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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Gloucestershire Lookup Requests => Gloucestershire => England => Gloucestershire Completed Lookup Requests => Topic started by: cmcmull on Tuesday 21 June 05 03:15 BST (UK)
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Hello Would someone be able to tell me if there is a William G Packer Soles age 28 born Eastleach and Sarah age 26 with baby Annie in 1871 in Gloucestershire. William is eldest son of Samuel Soles and Ann who had moved to Oxfordshire so I am not certain he was in Gloucestershire. William and Sarah were married in Boddington Tewkesbury district Gls in October 1870 and they were in Gotherington near Cheltenham in December 1870 so hoping they could still be in Gloucestershire. By early 1873 they were in Elmstone Hardwicke so they moved around a fair bit. Wlliam originally had surname Packer in 1851 but his surname was Soles at marriage. Sarah was from Gotherington so they may have just gone back to Gotherington for Annie's birth.
Thanks
Carmel
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Hi Carmel
could this be the right family?
addr: Stav Village, Staverton, Gloucestershire
RG10/2662
Registration district: Cheltenham
Sub-registration district: Charlton Kings
ED, institution, or vessel: 20
Folio: 54
Page: 14
Soles
William 28 Not Known Head ag lab
Sarah 25 Bishops Cleeve, Gloucestershire, England Wife
Ann 3 months Gutherington, Gloucestershire, England Daughter
Emma 10 Bishops Cleeve, Gloucestershire, England Niece
Tara
;)
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Yes thanks Tara that would be them. Bishops Cleeve is the bigger centre close to Gotherington and Annie was born Dec so would be 3 months. I don't know why William didn't know where he was born. He had it correct on 1881 census but I have still to find the family in 1861.
Thanks again
Carmel
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Following on from this I am trying to determine who the niece Emma would be. I have an Emily Potter born 1862 daughter of Sarah's brother James so would it be possible to request a lookup of James age 34 and Caroline age 33 Potter in Gotherington Gls in 1871. The other children were Mary Ann, Alice and Herbert so if Emily is missing from their family group I'll know if it is her with William and Sarah.
Thanks
Carmel
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Here are William's parents and siblings
1861 Census
addr: Baunton, Cirencester
RG9/1783, ed 16, folio 77, pg 3
Samuel Soles 40 Head carter
Ann Soles 40 Wife
Moses Soles 9 Son
Charles Soles 7 Son
Thomas Soles 3 Son
all born Eastleach Martin
can't seem to find William?? :-[
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1871
the Potters
1871
addr:Bishops Cleeve, Gotherington
RG10/2657, ed 2, folio 28, pg 14
Potter
James abt 1836 Head ag lab
Caroline abt 1837 Wife labourer
Mary Ann abt 1861 Daughter
Emily abt 1863 Daughter
Alice abt 1865 Daughter
Herbert abt 1869 Son
all born Gotherington except Mary Ann born in Cleeve
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can't find an Emma Sole in 1861 census either, she should be age 1.
any ideas to her and William's whereabouts in 1861??
Tara
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Tara
I think the niece Emma would be a Potter but obviously not James' daughter Emily since she was still with parents or daughter of one of Sarah's sisters since she was born Bishops Cleeve. I don't have marriages for her sisters but they were Mary Ann, Lucy and Jane. Maybe an early census may indicate if one could be mother of an Emma. The Soles were at Eastleach and as far as I know only William ended up in the Cheltenham Bishops Cleeve area for a while.
Could William be listed as a Packer (as he was in 1851) on 1861 census. He was born before Ann Packer and Samuel Soles were married.
I'll have a look around BMD etc and see if anything comes up to indicate the Potter girls married names.
Thanks again
Carmel
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On the Ancestry index there is an Emma Potter born c 1861 in Gloucestershire 1861 census and also Emma died 1877 age 17 in Cheltenham district so I think this is her and most likely an illegitimate daughter of one of the girls- the other sons are younger than Sarah and unlikely to have a daughter born c1860. I have found Lucy born 1842 married John Barnard or Barnett in 1871. He was 20 yrs older than her and in 1851 lived next door to the Potter family in Gotherington so Emma could be her daughter. Can't find any marriages for others Mary A may have died in 1851 and Jane may have died 1868 as Potters so hopefully there is an Emma Potter somewhere in Gotherington area census 1861 and possibly with grandparents James and Sarah.
Thanks for all your help
Carmel
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Here is the Emma Potter born 1861
she is a boarder with the Attwood family in Cleeve
Frederick Attwood abt 1809 Oxenton Head
Maria Attwood abt 1815 Boughton, Worcestershire, England Wife
Emily Wixey abt 1848 Bishops Cleeve Daughter
Frederick Attwood abt 1854 Bishops Cleeve Son
Sarah Ann Wixey abt 1835 Kentisey, Worcestershire, England Daughter-in-law
William Wixey abt 1843 Bishops Cleeve Son-in-law
James W Wixey abt 1858 Bishops Cleeve Grandson
Emma Potter 3 months Bishops Cleeve Boarder
not sure if this family is familar to you. In 1871 Emma does have her surname recorded as Soles not Potter, does William have any brothers or sisters that could be her?
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here are the Potters in 1861
addr:Greenway Lane, Bishops Cleeve
RG9/1793, ed 2, folio 23, pg 3
Potter
James abt 1812 Bishops Cleeve, Gloucestershire, England Head ag lab
Sarah abt 1814 Bristol, Gloucestershire, England Wife
Jane abt 1845 Gotherington, Gloucestershire, England Daughter
George abt 1851 Bishops Cleeve, Gloucestershire, England Son
Elizabeth abt 1857 Gotherington, Gloucestershire, England Daughter
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Lucy Potter is age 18 a servant in Shipton Oliffe to a Smith family.
Sarah Potter is age 16 a servant in Pendock Worcestershire to a Brown family
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Sorry to but in but i just couldnt resist sneaking a look to see if a Mr R Soles has turned up in the cencuses yet as one of your rellies ;D ;D ;D
Joe ;)
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Thanks for these Tara. The Emma Potter with Attwood family could be the same one. The Attwood name was not familiar but Wixey is. James Potter's wife Caroline was a Wixey and this is probably her family with mother remarried. However this causes more confusion. If Emma is a Potter and daughter of James and Caroline why wasn't she listed as a granddaughter of Attwoods. Maybe they didn't have a relationship for step granddaughter as they used in-law instead of step for children of wife from first marriage.
I assumed the enumerator just forgot to put in the surname when Emma was listed as a niece of William and Sarah Soles as I'm pretty sure there were no other Soles in Bishops Cleeve area unless there is someone else who I'm completely missing which is possible as William's sister Mary Hannah had a daughter Clara born and died 1862 in Baunton Cirencester district. Mary Hannah would have been 20 then so she could also have had a child about 2 years before. I'll put in a request to look for her in 1861.
Thanks again
Carmel
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Hi, I have found a sewing sampler, framed under glass, from an Ann Packer born 1821. It's dated 1832. She may be the mother of William George Packer Soles. If interested let me know.
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Hi Eric, Is there any indication where the sampler came from? I am interested in how you came to find the sampler and yes it possibly did belong to my husband's ancestor but the name is fairly common.
Kind regards, Carmel
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http://www.sole.org.uk/sole2/0801sole.htm
From; https://sole.org.uk/
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Hi yes all we know is that it came from England. It possibly was in Philadelphia USA then Ohio and Pittsburgh. I did a search online and there was only Ann Packer born that year (at least that showed up in the ancestry site). The sampler has a two story house design on it too.