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Research in Other Countries => Europe => Topic started by: Greensleeves on Saturday 20 April 13 09:14 BST (UK)
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Having had a brick wall demolished in the Common Room (thanks again to all who found so much info for me) I then bound back a couple of generations and find that my 5x great grandparents were Torres Reitan and Gunni Hansdr of Ytteroy, Nord-Trodelag, Norway. Their son John (Hans) Torrison was baptised 15 November 1772 at Ytteroy and he and his wife Barbara (also alleged to be Norwegian) subsequently settled in Rotherhithe, England.
My question is, where on earth do I go from here? Are there Norwegian records available online? And if there are, is there anyone about who understands Norwegian?
I suspect I have hit another brick wall here, but I am still immensely pleased to have got this far!
Thanks in advance for any help and/or suggestions,
Regards
GS
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Norway has a wealth of records freely available online. You can start here http://arkivverket.no/eng/content/view/full/629 (http://arkivverket.no/eng/content/view/full/629) and start to explore. I have enough Norwegian to make my way around the records and there is also Jan who is Norwegian and is of course fluent.
I also use familysearch in case the necessary records have been transcribed.
There are also Norwegian fora where even if you put a query in English with as much details as you have you should get a response. The link above will give you access to a users forum. You will have to register to be able to join, but again it is all free.There is also a DIS forum http://www.disnorge.no/slektsforum/index.php?language=engelsk (http://www.disnorge.no/slektsforum/index.php?language=engelsk)again you have to register
and the same site has a map which helps with locating the different areas of http://www.disnorge.no/kart/dismap.php (http://www.disnorge.no/kart/dismap.php)
Happy hunting
kaysii
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The baptism was easy to find.
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=16411&idx_id=16411&uid=ny&idx_side=-75 (http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=16411&idx_id=16411&uid=ny&idx_side=-75)
It is here towards the bottom of the left hand page. You have the mother's name followed by the "godparents". Most have a first name followed by the name of the farm they are probably living on.
The father's name is assumed, but the child was born within marriage.
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I have found the family in the 1801 census living on a different farm and you can see that his father is Tørres Andersenhttp://digitalarkivet.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=14&filnamn=f18011722&gardpostnr=78&personpostnr=1384&merk=1384#ovre (http://digitalarkivet.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=14&filnamn=f18011722&gardpostnr=78&personpostnr=1384&merk=1384#ovre)
Hans is unmarried and has 2 brothers Anders and Peder.
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How sure are you that your ancestor in Rotherhithe was born in that area of Norway, as there are several Hans or John Torrisons or variants of that name born in that time period in Norway. As the one born in Ytteroy was unmarried in 1801 and I assume your ancestor is the one having children from 1801 in Rotherhithe, I would think it is highly unlikely he is your ancestor. I have found a couple of trees with his name on Ancestry, but none that provide the evidence that he came from Norway. Given the area he was living
Is your ancestor the Hans (Aans) Torrison in an institution in Greenwich in 1841?
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Thank you very much indeed for such detailed information kaysii. I will plough through it and see where it leads me. I am much obliged for your help!
Kind regards
GS
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Have found a transcription of a child of John and Barbara Torrison called Barbara, born 21 August 1804 and baptised 27 March 1805 in Stepney, St George in the East in which it says that John is a mariner. If you are to look at records in Norway, you will need to prioritise those that are coastal rather than those living inland and try to follow through to find out if they are still there in 1801 or not. Not an easy task I'm afraid. I've not found a marriage in Norway that fits.
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So far I can't find a marriage for them either but I did find that baptism record giving him as a Mariner. I will have to put my notes in order before I go any further - have several pages of jottings; I don't have Ancestry worldwide so a fellow RC member has been doing lookups for me. However, there are quite a few Norwegian records on Family Search.
Thanks so much for your time on this kaysii, it is much appreciated.
Regards
GS
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Is your ancestor the Hans (Aans) Torrison in an institution in Greenwich in 1841?
I'm afraid I can't find this 1841 census entry, kaysii. I wonder if you could please let me have the reference number?
Many thanks,
GS
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Hi
1841 reference
Piece 489
Book/Folio 17/29
Page 14
The name has been transcribed as Aans Tarison.
kaysii
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Thank you so much for this kaysii - most grateful to you for your help.
Kind regards
GS
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Hi I've just found your post by chance. I think we may be looking for the same family of Torrisson. My 4 x great grandmother was Barbara Mattingley nee Torrisson and was born in Rotherhithe in 1804 .
I can't find her baptism records but have a hunch that her mother and father were John and Barbara from Norway.
Have you come across this Barbara before and would you have any further info?
Thanks, Regards
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Hi Greensleeves, I am a direct descendant of John and Barbara (4x great grandson) through his son Thomas born c1813. I know John was a Greenwich pensioner and died on 20th August 1849. I have a copy of his death certificate. I have quite an extensive Torrison family tree that starts from Thomas that was sent to me by a relative. This is as far as it goes back. My great grandfather Thomas Lewis Torrison always maintained his grandfather (John) had emigrated from Norway. I have been trying to find out the details and proof of this. Your findings are the closest to proof I have so far.
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What a shame, Pi, that my attention has only now been drawn to your post. If you are still contactable after all this while, I sincerely apologise for the lack of response. Perhaps you could post again if you receive notification of my post so that we can give you further information of John/Jan/Hans Torrison and the family's Norwegian links.
Kind regards
GS
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Hi Greensleeves,I'm still contactable
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Oh great, Pi, so glad you are still about. I am a descendant of John and Barbara and can confirm that he - and probably Barbara his wife - were both Norwegian, and he was a mariner. Coincidentally, another of their descendants has also been in touch with me recently too! This is all very exciting.
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I have also seen that Rubyhenry posted too, some years ago, also being descended from John and Barbara. This is getting to be like some amazing family reunion!
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Oh great, Pi, so glad you are still about. I am a descendant of John and Barbara and can confirm that he - and probably Barbara his wife - were both Norwegian, and he was a mariner. Coincidentally, another of their descendants has also been in touch with me recently too! This is all very exciting.
Hi Greensleeves,I'm still contactable
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Hi. I think I'm related too 😊 Bear with me I'm new to this site.
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Can you see my post greeensleeves??
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That's fantastic. I am a direct descendant, one of the few Torrison's in the country ( I believe we are the only family with the name) and my family have always lived in the East London and Greenwich area since John and Barbara arrived. I would love to find out which area of Norway they came from.
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Yes Yazz, I can see your post.
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so we all share a common ancestor!! I think Hans and Barbara are my GGGG grandparents, what about everyone else??
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Well Pi, by an amazing coincidence Yazz contacted me recently, as she is also a descendant of John and Barbara. My line descends from Barbara Mattingley's daughter, Frances (Fanny) Mattingley, who left Rotherhithe and turned up in records in Hartlepool, Co Durham on the eve of the 1851 census, the day she married William Shadforth of that town.
According to the information I have unearthed, John Torrison (aka Hans, Jan, Jans and various spellings of Torrison) was born on Ytteroy, a Norwegian island. He was baptised there on 12th November 1772, and was the son of Torres Reitan and Gunnil Hansdatter.
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Same as you, Yazz - John and Barbara are my 4x great grandparents too.
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Hello this is RubyHenry !
Good to be in contact with everyone .
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Hello and welcome, Rubyhenry, welcome to the grand reunion of the descendants of John and Barbara Torrison!
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Hi Rubyhenry.... another relation ... this is great!!
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What splendid news that you have all caught up with each other! A belated welcome to Rootschat Yazz, Rubyhenry and Pi.
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Wow!! This virtual meeting up of families on Rootschat is just the sort of thing we all dream of! It's wonderful! Fantastic!
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Thanks Groom !! a family reunion in the making :)
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Yes very exciting JB - four descendants of John and Barbara Torrison get in touch with each other within the space of a fortnight! Mind you, it would have been a lot earlier if I had actually kept my eyes on the responses to the earlier part of this thread!
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Yes, but perhaps all the information may not have been available then!
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Hans and Barbara are also 4 times great grandparents to me!!
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Here is my (simplified) line from John (Hans) and Barbara Torrison from them to my paternal grandmother:
1. John (Hans) and Barbara Torrison (b. Norway, lived in Rotherhithe)
2. Barbara Torrison (b. 1805, Rotherhithe) m. Richard Mattingly (Rotherhithe)
3. Frances (Fanny) Anna Mattingley (b. 1827, Rotherhithe) m. William Shadforth (b. 1831 Hartlepool, Co Durham)
4. Richard Mattley Shadforth (b. 1852 Hartlepool) m. Margaret Davies (b. Sunderland 1853)
5. Elizabeth Shadforth (b. 1885 Hartlepool) m. Robert Sedgwick (b. Hartlepool 1879)
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Hi All,
Here is my simplified line to my paternal grandfather:
1) John and Barbara as above - they lived in St Cathrine Street , now part of St katherine's dock by Tower Bridge
2) Thomas Torrison b1813 (Rotherhithe)m. Rebekah Armstead b 1827
3) Thomas George Torrison (Rotherhithe)b 1847 m Elizabeth Lewis b 1852
4) Thomas Lewis Torrison (Ansty Street, Rotherhithe) b 1877 m Florence Mary Jones b 1880 (Portsmouth)
5) Charles Henry Torrison b 1912 (Charlton) m Dorothy Amelia Wren (Deptford) b 1911
Interestingly my grandfather Charlie was known to us a Farvie which is not too dissimilar to the Norwegian for a paternal grandfather which is Farfar.
Yazz's is:
1 John and Barbara as above
2 Thomas and Rebekah as above
3) John Torrison b 1851 m Ester/Esther White b 1852?
4) Thomas Charles Torrison b 1886 m Florence Milsom b 1887
5) Nellie M Torrison b 1914
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Hi Pi thank you that's great info. So we share 1and 2. 3 must be brothers... and that's where we both descend from. Did you notice that somebody called ruby henry are also connected to the Torrison link? Do you have a tree ??
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I must say this is all very exciting that we have managed to link. I believe that Pi and Yazz are still in London. Thanks to the adventurous Frances (Fanny) Mattingly nee Torrison who somehow got herself from Rotherhithe to Hartlepool in 1851 to marry William Shadforth (mariner), the Torrison descendants on my tree come from County Durham and Yorkshire. Funny how these things happen.
I have a tree on Ancestry if anyone wants to have a look.
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Hi everyone
My line is through John and Barbara's daughter, Barbara Torrison who married Richard Mattingley.
They had Emma Mattingley who married Thomas Vickers and had a daughter Emma Vickers.
She married Charles Smith and had another daughter called Emma.
Emma Smith married John Bartlett and my grandmother was born, Rose Bartlett
Rose married Edwin Griffiths and my mum Glenis Griffiths married David Almond and they had me! Clair.
Incidentally Emma Vickers and Charles smith had another daughter called Elizabeth Smith and her great grandchildren still live in rotherhithe and we still see each other and refer to each other as cousins
Hope that helps a bit
RubyHenry (Clair)
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Out of interest Pi and Yazz, have you managed to find Han's family before he came to England? I think (hope) I managed to get him back further for Greensleeves a couple of years ago.
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Hello RubyHenry(Clair) - just looked at my Ancestry FT and I have your line down to Emma Vickers and I hadn't gone any further on that line yet. I'm descended from Emma Mattingley's sister Frances (Fanny).
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You might find it difficult to get past Emma Vickers as she never actually married Charles Smith. It's just lucky that as a family we knew she was a Vickers. Then it was difficult because of all the Smiths!
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Ha ha, seems like a family trait then! ;D We have quite a few skeletons in the cupboard on that line, I'm sure. But they seem so interesting, and I've always wondered how Fanny met William Shadforth from Hartlepool, Co Durham, who became her husband on census day 1851. The census return shows them as married but living in different houses - following the wedding they were staying with different Shadforth relatives presumably. Hopefully better arrangements were actually found for the wedding night itself! I also wonder whether Fanny ever had any further contact with her Rotherhithe family, or did she just travel north and disappear.
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Wonderful new info. Thanks everyone. I have a tree on ancestry feel free to have a look. It's called Razaq after my mum and Dad I received some new hints and they seem to be about Hans and Barbara parents... which one of them came from Denmark I think ?!
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Wow, this is all great stuff !! I've not been able to find out any further details as to where John and Barbara came from. It's the one thing I would really like to find out. They had two elder daughters before Barbara and Thomas and moved south of the river between the births of Barbara and Thomas. It seems the girls where christened in the east end and then recristened in Rotherhithe later as was Thomas. The area of Rotherhithe they lived in was the Scandinavian quarter of London around St Olaves Church. Many of the roads in that area have Scandinavian names.
Coincidentally, my grandparents moved to the north east for a time and my dad spent a few years as a child in Spennymoor. My great uncle moved there too and stayed but he and his wife had no descendants.
I only have a written family tree I'm afraid. I'll have a look on what you have on Ancestry
Pi (Tom)
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My tree on ancestry is clairalmond
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By amazing coincidence, Tom, my other County Durham line, the Sedgwicks, also were at Spennymoor for a few hundred years!
My user name on Ancestry is Greeensleeves (note the extre 'e') and my tree is Garnham-Pearl-Sedgwick-Shadforth. If you're not members of Ancestry and would like to share my tree, PM me with your email address and I think I can then invite you to look at the tree.
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I can't work out how to look up a tree on ancestry as new to it !I have a log in but do not subscribe.
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Just to add that with Groom's help (who posted earlier) we found that Hans Torrison was baptised on 15 November 1772 at Ytteroy, Nord Trondelag. His parents were Torres Reitan and Gunnil Hansdatter.
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I think I'll have to invite you, Tom. I'll ask Jan (Groom) how to do it and send you an invite.
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O greeenskeeves I've been in contact with you before in ancestry I have access to your tree already . We spoke back in 2013 and I think I owe you a trip to the archives at Greenwich hospital!
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Ha ha RubyHenry, you could be right there! :)
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This is details I have : John (Hans) Torrison 1772-1849. His mother is Gunnil Hansdatter 1744 Ytteroy Nord-Trondelag. Norway spouse Torres Reitan 1750 and her parents are Anne Hendricksdatter 1720 and Father Hans Lassen 1720 Norway.
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Sometime ago, I looked up on Google earth to see what Ytteroy looked like. I would love to visit there, to the home country so to speak. The only time my daughter has shown any interest in my FH research was when I told her we had links to Norway, at which point she became hugely animated and excited about being descended from the vikings. ;D
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Thank you all for providing the info on Johns parents etc. I've been trying to find out where John and Barbara came from as I would also like to visit there one day!!! I don't think you can be more a viking if you come from an island in a fjord ;D
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I agree - have you looked at the island on Google Earth - it looks wild and amazing? I would love to go there; as you say, you don't come much more Viking than that. In fact it reminds me that my daughter has never been particularly interested in my FH research, until I discovered the Norwegian connection. The fact that she was descended from Vikings suddenly got her very excited. ;D
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Hi All. Have we all caught up with the new info?? Any more Torrison relations out there??
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Hi, I think I may be related to people on this feed and would love to find out.
My grandad was John Torrison and he was from Charlton, Se7. I never met him as he died before I was born but he must have been born 1911 or before as my Nan Margaret. My Nan grew up on or near Warspite Road Charlton/Woolwich and then she lived on Floyd Rd opposite Charlton football ground. My Nan and grandad had three children, Pauline, Jacqueline and Terence and I am the daughter of Jacqueline.
My grandad John died around 1961 when my mum was about 16 and my Nan did not really talk about him much. Would be great to find out information about my family 😊
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Hi Tom Torrison
I received your message but I cannot reply to you via PM as I haven’t made 3 posts! Fantastic to hear we are related and you have a lot of information on my Grandad. Would be fab to hear more and see the family tree you mentioned 😊
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You can reply now ;)
Regards
Sarah
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Thanks very much Sarah 😊
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Hi. It’s quite difficult for me to find the threads to reply. Not used to this app and probably doesn’t help because I’m using my phone. I have two trees on ancestry Razaq. Which descends from Nell Torrison and a torrison tree which I made after finding relatives in charlton your neck of the woods. Still trying to join the dots and Sarahtorrison is a relative too. Look for me on Fb and we can connect. X
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Hey, nice to meet you 😊
I’m new to this app too so not sure how to use it. What is your fb name so I can look for you?
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what a fantastic story and how wonderful that you all found each other
my first dna analysis gave me a bit of scandinavian which i was thrilled with asi actually studied Norwegian as a new language in 1979-1981 but afterwards my scottish blood seems to have eaten up the Viking percent on Ancestry
do any of you want a teach yourself norwegian book ?
i should probably donate it to a museum with my dissertation
in those days Norway had 2 languages Bokmal (closer to Danish) + Nynorsk (closer to country
dialects)
every year there were official meetimngs about which changes to make to synchronise the 2 languages together until they became what is now NORSK
i also have winnie the Pooh in Nowrwegian (Ole BRum )+ a beautiful Norwegian book of trolls
It seems a shame for them to languish on a bookcase
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double posted my sister has lived in sweden for quarter of a century + taken the nationality since brexit
i find my Norwegian + memories of watching swedish Pippi Longstocking films with Norwegian subtitles means i can understand simple swedish too .
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Interesting what you say Brigidmac about your Norwegian line being ‘eaten up’ by your Scots line.
I have the name Peddieson/Pedeson on my tree and have often wondered if there is a link with Norway, it sounds Norwegian to me, I have come to a bit of a stand still re records.
They were from the Highlands of Scotland, Black Isle on the East coast. I understand there used to be a lot of shipping trade with Norway.
I must ask Father Christmas for a DNA test for Christmas ;)
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yes do ask him/her
ancestry can now specify regions and will probably sub divide the scandinavian bit
it pinpoints cheshier + isle of man as regions for my mother
+ parts of scotland
as for my russian latvian great grandfather \im clearly 12percent european jewish and it pinpoints locations to latvia +lithuanian which is where ancestors of our mayches who are 100 percent jewish come from {if they know }
having ROBERTS JONES + SMITH ON ENGLISH + wELSH sides it helps if the regions are narrowed down
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Hi nice to meet you too.
It’s Yasmine Mahmood. Not a Torrison 🤣. I’m holding pink balloons. X
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Hi Yazz, Anike,
If you want to friend me on Facebook, I'm Tom Torrison. I believe the only one, so should be easy.
:)
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Great Tom. I’ll do that now.
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Hello
So it seems I share the some of the same family members with you all 😊
My link is:
John and Barbara as above
2) Thomas Torrison b1813 (Rotherhithe)m. Rebekah Armstead b 1827
3) Thomas George Torrison (Rotherhithe)b 1847 m Elizabeth Lewis b 1852
4) Thomas Lewis Torrison (Ansty Street, Rotherhithe) b 1877 m Florence Mary Jones b 1880 (Portsmouth)
5) John Richard Torrison b 1905 (Charlton) m Margaret Elizabeth Wootten (Charlton) b 1911 - they had my mum, Jacqueline Anne Torrison, my auntie Pauline and uncle Terence Lewis Torrison
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Hi Anike and other cousins!
How exciting to add another member to the Torrison clan. My line of descent is:
John (Hans/Jan) Torrison and Barbara (born 1775)
Their daughter Barbara Torrison (born 1805) married Richard Mattingley, Rotherhithe
Frances Anna Mattingly born Rotherhithe 1827 married William Shadforth, Mariner, in Hartlepool County Durham on census day 1851. Presumably they met in Rotherhithe. I'm fascinated about how she travelled from there to Hartlepool. Did he sneak her onto the ship, I wonder... ;D
Richard Mattley Shadforth born 1852, Hartlepool married Margaret Davies, Hartlepool. Their daughter Elizabeth Shadforth, born Hartlepool 1879, died Middlesbrough 1974 was my maternal grandmother.
Regards
GS
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So none of you answered about the Norwegian books on my bookshelf
I think my friend is still in touch with one of our professors from 1980
I found my dissertation about bokmal and Nynorsk but can't find the accompanying cassette where I recorded 6 people from different regions telling the story called Ole Brun who bought 2 cows ..