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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Derry (Londonderry) => Topic started by: argyle25cassidy on Thursday 02 January 14 13:00 GMT (UK)
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Hi looking for info on Derry cattle dealers.....any archive or photos of the dealers or the old cattle market on Rossville street.......has anyone done a history of this subject, can't really find any info on this online.
My own granda John Cassidy 1882-1948 and his father William 1858-1928 were cattle dealers.
Any help in this matter would be very welcome, many thanks
argyle25cassidy
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Wonder that you didn't find 'anything' online since a google for 'market rossville St derry' came up with a youtube video (1902) and other historical mentions as well- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QZhXwly4MY
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I have that footage on a dvd..........but it doesn't tell you anything or name anyone on the film footage....and not that great footage either.
I am looking for proper info on the cattle market, I have dozens of books about Derry, but nothing with the cattle market in it. So if that's all "that is online" I don't think I was far off the mark with saying I can't find anything. Look forward to anymore replys with some proper info....many thanks
Regards argyle25cassidy
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Well, I did find various details about the cattle market online from various sources but since you are looking for some sort of 'proper info' and aren't interested in anything "that is online" suggest you check Derry City Library, Tower Museum, PRONI, newspaper archives, etc.
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I will look elsewhere.......you seem to have attitude to people when they ask for help, you might spend time looking for info for people, but that is your choice. If you found other info you didn't mention it.I have looked online and can't seem to find any info on the market. you are far to Abrupt with some of your posts.I look forward to any reply you might post you seem to imply that I have not looked online, if you don't live in Ireland/Derry you have to rely on the internet, that's why people come on these sites.
Regards
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First of all, there is absolutely no need to be rude. You do seem to have forgotten that I did provide you with information on at least one topic recently- all of which took time to look up and then post but you needn't worry because I shall not be annoying you further with any more information after this post.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=670397.msg5155378#msg5155378
I have no idea where you live and since you rejected online sources I suggested some offline ones.
Since you apparently don't live in Ireland a visit to Derry Library, Tower Museum and newspaper archives isn't practical but PRONI does have an online catalogue which would be worth checking and several online databases (especially the Valuation Revision Books which cover properties from the printed version of Griffith's until c1929).
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I'm not being rude.........I always use my manners
Thankyou for anytime you have put in, but I didn't get any info that I didn't already know.
I have looked on all the sites you suggest, that is why I came on here, because I didn't find any info.
Regards
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Hi Argyle25cassidy,
Have a look on Facebook page '400th anniversary of derrys walls' Its a page of old photos of Derry and people. In album -Old scenes from the city - photo of cattle market and folk have posted names and bits of information. Regards Reichs
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Many thanks Reichs..........I will have a look.
Regards argyle25cassidy
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Hi
I have had a lot of help through private messages.y many thanks for all the help..."you know who you are".
Kind regards argyle
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Wonder that you didn't find 'anything' online since a google for 'market rossville St derry' came up with a youtube video (1902) and other historical mentions as well- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QZhXwly4MY
Are you able to post this in the resources section Aghadowey. Just a suggestion. Very interesting just to see the clothes, transport and buildings in Derry at this time. From NZ I have visited many towns with a cattle market in UK and know that some still have regular days. What amazed me was that they don't seem to be in yards or stalls at all. In NZ we have saleyards, permanent fixtures and the sheep/cattle wouldn't be wondering around with everyone like they are in this video.
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Glad to see that someone found it interesting but I can no longer edit posts to add or update links.
Link added :)
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Hi looking for info on Derry cattle dealers.....any archive or photos of the dealers or the old cattle market on Rossville street.......has anyone done a history of this subject, can't really find any info on this online.
My own granda John Cassidy 1882-1948 and his father William 1858-1928 were cattle dealers.
Any help in this matter would be very welcome, many thanks
argyle25cassidy
Hello, what was your Grandmothers first name and did they live in Glasgow.
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I just discovered this site today and found your questions about the cattle markets in Derry and the dates and names you have mentioned, are more than familiar to me.
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http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=749241.new#new
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Hi
Unless i'm stupid i still can't find what this link is trying to tell me, i have dozens of books on Derry different subjects etc , but still can't find much on the cattle market/ dealers.
I have a copy if the old cattle market film 1902 which is great to see, but i am wondering if anyone has or knows where i can find old photos of the market/dealers.
Kind regards argyle
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I dont know if it helps much but my 2x great grandfather was a butcher and cattle dealer in St Johnstown, so I'm guessing that he attended this market regularly. His name was Hugh Lynch
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Hi
I'm still looking to find any old photos of the old cattle market, if anyone can help please get in touch.
Kind regards argyle.
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Hello, I just stumbled upon your post and found it interesting to note of your Cassidy family cattle dealers. Our Thomas Cassidy was a cattle dealer we suspect either Londonderry or Armagh. I too have found very little online except an article which speaks of the importance of cattle dealers. Ou Thomas was born about 1827 and married Margaret Somerville.
"The key figure in the success of the beef industry was the cattle dealer. He usually had some land of his own on which he could hold a stock of cattle. Like most other agricultural products cattle become ready for the market at the same time, namely at the end of summer, so a cattle dealer could hold over cattle to smooth out the supply to the English markets. As the cattle were bought and sold at the autumn fairs, sending them all directly to the English markets would cause a glut. The dealers had contacts with farmers, with the banks, with the railway and steamship companies and with the buyers at English fairs who were buying for the slaughterhouses. It was their organisation which made the beef industry profitable. The cattle from the less rich grasslands could not be sent directly to the butchers. The animals often had to finished off by fatteners who either had very good land or else stall-fed the cattle. Most of the cattle were shorthorns, except as noted above, Herefords in the Midlands. By the year 1900 many small farmers were using an Aberdeen Angus bull on small local cattle which produced a small animal which was popular with butchers. As with sheep and pigs, smaller and leaner animals were now being sought by the butchers. The whole tendency was away from enormous fat animals towards smaller animals with less fat. The drawback of this cross was that the cows were poor milkers (Farmers’ Gazette 9 June 1900)."
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I'm a bit puzzled by your post, Debra ???
Our Thomas Cassidy was a cattle dealer we suspect either Londonderry or Armagh. I too have found very little online except an article which speaks of the importance of cattle dealers. Ou Thomas was born about 1827 and married Margaret Somerville.
If he's you ancestor then presumably you've been able to find where the children are from, checked Thomas' death certificate, etc?
Is this your Thomas Cassidy or a diffiernt cattle dealer with the same name?
The Will of Thomas Cassidy late of Armagh County Armagh Cattle Dealer deceased who died 24 August 1874 at same place was proved at Armagh by the oaths of George Sherry (junior) and John Sherry both of Armagh Cattle Dealers the Executors.
His death certificate is not yet online on Irish Genealogy site but index shows he was 45 years old so born c1829. The above Will mentions family (some by name) and you can read the wording of the Will (2 pages) on PRONI's site-
https://apps.proni.gov.uk/WillsCalendar_IE/WillsSearch.aspx
This Thomas Cassidy's Will had a daughter named Bridget and this looks like a good match for her- father Thomas Cassidy (dead) cattle dealer-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1899/10394/5784672.pdf
If this is the correct Thomas then lots more information is online to trace him and his family.
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Also keep in mind that cattle dealers could be based in more than one area. A distant sort of connection of mine was a dealer in Co. Derry but travelled back and forth between here and England eventually with his family living in England so that I found numerous articles in both Irish and English newspapers.
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Hi Argyle - wow a big thank you. I have the section of the will and having been considering it may be our Thomas but I did not realise I could access the will. Lots of info there so thank you. I am going to keep digging. Unless there were several Cattle Dealers called Thomas Cassidy - which could also be the case...
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I was the one who posted the information- lots more to be found online.
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Oh so sorry - and a big thank you Aghadowey - much appreciated