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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Limerick => Topic started by: Mark Stephenson on Friday 03 January 14 06:02 GMT (UK)
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I'm Mark Stephenson and I live near Philadelphia, PA, USA. I trace back to John Patrick Stephenson who was born in 1852 and left Newcastle West, Ireland to go to Philadelphia sometime before 1873. The Stephensons of Newcastle West came from Newcastle upon Tyne, and Stephensons still live there. I am working my way back from Philadelphia to Newcastle upon Tyne and would appreciate any info that members can share. And Happy New Year to all.
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Hi and welcome to Rootschat
Can you give us a bit more information about your particular Stephenson family? It is one of the most common names in that area so it would help to know who John's parents were and if you have them on any census records.
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Big family, more information required. Section of your family quite famous. See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephenson's_Rocket
Neil
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What I know is incomplete and is anecdotal. There are a cluster of Stephensons in the Newcastle West, Ireland area. My father and his sister tried to make contact without success. My great grandfather John Patrick Stephenson emigrated to Philadelphia about 1870. When his son's (one of them my grandfather) were still young, a letter arrived from the Irish branch offering to educate the boys if they returned to Ireland and cease to be Roman Catholics. The Irish branch was supposedly wealthy and John Patrick worked for the Pennsylvania Railroad as a surveyor. He threw the letter out and apparently did not share much about his past.
My census data is for his time in America. I do not have the name of his parents and cannot say whether he was born in Newcastle upon Tyne and emigrated as a child, or was born in Ireland. Is there any online database that I can consult to reach back to records that may lead somewhere? Thanks.
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Okay so he married , who did he marry,
his fathers name will be on the certificate,
we need a few details, no matter how small , they will help,
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thank you for the guidance. i'll find out and respond.
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Sorry Mark, I have failed to pick up a John Patrick Stephenson, on the American census,with the little detail, you have given,
The only one I do find arrives 1879, and he is Irish,
He is a railroad worker,
living with his son Richard M Stephenson and family,
Pennsylvania, 1910,
The other is a miner living in 1892, at Green n Back St, Pittson Pennsylvania,
Then in 1918, you have a John P Stephenson, a railway gateman working for the Pacific Electric railway company,
would you like to post a confirmed census for us, America is such a huge place, I am possibly in the wrong area,
So before you try to go back to his roots , you need to have as much information as possible gathered in America, hearsay and family stories are not all ways accurate,
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Hi Mark
I'm thinking that it might be an idea to post your request on the Limerick Board - think that is where Newcastle West is (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newcastle_West).
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?board=68.0
It might be that someone with knowledge of there would be able to identify the family and then, if they did originate in Newcastle upon Tyne, you could use that info to find him here :)
Gadget
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Is it your tree that's online - he is given as married to Mary Sterling?
Info obtained from the 1910 census.
Gadget
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Yes. You found my family tree on Ancestry.com.
I am not sure about Mary's last name. The cemetery deed for the family plot notes an Eileen Spearing (Mary's sister) buried there. I currently don't have access to the documents attached to the tree, but my recollection is that the Census listed Mary as "Sterling." I plan to track down their marriage certificate this week.
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If it's any help, the 1880 census (New York, NY) has a Mary, aged 27, and a John, aged 28, as born Ireland, with their mothers and fathers also born Ireland. The eldest child, William, aged 7, was born New York.
Gadget
Added - There is also a family that matches in Philadelphia (Richard's POB) but John is down as 40 (i.e. born 1840 ish).
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Hi Mark and welcome :)
It does look as though you need to be on the Limerick board as Gadget suggests. I will ask a moderator to look and decide.
Griffiths Valuation was taken about 1850s and shows a couple of Stephensons in that area.
http://www.failteromhat.com/griffiths/limerick/newcastle.php
Family Search https://familysearch.org/search also shows Stephensons in the area.
Civil registration of births did not begin until 1864 so you would be looking at Parish records for a baptism which can be a bit hit and miss.
If you had his father's details from USA records it would help.
regards
heywood
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Thank you for this information.
Heywood, Griffith's valuation is very interesting and may confirm the oral history. JPS had four sons - John, Richard, William and Edward. Granted they are common names, but it's interesting that the names listed all match. I suspect I'll find out that Mary's father's name was Edward. Thanks for the reference.
Gadget: What is Richard's POB?
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Sorry Mark - I was using shorthand - POB/PoB = Place of Birth = Philadelphia
I'm on a laptop and the keys stick :-X
Gadget
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Gadget: Thanks for that. By the way, Happy New Year.
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Happy New Year to you too, Mark :)
Here's the link to the 1880
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MWJX-JD1
Not sure if you know but Family Search has masses of online info for free:
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/list#page=1®ion=UNITED_STATES
Gadget
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Gadget:
I did not know about Family Search, and thanks for mentioning it.
I do not think Richard Stephenson fits. The spelling is wrong, the dates are wrong, the names of the children are wrong. There was no Joseph to my knowledge. But thanks for looking.
Mark
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Is the 1910 census the first one that you have records for?
Stevenson and Stephenson are obvious alternatives - I'd not worry too much about the spelling. Can you confirm the birthplace and date of Richard.
Gadget
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PS
I think that this is the 1910 that you have on your online tree:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MGW8-FMN
A good match with the 1880 one.
Gadget
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May I just ask then, is there a connection to Newcastle on Tyne, England or should it be just Newcastle West, Limerick?
Looking at Irish census indexes http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/ , the few Stephensons in Limerick (none in Newcastle West district) are all Roman Catholic in 1901.
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Gadget: You are right that to does match well. But I have little or no information on the sons. Mary became an IHM sister and died in her 90s. She and my father's sister Marie were contemporaries in the order. Looks I like I've added more details to address, and thanks again.
Heywood: Yes, oral history is very clear that JPS was born in Ireland (presumably Newcastle West) to a Stephenson family that emigrated there from Newcastle upon Tyne. My goal is to make the link all the way back. I need to get his PA marriage certificate to see if his parents are identified, and from there see if there's a match to Griffith's Valuation. With that in hand, I'll have some basic information to look at Newcastle upon Tyne to see how we fit in. Does that explanation help?
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Mark ,
Do you know when Mary his wife died and estimated year if possible,
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If you are looking in Ireland, as well as Stevenson and Stephenson also check for Stevens and Stephens- all can be used interchangeably.
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Radcliff and Gadget:
I made some progress using another person Helen Stephenson. Richard M Stephenson had a son Richard, who married Ellen M. Stephenson (who was English). They had a daughter Helen, who was my father's contemporary. What is interesting and ties into Gadget's reference to the 1880 survey results is the 1940 census.
Listed as living on Aspen Street were Ellen (2609), Joseph A. (2613) and Richard M. (2615). My father's older brother was Joseph Aloysius. It fits well. Ellen's husband was killed while working on the Pennsylvania Railroad and the 1940 census lists her as a widow. I think that's enough data points to confirm this piece.
More directly, I do not have a date of date for Mary, JPS's wife. I am visiting Old Cathedral Cemetary soon. They have records there that I can look at.
Again, all, thanks for your interest and help.
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Did Joseph die in 1888 aged 12 years,
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Mark, please note that on both the censuses John's parents are given as born Ireland and not Newcastle upon Tyne, England. If you do trace the family back to Newcastle upon Tyne, I promise to go and take photos of their birth places as I live there :)
Gadget
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Lucky you Gadget, visit often,
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Gadget and Radcliff:
I'll buy the first round in Newcastle upon Tyne. Just have to find some misplaced ancestors.
To address Radcliff's question, I don't have a good answer. My guess is that it is not a match. JPS and his wife Mary had 4 sons that I know of. Richard (1873), William (1875), Edward (1882) and John (1885). I am not aware of an earlier son. I don't have the address from the census form but I would bet they are different. If you look at the cemetery listed in the death certificate summary on Family Search, it names C.C. I bet that's Cathedral Cemetery. For your ease of reference, all of these people lived immediately north of what is now the Philadelphia Museum of Art. Then, it was a reservoir. The Cathedral Cemetery serviced this area. That's also where JPS and Mary are buried. I'll check and see if any other Stephensons are there.
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Hi again Mark
I think that this is the same family but am wondering if you might have confused the generations
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MXSD-WRR
Gadget
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I think thre's an awful lot of confusion here :-\
Online tree says John Stephenson died 1917 Philadelphia but that may not be correct (especially in view of 1920 census just posted).
The records I found that seem to be linked to the family place them in Ward 15 (roughly between the site of Philadelphia Museum of Art and Girard College).
JPS and his wife Mary had 4 sons that I know of. Richard (1873), William (1875), Edward (1882) and John (1885).
... which is in contrast to 1910 census which lists John as 2 years younger than Richard (thus born c1875 rather than 1885).
There is a possible death for daughter Mary (shown in 1880 census)-
Mary Stevenson (c1877-1892)- parents John & Mary, 844 Bambrey St (ward 15) buried Cathedral Cemetery. Note: Bambrey St. is a few blocks north of Aspen.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JDLG-Z7M
Also one to keep in mind-
Joseph Stevenson (c1876-1888)- parents John & Mary 265 Bagoda (ward 15) buried Cathedral Cemetery.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JNLV-N5C
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265 Bagoda I was looking at a record with that on earlier,
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Reply #24, I think, asking about Joseph?
Forgot to add that all eveidence so far points to both John and his parents as being born in Ireland so if there is an english connection perhaps it's a generation or so futher back.
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Death for a Mary Stephenson in 1908- born 12 Feb.1841 Ireland- address is 2521 Olive St. (Ward 15)
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JK3N-DNY
Other side of Schuykill (just below Zoo) but still 15th ward.
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Aghadowey: Your mention of Mary Stephenson at 2521 is very interesting. To put things in some context, in 1940 the 2601 Parkway Condominium was built. Before that, it was the Baldwin locomotive factory. It's northern border was the 2600 block of Aspen. John Patrick Stephenson lived with his son John at 2518 Meredith Street, which ran directly into 26th Street on Baldwin's eastern border. Olive Street was cut off when the Reliance Insurance Building was built (its now part of the Philadelphia Art Museum) and parallels Meredith Street. So you have five Stephenson households on three streets immediately next to each other, and within two blocks. I can't say for sure what this Mary Stephenson's connection was but I expect to find one.
I checked your reference but did not see how you got the Olive Street Address. Can you share that?
Thanks for a great find.
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If you click on the link then look on the right side of the page click the bit where it says something like '.'- that will give you full details.
I know the locations are all in the same area which is why I've posted all the details- my grandfather was born on Thompson St. and his brother worked at Baldwin Locomotive Works :)
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Hi again
This 1900 census entry looks tempting:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/M37V-H9Y
Gadget
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I like that one too, Gadget :)
Will see if I can get the address. Something I found last night makes me wonder if the son Edward wasn't named after John's uncle so will look for that again as well.
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I can't quite make out the street name - Pnott or something like ::)
How about this for son Richard:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/M37V-G23
Gadget
(PS - I'm sure I saw an interesting household headed by an Edward on the 1870 - will go back and check)
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1900 census gives Mary's birth as Dec.1846 which doesn't match well for the birthdate in 1908 death record I posted earlier :(
Address says Perott St. which should be Perot St. (just south of Aspen)
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I think they got their ages well and truly mixed up though :-\ All the sons' ages seem to match.
Can't find the Edward one at the moment. I'll look again later.
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1870 Census- 1828 Olive St., Philadelphia
Edward Stevenson, 52, Ireland
Susan Stevenson, 48, Ireland
Annie Stevenson, 20, Ireland
Jane Stevenson, 18, Ireland
Sarah Stevenson, 16, Penna.
Eddie Stevenson, 9, Penna.
John Stevenson, 7, Penna.
Joseph Stevenson, 24, Ireland
John Stevenson, 23, Ireland
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Snap - Just found them:
Can't find the link to the 1870 as yet but it's 1828 Olive Street, Ward 15
Edward Stevenson, 52
Susan, 48
Annie, 20
Jane, 18
Sarah, 16
Eddie, 9
John, 7
Joseph, 24
John, 23
I think it's on FS as just the last four.
Added - I think it says Waggoner for Edward and John's occs
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Olive St. is the address for 1908 Mary Stevenson death (but different house)!
Edward Stephenson (1818 Ireland-1889) https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JXQV-26N
Note: certificate gives occupation as mechanic but reigster as watchman
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-12896-159809-7?cc=1320976&wc=MMRX-V5W:n923836804
1880 gives John as Edward's nephew- single and a shoemaker so this doesn't look like the John Stephenson we've been searching for.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MWJX-G7X
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Think we're looking at same ;D
Just typed this out - I wonder if Edward had more than one nephew called John!
Is this the remains of the family in 1880
Hare Street
Edw. 58, watchman, b. Ireland
Susan, 55, wife, b. Ireland
Annie, 26, dau, servant, b. Penn
Edward, 20, son, stair builder, b. Penn
John, 17, son, pattern maker, b. Penn
John, 30, nephew, shoemaker, b. Ireland
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According to an online family tree Edward Stevenson's daughter Annie died 1872 and then had a son in 1877!
Think this thread really needs moved to U.S. board as there's certainly no indication where the family lived in Ireland and all the information is currently being gathered from U.S. records.
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Think this thread really needs moved to U.S. board as there's certainly no indication where the family lived in Ireland and all the information is currently being gathered from U.S. records.
Agree - not sure how Mark got the Newcastle West link
(Possibly the subject line might be changed too )
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Thanks all for so much effort and input. I've got multiple issues to respond to so let's get to the big one first.
Does this discussion belong on this board? I began this effort with the goal of taking what I knew about Stephensons in Fairmount (a section of Philadelphia just north of the Art Museum and west of the prison and tracing back first to Newcastle West and then to Newcastle upon Tyne. If the administration of the site puts my initial inquiry on the US board, so be it. What happens when my/our (because I don't think I'll make it without you) efforts are rewarded and the effort moves to Ireland. Is that a new topic there? But I'm happy with whatever the experts decide is correct.
Moving on to your various replies:
Reply # 35: Yes, it is tempting. The dates of birth of John and Mary do not match what I understand to be the case. I have JPS' DOB as 1852. I have located a Mary Spearing also born in 1982, who lived in the 18th Ward. Family oral history has it that Mary Spearing came from West Philadelphia, i.e., the other side of the Schuylkill River, and was the daughter of a doctor. Her mother would not speak to JPS and her parents did not come to the wedding. That location and her age are reasonable matches but I will know more when I see the Cathedral Cemetery records.
Reply # 37: I think this is correct. Attached please see the 1940 US census entry for Richard, his mother Ellen and his brother Joseph. I remember Aunt Nellie and went to her funeral. Her daughter stayed in the house. The nesting of the three households makes this a solid lead. It also confirms Richard's DOB as 1872-1873.
Reply # 41: I would be surprised if the 1870 Olive Street family is related. The address is on the far eastern end of the ward and Eastern State Prison, a massive edifice, cuts that part of the ward off. Also, the 2521 Olive Street address is so much closer to where the Stephensons clustered and Mary Stephenson is not that far off in age from what's expected. It's important to remember that most people in Fairmount at that time rented their homes. JPS' son John P Stephenson bought 2518 Meredith Street, which is right around the corner from the Aspen Street addresses (going west) and right around the corner from the Olive Street address (going east). I suspect that JPS and Mary rented 2521 Olive until her death in 1908 and then JPS moved in with his son John.
Reply # 42: Another solid fact is that JPS died in 1917. My father, who was age 5, remembers going to see him shortly before he died and then to the funeral. It was his first viewing (in the parlor) and he never forgot it. As an aside, he was living with his son John then, in a rented house four doors down the street from 2518 Meredith.
I hope these responses help. I apologize for the length but there was a lot to cover. I hope to be able to provide some hard facts later this week after I finish reviewing cemetery and city records.
Again, thanks to you all for your generous and gracious help.
Mark
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Hello again Mark
Just one comment at the moment. You say in two posts:
John Patrick Stephenson lived with his son John at 2518 Meredith Street, which ran directly into 26th Street on Baldwin's eastern border.
JPS' son John P Stephenson bought 2518 Meredith Street,
The 1920 census that I linked to has a John P Stephenson, wife Mary and a widowed father, John Stephenson, b. Ireland living at 2518 Meredith Street.
Do you have any evidence of John Stephenson's death in 1917 apart from your father's account?
Gadget
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Further to the information on the 1920 census that I referenced in Reply #28 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MXSD-WRR:
*John P Stephenson married a Mary Fee in 1913. License no - 293520
*In the 1930 Census, they are living at 2518 Meredith with Leo, John B (nephews) and Jane Fee (m in law). John, 57, owns his home. Was 40 when he married. Born Pennsylvania. Parents both Irish origin. His occupation is given as a Repair man/Railroad car (1920 - 46, car builder/railroad)
Gadget
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Now, a few comments from me :)
The online Philadelphia death records only go up to 1915 which is too late to determine John Stephenson's death. However, the 1920 census clearly shows that he was living with son John in 1920 so your father, must have been a bit older than 5 years old when his grandfather died (it's not uncommon to get dates or ages muddled).
I'm not sure where you are located, Mark, but rather than trying to purchase lots of certificates first step might be to contact Cathedral Cemetery asking for burial dates, anyone buried in same plots as your relatives (unknown relatives often are discovered this way) and any other details they can help you with. If there are any headstones they might give other information.
Next, if you are in the Philadelphia area, I would start checking for newspaper obituaries and death notices (once you have a date of death or burial).
This really does need to be on the U.S. board as other posters that check there might have resources for those of us (Gadget and myself for example) that are in the U.K. If, at a later date more Irish information is found then a new topic on appropriate board can be done (with a link to this topic so that everyone can see previous posts). Just click on 'report to moderator' and ask for moving as well as title change- something like Stephenson Family, Philadelphia might be good.
Meanwhile, I'll continue loking for more clues...
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One further question, Mark, as I'm working on a new theory.
"My great grandfather John Patrick Stephenson emigrated to Philadelphia about 1870."
Is there any real proof that John's middle name was Patrick? or used the initial P? or even had a middle name?
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Good Morning Aghadowey:
I think the answer to your questions is yes. About 10 years ago, I went to the Cathedral Cemetery and got the records for the persons buried in the family plot (which is in the annex). I went over the names with my Aunt Anne, who put them in order. In a house cleaning, my notes were lost (don't ask). I recall JPS entered as John Patrick. His wife was Mary Spearing. I'm going back to recapture that data. I do not know that he used a middle name or initial in life.
His son, also John Patrick, married Mary "Mame" Fee. Thank you for the date. My father spoke of her often. She died relatively young and her sister Agnes came to help John in the transition. They married and I knew Agnes, who died ~1975. When I handled Agnes' estate, I met Jane Fee, Leo Fee and Mon. John Fee. Mary appears in the 1930 census as John P Jr.'s wife. Jane, Leo and John are her nephews. If it helps, I believe most of JPS's sons worked for the Pennsylvania Railroad. I know that my grandfather Edward and Ellen's husband (who I believe was William) did. He was killed in a yard accident. I apologize for the added color but it helps me keep things straight.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XHZ1-1P7 (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XHZ1-1P7)
In 1940, Agnes appears.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1942-27807-7960-21?cc=2000219&wc=M9Q6-B1R:n65618583 (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1942-27807-7960-21?cc=2000219&wc=M9Q6-B1R:n65618583)
As always, thanks.
Mark
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Hello Mark
If what you say is so, then JSP was alive in 1920 - see my replies #47 and #48
Gadget
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Gadget:
Exactly. As you point out, he's there for census. It's what prompted me to get over to the Cathedral Cemetery records and sort that out. But I think you will be proved to be correct.
Mark
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Report back, Mark - I've been looking in vain for Philadelphia death records for 1920-1930 but nothing online.
I was lucky with my ancestral cousins - they lived PA but died Florida :)
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I know Olive street has been mentioned but not sure if we listed this one ?
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MZ5V-2GP
1870 Census - 1828 Olive street
Mary Spearing, 24, b. Ireland
Gadget
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Hello again, Gadget:
From the age 24, this Mary was born in 1846, which dovetails nicely with the Mary who lived at 2521 Olive Street, Could be we are picking her up earlier at a boarding house.
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I've just received the burial records of the Cathedral Cemetery ("CC") and can clear some things up.
For clarity, I am referring to John Patrick Stephenson (b. 1850) as John, Sr., and his son as John Jr. I am basing this on all of the information that you have uncovered as well as my work at Ancestry and the cemetery records. For the sake of brevity, I've omitted the citations. I have provided the information received from the Cathedral Cemetery at the end.
John Stephenson, Sr. was born in 1850 and died on September 26, 1924. He was interred on September 26, 1924. He emigrated to the United States in 1866. He married Mary Spearing in 1871. By way of confirmation, Ellen Spearing (b. 1854; d. 1938) is also buried in the plot, Everyone else is a Stephenson, and I was informed that she was Mary's sister. Also by way of confirmation, in 1920, John Sr. or Jr. reported John Sr.'s birthdate as about 1840 and his immigration date as about 1860.
Mary Spearing Stephenson was born on February 2, 1841. Based on her death certificate, she died on June 17, 1908 and was interred on June 20, 1920. Her DOB appears in her death certificate. At the time of Mary's death, John and she lived at 2521 Olive Street. At the time of John Sr.'s death, he lived at 2518 Meredith Street. At the time of his death, the Cathedral Cemetery recorded his age as 74, making his DOB to be 1850.
In addition to the four sons that we know about, John Sr. and Mary had two children that did not survive.
Joseph was born in 1876. He died in 1888. At the time, John and Mary Stephenson lived at 265 Bagoda Street, Philadelphia.
Mary Stephenson was born on in 1877. She died on January 18, 1892. At the time, they lived at 844 Bambrey Street.
John P Stephenson (Jr.) was born in 1872 and died in 1946. He married Mary Fee, who was born in 1875 and died in 1938. They resided at 2518 Meredith Street together until 1938. John remained there until his death. His widow, Agnes Fee Russell, remained there until her death in 1976.
I am going to do a more detailed summary that links each of these facts to its citation but I wanted to share with you how much we have achieved. Gadget, Aghadowey, Radcliff and Heywood - you are masters at this and I am very grateful for your help.
Best wishes all.
Mark
______________________
Cathedral Cemetery
Joseph Stephenson, age 12, interred 12-15-1888
Mary Stephenson, age 15, interred 1-18-1892
Agnes Stephenson, age 92, 8-28-1976
Mary Stephenson, age 67, 6-20-1908
John Stephenson, age 74, 9-26-1924
Ellen Spearing, age 75, interred 6-2-1938
Mary Stephenson, age 62, interred 12-29-1937
John Stephenson, age 74, 11-13-1946
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Glad that you've got it sorted out a bit better now- the burial records do help.
Going back to something you posted earlier in the topic: “When his son's (one of them my grandfather) were still young, a letter arrived from the Irish branch offering to educate the boys if they returned to Ireland and cease to be Roman Catholics. The Irish branch was supposedly wealthy and John Patrick worked for the Pennsylvania Railroad as a surveyor. He threw the letter out and apparently did not share much about his past.”
A Catholic relative in Ireland would hardly be likely to want to raise the boys as Protestant. I suspect that Mary's maiden name was Sparing (Spearing could just be a variation of it) and that her family were Catholic. I'm doubtful that John Sr. had the middle name of Patrick (or at least not in Ireland).
There's still a possibility that Edward Stephenson is related, so here's an outline of that family to keep in mind. Unfortunately they seem to have used Mount Moriah for burials and it's now in a terrible state (do NOT google images for it if you are easily distressed).
Edward Stevenson (c1818 Ire.-1889) m. Susan (c1822 Ire.-1890)
1870- 1828 Olive St.; 1870- 2103 Carlton, 1872- 2106 Cottonhill, 1880- Hare St. (watchman) https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MWJX-G7D, 1890- 2324 Hare St
Death (Edward 1889): https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JXQV-26N
Death (Susan 1890 @ 2324 Hare St) https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JKQX-B5S
1. Annie Stevenson (c1849 Ire./Penn-aft.1880)
Died 1872 & had son 1877 according to online tree
2. Jane Stevenson (c1851 Ire.-1870 pneumonia)
Death: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/VKZT-YP9 2103 Carlton Mt Moriah
3. Sarah Stevenson (c1853 Ire.-1872 TB)
Death: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/VKZR-WS9 2108 Cottonhill Mt Moriah
4. Elizabeth Stevenson (c1857-1870 TB)
Death: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JD1T-RL4 1828 Olive St., Mt Moriah
5. Edward/Eddie Stevenson (c1860 Penn.-aft.1880)
6. John Stevenson (1862 Penn.-aft.1880)
Birth https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/VB1Q-YJL
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Good Evening Aghadowey:
I read your reply and had to laugh. I grew up in Yeadon and at one point lived at 1305 Angora Drive. If you went out my front door, crossed the street and walked to the back of my neighbor's yard, you were in Mount Moriah cemetery. It was one of my favorite playgrounds as a boy. Yes, it looks terrible now. I used a picture of one of the overgrown mausoleums at Halloween. The world is increasingly small.
I think I garbled the story. The Irish Stephensons living in Newcastle West were protestants and John left because he had become a Catholic. I'm sure you are right to say that Mary Spearing was also a Catholic. Supposedly, they were married in Old St. Mary's and moved into the old St. Francis X parish when it was still at 26th and Callowhill. I will start looking at Sparing entries. Why do you think that spelling is more likely? And I will see if I can confirm or disprove a middle name for John Sr. Why do you think it unlikely he had a middle name or at least didn't use it?
Your alternate Edward Stephenson is interesting. I'll work my way through it and respond with some thoughts.
Best wishes.
Mark
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Hi Mark, we are Spearin/Spearing from Limerick, Ireland from Limerick.We have been researching this family for many years. We have Spearin/Spearing from all over the world in our databases. Come join us at our Family website http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~spearin/Index.html
Looking forward to hearing from you
Margaret Spearin
I think the answer to your questions is yes. About 10 years ago, I went to the Cathedral Cemetery and got the records for the persons buried in the family plot (which is in the annex). I went over the names with my Aunt Anne, who put them in order. In a house cleaning, my notes were lost (don't ask). I recall JPS entered as John Patrick. His wife was Mary Spearing. I'm going back to recapture that data. I do not know that he used a middle name or initial in life.
His son, also John Patrick, married Mary "Mame" Fee. Thank you for the date. My father spoke of her often. She died relatively young and her sister Agnes came to help John in the transition. They married and I knew Agnes, who died ~1975. When I handled Agnes' estate, I met Jane Fee, Leo Fee and Mon. John Fee. Mary appears in the 1930 census as John P Jr.'s wife. Jane, Leo and John are her nephews. If it helps, I believe most of JPS's sons worked for the Pennsylvania Railroad. I know that my grandfather Edward and Ellen's husband (who I believe was William) did. He was killed in a yard accident. I apologize for the added color but it helps me keep things straight.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XHZ1-1P7 (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XHZ1-1P7)
In 1940, Agnes appears.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1942-27807-7960-21?cc=2000219&wc=M9Q6-B1R:n65618583 (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1942-27807-7960-21?cc=2000219&wc=M9Q6-B1R:n65618583)
As always, thanks.
Mark
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Good Evening Margaret:
Thank you for the invitation. I took a quick look at your site. I am registered at the Stephenson site and am happy to register on the Spearing site too. I don't have a match yet but let's give it time. I'll find my DNA kit and join up.
I look forward to working with you. Best wishes.
Mark
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Hello Mark
Very pleased that some of your ancestors are now sorted :)
One thing that I noticed on the 1900 (My Reply #35) ~ Mary is down as having 7 children with 4 of them still alive, so there is another death/stiillbirth besides Joseph and Mary.
Gadget
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Good Morning Gadget:
I am missing something here.
The 1990 "Steavinson" Census summary by FamilySearch doesn't mention number of children and the image they attach has only John Steavinson, head of household, as the last entry on the page. I do not see a following page that lists the rest. I am not finding the next page.
And seven children would be interesting. My information is that they were married in Old St. Mary's and later moved to St. Francis X. Could there be a burial record coming out of Old St. Mary's for the 7th child? I'll have to check.
Mark
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HI Mark
if you can send me a private message (PM) by clicking on the little green scroll under my avatar with your e-mail, I can send you the page.
Gadget
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The "Steavinson" 1990 census contains more than one riddle.
2521 Perot does not exist and never did. Perot Street runs east/west and stops at 25th Street. It has no 2500 block of houses. When you reach the intersection of Perot and 25th, you can turn left and walk about 50 feet and reach the 2500 block of Olive Street. If you turn right, you walk about 100 feet and you reach the 2500 block of Meredith Street.
The census taker switched Perot for Olive. The top of the page on which John Stephenson appears contains houses from the 2500 block of Meredith so our census taker didn't make that mistake. If you look at the intersection on Google Maps, you can see that Perot and Olive are not far off-line from each other, and he may have thought Olive ended and Perot continued. Ordinarily we would never know because in the construction of a new building, most of the 2500 block of Olive Street was demolished. But Mary Spearing Stephenson died at 2512 Olive Street in 1908. And John died at 2518 Meredith in 1924. Walk up 25th Street to Aspen, turn left and walk another block and you reach Richard and Rose Stephenson's house at 2615 Aspen Street.
So now we can confirm ...
1. The 1900 census entry is for John and Mary Spearing Stephenson, Sr.
2. The correct address is 2521 Olive Street, where Mary would die eight years later.
3. The Stephensons had seven children - four survived, two died and one is unaccounted for.
4. The 1900 census entry that John was born in May 1845 may be the most reliable.
At this point, it seems to me that the only thing missing are facts concerning John and Mary's immigration. We have basis to believe he arrived in 1866 from Ireland, and that she arrived from Ireland but we don't have a date. Nor do we have a port of entry. I believe I saw an naturalization for John. It may be part of the Ancestry Stephenson tree. But the naturalization papers I've seen from that era merely contain the affirmation of the applicant to be naturalized. I haven't seen an application that contains details. Do you know of a source in the immigration process circa 1866 that would capture details? As you may have seen, I am now working with the Irish Spearing/Sparing family forum. That provokes another interesting question. Either Radcliff or Heywood pointed out that Stephenson is not a common name in Limerick but has been there for 300 years. Apparently Spearing/Sparing is very common. What if John and Mary knew each other from Limerick? They were just under two years apart in age. Finding one in Limerick might target where to look for the other. According to the 1900 census, they were married in 1870. He was age 25 and she was age 23. Sounds right.
Again, thanks for all your interest, help and guidance in piecing together this puzzle.
Mark
With whatever we get from that, it looks like its time to virtually visit Newcastle West. Thoughts?
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Hi Mark and welcome :)
It does look as though you need to be on the Limerick board as Gadget suggests. I will ask a moderator to look and decide.
Griffiths Valuation was taken about 1850s and shows a couple of Stephensons in that area.
http://www.failteromhat.com/griffiths/limerick/newcastle.php
Family Search https://familysearch.org/search also shows Stephensons in the area.
Civil registration of births did not begin until 1864 so you would be looking at Parish records for a baptism which can be a bit hit and miss.
If you had his father's details from USA records it would help.
regards
heywood
Hello Mark,
Here is my little contribution regarding the Stephenson name in Newcastle West area around 1850s.Searhing Griffiths may show Spearings and Stephensons in other areas.
I just want to compliment Aghadowey and Gadget on their sterling work here. It is lovely to see the development unfold. :)
Good luck with your further searches
heywood
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And thank you, Heywood, for your contribution. It's been the target that I'm shooting for. With the new information that Aghadowey and Gadget found, I may be on my way. Thanks all. Any suggestions are most welcome.
Mark