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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lincolnshire => Topic started by: Drop Bear on Thursday 11 July 13 01:28 BST (UK)
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Hi all,
Is anyone able to lookup 4 deaths for me please. Also where would they be buried?
Sarah Ann Richards - Christened 19 May 1825 (confirmed) died 19 December 1840
Charles Richards - Christened 13 November 1829 (confirmed) died 6 May 1840
Harriet Richards - Born 1833 died 1840
Charity Richards - Born 8 November 1837 died 11 May 1840
All of the above children have parents of William Richards and Sarah Alexander. All of the above children were born in Stamford.
There are supposedly death notices in the Stamford Mercury on Friday 8 May 1840 for Charles and Friday 15 May 1840 for Charity but I cannot find these.
Just to add to this family, I have Hannah Richards Christened 1 October 1833, All Saints, Stamford. On the 1841 Census for the family in North Street, All Saints, Stamford, I have Hannah aged 2. Did the first Hannah die, and when was the second Hannah born (obviously 1839) I cannot find her in the Vital Records. Also she is not with the family when they emigrated to Australia in 1849. So did the second Hannah also die ??? ???
Any help would be appreciated.
Kind regards
DropBear
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Charles RICHARDS d.1840 Stamford 14 400 Jun Qtr and buried 10th April 1840.
Charity RICHARDS d. 1840 Stamford 14 400 Jun Qtr and buried 14th April 1840.
Harriet RICHARDS d. 1840 Stamford 14 3511 Sep Qtr and buried 24th July 1840.
Sarah Ann RICHARDS d. 1840 Stamford 14 403 Dec Qtr and buried 21st December 1840.
All burials were at All Saints, Stamford.
Harriet's death reference could be incorrect, but this is the reference shown on FreeBMD.
Victor
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Thank you Victor, I appreciate your time ;D
I obviously need to delve further as the dates are close but not the months ??? >:(
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Charles RICHARDS d.1840 Stamford 14 400 Jun Qtr and buried 10th April 1840.
Victor
Victor, did all of these dates come from FreeBDM? Perhaps they are not the ones I am looking for :(
I have since received Charles's death certificate and if definately says 6th May 1840
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Hi,
I have had a look in the Stamford Mercury papers on microfilm held in Grantham library and found the following information in the death sections.
Friday May 8th 1840.
In All Saints Stamford on Wednesday last aged 10 CHARLES second son of Mr Wm Richards shoemaker.
Friday May 15th.
In All Saints Stamford on Monday last aged 2 CHARITY 4th daughter of Mr Wm Richards shoemaker.being the 2nd who died within a week.
Friday Dec 25th.
18th December aged 15 SARAH ANN daughter of Mr Wm Richards shoemaker of North St Road(being the fourth of his children to die in 7 months).
I did not see Harriet/Hannah's death but will have another look next Saturday hope this information is useful.
Kathy
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Burial register for Stamford All Saints showing the burials of Charles and Charity, both in May 1840.
http://www.lincstothepast.com/Records/RecordDisplayTranscript.aspx?oid=522437&iid=296597
Harriet's burial is on the the next page (image 124) and Sarah's on image 126.
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Hi,
I have had a look in the Stamford Mercury papers on microfilm held in Grantham library and found the following information in the death sections.
Friday May 8th 1840.
In All Saints Stamford on Wednesday last aged 10 CHARLES second son of Mr Wm Richards shoemaker.
Friday May 15th.
In All Saints Stamford on Monday last aged 2 CHARITY 4th daughter of Mr Wm Richards shoemaker.being the 2nd who died within a week.
Friday Dec 25th.
18th December aged 15 SARAH ANN daughter of Mr Wm Richards shoemaker of North St Road(being the fourth of his children to die in 7 months).
I did not see Harriet/Hannah's death but will have another look next Saturday hope this information is useful.
Kathy
Kathy, thank you so much ;D You obviously went out of your way for me and I appreciate that very much. So that confirms the deaths of Charles, Charity and the first Sarah Ann (yes there was another Sarah Ann as well as two Hannah's). Now I just need to find where they may have been buried. I would appreciate the offer to find the death notices for Harriet and Hannah if it is not inconvenient as once I have confirmed them, I have the family sorted from there.
Again thank you so much ;D ;D
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Burial register for Stamford All Saints showing the burials of Charles and Charity, both in May 1840.
http://www.lincstothepast.com/Records/RecordDisplayTranscript.aspx?oid=522437&iid=296597
Harriet's burial is on the the next page (image 124) and Sarah's on image 126.
Thank you pamthomas, I appreciate you looking for me. This link is not working for me. I have even tried going in by www.lincstothepast.com but it will not work. If I were to PM you my email address, could you possibly email the burials to me ??? Having a look, I have noted that the site does not work for a number of people for no particular reason >:(
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Thank you pamthomas, I appreciate you looking for me. This link is not working for me. I have even tried going in by www.lincstothepast.com but it will not work. If I were to PM you my email address, could you possibly email the burials to me ??? Having a look, I have noted that the site does not work for a number of people for no particular reason >:(
I tried it a few seconds ago, and it's not working for me either, so I would first of all suggest that you try it again another day, because it worked for me last night.
If you have a subscription to FindMyPast the Stamford All Saints burial images for 1840 are available there. Images 118, 119 and 121.
Hannah's baptism is image 286.
Incidentally, I think that the Harriet who died aged 6 in 1840 is the Hannah who was baptised in October 1833. If she was baptised shortly after birth then the age would be correct as she wouldn't be 7 until August/September.
Hannah's baptism in 1833 is image 286 on FindMyPast.
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Incidentally, I think that the Harriet who died aged 6 in 1840 is the Hannah who was baptised in October 1833. If she was baptised shortly after birth then the age would be correct as she wouldn't be 7 until August/September.
Hannah's baptism in 1833 is image 286 on FindMyPast.
Thank you pamthomas, I was inclined to think that myself but there was a reason I dismissed it (can't quite remember at the moment but I will tell you when I remember). Having you also suggest that has made me wonder again if this is indeed the case.
I have been going through my notes and I have a death date of 22nd July 1840 next to Harriet's name perhaps if Kathy would be kind enough to look at that date when she is next at the Grantham library we could solve the Harriet/Hannah mystery. Also on Sarah Ann's notice that Kathy provided, it says "being the fourth of his children to die in 7 months" a July death would fit in. I do not have a subscription to FindMyPast but as you suggested I will continue to try ;D
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O.K. I have had a look at my notes and have my reasoning behind there being a Hannah and a Harriet.
Their mother's death certificate states 4 females deceased (Sarah Ann, Harriet, Charity & Hannah)
Through this thread we have confirmed Sarah Ann and Charity (still can't get that link to work for Harriet)
Their mother's death certificate states 1 male deceased (Charles)
Through this thread we have confirmed Charles
All other children were alive and accounted for when their mother died. I have a note from a family member that says that the 1833 Hannah may have died in 1834.
So in summary to my original post this is what I have;
Sarah Ann Christened 19th May 1825 died 19th December 1840 but where is she buried
Charles Christened 13th November 1829 died 6th May but where is he buried
Harriet maybe born 1833 maybe died 22nd July 1840 and where is she buried
Charity Christened 8th November 1837 died 11th May 1840 but where is she buried
Hannah Christened 1st October 1833 maybe died 1834 and where is she buried
Confirmation of Hannah and/or Harriet are obviously key as then there is the question of the 2 year old Hannah on the 1841 census that did not leave for Australia with the rest of the family in 1849 and that would be 5 deceased females
P.S. I am still trying to get onto lincsonline, haven't given up yet. ;D
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Hi DropBear,
I will look for Hannah & Harriets information on Saturday and let you know the outcome.
Kathy
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Hi DropBear,
I will look for Hannah & Harriets information on Saturday and let you know the outcome.
Kathy
Many thanks Kathy, you are a gem :D ;D
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Hi DropBear,
I have checked for births/deaths from Jan 1833 to May 1834 and sorry no luck so far :( :( :( but will have another look next Saturday I am only in for an hour but I don't mind looking.
Kathy
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So in summary to my original post this is what I have;
Sarah Ann Christened 19th May 1825 died 19th December 1840 but where is she buried
Charles Christened 13th November 1829 died 6th May but where is he buried
Harriet maybe born 1833 maybe died 22nd July 1840 and where is she buried
Charity Christened 8th November 1837 died 11th May 1840 but where is she buried
Hannah Christened 1st October 1833 maybe died 1834 and where is she buried
Try FreeREG http://www.freereg.org.uk/cgi/Search.pl
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Hi Geoff,
I have checked FreeReg hoping it would give me dates of births+deaths of Harriet and Hannah from 1831-1849.(If found that would be a great help looking in Stamford Mercury paper).The only one I could see was Hannah's baptism 1 Oct 1833 which has already been found.The others are very elusive.
Kathy
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Hi Geoff,
I have checked FreeReg hoping it would give me dates of births+deaths of Harriet and Hannah from 1831-1849.(If found that would be a great help looking in Stamford Mercury paper).The only one I could see was Hannah's baptism 1 Oct 1833 which has already been found.The others are very elusive.
Hi Kathy :) - the burials of most (if not all) of the RICHARDS kids can be found on FreeREG - the ones in 1840 certainly show up. :) I only looked in 1840 which seems to show they were buried Stamford (All Saints).
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Hi DropBear,
I have checked for births/deaths from Jan 1833 to May 1834 and sorry no luck so far :( :( :( but will have another look next Saturday I am only in for an hour but I don't mind looking.
Kathy
You are amazing Kathy, I really appreciate your help. ;D ;D
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Hi Kathy :) - the burials of most (if not all) of the RICHARDS kids can be found on FreeREG - the ones in 1840 certainly show up. :) I only looked in 1840 which seems to show they were buried Stamford (All Saints).
Geoff-E, I appreciate your input but it is Hannah & Harriet that appear to be elusive, which is what Kathy is kindly freely giving her time and research for. Hannah cannot be found on the FreeREG burials and Harriet cannot be found on the FreeREG baptisms. (Feel free to prove me wrong). It would appear there is definitely a Hannah, as there is a baptism for 1833 but we are yet to find a death for that Hannah. As previously posted there is a Hannah on the 1841 census aged 2 which would have her born 1839. Thoughts that this may have actually have been Harriet can be disproved as we have confirmed a burial for Harriet in 1840. So we are also trying to find out what happened to the 2nd Hannah aged two as she did not go to Australia in 1849 with the rest of the family.
Kathy has helped me by confirming the two Stamford Mercury news articles I had been told of PLUS she found Sarah Ann's which I was not aware of and I am grateful for.
You say it seems to show they are buried in Stamford All Saints, could you clarify that for me then. I live in Australia and "in the Parish of All Saints, Stamford, Lincolnshire" means a suburb or place. Do you mean there is a churchyard or cemetery. Perhaps I was not clear with "where are they buried", I mean physically where are they buried. ???
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You say it seems to show they are buried in Stamford All Saints, could you clarify that for me then. I live in Australia and "in the Parish of All Saints, Stamford, Lincolnshire" means a suburb or place. Do you mean there is a churchyard or cemetery. Perhaps I was not clear with "where are they buried", I mean physically where are they buried. ???
There was certainly a burial ground around All Saints church as the photo shows. http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/LIN/Stamford/stamford_churchhist.html
The 1886 1:500 map shows that All Saints was not endowed with a huge church yard and I suppose it's possible that there was an "overspill" yard somewhere http://www.old-maps.co.uk/maps.html?coords=502838,307153
It was the mid 1850s before municipal cemeteries (often out of town) were opened.
There is a map of All Saints parish here http://www.stamfordallsaints.org.uk/
:)
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Hi Kathy :) - the burials of most (if not all) of the RICHARDS kids can be found on FreeREG - the ones in 1840 certainly show up. :) I only looked in 1840 which seems to show they were buried Stamford (All Saints).
Geoff-E, I appreciate your input but it is Hannah & Harriet that appear to be elusive, which is what Kathy is kindly freely giving her time and research for. Hannah cannot be found on the FreeREG burials and Harriet cannot be found on the FreeREG baptisms. (Feel free to prove me wrong). It would appear there is definitely a Hannah, as there is a baptism for 1833 but we are yet to find a death for that Hannah. As previously posted there is a Hannah on the 1841 census aged 2 which would have her born 1839. Thoughts that this may have actually have been Harriet can be disproved as we have confirmed a burial for Harriet in 1840. So we are also trying to find out what happened to the 2nd Hannah aged two as she did not go to Australia in 1849 with the rest of the family.
Kathy has helped me by confirming the two Stamford Mercury news articles I had been told of PLUS she found Sarah Ann's which I was not aware of and I am grateful for.
From my post #8 in this thread Incidentally, I think that the Harriet who died aged 6 in 1840 is the Hannah who was baptised in October 1833. If she was baptised shortly after birth then the age would be correct as she wouldn't be 7 until August/September.
Hannah's baptism in 1833 is image 286 on FindMyPast.
Hannah's baptism in the register for the parish church of All Saints in the town of Stamford.
http://www.lincstothepast.com/Records/RecordDisplayTranscript.aspx?oid=551297&iid=291962
It wouldn't be the first time a name has been entered incorrectly into a register.
You say it seems to show they are buried in Stamford All Saints, could you clarify that for me then. I live in Australia and "in the Parish of All Saints, Stamford, Lincolnshire" means a suburb or place. Do you mean there is a churchyard or cemetery. Perhaps I was not clear with "where are they buried", I mean physically where are they buried. ???
Usually, in ye olde days, a burial entry in the church register meant that someone was buried in the churchyard attached to the church. Sometimes, as Geoff has said, and especially by the early 1800s in the larger parishes (and All Saints is now the largest parish in Stamford and also one of the oldest), burials could have taken place in an 'overspill' burial ground. Perhaps the local vicar could confirm this?
http://www.lincoln.anglican.org/search_parishes.php?13209000
The five parishes of Stamford which are in Lincolnshire are All Saints, St George. St John the Baptist, St Mary, and St Michael. On FreeREG, All Saints and St Michael are fully transcribed for the years you want. Baptisms for St George 1832 onwards can be found
http://www.lincstothepast.com/Records/RecordDisplayTranscript.aspx?oid=718398&iid=289910
Baptisms St John the Baptist
http://www.lincstothepast.com/Records/RecordDisplayTranscript.aspx?oid=584973&iid=568020
Burials for St John 1830+ start
http://www.lincstothepast.com/Records/RecordDisplayTranscript.aspx?oid=584452&iid=288814
Neither baptisms nor burials for St Mary 1812+ are available on Lincs to the Past or FreeREG.
Transcriptions of the burial registers by Lincolnshire Family History Society indicate no Richards (or Rickards) burials for young children in any Stamford parish 1840 +/- 10 years apart from the four already found in 1840.
The town of Stamford itself borders Northamptonshire, but there is also Stamford Baron which is in Northamptonshire. Records for which are on FreeREG.
It should be noted that the death/burials notices Kathy found are in the newspaper are not the type of 'family announcements' made nowadays.
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Thank you Geoff-E and pamthomas. I am looking at the links you have given me and will post a response shortly.
pamthomas, I do understand what you are saying about Hannah being Harriet and visa versa. ;D I really do. What makes me question this though is the mothers death certificate;
4 deceased females - we have 100% confirmed Sarah Ann and Charity
1 deceased male - we have 100% confirmed Charles
Who then are the other 2 females? As mentioned before I can 100% confirm and account for all of the other children.
Also, the question still remains as to the Hannah on the 1841 census aged 2. Where did she come from and where did she go.
I do hope you don't get cranky with me as I understand what you have said and under ordinary circumstances I would definately agree with that theory but the death certificate and census tell me another story :o
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UPDATE
As suggested by pamthomas, I have emailed All Saints and received this reply from the Churchwarden;
"The All Saints churchyard is not in current use. A number of gravestones are still there and when time permits I will look for you and let you know my findings."
so I will advise when I get another reply. Thank you pamthomas.
I have received the death certificate for Harriet, 22 July 1840, so I am beginning to come around to the 1833 baptism of Hannah being Harriet ::)
(I can hear you saying "I told you so") BUT
I have also received the death certificate of the children's father and it also claims 4 deceased females and 1 deceased male.
So I will leave the Harriet/Hannah one alone for now and see if anyone can nut out the mystery of the Hannah aged 2 on the 1841 census. Any suggestions would be appreciated ??? ???
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... it also claims 4 deceased females and 1 deceased male.
I suppose there is always the possibility that children were stillborn and were not baptised. :(
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Good thought Geoff-E but who is the 2 year old child listed on the census that I cannot account for?
I now believe this is the current theory.
Four deceased females;
1. Harriet
2. Charity
3. Sarah Ann
4. ??
1 deceased male;
1. Charles
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... who is the 2 year old child listed on the census that I cannot account for?
This one?
Births Dec 1839
RICHARDS Hannah Stamford 14 569
Could have died in transit to Oz I suppose. :-\
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BINGO, you found her. You are a legend Geoff-E. She was not listed with the rest of the family going to Australia which leads me to believe she died before 1849.
Where did you find that?
You are too good, thank you for not giving up on me ;D ;D