National Archives pieces MT40/142 to MT40/149.
When I get round to it hopefully they will be published online. Meanwhile if anyone needs a look up, just PM me.
SW
Hi Seaweed,
Would this include ships that repatriated men held as Japanese POW's?
They don't seem to be listed on any incoming passenger lists to the UK, and so I assume they must have been returned on Troopships?
Unfortunately I don't have a ship's name, and so that probably makes looking for my late Uncle, Ernest Rencella Wilson, (1897 - 1957) a bit like looking in the proverbial haystack!
Romilly.
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Without the name of a ship, yes you are looking for the proverbile needle in a haystack. The records I have only give the ships movements. No details of passengers.
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Do you know why the file ends in 1961 instead of December 1963? I did ask you by PM back in July but had no reply.
Jebber
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Sorry must have missed your PM. There maybe records which may be from later dates. if you tell me what ship are you interested in, I'll take a look.
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Thanks seaweed,
I was just curious, as trooping by sea ended with the sailing of the Oxfordshire to Malta and back in December 1962, I know because I was on board.
Jebber
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Yes. you would be correct. Her last trooping voyage commenced Southampton 4/December/1962
Arrived Gibraltar 7/12 sailed same day
Arrived Malta 10/12 sailed 13/12
Arrived Gibraltar 16/12 sailed same day
Arrived Southampton 19/12 Disembarked 20/December/1962
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Thank you seaweed.
It was a sad day when sea trooping ended, unlike some people my husband and I enjoyed it. Happy days.
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Hello seaweed,
What would you have regarding SS Asturias ?
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I have details of her movements from 30/Oct/1952 until 27/Aug/1957
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The last Troopship I know of was the SS Canberra 1982. British Falkland Islands and return. I have fond memories of her. She transported my wife and I to Port Everglades, Florida from Southampton 1981 as fare paying passengers.
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I have details of her movements from 30/Oct/1952 until 27/Aug/1957
I left Southampton on her October 1948 bound for Australia as a free passage ex serviceman.
She was still in troopship mode ........ but the meals were fantastic.
Joe
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Hi Seaweed,
Would this include ships that repatriated men held as Japanese POW's?
They don't seem to be listed on any incoming passenger lists to the UK, and so I assume they must have been returned on Troopships?
Unfortunately I don't have a ship's name, and so that probably makes looking for my late Uncle, Ernest Rencella Wilson, (1897 - 1957) a bit like looking in the proverbial haystack!
Romilly.
Hello Romilly,
I am sure we have been in touch before about your uncle as his name rings a bell. I have checked all my PoW files and his name is not mentioned. I take it that there is no mention of his return in ADM 340/147/21 - http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=D8294305
Regards
Hugh
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I have details of her movements from 30/Oct/1952 until 27/Aug/1957
I left Southampton on her October 1948 bound for Australia as a free passage ex serviceman.
She was still in troopship mode ........ but the meals were fantastic.
Joe
See http://www.ssasturias.net/voyageandrepairlogs.html
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I have details of her movements from 30/Oct/1952 until 27/Aug/1957
I left Southampton on her October 1948 bound for Australia as a free passage ex serviceman.
She was still in troopship mode ........ but the meals were fantastic.
Joe
See http://www.ssasturias.net/voyageandrepairlogs.html
Thanks for that .. she left Southampton 27.10.48 and arrived Sydney 4.12.48.
Joe
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The last Troopship I know of was the SS Canberra 1982. British Falkland Islands and return. I have fond memories of her. She transported my wife and I to Port Everglades, Florida from Southampton 1981 as fare paying passengers.
I sailed in the Canberra in October 1966 when working on board for Thos Cook & Son Ltd selling shore excursions. I have a full description of what happened in my memoirs and anyone interested may send me a PM and I'll dig it out. It was a 4 week cruise from Sydney to Japan and Hong Kong and return to Sydney.
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I took snaps of many of the troopships in the Harbour at Aden when I served in the RAF there from March 1952 through to March 1954.
We flew in a Lancaster Air Services York from Blackbushe to Luqa then Fayid. Then after 10 days at El Hamra went down the Red Sea to Aden in the Mohammedi.
So Seaweed have you got a record of that one?
Several truckloads of airmen went down to Abadiyah just past Suez and we spent a whole day in desert surroundings waiting for the ship to arrive. After it anchored hordes of East African Rifles came ashore, then another long wait. Finally the word went around, the MO had condemned the troopdecks so a long drive back to El Hamra. Very late at night before we had got bedding and a tent again. Then I was woken around 1am, and my name being on a short list was told to be up and ready at 6am. This time only one truck and we went straight on board to be given StateRooms would you believe!!! We blew a boiler on the way down the Red Sea which no one complained about as it turned the voyage into a 4 day cruise.
Two years later when tour expired I was down to return on the Empire Windrush. But the days went by and she still didn't arrive. The Georgic passed her in the Indian Ocean and those of us well over our tour of duty in Aden were transferred to the Georgic.
Would you have those dates please, Seaweed?
This time it was a ten berth cabin, and since all duties had been allocated to bods who embarked in the Far East, we only got to get down on our knees on one day sloshing water and sea soap about to clean the corridor.
I shall never forget arriving in Liverpool within sight of the Liver Birds. Howls of derision went up from the troops lining the railings when we saw our fist Teddy Boys on the Quay side. They beat a hurried departure. But the worst was the news that morning that the Empire Windrush had gone down off Algiers. Had I not been transferred to Georgic I would have arrived home wearing French Foreign Legion uniform. 4 men from the Engine Room were lost.
Another memory of that morning was when queuing up for travel rations and as a burly docker came by the Tannoy Bell rang out. 'Was that fer Lah?" he said in some surprise in broad Scouse.
MOD COMMENT: IMAGE REMOVED AS PER ROOTSCHAT COPYRIGHT POLICY
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EMPIRE WINDRUSH suffered an engine room explosion and caught fire 30 miles off Algiers. She was abandoned at 0630 on the 29/March/1954 and sank at 1100 hrs the same day.
The only voyage of GEORGIC any where near that date is.
Arrived Aden 6/March/1954 sailed same day
Arrived Port Said 10/3 sailed 11/3
Arrived Liverpool 19/3 Disembarkation complete 0930hrs
De stored by 22/3 and returned to civilian role.
I understand she made further trooping voyages in late 1954/early 1955 and later served on the migrant service to Australia. She was broken up Faslane 1/2/56.
MOHAMMEDI made several voyages on the route and timescale you describe in early 1952. She was returned to her owners in July 1952.
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Many Thanks Seaweed. Just shows how things get a little muddled in the mind after 60 years. So it was ten days after I got home that the Empire Windrush went. I had so much disembarkation leave and accumulated leave I had a lot more on my mind I guess.
But I had another near miss and that was definitely on the morning that I was on my way to join the Batory Cruise from Southampton. That time I was selling shore excursions on board for Cook's in Berkeley Street, London.
I'm pretty sure that it was on 23rd December 1963 when I stopped first of all at Berkeley Street to pick up the tickets. While waiting for the guys in Cruise Dept to arrive I naturally had a word with my mates in Overseas Reception. Hadn't been there long when the phone rang to tell us that the Lakonia with Geoff on board was on fire somewhere south of Portugal. From memory I think the Lakonia set sail on 19th December and she caught fire in the hairdresser's salon. We had 4 staff on board including a young lad from Watford only 19 years old. He was killed when jumping into the sea - his life jacket broke his neck they said.
About a month earlier when we got our sailings Geoff tried every persuasion to get our cruises changed. He wanted the Batory as he had been to Madeira and the Canaries so many times, and the Batory's itinerary was Southampton/Cadiz/Palma/Malta/Tunis/Cagliari/Algiers/Gibralta/So’ton. Geoff had never been to Cadiz Tunis or Cagliari. Fortunately for myself Geoff was senior to me and they needed someone in charge on the Lakonia. They were in the Cinema when the alarm went and 'Abandon Ship'. Geoff made it to a lifeboat, but many didn't. He was picked up by a freighter and landed in Madeira. When he finally flew from Lisbon to Heathrow the BEA steward was none other than our neighbour and good friend Albert.
Two other small ships I sailed in across the North Sea came to grief a few years after I was on them, Kronprinz Frederic burned out in Harwich and another the Duke of Lancaster which got cut in half when hit by a freighter.
It was a tragic year for Geoff as a month earlier he had gone to Malta on holiday and another good friend from Cooks was drowned while swimming there.
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Hi Seaweed,
Would this include ships that repatriated men held as Japanese POW's?
They don't seem to be listed on any incoming passenger lists to the UK, and so I assume they must have been returned on Troopships?
Unfortunately I don't have a ship's name, and so that probably makes looking for my late Uncle, Ernest Rencella Wilson, (1897 - 1957) a bit like looking in the proverbial haystack!
Romilly.
Hello Romilly,
I am sure we have been in touch before about your uncle as his name rings a bell. I have checked all my PoW files and his name is not mentioned. I take it that there is no mention of his return in ADM 340/147/21 - http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=D8294305
Regards
Hugh
Hello Hugh,
Yes, - you have given previous very helpful assistance with tracing records on my late Uncle Ernest Rencella Wilson.
I believe that I already have that record from Kew, - it relates to Ernest's RNR Service in WW1.
I am still trying to piece together what happened to Ernest in WW2... I have his WW2 Medal Record, but can find no trace of him being a Japanese POW, - although anecdotal family stories say he was:-(
Romilly.
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Hi Seaweed
I wondered if you were able to search for troopships by date. My father arrived in Govan on 10 September 1943 from Gibraltar - I would be very interested in the name of the ship he was on. There is also a story in the family that when they first left Gibraltar they were fired upon and had to return to port - not sure if they then carried on later in the same ship or if they had to change ships. thanks in advance for any info you may have. Lynne
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great thread 8)
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Convoy MKF 22 arrived in the Clyde on the 9/Sept/1943. Normally troops would be disembarked the next day.
No other troop convoys with the exception of two single vessel troop convoys the US flagged GENERAL JOHN POPE on the 12th from Hampton Roads and the French vessel CHAMPOLLIAN from Iceland on the 7th, arrived in the Clyde area between the 5th and the 15th of September 1943.
My guess is your man was part of MKF 22.
Problem is there were 3 troopships that sailed from Gibraltar and others that sailed from nearby ports.
The Gibraltar contingent comprised CAMERONIA, DEMPO (Dutch) and DOMINION MONARCH.
Researching troopships is always difficult because of the obvious security considerations. Army War diaries rarely give names of vessels but as a rule referred to them in code. This code changed from one convoy to the next.
Take a look here
http://www.convoyweb.org.uk/mkf/index.html?mkf.php?convoy=22!~mkfmain
You will note both CAMERONIA and DOMINION MONARCH had some problems. I know DOMINIAN MONARCH underwent repairs at Liverpool until 16/October/1943 but have no record of CAMERONIA.
I think your best bet is to look at the convoy reports at Kew to try and find out which vessel, if any was attacked and returned to Gibraltar.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/s/res?_aq=&_ep=mkf+22&_or1=&_or2=&_or3=&_nq1=&_nq2=&_nq3=&_sd=&_ed=&_col=0&_sw=ref&_cr1=adm&_cr2=&_cr3=&_ps=15&_ro=any&_rd=&_rsd=&_red=&_fr=&_st=adv
Do you have the name of your mans regiment or unit?
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Thanks so much for your reply. Dad was in the Royal Engineers, 278 company,
703 Artisan Workers - building the airstrip on Gibraltar.
We have the date of 10/9/43 on a telegram from Govan to my mother saying he had landed that morning.
My sister will be visiting Kew hopefully in the near future and this will give her something to go on.
Lynne
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I am not that familiar with Army records but it may pay your sister to look here also.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C798197
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Without people like seaweed our current history of Matters Maritime would be totally lost ...... a lot of rootschatters have benefitted from his input.
seaweed deserves the rootschat Medal of Honour. :) :)
joboy
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This looks interesting. Have you any details of a troopship carrying 1st Royal Fusiliers from Bombay (I think) to Egypt. Believe embarcation Sept 23rd 1939, arrival Egypt about October 3rd?
Many thanks
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Without people like seaweed our current history of Matters Maritime would be totally lost ...... a lot of rootschatters have benefitted from his input.
seaweed deserves the rootschat Medal of Honour. :) :)
joboy
I'll second that!
Romilly :)
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Tracing the movements of Troopships and what units they transported, is always difficult due to security issues.
Given the the information you have posted I am afraid the search paramiters are too large.
I note you have made a post on the main WW2 board. Let's see if there is any information posted which may give a clue.
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Thank you joboy and Romilly.
regards SW
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Thank you for reply Seaweed. Yes, I hope something might come from the main WW2 board but understand it is all some time ago! Meanwhile, do the dates quoted give any clue as to which ship? If not, what other information would enable the field to be narrowed?
Again, thank you for all your efforts.
FBB
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I am trying to find the date in 1954 when I sailed from Liverpool to Kure aboard the HMT Lancashire .
I think it would be between August and December.
Whilst we were on route a lad fell down some stairs and died from his injuries and he was buried at sea.
Hope you can help.
Best regards,
Jim Tilbury
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Hi Jim,
up to now no dates, but two photos of HMT Lancashire:
http://www.rafchangi.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Lancashire.1.jpg (http://www.rafchangi.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Lancashire.1.jpg)
https://sites.google.com/site/hmtships/Lancashire.jpg (https://sites.google.com/site/hmtships/Lancashire.jpg)
Rudolf
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I am trying to find the date in 1954 when I sailed from Liverpool to Kure aboard the HMT Lancashire .
I think it would be between August and December.
Arrived Liverpool 30/Aug/1954 Sailed 21/9
Arrived Port Said 2/10 Sailed 2/10
Arrived Aden 7/10 Sailed 7/10
Arrived Columbo 14/10 Sailed 14/10
Arrived Singapore 20/10 Sailed 20/10
Arrived Hong Kong 25/10 Sailed 25/10
Arrived Kure 30/10 Sailed 12/ Nov/1954
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Hi Seaweed.
Thank you very much for the info. It was most helpful.
Best regards
Jim
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Hi Seaweed,
Hopefully you can help. I am trying to find out if the Devonshire sailed from Southampton to Cyprus on the 1st July 1959 and when it reached Limassol. I believe my late father was on this ship.
It would be much appreciated if you could confirm this.
Thank you for your help.
Peter.
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Seaweed, could you let me know if the City of Exeter was a troopship on 5th November 1941, or was it just a normal passenger ship at this time?
If it was, would you have any idea when it arrived at Calcutta.
The reason for my query is that my parents left Glasgow aboard, for Calcutta in 1st class. He was a missionary, and my mother was a housewife, on the record I have from the National Archives.
A Chesters
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DEVONSHIRE official number 166272
Arrived Southampton 22/June/1959 Sailed 3/7/1959
Arrived Malta 10/7/59 Sailed same day
Arrived Tripoli 11/7/59 Sailed same day
Arrived Limassol 14/7/59 Sailed 16/July/1959
I guess 1/July/1959 was the date that your father embarked. She underwent voyage repairs at Southampton between 22/6 and 3/July/1959
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CITY OF EXETER official number 136297
As far as I am aware she was still sailing as a merchant passenger ship in 1941
Her movement card which should tell you for certain and give details of her movements is available to download.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=D8649697
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Hello,
here are two photos of SS CITY OF EXETER (Ellerman Lines; launched in 1914 / scrapped in 1950)
http://www.exetermemories.co.uk/em/_transport/namedexeter.php (http://www.exetermemories.co.uk/em/_transport/namedexeter.php)
In 1940 she met the German Raider C:
"On 2 May, she met the British passenger liner SS City of Exeter. Rogge, unwilling to cause non-combatant casualties, declined to attack. Once the ships had parted, Exeter's Master radioed his suspicions about the "Japanese" ship to the Royal Navy."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_auxiliary_cruiser_Atlantis (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_auxiliary_cruiser_Atlantis)
Rudolf
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Thank you both for that information. Seaweed, I will follow up the archive information you gave me.
Rudolf, your wikipedia mention brings vague memories about the Atlantis. I have this feeling that the captain was a German sailor, not a nazi, so was as much of a gentleman as was possible during the war.
Again, many thanks
A Chesters
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@ A Chesters,
your feeling is right.
"Rogge also was one of the few German officers of flag rank who was not arrested by the Allies after the war. This was due to the way he had exercised his command of Atlantis."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernhard_Rogge (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernhard_Rogge)
As far as I know, the ship had from time to time several hundred "guests" in the freight rooms and Rogge handled all occurring problems absolutely correct.
Rudolf
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DEVONSHIRE official number 166272
Arrived Southampton 22/June/1959 Sailed 3/7/1959
Arrived Malta 10/7/59 Sailed same day
Arrived Tripoli 11/7/59 Sailed same day
Arrived Limassol 14/7/59 Sailed 16/July/1959
I guess 1/July/1959 was the date that your father embarked. She underwent voyage repairs at Southampton between 22/6 and 3/July/1959
Thank you for your quick answer. Very helpful indeed. So Dad reached Cyprus 55 years ago today.
Peter.
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Hi Seaweed
Do you have the Empire Ken (Limassol to Southampton) for December 1955, I believe she docked in Southampton 1st/2nd Jan 1956 ....
Regards
sre
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Empire Ken (formerly SS Ubena German East Afrika Line)
Southampton to Mombassa June 1951
Lots of memories on this voyage but these are abiding ones.
Sandstorm at Masawa (Eritrea) - had to make sure the vents were closed otherwise you got a cabin full of sand.
Swahili lessons to prepare us for life and communication in Kenya - one 4 year old lad got fed up and went walkabout- he found an opened tin of red paint and a paint brush and amused himself by painting the funnel!
Severe storm in the Indian Ocean between Aden and Mombassa causing us to slow right down and lose a couple of days on that leg of the voyage.
Happy days
radstockjeff
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Hi Seaweed
Do you have the Empire Ken (Limassol to Southampton) for December 1955, I believe she docked in Southampton 1st/2nd Jan 1956 ....
Regards
sre
Arrived Limassol 17/Dec/1955 from Algiers Sailed 18/12/55
Arrived Port Said 19/12/55 Sailed 20/12/55
Arrived Southampton 29/12/55 Sailed 10/Jan/1956 after voyage repairs.
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Empire Ken (formerly SS Ubena German East Afrika Line)
Southampton to Mombassa June 1951
Lots of memories on this voyage but these are abiding ones.
Sandstorm at Masawa (Eritrea) - had to make sure the vents were closed otherwise you got a cabin full of sand.
Swahili lessons to prepare us for life and communication in Kenya - one 4 year old lad got fed up and went walkabout- he found an opened tin of red paint and a paint brush and amused himself by painting the funnel!
Severe storm in the Indian Ocean between Aden and Mombassa causing us to slow right down and lose a couple of days on that leg of the voyage.
Happy days
radstockjeff
Sailed Southampton 28/June/1951
Arrived Algiers 3/7/51 Sailed same day
Arrived Port Said 8/7/51 Sailed 10/7/51
Arrived Port Sudan 13/7/51 Sailed same day.
Arrived Massawa 14/7/51 Sailed same day
Arrived Aden 15/7/51 Sailed 16/7/51
Arrived Kilindindi (Mombasa) 22/7/51 Sailed 24/July/1951
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Many thanks for that Seaweed ....
I was a child on that voyage, I remember we didn't get much sleep that night in Port Said as it was fog bound and we were kept awake all night by the fog horns sounding ....
Thanks for your help and keep up the good work
Regards
sre
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Hello Seaweed.
Do you know which troopship left Singapore on 24 August 1957 please? I went out to Malaya for National Service on 28.04.1956 from Liverpool, but have no recollection of which ship I returned on.
Any information you can supply would be most welcome.
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Could it be EMPIRE FOWEY official number 180840
Sailed from Singapore 24/Aug/1957
Arrived Southampton 17/Sept/1957
Via Columbo, Aden, Suez, Port Said, Limassol
There is plenty of info on this vessel via the internet.
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Hi Seaweed,
Do your lists include January/February 1961?
If so, it would be incredibly helpful if you could find which troopship left Cyprus on or around 28/01/1961 to return to England.
Thank you for the great service you are providing!
Peter.
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Thank you very much Seaweed. I had a feeling that it might have been the Empire Fowey, but needed confirmation.
We definitely came into Southampton and moored next to the Queen Elizabeth, which absolutely dwarfed us.
I'm delighted to have been given this information as it doesn't appear on my record of service.
Thanks again.
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Hi Seaweed,
Do your lists include January/February 1961?
If so, it would be incredibly helpful if you could find which troopship left Cyprus on or around 28/01/1961 to return to England.
Thank you for the great service you are providing!
Peter.
OXFORDSHIRE official number 187155 sailed from Famagusta 29/Jan/1961
Gibraltar 2/2/1961
Arrived Southampton 5/2/1961
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Hi Seaweed,
Do your lists include January/February 1961?
If so, it would be incredibly helpful if you could find which troopship left Cyprus on or around 28/01/1961 to return to England.
Thank you for the great service you are providing!
Peter.
OXFORDSHIRE official number 187155 sailed from Famagusta 29/Jan/1961
Gibraltar 2/2/1961
Arrived Southampton 5/2/1961
Thank you so much. That is brilliant.
Peter.
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Seaweed, very sorry to ask for more information but the ship I am looking for reached Cyprus on 7th July 1959 so it can't be the Devonshire. Have you got a troopship that left England on 1st July and reached Cyprus around that date?
Sorry to have to ask for more help.
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Seaweed, very sorry to ask for more information but the ship I am looking for reached Cyprus on 7th July 1959 so it can't be the Devonshire. Have you got a troopship that left England on 1st July and reached Cyprus around that date?
Sorry to have to ask for more help.
Only one vessel comes near, EMPIRE FOWEY official number 180840
Sailed Southampton 30/6/1959
Arrived Limassol 8/7/1959
These dates are somewhat approximate. She could have sailed at 00.01 on 1/7/59 and arrived 23.59 on 7/7/59. To get a totally accurate timescale you would need to look at her logbook. Problem is Troopships sometimes did not record timings in their logbooks for security reasons.
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Seaweed, very sorry to ask for more information but the ship I am looking for reached Cyprus on 7th July 1959 so it can't be the Devonshire. Have you got a troopship that left England on 1st July and reached Cyprus around that date?
Sorry to have to ask for more help.
Only one vessel comes near, EMPIRE FOWEY official number 180840
Sailed Southampton 30/6/1959
Arrived Limassol 8/7/1959
These dates are somewhat approximate. She could have sailed at 00.01 on 1/7/59 and arrived 23.59 on 7/7/59. To get a totally accurate timescale you would need to look at her logbook. Problem is Troopships sometimes did not record timings in their logbooks for security reasons.
Thank you. Those dates fit with the service record I've. Absolutely brilliant.
Thank's for all your help.
Peter.
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Hi Seaweed,
Do you have the name of the troopship that the Lancashire Fusiliers sailed to Cyprus on in June 1957?
Left Southampton 7/6/1957 and arrived Limassol 17/6/1957.
Thank you for your help.
Peter.
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Hi seaweed
Do you have any data on British India Steam Company SS Aronda that took 42 RTR to the middle east in April/May 1941?
Thanks
Clive P
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She was built in 1941 and this was her first voyage. 9031 tons, Coal fired Steam Turbine, Twin Screw.
She could accommodate 166 in her first class cabins and had capacity on her troop decks for 1662 OR.
She was part of Convoy WS8A (fast)
Sailed from the Clyde 26/April/1941
Arrived Freetown 9/5/41 Sailed 13/5/41
Arrived Durban 27/5/1941 Sailed 31/5/1941
Arrived Suez 13/6/1941 Sailed 17/6/1941
There is an excellent description of this Convoy in the book "The Winston Specials" Troopships via the Cape 1940-1943 by Archie Munro. ISBN 1-904459-20-X Published by Maritime Books Liskeard, Cornwall PL14 4EL.
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Thanks Seaweed. I've ordered the book and look forward to reading more.
Clive P
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Hello,just wondering if you have any information on ss Burtarn
Sailed from dover to portsaid
My uncle was onboard ih theR.e.m.e.
Thanks sandy
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Have you spelled the name correctly? I cannot find any vessel with the name BURTARN.
Also can you give me the approximate date of voyage?
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Thanks for reply,it appears that he sailed in 1944 and came back in 1947 on the
Empress of scotland.ss burtarn,this is the way he spelt it .
Hope this helps.thanks again.
Sandy
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Are you sure about the port of embarkation? Given that Dover was under bombardment for a large part of WW2 it was most unusual for troopships to depart from there.
Could the vessel be named "MOOLTAN" she made several voyages to Port Said in 1944 mainly departing from the Clyde with some calls at Liverpool.
EMPRESS OF SCOTLAND made several voyages from Port Said in 1947 arriving in Liverpool or Greenock.
Do you know the exact REME unit he belonged to.
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Hi,
I've got a photo a relation on a ship when he was in the 6th Royal Tank Regiment which has 'City of Canturbury 1947' written on the back. I know he was in Italy - Udini, Egypt - Port Said and I think Palestine between 45 and 47. Is it possible to match the ships movements around that information? (I have his Army record if needed).
Regards
Jon
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I am away from home at the minute and cannot easterly access my records. Yes it is possible to match ships to dates. I will get back to you.
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Hi
The R.E.M.E.unit was fighting vehicles at merstham,redhill.Then put on ss burtarn to port said
Then on train to tel el kibir where he was put into 7th canadian armour division in north africa
As r e m e support.Eventually ending up in palestine untill demo.
Sandy
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Sandy,
I have not had access to a PC for over a week, so sorry for the late reply.
I still cannot find a vessel with the name BURTARN.
Unless we can find any records of her? Then I cannot put you on the correct course.
SW
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I've got a photo a relation on a ship when he was in the 6th Royal Tank Regiment which has 'City of Canturbury 1947' written on the back. I know he was in Italy - Udini, Egypt - Port Said and I think Palestine between 45 and 47. Is it possible to match the ships movements around that information? (I have his Army record if needed).
Gentle reminder in case you've forgotten my query...
Jonathan
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Apologies. I had forgoten.
Attached details of movements of CITY OF CANTERBURY for 1947
Not much use by the look of it as she made several calls at Port Said in that year.
Not that well up on army records but there are a couple of files at the national archive which may be of use to you.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C4334543
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C4334554
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Apologies. I had forgoten.
And there I was thinking that you just preferred not to give an incorrect answer. (your signature quote)
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Thanks for the schedule and links. I'll add the latter to my list to look at next time I'm in London.
Jon
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Hello seaweed - Just found your post re Troopships - can you still do lookups as mentioned ?
I am doing a timeline of my military activity and would like to check dates for a few passages made around India, Burma, Singapore before they invented air travel !!
B wishes Tfitzp
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Yes. No problem.
Just give me the name of the troopship/s with approximate dates you sailed on and I will do my best to oblige.
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Thanks - my main trips without dates were 1) Empire Halladale leaving Madras Apr ? 1947 to Singapore. 2) reembarking on same ship Singapore to Rangoon. 3) unknown ship dep Rangoon Feb 1948 arrive UK 12 Mar 1948. Guess names = Dunera, Scythia, Nevasa. Sorry for age-related vagueness. Diolch yn fawr.
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Just saw post by joboy - cant PM lacking posts [only reg in 2009!!] suggest he refers to
http://www.ssasturias.net/
for much info on MV Asturias
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Are you sure the name of the vessel was EMPIRE HALLADALE?
My records show from 27/8/1946 until 7/11/1947 she was employed exclusively as a Troopship between Tilbury and Cuxhaven. (see attached)
Of the three vessels you gave me only one comes close, NEVASA.
Sailed Rangoon 11/Feb/1948
Arrived Southampton 8/March/1948
via Colombo sailed 15/2/48, Aden 22/2/48, Port Said 28/6/48
8/March/1948 was the date NEVASA entered Southampton Water. It may have been a few days until she berthed and you were disembarked.
Addendum.
Could the vessel be EMPIRE HELFORD ex KOSCIUSZKO Her movements would fit. ::)
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Just saw post by joboy - cant PM lacking posts [only reg in 2009!!] suggest he refers to
http://www.ssasturias.net/
for much info on MV Asturias
Hi tfitzp and welcome to rootschat ...... I did have that link and I think seaweed gave it to me initially.
When I arrived via Asturias in November 1948 it carried mainly ex service men and women and was still in troopship mode.
Enjoy your time with us.
Joe
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Thanks for the good work - agreed it probably was Helford [twas a bit of a Hell ship] - could you please do her movements for 1947-04 Madras-Singapore-Rangoon.
And if you dont mind I would appreciate details of the HMT Lancashire run dep Singapore 02-06-1953 [day after Everest scaled] arr So'ton 02-07-1953 - page download would be nice.
PS My work on HMT Asturias is now up on http://www.britisharmedforces.org/pages/nat_troopships.htm
and my article on HMT Lancashire appears on
https://limostwanted.wordpress.com/hmtroopship-memoirs/lancashire/#comment-27182
Diolch encore
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First, movements of EMPIRE HELFORD
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LANCASHIRE Seems Liverpool was the port of disembarkation.
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Very many thanks for the good work - re HMT Lancashire the arrival port changed due to delay in schedule - for interest heres a pic I took of Empire Fowey leaving Singapore in 1952/3 - cheera again
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Thanks for posting an original photograph. In the grand scale of things, relatively unimportant but this kind of information needs to be preserved for generations to come
regards
SW
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I have a query on the use of the "HMT" abbreviation.
As far as I have studied the subject, HMT referred to His Majesty's Trawler, particularly used for converted trawlers for mine hunting and Submarine hunting, and maybe convoy escort work.
Is HMT an official Royal Navy title? (For "Transport" or Troopship )
I do not think it is. But that is my personal opinion.
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I would concur with you. However I have e mailed H Mac, who is more the expert on RN terms and designations, asking him to join the thread.
regards
SW
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Thank you.
One other point on the topic of UK troopships, I think most, if not all, were chartered or leased by the UK government, and were substantially crewed by Merchant Navy officers and men.
I believe that my father was a survivor of the Lancastria sinking, I looked at a register of ships lost or damaged during WW2 in the Merseyside Maritime museum. One column in the register showed Lancastria as being O.H.M.S. at the time.
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Yes, I would agree with you both. The Admiralty didn't to my knowledge give out the HMT prefix officially. Also with HMS, a ship flying the White Ensign could only be called HMS if she was actually commissioned.
I have seen questions regarding the prefix HMT with regard to troopships, again, to my knowledge they were never officially H.M. Troopships just an unofficial title.
Regarding OHMS, a ship can be 'On His Majesty's Service' but this does not affect what she was called. There were plenty of ships OHMS during WW2 from cargo ships to troopships.
Regards
Hugh
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That sounds right to me.
In the Falklands, Canberra, QE2, and other Passenger ships were known as STUFT Ships taken up from Trade. IIRC, the section of MoD administering those contracts were based in Empress State building in Fulham, near Earls Court ( thirty years ago)
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Hello Seaweed,
Would it be possible for you to check SS Empire Orwell please? It left Singapore in September 1950 and arrived at Southampton 23/24 October 1950.
Thank you.
Jules.
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Hello Seaweed,
Would it be possible for you to check SS Empire Orwell please? It left Singapore in September 1950 and arrived at Southampton 23/24 October 1950.
Thank you.
Jules.
EMPIRE ORWELL Ex EMPIRE DOON Ex PRETORIA (German registered)
Built 1936
GRT 18036 tons
550ft X 72.4 X 40.4
16 knots
Oil fuel
Twin Screw
Troop Accommodation
263 1st and 2nd class cabins
1104 3rd class cabins
1407 Standees (Steel bunks.)
Sailed Singapore 30/Sept/1950
Arrived Colombo 4/10/1950 Sailed same day
Arrived Aden 10//10/1950 Sailed 11/10/1950
Arrived Port Said 15/10/1950 Sailed same day
Arrived Southampton 23/10/1050
Underwent Dry docking from 24/10/1950
Sailed Southampton 23/11/1950
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Hi Seaweed,
Mention of the Empire Orwell brings back a vivid memory of one New Year when I sat with others on a stretcher group in the Foyer by the Purser's Office.
I wonder if you could check for me whether that would have been New Year 1953 or New Year 1954 - when she was in Aden? I think it must have been the night of 1952/1953 as I don't recalling a feeling of 'I'll be going home soon' which wasn't until I embarked on the Georgic around Feb/March 1954.
We didn't have to manipulate a stretcher that night. It was much more serious. We had gone on board to carry Oxygen Bottles for a Blue Baby which we took off the ship and up to RAF Hospital, Aden. We had a long wait and it was rather a sombre mood as everyone was thinking about the babe and whether it would survive. We must have been there an hour or more when suddenly all ships in the Harbour sounded their horns to herald in the New Year. I think someone remarked, Never mind we can celebrate New Year in the UK in three hours time. The Ambulance had to be stopped half way up the mountainside road to the hospital while the Medical Officer revived the child's heart which had stopped. I think the family were on their way home from Hong Kong and often wonder if it survived to live a long life.
Malcolm
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Thank you very much for the information. It is a very kind offer of yours to share it so freely.
Jules.
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EMPIRE ORWELL official number 180806 Arrived in Aden 31/December/1953 and sailed 1/January/1954
I tried a quick search to find the vessel logbook for the period which may have given an account of the circumstances of the babies plight. Sadly, it seems the logbook has been lost or destroyed.
GEORGIC Sailed Singapore 25/Feb 1954
Arrived Columbo 1/3/54 sailed same day
Arrived Aden 6/3/54 sailed same day
Arrived Port Said 10/3/54 sailed 11/3/54
Arrived Liverpool 19/3/54 Disembarkation finished at 0930 19/3/54 The vessel was then returned to here owners having ceased Trooping activities.
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I guess I will be mentioning a fact most of you know when I say that the Queen Mary once carried 16,000 troops. From New York to either Glasgow or Liverpool I guess?
And another funny troopship story. Apparently a troopship from New York arrived Liverpool on or about VE day. So they were given the order to return the troops straight back to New York.
But the really funny bit is that they were the first US forces to return home from Europe.
They received a Heros Welcome, Bands playing, Fire boats discharging water jets, Fireworks, The full Nine Yards. The only action they had seen was in Liverpool ... ;D . ;D
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EMPIRE ORWELL official number 180806 Arrived in Aden 31/December/1953 and sailed 1/January/1954
I tried a quick search to find the vessel logbook for the period which may have given an account of the circumstances of the babies plight. Sadly, it seems the logbook has been lost or destroyed.
GEORGIC Sailed Singapore 25/Feb 1954
Arrived Columbo 1/3/54 sailed same day
Arrived Aden 6/3/54 sailed same day
Arrived Port Said 10/3/54 sailed 11/3/54
Arrived Liverpool 19/3/54 Disembarkation finished at 0930 19/3/54 The vessel was then returned to here owners having ceased Trooping activities.
Many thanks Seaweed, so it was closer to my end of tour. That's a shame, no logbook. So it would have been on the 11th March 1954 that the surface of the Med outside of Port Said would have been littered with KD bush jackets and shorts. I think I was off the ship around 8.30am. I know we were up well before dawn to get a look at Blighty and first sight were the Liver Birds, then when the early morning light came howls of catcalls and whistles from the side of the ship as everyone caught sight of the first Teddy Boys who were strolling along the quayside.
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Hello again Seaweed,
I hope you don't mind me asking for one other one please? It is for the SS Cameronia. I am going by service record dates so they may be a couple of days out. Left the UK 16/17th March 1947 and arrived Egypt 31st March/1 April 1947.
Thank you very much.
Jules.