RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: tedscout on Monday 26 August 13 13:31 BST (UK)
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Hello dear Rootschatters,
William George Freeman was a 15 year old convict who came to NSW on "The John" in 1832.
He got his ticket of leave on 19 April 1837 in New South Wales. The next time I can find him is in Adelaide on 15 September 1840 when he marries Sarah Ann Stacey.
I know most things about him before 1837 and after 1840. I know of all his children and most of his decendents.
I just want to know how he got from NSW to SA. There are family stories and information on various websites, but I want proof, and I am finding it hard to find.
Hope someone with better knowledge of SA than me, or with better resources, or just better at finding things will be able to help me.
Thanks for reading this, and thanks in advance for anything you may find.
Cheers, Ted
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Hi Ted, Do you know when he got his Certificate of Freedom? Also what was he doing 1837 and where?
Neil
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According to the records he actually got his certificate of freedom in 1837 Ref # 37/0339
Knocked off a bit of Cheese ;D Ensuring his Bone density was OK no doubt. ;)
Neil
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Ted & Neil
How can a Freeman be a Convict..... It takes a Big Cheese to do that.....
Now NSW c1837 ... to SA before 1840 .... by sea down via Bass Strait .... perhaps with sheep and as shepherd accompanying a Supercargo in charge..
Some left from Eden NSW ...
TROVE should help but also back issues of Australian National Maritime Museum quarterly journal may have article.....
Cheers JM
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I am more worried by the fact that he came all the way from England on the "JOHN" :o Dysentery perhaps ::)
Neil ;D
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Neil is quite right, he received his certificate of freedom in 1837, not his TOL, so he could do anything he pleased. The 1837 muster shows that he was assigned to/working for J. HAWDON of Bateman's Bay. He probably already had a TOL so was with HAWDON by choice.
Joseph HAWDON? http://adb.anu.edu.au/biography/hawdon-joseph-2168
"In 1838 Hawdon and Charles Bonney drove cattle from a station near Howlong to Adelaide following the course of the Murray River for most of the way. This venture helped to fill in the map. Next year, with Lieutenant Mundy, he drove tandem over a more direct route between Melbourne and Adelaide".
So perhaps William went with him.
Debra :)
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:) Well spotted Dundee :)
HAWDON J Two NSW chaps
Joseph is mentioned 1840-1848 in the NSW Col Sec’s LAND index at NSW SRO
John is mentioned many times across a number of indexes, seems to be associated with land in Victoria 1839-1848 and around Maneroo (ie The Monaro District) NSW
http://www.records.nsw.gov.au/state-archives/collection-search
Cheers, JM (Neil, the Big Cheese could have been handy on the John trip)
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http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/70934477 18 Jan 1879 Australian Town and Country Journal
John Hawdon his life story in words ;D and picture too :) ( :D Joseph was his younger bro :D)
;D ;D ;D Ted, Neil, Dundee .... JM is happy RChatter, there's a mention of Bowman in one of the newspaper cuttings about John Hawdon ;D at Trove, and it is confirming info I have had sitting in a too hard tray for decades ::) ::) :
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/16600463 SMH 9 Nov 1929. Fantastic article, mentions the letters of introduction used back 100 years and more ie in the then penal colony of NSW when some arrivals were free settlers who brought letters of introduction with them.
Ted, many many many 'umble thanks from JM and my living rellies (some were adults when SMH article was first hitting the streets) .... your thread re William Freeman will be topic of the quarter in my next SCANDELL sheet I do up for my elderly rellies. I had been trying to find a topic to focus on, and Ted, you have found it for me.
Cheers, JM (Assuming I can have Leave of Absence from RChat for a day or so ;D to get my Bowman folders back up and re-read and thus central for my focus).
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No mean feat in those days Howlong to Adelaide (google Maps) shows approximate route, even passes over Cobb Highway (possible tie in) approximately 900klms at 10klms per day = 90 days. Phew :o
Neil ;)
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Goodmorning everyone,
Thank you for all your answers. It was late last night when I wrote the topic and yes of course I made a mistake. It is his Certificate of Freedom he recieved in 1837.
I haven't seen the 1837 muster and didn't know he was with Hawdon. This explains a lot. Thank you so much Debra.
Neil - Our family saying is "When is a Freeman not a free man? When he is a convict".
Oooh 3 red posts - you are working hard on my behalf. Thank you.
Cheers, Ted
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http://adb.anu.edu.au/biography/bonney-charles-3020
"On 4 January 1838 he was invited by Joseph Hawdon to join an expedition taking cattle to South Australia. Bonney accepted at once and joined the party at the Goulburn River on 17 January. They travelled down the Goulburn to the Murray, which they followed until they saw the Mount Lofty Range and then turned west to Adelaide where they were enthusiastically welcomed by the colonists, many of whom were living on kangaroo meat. On the journey Bonney had often pacified hostile Aboriginals by his cheerful demeanour and the music of his flute."
BOOK perhaps in Ted's local library ;D
"The Journal of a Journey from New South Wales to Adelaide
Hawdon, Joseph
Published by Georgian House, Melbourne, 1952"
and from an online book review
"Illustrated with Black and White plates. Fold-out map. ....... 65pages This is the story of the first overlanding of cattle from New South Wales to Adelaide, undertaken at the height of summer, over unknown country and accomplished with the loss of only four cattle!"
height of summer .... hopefully the (Hume ::) ) River had water in it :)
I have already phoned a rellie born in 1917, he is 'beside himself' he went droving out past Wentworth across to Adelaide with his Da and Uncle and Great Uncle in 1930s .... sleeping under a bullock dray :)
Cheers, JM
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BOOK perhaps in Ted's local library ;D
"The Journal of a Journey from New South Wales to Adelaide
Hawdon, Joseph
Published by Georgian House, Melbourne, 1952"
Better than my local library JM - its digitised on TROVE
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:) Fantastical news Ted.... I will definitely be AWL ;D
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I've just finished reading it. Wow what a journey. I know a few people who live on the Murray who will be very interested in this book for various reasons.
Now how do I find that he was one of the "Servents" got paid to go on the trip?
If I'm lucky my Billy could be the "William" who was put in the hollow tree because he was nearly blind because of the heat. I wish Joseph Hawdon had used the men's names. >:( He obviously cared for them.
I wonder if a record was kept about the men's wages when they got to Adelaide?
Cheers, Ted
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JM, great to see one of your brick walls demolished after you have helped so many others with theirs.
Cheers
Macushla
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Thank you Macushla.
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Hi there,
In a court case in 1897 in which Billy Freeman (1817 -1899) sued a parson for money owing (!) it says "the old man, who came to South Australia with Captain Sturt in 1838" which strongly suggests that though he was indentured to John Hawdon, he came to Adelaide on the third cattle drive with the famous Charles Sturt. Cattles drives in 1838: Joseph Hawdon (John's brother), Edward Eyre and Charles Sturt. Sturt's farm at Varroville NSW was only 10 miles from John Hawdon's at Elderslie NSW. In the court case involving William and Sarah in 1862 a testimonial was handed up from Sturt and also from Edward Stirling. landowner and MP at Strathalbyn. This suggests Billy may have worked for Stirling when he arrived in SA. Alan Atkinson. Adelaide
Regards Alan Atkinson
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How do I thank you all.
It's been 10 years since I last read this thread.
Such amazing people you all are to help me and my hubby find his 4 x great grandfather.
To all who helped and cared we found Billy in his unmarked grave.
And traced the footsteps of his sons up the Murray.
Cheers, Ted
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Congratulations, Tedscout, and to all who helped.
What an amazing outcome.
So exciting to hear of others' successful outcomes.
M.
P.S. What's the next challenge? :)
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Well we went to where Billy was born (Freshford, UK) and we went where Billie died (Macclesfield SA).
We followed his sons up the Murray to Echuca.
WW1 & 2 vets.
So proud of the little boy who stole 2lb of cheese, and became a Convict.
I think the only thing I can add to Billy's walk is - This is Real Australian History.
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Thanks to everyone who followed Billy's journey.
And an amazing Book is the result - Alan - has published The Trials of Billy Freeman.