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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Banffshire => Topic started by: littleliz02 on Thursday 14 March 13 22:01 GMT (UK)
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Hi I have posted before trying to trace my gr gr grandfather Alexander Williams. According to the 1901 and 1911 census he was living in Northumberland and the were born is shown as Banff, Scotland in 1869 on one census and then 1872 on the other. When he died in 1945 he was 76 years, therefore, I assume he was born in 1869.
The problem I have is that I am unable to trace his birth in Banff, having tried all combinations of Williams I can think of, I am now beginning to wonder if there would be an alternative meaning/spelling of the christian name 'Alexander'. Could anyone help me out with this.
On his marriage certificate in 1913 Northumberland it states that his father is called John Williams (dec'd).
Any help would be gratefully appreciated
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Was he shown as 43/44 when he married in 1913? Was he a widower?
Can you confirm the 1901 census details as I can't see an entry in Northumberland fitting the profile you have given
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Hi
He was shown as bachelor when he married in 1913.
On the 1901 census he is shown as living with Elizabeth and they have a child Alexandre b 1900, however, I believe he did not marry Elizabeth, she took his name on the census and the did not marry. They lived in South Shields, Durham.
Alexander Williams met Catherine Rafferty and for some reason they moved North of the River Tyne and married at the local registry office located in North Shields, Tynemouth, Northumberland in 1913. I think they reason they moved and got married in the Registry office was due to her expecting their first child in 1913, and their second (my grandfather) in 1914.
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He is in Durham - not Northumberland
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Hi liz,
Keying the name Alexander Williams into familysearch and searching Scotlands births in Banffshire throws up several Alexander McWilliam.
Is it a possibility that your grt grt grand father maybe lost the Mc and gained an sat some point in his life?
Cheers Looby
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Sorry Liz,
Missed a space there ;D
Should read ....did Alexander lose a Mc and gain a s at some point in his life?
Looby
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Links to previous posts to prevent duplication of info
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,623889.msg4732891.html#msg4732891
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,624688.0.html
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Looks like you've already gone down the route of McWilliam , liz.
Sorry other than the obvious Alex and Sandy I can't think of any other alternative name for Alexander.
Good luck with you search,
Looby
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Thanks Looby, didnt realise Sandy was an alternative, I will give that a try.
Liz
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There is always the possibility that he was illegitimate and registered under his mother's name. Have you found him in the 1871 or 1881 census? His parents might have subsequently married. Even if they did not, it is quite common for illegitimate people to state their real parents' names and say the were married, especially when they were themselves married away from their birth area and nobody could challenge the fact.
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When he died in 1945 he was 76 years, therefore, I assume he was born in 1869.
Not so. He died in the first quarter of the year, therefore no later than March. If his birthday was in April, May, June, July, August, September, October, November or December he would not have had his birthday in 1913, so the likelihood is that he would have been 77 by the end of 1913, or in other words (assuming that his age is accurate) he is more likely to have been born in 1868 than in 1869.
What age is on his marriage certificate?
Also, if the census just says 'Banff, Scotland' it could mean the county of Banff, in which case you are looking for an Alexander Williams or McWilliam or even Williamson born anywhere in the county, not just in the burgh or parish of Banff.
Sandy and Alec or Alex are common abbreviations for Alexander. Less common are Eck, Al, Sandor, Zander, Ally, etc etc but I'd be very surprised to see any of those on a mid-19th century birth certificate.
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Links to previous posts to prevent duplication of info
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,623889.msg4732891.html#msg4732891
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,624688.0.html
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Hi Forfarian, thank you for the reply.
Alexander was 44 years on his marriage certificate - he married on 17th may 1913. Therefore, would you say i was best searching in 1868 for his birth?
It looks like I will have to search all the boys born is the county of Banff in 1868 with the name Alec, Alexander Sandy and then Williams, McWilliam, Williamson. Oh my goodness that will keep me busy.
In reply to GR2, unfortunately I am unable to locate him on the 1871 and 1881 census.
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Alexander was 44 years on his marriage certificate - he married on 17th may 1913. Therefore, would you say i was best searching in 1868 for his birth?
That's excellent because the age at marriage and the age at death are consistent with one another.
You need to search both 1868 and 1869.
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Just to give an update, I have searched for Alexander Williams born in Banff 1868 and other variations and have started to explore the birth below which i found on Scotlands People births in the parish of Boham:
Alexander McWilliam (Illegitimate)
16/04/1868 (keith)
Mother Espet McWilliams (Domestic Servant)
Domicil Maggieknockater, Boham
Further exploration is that Alexander is listed on 1871 census in Maggieknockater:
Elizabeth McWilliam (Head)
James McWilliam (Son)
Elpet McWilliam (daughter)
Alexander Grant (granson)
He is listed as Alexander Grant on 1881 census and then I cant locate after this.
I am hoping that after 1881 he moves to Durham and is then changes his name to Alexander Williams (a long shot but I have tried all other avenues i can think of)
Could anyone explain why even though Alexander surname at birth is recorded as McWilliam, this is changed on the cenus, would it have something to do with him being illegitimate?
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He is listed as Alexander Grant on 1881 census and then I cant locate after this.
Could anyone explain why even though Alexander surname at birth is recorded as McWilliam, this is changed on the cenus, would it have something to do with him being illegitimate?
Yes, very much so.
An illegitimate child can only be registered with its father's name if the father accompanies the mother when she goes to register the birth, and signs the birth certificate alongside her. So it can be the case that the entire parish knows who the father is, but if he refuses, or isn't available, to sign, the child is registered under only its mother's surname. The child is often known, nevertheless, by its father's surname.
As it is Boharm, there is little chance that Elspet's pregnancy evaded the attention of the Kirk Session, in which case their minutes may contain some information about her case. The Boharm KS minutes are in the National Archives Records of Scotland in Edinburgh, and they can be consulted in the form of digital images either there or in a few other archives elsewhere in Scotland, including Aberdeen and Inverness. If you are unable to go to any of these you will need to find someone willing to look them up and transcribe them on your behalf.
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Thanks Forfarian, fountain of all knowledge. I am very grateful.
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In the Mearns and Angus another alternate for Alexander was Sy. Not sure if that is the official spelling
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Alastair/Alasdair was the Gaelic equivalent.
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Alastair/Alasdair was the Gaelic equivalent.
Is, not was, though it's now regarded as a name in its own right.