RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => United States of America => Topic started by: softly softly on Wednesday 14 May 14 12:47 BST (UK)
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Hi, William married Caroline Phillips in London in 1892. They had a son of the same name in 1893. This son appears as adopted in 1901 uk census and still with adopted mother in 1911. Family know he was just abandoned by parents who went of to usa. Having only last week cancelled my worldwide sub to A***try can anyone possibly find them in 1900/1910 us census or any travel records please. Thanks
John
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When were William & Caroline born
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You may have some luck finding them here
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/1325221
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/1727033
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/1488411
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May be a bit more information would help like year of birth and where also William's occupation about what year they left for U S A.... there are a few William Wallace Rayners in the Electoral roll ??
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Hi, I believe William Wallace Rayner senior was born in 1872. The William who appears on the London electoral registers is his son, often with his wife Riviera and mother in law Fanny Burt. Its known he did return from the usa at some point but no dates available afraid.
Thanks
John
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Not seeing him or the wife in any U S A census forms did he come back to Britain with his wife ?
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Hi,
Border Crossing Canada to the USA 18 August 1896 - William Wallis Rayner born 1872 and aged 24 years. Departed Liverpool England. Arrived Quebec on the Lake Huron. Single. Labourer. Last residence :- 171 St Leonards Road. Poplar. London. Final destination :- New York. Had never been in the USA before.
Above him on the list Alfred Joseph Rayner - aged 28 years, single, painter. Gives the same 171 St Leonards Road address.
(Listed on the Canadian Passenger List as William Wallis Rainer.
The Poplar address might agree with a birth record for William Wallace Rayner - July 1872 Poplar.
Sandra
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Sandra, that ties up spot on with the older brother Alfred Joseph being with him. Many thanks for all help in this.
John
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Alfred Joseph Rayner seems to return to the USA on a New York Passenger List 2 April 1905 - Southampton to New York on the St Paul. (Unfortunately no William though) Alfred, single and a decorator, going to New York. ??? Seems to be a manifest marking which would suggest he stayed in the USA and was naturalized 11 September 1942. 2 X - 145 -681 -404 (Area 2 is New York)
Sandra
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Sandra, thanks for this. I do not want to get ahead of myself but have just downloaded an immigration record from Canada to the uk 1920. On it are a Caroline Rayner aged 40 (c1880) wife no husband, and 7 children all born after 1902. One that sticks out is a WALLACE Rayner aged 7(c1913) UK GRO records do not show his birth in the uk, however there's a death recorded of a Wallace Maxwell Rayner aged 72 in June 1985. Other children were Grace c1910, Arthur c 1911, Dorothy c 1917, Erine7/12 months. 2 others also with them were Ralph R C1902 and Sidney c1916. Whilst all this is speculative and exciting can it be established if the children were all born in USA/Canada to William Wallace and Caroline.
Thanks
John
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Wallace Maxwell Rayner - 2 March 1913 York Ontario - Father William Rayner (bricklayer) and Mother Caroline Sibbitt.
Sandra :'(
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To double check - Grace Rayner - 13 July 1908 York Ontario - Father William Rayner (Bricklayer) and Mother Caroline Tippett - 17 Surburban Place.
Another variation on the Mothers name
Arthur Edward Rayner - 6 dec 1910 York Ontario. Father William Rayner (Bricklayer) and Mother Caroline Siggitt.
Couple married in England 1899.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra, hay-ho it was a valid attempt. William Rayner married Caroline SIPPITT June q 1899 west ham. Its strange that when William crossed over to the USA he records he is a single man having married in 1892.
John
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Hi, Further to all the help currently received(thanks) A***try has listed 3 Caroline Rayners on new York passenger lists. Can or does anyone have access to these details please.
John
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MS. Caroline Rayner born 1857 - aged 30 years - Liverpool to New York - SS Wisconsin
arriving 8th Sept 1887. Described as a lady. Last resided Surrey. No other Rayner travelling.
Caroline Rayner born 1887 - Birth Location given as London Canada and aged 43 years. Single.
Port of Departure: Mediterranean Ports to New York. SS Laurentic. 24 Feb 1930 - In transit to London Ontario to friend Mrs Luscombe, 823 Dufferin Avenue, London. Ontario.
Caroline Rayner born London Ontario, aged 38 years - SS Duchess of Bedford. Single. No Occupation. H H Rayner (father) Hill Crest Inn, Port Stanley, Ontario which was her final destination. Ship Left New York 11 Feb 1929 and returned to New York 12 March 1929.
Sandra
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Thanks Sandra, not my girl-proving tricky to trace. Have confirmed William Wallace Rayner senior 1872 died aged 75 in 1947 in the uk-have his death cert now.
John
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Back to the drawing board. Didn't quite sound like the one you were seeking.
Sandra
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Hi, further to my enquiry can anyone please look up the following 1910 usa census. William Rayner aged 38-lodger,birth c1872 living Manchester Ward 8, Hillsborough New Hampshire. Wanting to see if there are other Rayners with him and details of the household in general. This could be my man who was born in 1872.
Thanks
John
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Manchester Ward 8, Hillsborough, New Hampshire 1910
Robert E Mckean 56
George R Mckean 24
Clarence D Mckean 24
Robert L Mckean 12
William Raynor 38 Born England. Immigrated 1908. AL. Single. Lodger. Operator at Woolen Mill.
Sandra
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Many thanks Sandra, was hoping there may had been a Caroline with him. The search continues.
John
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Hi, further information has come to light and requires following up. When William died in 1947 his death certificate detailed an address in the uk. Following inspection of the electoral registers for this address both pre and post war it shows he was living with HANNAH MATILDA RAYNER and Thomas Henry Rayner. I am suspecting William left wife number one-Caroline, went to Canada/USA and possibly re-married a Hannah Matilda !!!!!!! and also had a son. There is no evidence in the uk gro of a marriage and or the birth of a son. Looking at uk deaths there is a Hannah M Rayner dying in 1950 in Lewes the same place as William in 1947-her birth date c1868. As for deaths of Thomas Henry Rayners in the uk a strong contender is a death in 1990 with a dob of 27.12.1912. There are no uk births late 1912/early 1913 for a Thomas Henry. So, is there any way of trying to establish a marriage-William/Hannah and or a birth of a Thomas Henry. As you know any help is always welcome.
Regards
John
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There is a Hannah Matilda and Thomas Henry together - 1901 Census East Ham St Mary Magdalene. ???
Thomas Henry Rayner 41 Born Northfleet, Ken.
Hannah Matilda Rayner 32 Born South Norwood, Surrey.
Claud Thomas Rayner 9 Born Battersea, Surrey.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra, guess I'm tired and trying to hard. The 1901 census does indeed show details as you quoted. This is Williams older brother and his wife and son. Looks as though he lived with them after returning from abroad. What through me is in 1946 the electoral register shows only William and Hannah, I jumped to the wrong conclusion. Thanks again
John
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That's ok - no prob. Noticed a possibility for the son Claude Thomas died in 1949 Basford Nottinghamshire. he appears on a UK return passenger list 10 September 1936 - Auistralis to Hull. Also travelling a wife Lily (45) and a daughter Josephine (14)
Sandra
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Sandra, sods law. Brother Thomas died in 1937 in Lewes that's where I jumped before I researched. Again thanks, have a good day
John
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I have only just found this site so apologies for this late contribution.
My father was Wallace Maxwell Rayner and his parents were indeed William and Caroline.
My grandparents emigrated to Canada in either 1902 or 1905. At that time I believe their only son was Bill. Their port of arrival was Halifax, Nova Scotia. They set up home in Toronto and I know for sure they never lived in the U.S.
Granddad was a bricklayer and he taught all his sons the trade.
As previously detailed on this site Wallace was born March 1913 in York County which is now part of the Greater Toronto Area.
Bill was born in England but never went back. He had two daughters who still live in the Toronto area.
My grand parents returned to England in the 1920s. I do not have an exact date. Granddad liked his drink and was worried that prohibition would come to Canada, hence the return to the UK. Gram, as she was known to us kids, fought the move back but really did not have much say. She hated England for the rest of her life.
There never was a divorce. The names Hannah and Tommy as detailed in an earlier post are a mystery to me and I believe purely coincidental. Granddad died in the 1940s so I never met him but gram lived well into her nineties. She always requested that she be buried in Canada but sadly this did not happen.
There were 11 children in all and I have to report they have all passed. Bill, Ralph, my dad, Arthur, Cliff and I believe either a Sid or Ron or perhaps both. The girls were Grace, Dorothy, Irene and Olive. I recently found out my dad was a twin but his sibling died at birth.
My dad married May Victoria Burrows in August 1934. My sister Pauline was born January 1936. I am John Wallace and was born in July 1947.
Dad died June 1985, mum died November 2007.
I moved to Canada in 1966 where I still live.
I hope this helps you with whatever research you are doing but if you have any further question I will do my best to answer.
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Hi John, firstly a welcome to rootschat. If ever you need more eyes and help to try and solve a family history issue the folk on here are worth their weight in tiddley winks.
It's purely coincidental that your family line are both a William and Caroline. With regard to your grandfathers death there is a tree on Ancestry that strongly suggests he died in 1944 @ 16,Tennyson Way, Romford , Essex. He was born according to this tree in January 1879. Thanks for getting in touch. I have 2 sons who live in downtown Toronto, they both met Canadian ladies and off they went.
Regards
John