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Some Special Interests => Travelling People => Topic started by: horsesmad on Thursday 31 October 13 17:19 GMT (UK)
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just got a marriage cert back for noah lawrence and oachie cooper whom i believe is ocean mary cooper born approx 1901, it says her father is vanslow cooper profession hawker, witnesses annie cooper and j castle, in 1922 oachie give her address as york road teddington,
any help on which vanzlow cooper this could be would be greatly appreciated.. :)
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Hi
There are some entries on the 1911 index for this name including an entry in Middlesex
There is also an entry for a Daniel Cooper b 1875 in Middlesex which has been amended to Vanslo
Rootschat do not allow 1911 lookups so you would need to buy credits to view the entries yourself.
If you are viewing them via http://www.1911census.co.uk/search/tnaform.aspx you will need to look for the second entry as Daniel Cooper
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:)thank you for that it was the same as i was looking at :)
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My ggg grandad was sam cooper (norwood sam) I think he had a son called vanslow. This was a common name in the family. I think he married a smith. Does anyone have a family tree of my family or photoes. As I dont know how to do things on the computers. Thanks maxwell williams
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:)hi max
i think the sam cooper you are looking for married amy smith, i do not know if the vanslow im looking for would be the same one as you, if you could put more information this may help, maybe your grandparents ect this could help where your family lived as many names as possible, then this will help people make a connection :)
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No the sam cooper im talking about was with flora.
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Sam and florina cooper baptised their son vanslow at ewell in surrey in 1825 .also I know vanslow had a boy called faniel. Cheers.
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Hello sorry to poke my nose in here but the Vanslow Cooper I think you looking for was my great great Grandfather , he also had a son called Vanslow (uncle Vanny) and one called Henry who i am named after along with me father me grandfather and my son little Henry boi lol.........Now me great grandfather (Henry) who was a lovely man had a sister called Oachie (aunt Oachie) and two other sisters one who married Chick Summers father to Alfie and Jimmy Summers and the other sister married I think a Brazil and he's brother (uncle Vanny) Vanslow had a boy called Gary me (cousin Gary) who still lives in Teddington ............All these Coopers come from one man called Mattias Cooper the Royal rat catcher lol and are known as the Windor Coopers and are the oldest Gypsies in the country ....Vanslow is a dutch name and that would make sense because before the coopers travelled to England they were traced to Holland and was known as the black Dutch as cooper gypsy skin is very dark ....A gypsy coopers real romany name is Vardo masaplona but because we only spoke romany when we entered the country the English could not understand us and as you know a Vardo is a trailer or wagon in romany and we the Coopers built barrel top wagons and as you know in english a cooper was a barrel maker so the english called us coopers as our wagons were built the same as barrels hahaha........I also remember me grandfather cooper always going on about he's cousins the Keffords and that some of them had got work in Australia spraying roofs and tarmacing and i once even spoke to one of them on the phone about me going out there to work with them but I never ended up going....
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Also ocean may of had another sister im not to sure but the J castle you mention would of been Jimmy Castle who had boys wally and Jimmy and one more thing Vanslow Jnr oceans brother (Gary coopers father) married a Kefford.......Ocean had a boy also called vanslow (he could sing just like Elvis lol).....she had other daughters i dont know to much about them I know one married a castle and one used to still sell flowers just like her mother ocean..
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:) :) :)ah thank you so much info and yes its the right family, oachie married my great grands nephew noah lawrence, they seemed to settle in stains middlesex. its said that vanslow married florence penfold i dont see any evidence of her being penfold, but found vanslow in york rd with a florence, when oachie married she gave york road as her address, on later electoral registers you find vanslow with a jenny cooper,at the same address i traced this back to her being genty kefford have you heard of the lawrences?my grandad swaileys mother was annie taylor daughter of plato and betsie, thank you for all of this, oh one last thing, so is vanslow jr mother amy cooper :)
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sorry mean vanslow 1873, there is so many vanslows lol :)
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Right this is where it gets confusing .........My great grandfather Henry, Oachie's brother married a woman called margaret cooper her maiden name was already Cooper(me great grandmother) and im pretty sure they were cousins whats not unusual with in gypsies as you probably know but i dont know if they were 1st or second cousins but rumor has it she run off with a man called Tom scott but she must of come back to me grandfather because I new and love me great grandmother.......Vanslow Lawrence(elvis singer) son of Oachie 's was very close to me grandfather(my fathers father) and used to go to work with him but i dont know who he married but i can find out because me grandmother is still alive and going strong lol and she will know im seeing her tomorrow...Vanslow Lawrance's sisters one of them was called Lila Lawrance and she married a Horse dealer called Jonny Cooper lol who is related to me great grandmother Margaret cooper.....Now I can find out more about this too because one of Lila and Jonnys Sons rung me up the other day (little Jonny) to buy some caravans from me as thats what i trade in and I will be going to there yard in the next couple of weeks and will have a good catch up as i haven't seen none of Jonny and Lila's lot in years.....another of Oachies Daughters married one of the Ball's but not sure who but again I can ask.........You mention the name florence and asked about Amy cooper ....Right Amy cooper was Oachies sister she married Chicken Summers and had 2 boys and 2 girls....Oachie had another sister called Fiance Cooper (aunt Fiance) and this could be where the name Florence is coming from because they all lived in york rd ...........Now you ask about Penfolds ..both my great grandfather (Henry Cooper ) and great grandmother (Margaret Cooper) both claimed that there mothers where Penfolds lol but again the only evidence of this I have is that there's loads of Penfolds around me down here in Kent and they all claim to be related to me lol...........Was your Grandad swailey a Lawrance and he's mother was a Taylor ....I have loads of Taylor cousins lol and have a good few friends with the name swailey or swales for short ...........Are you a traveller ??? What is your surname now???? what was your fathers surname???
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Right Just spoke to me granny and im wrong about a couple of things lol...........Me great granny never run off with tom Scott hahahaha her sister Lydia Cooper was married to him lol where i got that from i dont know........... and Florance Penfold Was married to Vanlow Snr making her my great great granny.....
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:)lol, i really need to read all you have written over again, i have a tom scott lol my great great grand mother was elizabeth scott her parents were fred scott and cinderella lee, the scotts ended up around mitchim, no i am not a traveller, my nan was may lawrence, she had a brother swailey, he went by the name sonny lawrence, my great grandad swailey was killed in the first world war, my grandads brothers were noah lawrence he married lila dixey, henry lawrence he married lila port and alfred who married maria lee :)
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You say your not a gypsy lol but all the names you are looking for apart from lawrance are gypsy names hahaha .........I am a gypsy and the problem with gypsies is everyone names there kids after there self's and only breed with other close gypsy families who are usually related anyway making it near on impossible to trace them back ..........
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:)umm i know the name lawrence doesnt come up, but my great great grandad job, well his mother was jane hilton, she had a son emmanuel hilton, she then married a james castle, he died, but she had a son with him james, husband james then dies, she gets with thomas lawrence, but job and james are never with her, first they are with the castles, then they are with abel williams, then for twenty years job goes by the name castle not lawrence, i dont know lol :)
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I know the Castles they are close to my family and related I also know the Hiltons who are also gypsies and are related to the castles lol
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You see even though its hard to trace gypsies back the saving grace is that they dont lose each other like other people as they are such a close nit community and i would have money on it that all the names you have mentioned such as castles , hiltons, lee's, taylor's, penfolds, scott's , coopers , keffords, are directly related to the people that surround me today and my guess is that because it sounds like a couple of these gypsy women married gorjas (none gypsy people) like you family the Lawrance's back then that would of been shameful meaning these women would of been expelled for the community leading to over time losing all history of where they come from .........this is just my theory but I would have money on it and this would explain why Job and Jim held the name Castle as they considered there self's gypsies
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henry you have been such a great help thank you, its hard for people like me who are not travellers, to find people who are that will share info with us, im not pretending to be a traveller but my ancestors were so when you are trying to do your family tree its hard, also all the marrying in and out does not help :)
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:)henry if you talk to your cousin gary or any other family can you ask them about the lawrences thank you :)
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:)hi max
i had a look at what you posted, vansloe was son to samuel born 1794 to 1856 and florina 1791 to 1855.
there is also fairnetty 1823 and nelson 1829 who married mary ann gosling in 1863.
there is a lot on samuel, but was not sure what you already knew, if you want me to send you some info let me know :)
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Hi hope you dont mind me joining in Vanzelo Cooper was my g/mothers brother she was Eliza Cooper. The children of Vanzelo and Amy are :
Liza Cooper married William (Darkie) Ball
William Cooper (one legged Billy ) he never married
Vanzelo Cooper married Fitnness (not sure about the spelling) she was a Penfold
Minnie Cooper married Albert Penfold (brother to Fitnness)
George Cooper married Jane Smith
Amy Cooper married William Hearn
Alfred Cooper married EmilyAmer & Vivi - to continue
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Sorry just had to check my notes I believe Alfred married twice to emily and Vivie Lues
Charity Cooper married ? Goodmen
Rhoda Cooper married Joe Goodmen and
Samuel Cooper married Violet Ridgley
hope this helps you in your search as gives you a few more names to go on .
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As you said it can be confusing all having the same name and I have to correct my previous information my G/mother Eliza Cooper was not Vanzelos brother but her father Samuel Cooper was.
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:D thankyou woodcutters.
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You are welcome a lot of the information was passed to me from my cousin Viv she is a direct descendant of Vanslows ;)
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:)hi woodcutters, have u heard of the lawrences they settled in ashford middlesex :)
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Sorry unable to help with the Lawrences :)
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Minnie married albert penfold my mothers uncle,his sister fiancé married vanslow minnies brother
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Ochie is my grannie her son vanny the Elvis singer is my dad
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Ochie is my grannie
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Hi michelle.
My great grand dad is swailey lawrence, he was born in1892 he was the brother of noah lawrence that married lila dicksy.They a noah lawerence that married oachie cooper.
would this be your family :) :)
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My dad is vanny my sister is kelly vannys mum was called ochie I don't no much about the family as I was adopted by Donald beach could you ring me maybe (*)
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Yes swalie is my uncle
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hi
i will call u later :)
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Vanny is my father
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Hi hoping someone can help, I’m trying to find information on my great grandfather Samuel Cooper married to Violet had 5 kids including my Nan Irene Clare. Any information would be greatly appreciated, I am told he had a brother called Vanslow. He lived in a lot of places but towards the end of his live he lived with my Nan in twinning Avenue.
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You are talking about my Grandmother Oshen Mary Lawrence. She was married to Noah Lawrence. They had a son Vanslow Lawrence..My great grandparents grave is in Feltham Cemetry. Lila and Noah Lawrence and can be seen if you do a search for Lila Lawrence. Oshies grave also there but I can't locate it.
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Hi Kimmy.
My family are the lawrences, my great grand father was swailey lawrence and he was killed i ww1.
so he is brother to noah that married lila, i have been and visted the grave in feltham its huge.I am in contact with a cousin becky and she is the grand daughter of alfred lawrece brother to noah and swailey,
we know a lot about the taylor side but we cant find out much about job lawrences parents thomas lawrence and jane hilton, would you know anything .
regards
paula
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Hi Paula, Uncle Joby was my great uncle, my dad's uncle so unfortunately I didn't know his family. All my dad's brothers and sisters have gone now. It's becoming more difficult to find out about our family. Plus if course they all used the same names; Swaley, Vanny, Noah etc. I haven't seen Becky for a long time but she certainly will know more than me. Regards from Kim