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Some Special Interests => Travelling People => Topic started by: waynus james on Sunday 11 November 12 17:07 GMT (UK)
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I am trying to trace any photographs or information relating to John and Minnie James who lived at 8 Seaton Road, Mitcham (definitely there in 1911). They had 23 children - their youngest daughter Ellen was my granny and I would love to find out more information about her brothers and sisters.
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Further to my previous post, I have now found out that Minnie and John James lived at Queens Road, Mitcham in the 1920s - so not sure if this will jog anyone's memories.
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Hi All
Just come back to the site after a break.
Still looking for help on this one - would be good to hear from you if you have any information. We have since found our that John James's parents were Joseph and Louisa James.
Best wishes
Waynus James
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I have a John James wife Louisa who's son is called John. They all lived in mitcham . Do you know any other family names ?
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How sure are you about Johns Parents?
Marriage;
25 March 1878, Dorking, St Paul
John JAMES, 20, Bachelor, Hawker, Father JOHN** James, Hawker
Mignonette AGNES, 17, Spinster, Father Samuel CALLA , Hawker
(Her Fathers surname is hard to read ans is transcribed as Calla)
FreeBMD March 1878 Marriage Reg has her as Mignionetta AYRES
(image on Parish Entry could be Ayres)
1881 in West Horsley, Surrey we have;
John James, 20, Hawker, born Aldershot, Surrey
Minnie James, 20, Hawkers Wife, born Brighton, Sussex
Louisa J. James, 1, Daug, born Leatherhead,Sussex
John is with his Parents JOHN/LOUISA, nee Ayres also in 1891 Census, down as Married.
Also on 1911 Census they have a lot less than 23 Children born to them?
Trish :)
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In case you dont have this.
Mignonette EYRES
Birth Date: 4 May 1861
Baptism Date: 24 May 1861, Ashtead, St Giles
Mother: AMY Eyres, abode Ashtead Lane?, Traveller
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Sorry I have a John James with wife Louisa james (ayres) and they have a son Joseph- I have louisa and John are my ggg grandparents. My dad did some research before he died, which was back in 2010 . Since then there has been lots more information from other people on this site which I'm trying to piece together . At the moment I'm at 1891 which isn't that far back but I remember my dad talking about a minnie james , the ayres , and doe and draper family oh and the smiths !! Help rebecca
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hi
does any one have phoebe james born 1889 :)
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hi
john james marries louisa ayres.
children
john james marries migonette ayres
alfred james marries ocean draper/ doe
joseph james marries rebecca smith
:)
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Trish1120 sorry I didn't read your last message properly !!!
Horsemad thank you that sounds right with what I have , where exactly did you find it ? I have the information from my dad's old stuff but no reference to where he got it !!
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Horsemad sorry I forgot to say I have a phoebe james from around then but it'll take a minute to find 😊
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hi, i was reading the above post from you both, and i have phoebe james, well they all lived in the right area, so i did a little more looking at her and some other family trees :)
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John and louisa james had a number of kids , Alfred and John.
Alfred weds ocean doe they have kids one of which is phoebe ......I think that's how it goes !! John is my 3x great grandad or something lol it confuses me ! Do you have the parents of ocean ?
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do you have a tree on ancestry :)
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No not yet , most of the info I have is stuff my dad did through this site so I have been trying to piece it all together . I know a tiny bit about phoebes mums parents unless you already have that ? Do you have anything more about rebecca smith ? 😊
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nothing about rebecca but phoebe married henry scott that my family, some one has a james tree with miley in it, i think oceans father looks to be goliath doe :)
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Yes that's her dad and her mum was Mary Ann draper before they married, her mum was called siberena whos husband was joseph smith - that's if my dad's research was right lol !!
My great granny was vertina james and my great grandad was james miley and there's quite a few of them . Possibly that's my dad's tree ! Is it possible for you to find out who's tree is is ?
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its jjames 840 :)
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That's my dad omigod. Thank you 😊 I'll now be able to look at his tree and find out some more !!!
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Once I've sorted the tree out I'll let you know mine - you never know we're probably related further back as well
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your welcome, hope waynus reads this as its his family also :)
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Yeah that would be amazing , I'm going to pm him 😊 thank you again I'm sure I'll find more that I have no clue about
Thanks rebecca
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1911 alfred and ocean are living at 35 queens road :)
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I didn't know that but I know her mum was born in Basingstoke !!! I think there are more drapers and does in our family but I'm not 100% on that ?!
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1911 phoebe is on the census twice, one with her parents as married and the other with henry scott as phoebe scott lol, they were not married in 1911 they didnt marry till 1915, double wedding with ocean and alfred lol :)
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I forgot to tell you that my dad had it written down lol they are a funny lot aren't they ? If my mum tried to steal my big dad I'd be right annoyed lol
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thing is most of them were never married when they said they were, its funny really we found them all out ;D
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They changed their names first and second and gave different places of birth but like you say we found them out 😁 !!! I think using this site helps a lot as well
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it does are u on any other sites :)
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No not yet, love only started this about a week . I Googled james family mitcham and found some of my dad's conversations on this site . One of the people he was talking to turned to be his cousin lol these conversations were from 2009 !!
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well if you want to join some sites let me know:)
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I will do . Tomorrow I'm going to set up an account on anscestry and once I've actually added what I know I'll pm you :😊
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;D
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Hi Rebecca
Lovely to hear from you - bit confused now!! I have been researching various families for the past 3 years. My granny is Ellen James - daughter of John and Minnie. I have looked at all the census records on her family but we only found them on a few census's - John and Minnie only appear on 2 census's - 1881 and 1911. In 1911 they only appear to have 3 children when they are living at 8 Seaton Road, Mitcham - however most of the others would be married at this time but my granny is there with her parents. We did find John with his parents in 1891 along with many of his brothers and sisters but in all the records we have found his father is named Joseph (see details below).
"In 1891 John appears on the census with his parents, Joseph and Louisa. They are camping on Park Downs, Epsom, Surrey. They are aged 54 (born in Aldershot) and 52 (born in East Grinstead). Also living with them are Robert aged 33 (born in Molesey, Surrey), John aged 31 (born in Nutley, Sussex), Rebecca aged 30 (born in Aldershot), Henry aged 27 (born in Aldershot), Elizabeth aged 26 (born in Reading), Louisa aged 25 (born in Greenwich), Alfred aged 24 (born in Hadlow), Mark aged 22 (born in Mitcham), Joseph aged 19 (born in Morden) and Ada aged 10 (born in Leatherhead). Their occupation is listed as travelling gypsies."
We also traced Minnie and she was a Collins - her parents were Samuel Collins and Amy Ayres.
Hope this helps you - please let me know if I can help further.
Best wishes (wont be back on line until next Monday as away now)
Waynus
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Hi waynus,
Since reading your previous message I have checked the 1891 census 3 times lol and I see john as head of the family BUT the every other name . I have it saved on my tree on ancestry but I don't have a clue how I get it on here for you.
Their son Joseph marries a rebecca smith and their daughter vertina is my great gran !! I have louisa as an ayres whos parents are henry ayres and olive james . Still confused we are definitely looking at the same people but seeing a different name for joe/john :D
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i looked also can only see him as john :)
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So I'm not going mad ?!?
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A BIG APOLOGY!!
You are quite right - last night I re-looked at the census records and had incorrectly copied it down as Joseph in my own records therefore for the last 3 years I have been reading it as Joseph and Louisa!! I am so glad you have put me right on this.
Did you find these on any other census as we have only found them on 1881 and 1891 - although may have been looking under the wrong names!! Someone else on this site found John and Minnie with a daughter Amy but I have been unable to find this - have you come across this - they definitely did have a daughter Amy.
Have you ever seen any photos of these - I would love to find any but have had no luck so far.
Do you come from the Mitcham area yourself?
Best wishes
Waynus
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Hi Waynus ,
Thank God you said that because I kept checking everything , and what with the james love of recycling their names we could've easily been talking about two different families!! My dad had them in 1891 but we had their son Joseph, wife Rebecca and children in 1911 and 1901. I haven't seen anything about john and minnie officially but my dad did have Scribbles on scraps of paper about them . I think minnie full name is migyonette or something like that and possibly was an ayres .I haven't seen any pictures which is a shame but fingers crossed we may find some one day !!
I'm from Croydon and my dads family stayed close to that area . I have been told from a second cousin that there's still a few of the james family there , not sure how distant though .
I thing this site is amazing , in the few weeks I've been using it I've found 2 of my dad's cousins !! So how are we related ? John james son Joseph is my great great grandad !
Rebecca
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Hi Rebecca
Sorry for confusing you - my great grandfather is John and Louisa's son John who married Minnie. Yes we have found her as Mignonette too but she is a Collins (her father was Samuel Collins and her mother was Amy Ayres) and we also found her as an Ayres on one census.
In the 1911 census the family are living at 8 Seaton Road, Mitcham with 3 of their youngest daughters - my granny Ellen is the youngest who is there with them.
Glad you have found some other cousins - yes there are still James' living in Mitcham. I visited there a couple of years ago and spoke to some of them. Their granny was also Verty.
Shame about the photos - maybe someday.
I have also looked for some of the other brothers and sisters and I have found a few of them and who they married - if you want any information let me know - happy to share what I have found.
If you don't hear from me for a couple of days - its because I don't have a computer and use my friend's when i get chance. Please keep in touch - nice to talk to cousins we don't know!!
Best wishes
Waynus
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Cousin hello !!!
Waynus I recently spoke to a man called Jimmy and his granny was vertina and my grandad was her brother!! So we aren't that distant cousins lol !! Just think how many of us there are ! I have about 20 cousins just through my dads siblings and they all have a few kids as well :D
It would be great to have any information you have thank you :)
I'll forward to hearing from you soon
Becky x
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Hi Becky
Hope you are OK.
I have sent you a personal message - have you received this? If not, let me know and I will send it again.
Best wishes
Waynus
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Hi all.
My great grandad was Samuel James...son of John James and Minnie Ayres/Collins. He was born in 1883 in Surrey and died in 1944.
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Hi Craygirl
Well - you have certainly shocked me. I was told that Samuel had died young in the first world war along with his brother Bobby. We have traced Bobby's memorial in Belgium but had not been able to find anything for Samuel (now we know why!!). If you have any more information about him, I would be grateful to receive this. Who did he marry, how many children did he have, do you have any photos????? This will enable me to close some parts of the family history as he has always been a mystery.
Thank you so much for getting in touch - you have made my day!!
Best wishes Waynus
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Hi Waynus.
Was good to hear from you.
Samuel was my mum's grandfather.
His wife was Emily King...although they didn't marry. I think they had 7 children. Minnie, Louisa, Brittania, Leonard, Ellen, Rose and Robert. They all travelled around Kent working on the farms and hawking. After Sam died in Orpington in 1944 the family settled in St Mary Cray, Orpington on a site called Corke's Meadow until they were forced out and made to live in houses. I also thought Sam had died fighting in the war because when I was younger they used to say " he died in the war". But really he died during the war years when the family was on the run because his son had been called up to fight and they didnt want him to go :D.
Also, my mum said that Sam's sister Violet b.1897, lived in the same area.
I do have a photo of him that I will dig out this week for you.
I hope this helps.
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Hi
I did send a private message - did you get this?
I have been away which is why I have not been on the site.
Back now and would love to keep in contact with you. I do already have a lot of information about the family.
Best wishes Waynus
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Hi Craygirl
Hope you are OK. Did you see my previous message - very keen to share this information with you.
Get back in touch when you can.
Best wishes
Waynus
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A BIG APOLOGY!!
You are quite right - last night I re-looked at the census records and had incorrectly copied it down as Joseph in my own records therefore for the last 3 years I have been reading it as Joseph and Louisa!! I am so glad you have put me right on this.
Did you find these on any other census as we have only found them on 1881 and 1891 - although may have been looking under the wrong names!! Someone else on this site found John and Minnie with a daughter Amy but I have been unable to find this - have you come across this - they definitely did have a daughter Amy.
Have you ever seen any photos of these - I would love to find any but have had no luck so far.
Do you come from the Mitcham area yourself?
Best wishes
Waynus
I have been researching my husband's family and in his tree he has Amy James baptised on 16 Feb 1882 at Tandridge, St Peter, Surrey, England, Father: John James, Mother: Minnetta James.
Amy James married William Shoebridge on 24 Apr 1905 at Chaldon, St Peter and St Paul, Surrey, England. Amy died 1934 and was buried on 28 Sep 1934 at St Mary's Church, Walton-on-Thames, Surrey, England.
I have found another Amy James baptised on 16 Apr 1882 at Esher, Surrey, England, Father: John James, Mother: Minnie Nellie James but nothing further on this so I am unsure which is the correct baptism for the Amy James who married William Shoebridge.
Also I cannot find Amy James on any Census records.
Any information would be very much appreciated. :)
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Hello Mitch Yes this one is a bit confusing! I have never been able to find Amy James on a census but I did find her on the baptism with parents John and Minnie James but no Nelly that is new. My granny told me that she married a Hyram Hoadley but I have since been in contact with her grandson who said her maiden name was Collins not James so did she change her name to the same as her mum or are there 2 Amy James!! However my aunt told me that her aunt Louie married a Shoebridge but maybe she got the wrong sister. I would love to know if you manage to figure this out.
Regards Waynus
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i am trying to trace a john king lived at eynesford near dartford he m a maryann john died and by 1841 maryann m a john best. who died dartford may 1883age 56. do you know anything about this john pleas we know nothing about him just whats above.john and mary ann had d maryann b 1821 at crockenhill. my grt granny.would love to know about john king
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sorry to be so long getting back to you i have been on holiday i dont know anything aboult john king but my grate uncal sam james married a emmly king and thay lived crocking hill maybe theres are her parents i am not shorw look for theres and trace her back you might come up with some joy did you find anything els aboult amy james kind regards waynus
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Sorry to butt in here achoo but I thought I might try and see if I could find anything for you.
If John Best died 1883 age 56 he would be born c 1827 so a little young to be married before 1841!
I may be way off here but this is what I can see.
1841 we have;
John Best 30
Mary Best 30
Mary KING 12*****
Caleb Best 11 (looks like 4* to me)
Henry Best 2
So Mary born c 1829???
1851 Census
John Bert 44 Ag Lab
Mary Ann Bert 48
Caleb Bert 14
Henry Bert 12
All born Eynesford
HENRY Best bapt 3 Mar 1850, birth 10 Feb 1839
CALEB Best bapt 11 Jun 1837, birth 24 Feb 1837
(FreeREG)
BEST, HENRY mmn THORRINGTON***
GRO Reference: 1839 M Quarter in DARTFORD UNION Volume 05 Page 105
1861 Mary Best is a Widow born c 1803 Eynesford, living with Son Caleb
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MARY ANN King bapt 5 Oct 1828, St Martin of Tours, Eynesford
Parents JOHN/MARY ANN
Father a Labourer
Abode Crocken Hill
Other bapts to John/Mary Ann;
HANNAH 9 Mar 1828, birth 22 Sep 1824
WILLIAM 3 Apr 1831, birth 8 Mar 1831, buried 12 Jan 1835 age 3 years and 11 mths
(these bapts have John as a Shepherd)
JOHN King Buried Baptist Church, Eynesford 01 Jun 1835 age 34*****
Abode Crockenhill
Buried in Baptist Burial Grounds, Crockenhill, Eynsford. Died 26 May
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If I am following the right Family did Mary Ann marry William PACKMAN 1848?
If so witnesses were Hannah and J PAIN
Hannah KING married Jepe PAIN 1 Nov 1845
Both name their Father as John King a Labourer
EDIT I cant see anything for a Mary Ann Thorrington, bapt or marriage to a John King ::)
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thank you trish your good to me that the ones im looking for. does it say who john king parents are pleas
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I cant see a bapt on FreeREG c 1801 for a John King.
Also I cant see anything for a Thorrington family esp a Mary in Eynesford.
I am not really sure about that birth reg for Henry King now mmn Thorrington.
Looked for a Marriage in case Mary was married before but no luck.