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Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: Debsss on Monday 02 June 14 10:12 BST (UK)
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and they had a child named John Edward Valentine SMITH (b ? 1856, England) married Alice WILSON (nee CUMBERBEACH), New Zealand.
John and Mary SMITH are my g.g.grandparents and I can't find their branches of surrounding family :o
I know there was an early NZ pioneer called Charles SUISTED who had possibly had a sibling Mary but cannot link my Mary to this one.
Any ideas welcome please
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Hello...
Welcome to Rootschat :)
You've actually posted on the "NZ Completed Requests" board, an easy mistake to make.
I'll ask one of the moderators to move your thread onto the main NZ board.
Good luck with the search :-)
Regards
Beg
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Hi Alise, and welcome to RootsChat. ;D
The only New Zealand marriage I can find for John Edward Valentine SMITH is to Helen Kidd MURDOCH in 1922. No marriage for a Alice CUMBERBEACH.
But this might be the event you're after: In 1881 an Alice WILSON married a John SMITH (no middle names).
Did John SMITH or his wife Mary nee SUISTED emigrate to New Zealand, and if so, when? Do you have dates of death for them or for the son John, or for Alice?
Spades
p.s. Thanks Beg, I'm on it. ;D
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Hi,
I will throw this one in for elimination or not.
Looks like the NZSG hold in their Certificate Collection, a certificate for an Alice Cumberbeach and a John Smith for 23 June 1922, Dunedin, which ties in with a death for George Edward Smith.
Cheers
KHP
You can double check the Kiwi Index Spades
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Hi,
The Charles SUISTED you mentioned was probably this man, born in Sweden.
http://www.nzsba.co.nz/news/October-2013/Swedish-Pioneer
Spades
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Hi Alise, and welcome to RootsChat. ;D
The only New Zealand marriage I can find for John Edward Valentine SMITH is to Helen Kidd MURDOCH in 1922. No marriage for a Alice CUMBERBEACH.
But this might be the event you're after: In 1881 an Alice WILSON married a John SMITH (no middle names).
Did John SMITH or his wife Mary nee SUISTED emigrate to New Zealand, and if so, when? Do you have dates of death for them or for the son John, or for Alice?
Spades
p.s. Thanks Beg, I'm on it. ;D
whoooops ..thanks for moving it . I'm a chat newbie in case no-one had noticed :} The info I have is
Mary Suisted (?Sjostedt) m John Smith << these are my research targets :)
i only know of one child
John Edward Valentine Smith (Snr) (? b 1856 - )
married Alice Cumberbeach b Jan 1856 (this being Alice's second husband - yes first was James WILSON)
Alice d 14 Dec 1924 in New Zealand
they had 3 children - one of them being my pedigree
John Edward Valentine Smith (Sam) (1885 - 1957)
I don't know with certainty if John and Mary emigrated. I do know John E V SMITH (Snr) was born in England (according to marriage cert at least) and somehow ended up in NZ, marrying Alice in 1881.
Thanks all for your replies. Sorry for the glitch
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Hi,
I will throw this one in for elimination or not.
Looks like the NZSG hold in their Certificate Collection, a certificate for an Alice Cumberbeach and a John Smith for 23 June 1922, Dunedin, which ties in with a death for George Edward Smith.
Cheers
KHP
You can double check the Kiwi Index Spades
John E V SMITH (1885 - 1957) had a brother called George Alexander Edward SMITH , I think. I have just joined the NZSG but still finding my way around. Thank you
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Sorry for the glitch
No need to apologise .... it can happen to anyone, whether they are newbies or not.
Cheers
KHP
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Hello,
A connection perhaps??
NZ BDM index has the birth for a Charles William Richmond SUISTED in 1874, parents Janet & Ekermann Selby SUISTED.
There were five children born to this couple another of whom was Florence Mary Agnes, born
1886.
https://www.bdmhistoricalrecords.dia.govt.nz
WW1 file for John Edward Valentine SMITH can be viewed and/or downloaded from Archives.
www.archway.archives.govt.nz
Possible snippets about this man in "Papers Past".
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz
Minniehaha.
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Just so we don't double up on info,the poster has a thread on the TM board
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Community/MessageBoard/Messages.aspx?id=1433430&topic=40
Cheers Janette
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Thanks Janette :D
Cheers
KHP
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Hello,
A connection perhaps??
NZ BDM index has the birth for a Charles William Richmond SUISTED in 1874, parents Janet & Ekermann Selby SUISTED.
There were five children born to this couple another of whom was Florence Mary Agnes, born
1886.
https://www.bdmhistoricalrecords.dia.govt.nz
WW1 file for John Edward Valentine SMITH can be viewed and/or downloaded from Archives.
www.archway.archives.govt.nz
Possible snippets about this man in "Papers Past".
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz
Minniehaha.
Hi Minniehaha - I've been looking closely at that family and my Mary would need to have been born prior to 1856 (ish) as the mother of John E V SMITH Senior. Charles Eberhard SUISTED (b 1810) did have a sister apparently called Mary (seen on ancestry with no vital stats) but I can't make a link other than New Zealand being in common. I've seen the WWI file and a Mrs Carrie Smith is mentioned. No-one can verify that was his wife - in fact it's almost certainly not true and has been a red herring for historians researching our family. Thanks for looking.
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Hello...
No help sorry but I'm curious about a few things...
You wrote...
Mary Suisted (?Sjostedt) m John Smith << these are my research targets
Is the bit in brackets "(?Sjostedt)" your addition or was it written like that on their son's marriage certificate.
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It's a bit obvious but I'm guessing you've already looked through the 1861 and 1871 UK censuses for a five/fifteen year old John SMITH, son of John and Mary.
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Apart from their son's marriage certificate is there any other mention you've found of John and Mary SMITH
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Can I just clarify that you've made no actual connection between the adventurer guy Charles SUISTED and your Mary SUISTED. It's just a shared surname.
And out of interest, have you viewed the 1838 Denization Papers for Charles SUISTED.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C9110487 (http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C9110487)
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Happy to try and trace Mary SJÖSTEDT, sister of Charles SUISTED if you want. If this Mary stayed in Sweden it shouldn't be too hard to find her (famous last words :) )
Regards
Beg
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Hello...
No help sorry but I'm curious about a few things...
You wrote...
Mary Suisted (?Sjostedt) m John Smith << these are my research targets
Is the bit in brackets "(?Sjostedt)" your addition or was it written like that on their son's marriage certificate. (My additional query)
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It's a bit obvious but I'm guessing you've already looked through the 1861 and 1871 UK censuses for a five/fifteen year old John SMITH, son of John and Mary. (Yes, subbed to site which has these and cannot locate person of interest--but maybe I have missed?)
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Apart from their son's marriage certificate is there any other mention you've found of John and Mary SMITH (No, not up 'til now)
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Can I just clarify that you've made no actual connection between the adventurer guy Charles SUISTED and your Mary SUISTED. It's just a shared surname. (That's right)
And out of interest, have you viewed the 1838 Denization Papers for Charles SUISTED.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C9110487 (http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=C9110487) (Yes, and this is the Charles who married Mary Emma RICHMOND whom I've seen prior in my search but can't find a John Smith in the picture)
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Happy to try and trace Mary SJÖSTEDT, sister of Charles SUISTED if you want. If this Mary stayed in Sweden it shouldn't be too hard to find her (famous last words :) ) (Smiles. I have within the last day or so heard from an unmet relative whom I found online, and hoping they may know more. So I'll see where that takes us first and come back to you.)
Regards
Beg
Thanks Beg!
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Thanks Beg!
Thanks for the thanks but I haven't actually done anything yet :)
Forgot to ask...
Have you looked at the 1881 ITM for John SMITH and Alice WILSON
And have you viewed the death certificate for John Edward Valentine SMITH b.1856. I note you've only mentioned his birth and marriage details. Would be handy to see if his death certificate details can add anything, especially time in NZ.
I'm assuming his death is...
1930/9149 - SMITH, John - 72Y - d.o.d 19 Nov 1930
Alice d 14 Dec 1924 in New Zealand
The above John SMITH shares a plot in Wyndham Cemetery with an Alice SMITH who died or was buried on 15 Dec 1924
Southland Council cemetery search
http://www.southlanddc.govt.nz/my-southland/cemeteries-/cemetery-search-/ (http://www.southlanddc.govt.nz/my-southland/cemeteries-/cemetery-search-/)
Regards
Beg
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I did have a guffaw when I saw your first comment. I meant thanks for taking an interest! ;D
No. I only just found out about them (ITM's). Will ferret that out too.
I didn't know when his death was with so many namesakes on BDM. :o I kept looking in Dunedin Council cemetery records I think. Anyways, I missed it so I more than appreciate your find. Thank gawd for experienced eyes :)
ETA: Looking at Wyndham cemetery now, and wondering if those other Smiths are closely related and could give clues.
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Work in progress
Am in process of ordering ITM for John and Alice SMITH
Have ordered John's (d 1930 thanks for that death date~!) death printout -
Have heard back from unmet relative - Mary SUISTED not known about, unfortunately. no further info has come to light yet.
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No further info on the ITM - in fact parents not mentioned, according to transcription from Archives. Cannot find any further leads at this stage on Mary SUISTED or her marriage to John SMITH. ::) Participating in Family History month through Auckland libraries which may/may not generate some new paths to search :)
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Have ordered John's death printout
Hi again...
Was there anything of interest on the 1930 death printout for John SMITH. Specifically where and when he was born plus when he arrived in NZ.
Don't suppose there was any additional info on his parents, such as middle names.
And was the informant a SMITH?
Regards
Beg
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Hi Beg
I will try and attach the death printout record - just in case I'm missing clues.
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I will try and attach the death printout record - just in case I'm missing clues.
Hi again...
Thanks for that. So John SMITH was approximately 18 when he arrived in approximately 1876 at most likely a South Island port, quite possibly Port Chalmers. I guess that's a start :-)
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I've seen the WWI file and a Mrs Carrie Smith is mentioned. No-one can verify that was his wife - in fact it's almost certainly not true and has been a red herring for historians researching our family.
For the record, the Army Service file says that John SMITH married a Carrie KENDALL in 1906 in Wanganui. They had a son Erich born 1906 in New Plymouth.
This Carrie KENDALL might be the Carrie CHRISTENSEN who married Thomas William KENDAL in 1896. They had a son Eric Claude KENDALL in 1904. They were officially divorced in 1919.
Supreme Court - Divorce
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0197j/ (http://www.rootschat.com/links/0197j/)
It may pay to do a Births fiche look-up to find out if Eric b.1904 was born in New Plymouth. If so, it's possible that he is the "Erich born 1906" mentioned in John SMITH's Army Service record. It looks like this Eric died in 1968 and is buried in Palmerston North.
If you can find the age of Carrie CHRISTENSEN when she married in 1896 you can then compare it to the Carrie SMITH buried at Te Henui Cemetery, New Plymouth. She died in 1930 aged 61 so was born c.1861
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Charles Eberhard SUISTED (b 1810) did have a sister apparently called Mary
Do you have any further info on Mary, the sister of Charles SUISTED / Carl SJÖSTEDT. I've looked at the Household Register where she would most likely be mentioned...
Fryksände kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, A I:14 1812-1821, page 132
... and although there are three sisters mentioned none of them is a Mary. And it's likely that this is the entire family as apparently the father died in 1821, although I can't find a record of his death.
Regards
Beg
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Hi Beg
I re-looked at the family tree that has a Mary as a sibling, but it could be an entry error as it's exactly the same name as a listed daughter of Charles' with no other stats whatsoever. Altho' it appears to be a comprehensive tree. No other mention found elsewhere when I back-tracked.
I've also looked at a passenger on the ship Persia called Mary Sjosted (kindly sent by a fellow researcher) but can't get any grip on her. She is stated as age 55 and didn't appear to be a fit for my family? I've attached it for your perusal.
I will request help to look up those other details you mentioned when I'm at the research centre, keeping in mind that John Smith in particular is the grandson of my research targets.
Thanks so much.
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Hi again...
Do you have any other info about that passenger list. Where it was found, year of voyage, ports of arrival/destination, column headings (especially the ones listing the countries).
Do you think Mary and Ellen BORS? are travelling together or that it's just a coincidence the only Swedish passengers on that page are listed together.
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Yes I know that Carrie SMITH isn't who you're actually seeking. Just thought I'd throw that one in there.
Regards
Beg
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I'll def check out Carrie later this month...been a bit of a puzzle for the family apparently, so I'm keen to check it out further.
This is what I received ..."The Mary Sjostedt I found born 1811 Sweden departed Liverpool England 6 Oct 1866 aged 55yrs to New York - Ship name Persia. " and then was sent the above attachment. On further enquiry - got this>>>
New York Passenger Lists, 1820-1957
Mary Sjostedt
Arrival Date: 6 Oct 1866
Birth Date: abt 1811
Age: 55
Gender: Female
Nationality: Sweden
Place of Origin: Sweden
Port of Departure: Liverpool, England
Destination: United States of America
Port of Arrival: New York
Ship Name: Persia
Sorry I don't know any more than this .
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Hi all
Have been following this for a while and perhaps I can add a few things. I checked up this passenger list and found a Ellen Rose in New York aged 15.
The name on the list is Ellen Roos.
The family she was living with in New York:
Frederich Seastedt
Eliza Seastedt
Tyek Rose
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/M8FW-1K5
It could be coincidence but this could be the Ellen on the passenger list and the surname Seastedt is really a translation of Sjöstedt...... sjö = sea.
But they are probably not connected to your family.
Ian
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Do you have any further info on Mary, the sister of Charles SUISTED / Carl SJÖSTEDT. I've looked at the Household Register where she would most likely be mentioned...
Fryksände kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, A I:14 1812-1821, page 132
... and although there are three sisters mentioned none of them is a Mary. And it's likely that this is the entire family as apparently the father died in 1821, although I can't find a record of his death.
Hi Beg
I checked out this Mary from the page you posted. As you said there is no Mary. I looked in all the books of this family and there weren't many children listed. I looked at some trees on the net as a reference and found that some dates and even names did not correspond from what I found.
I went through all the births from 1798-1820 and found these:
Lisa Carolina 1803 (missing from book, the only one)
Briljanta Augusta 1804
Gustafva Catrina Fredrica 1805
Carl Erik 1806
Ardrietta Jacobina 1807
Julia Rasira 1808
Erica Sofia 1812
Eva Maria 1813
Sorry to bore you all with all the names but I thought it would be interesting to list all the names in this family as there doesn't seem to be a complete tree on the net. As you can see there is only one mention of a Maria, even though there is a name of a Mary Emma in some trees.
Ian
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Hi Debsss
I am wondering about the name Suisted as it seems to only originate from New Zealand. So if her name was Sjöstedt why would he write the name Suisted, which means in my opinion that Mary must have actually come from the Suisted family of Charles Suisted.
Was the name Suisted written on the marriage certificate?
Ian
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Hi Debsss,
The 1930 death certificate of John SMITH attached above isn’t terribly helpful as it doesn’t provide his parent’s names.
It seems to me that your enquiry has come full circle. I think that we should start again and proceed from the known to the unknown to see where it leads. With a common name like SMITH it is easy to become confused.
So, you said in your original post that John SMITH and Mary, nee SUISTED, were your great-great-grandparents. I can’t find a record of a marriage on FreeBDM.
Do you have any record of John’s and Mary’s marriage? Do you have any idea where they might have married or lived (anecdotal, even)? Have you found them together on any UK Census? Do you have any idea when or where they died?
Do you have any other documentation or certificates relating to the family which might throw some light?
I agree with Ian's suggestion that it might be best to assume for the moment that SUISTED might be the correct name.
Spades
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Just tidying away loose ends before the circle closes :-)
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The 1904 birth of Eric Claude KENDALL was registered in New Plymouth so that looks a promising lead to finding the identity of Carrie SMITH.
According to burial records the Carrie SMITH buried at Te Henui cemetery in New Plymouth would have been born in 1861, which is a long way from 1885 when John Edward Valentine SMITH junior was born. She may well be a red herring.
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The birth of Lisa Carolina SJÖSTEDT was recorded in...
Filipstads kyrkoarkiv, Födelse- och dopböcker, C:7 (1779-1809), Page 399
There is an older brother August Pihl born in 1801...
Filipstads kyrkoarkiv, Födelse- och dopböcker, C:7 (1779-1809), Page 375
Not sure if there are any earlier children. Can't seem to find a corresponding marriage.
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The Eliza SEASTEDT found by Ian may have been the Eliza STEVENS who married Adolf Fred SEASTEDT in New York City on Nov 27 1852.
Index to Marriages and Deaths in the New York Herald: 1835-1855
Stevens, Eliza Spouse : Seastedt, Adolf Fred
Date/Year of Marriage : Nov 27, 1852
Location : New York City
County : New York
They share a plot at Green-Wood cemetery in New York.
Eliza SEASTEDT d.31 Dec 1873, Adolph F SEASTEDT d.18 Mar 1879
http://www.green-wood.com/burial_search/ (http://www.green-wood.com/burial_search/)
Apparently this Eliza's Will is part of US Case Law (Thompson v. Seastedt 1875). Wonder how you could get to see a copy of the Will, assuming it still existed.
Will be most impressive detective work if this Ellen ROSE is the passenger Ellen ROOS travelling with Mary SJÖSTEDT
Regards
Beg
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Hi Ian and Spades
That is very interesting to me what you have written Ian...esp about Ellen and the possible connection / co-incidence.
The marriage cert states mother of bridegroom: family name at birth as Suisted. (m 11.07.1881) in the house of Mrs Barnett (bride's mother)
That is the only clue Spades that gives me a maiden name for John Smith's (1856 - 1930) mother is the marriage cert. That is all I have on John's parents thus far.
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Hi Debsss
The Charles Suisted in New Zealand actually got married in England in 1833. He wrote the name Suisted on the marriage record. It can be seen on a tree on Ancestry.
So he had already used this name in England before going out to New Zealand.... interesting I think.
Ian
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Hi Ian
At one stage I looked quite closely at that family (and found a lot about Charles' adventures - what an interesting life he had) but I couldn't make a definite connection to my Mary. I have tried to find my Johns and Mary on a passenger list but that became too mind boggling. :o
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Beg, I understand that married men (as opposed to single without children) received a higher pay rate so ...who knows...
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Hi
I understand that, but I think it is strange that the name Suisted stated on the marriage certificate is not in some way connected to the Suisteds in New Zealand. I do believe there to be a connection anyway.
Ian
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Ian I believe so too :)
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The Eliza SEASTEDT found by Ian may have been the Eliza STEVENS who married Adolf Fred SEASTEDT in New York City on Nov 27 1852.
Index to Marriages and Deaths in the New York Herald: 1835-1855
Stevens, Eliza Spouse : Seastedt, Adolf Fred
Date/Year of Marriage : Nov 27, 1852
Location : New York City
County : New York
Nice one....
I have found another census from 1870 on Ancestry with the same names. The first one I posted was from Ward 15, District 5. The one I am posting now is from Ward 15, District 2. The difference now is that the names look more like Suisted..??
Sustut Adolph
Sustut Lizzie
Rose Ellen
Rose Tycko
The names are as I see them. So Seastedt is now Sustut...!?
I do know that it says Tycko, it is an old Swedish name.
Source Citation: Year: 1870; Census Place: New York Ward 15 District 2 (2nd Enum), New York, New York; Roll: M593_1033; Page: 42B; Image: 88; Family History Library Film: 552532
Ian
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Hi again...
Does anyone mind if I link to the US board for advice on searching in New York. I know it's heading away from "start with what you know" but I'm curious to see if Adolf and Eliza lead somewhere. Would be handy if Adolf turned out to be a maternal uncle to John SMITH (1856-1930)
Regards
Beg
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Apparently this Eliza's Will is part of US Case Law (Thompson v. Seastedt 1875). Wonder how you could get to see a copy of the Will, assuming it still existed.
Here is the case.... http://www.forgottenbooks.com/readbook_text/The_New_York_Supreme_Court_Reports_1876_v6_1000083151/99
Ian
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Hi Ian...
It really is amazing what can be found online if you look hard enough. This internet thingy must surely rate up there with the invention of the wheel :-)
Am assuming the "niece by marriage" is Ellen ROSE.
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Here's my thread on the US board asking for New York advice. Seems Adolph was from Stockholm. Bit of a nuisance.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=694682.0 (http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=694682.0)
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Just for the record, FreeBMD mentions an Edward Valentine SMITH born 1861 Q1 in Marylebone, London. Would be nice to find out the names of his parents. This Edward doesn't seem to be on FreeCen 1861 or 1871 but that may simply be because he has yet to be transcribed.
Regards
Beg
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Hi
I understand that, but I think it is strange that the name Suisted stated on the marriage certificate is not in some way connected to the Suisteds in New Zealand. I do believe there to be a connection anyway.
Ian
As part of that search, I have Charles Suisted's petition for naturalization, purchased from the National Archives UK. May be of interest to others researching this family, if nothing else. Unfortunately, it's too big to upload here but happy to send to anyone interested.
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Sustut, Adolph
Sustut, Lizzie
Rose, Ellen
Rose, Tycko
Axel Tycho Eugene ROOS - son of Nicolaus ROOS and Sofia SJÖSTEDT
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FK7J-2M6 (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FK7J-2M6)
Katarina kyrkoarkiv, Födelse- och dopböcker över äkta barn, C II:10 (1843-1850), sid.487
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Elin Leontine Astasia Euphrosyne ROOS - daughter of Nicolaus ROOS and Sofia SJÖSTEDT
b.5 Feb 1855, Katarina, Stockholm
Katarina kyrkoarkiv, Födelse- och dopböcker över äkta barn, C II:11 (1851-1859), sid.212
Regards
Beg
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Nice one Beg,
And here is Ellen..... Elin Leontine Astaria Roos b. 5 Feb 1855
The family: Katarina AI:109 (1856-1856) Bild 86 / sid 161
Ummm, Sorry, but I didn't read your last post properly!!
Ian
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Hello Ian...
Ooops...I most likely edited my post and didn't notice your following post. Sorry about that :-)
How did you find them in the Household register. I saw Götgatan mentioned in the birth register but couldn't see it in the index page of the Household register (at the front of the book). And I still can't see the family on page 161 of Katarina AI:108-109 (1856)
My eyes must be going. Time for bed :-)
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Hi Beg,
It says on the birth record that they lived in Wägaren Quarter.
Ian
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And I still can't see the family on page 161 of Katarina AI:108-109 (1856)
My eyes must be going. Time for bed :-)
Sofia is a widow and her name is Roos not Sjöstedt. They are about half way down on page 161.
Ian
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Hi Ian...
Sneaky SVAR :-) They had two volumes (108 and 109) in the one link. I was supposed to scroll through 108 to get to 109. Live and learn.
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Here's a very comprehensive website of the ROOS family.
http://www.adelsvapen.com/genealogi/Roos_af_Hjelms%C3%A4ter_nr_51 (http://www.adelsvapen.com/genealogi/Roos_af_Hjelms%C3%A4ter_nr_51)
I'll post the relevant part for future google searches of this thread.
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Nils Torsten ROOS, born 16 Apr 1815 in Elseröd, Sweden.
Son of Gustavus Adolphus
Married 5 May 1846 in Stockholm to Sofia Leontina SJÖSTEDT
Died 30 Apr 1854 in Stockholm and buried at Katarina Cemetery.
Sofia Leontina SJÖSTEDT, born 26 Oct 1821 in Stockholm
Daughter of merchant Gustaf Adolf SJÖSTEDT and Margareta Catharina TENGDEN.
Died 29 May 1857 in Stockholm and buried in the same grave as her husband.
Children:
Adolf Leonard Theodore, born 20 Mar 1847 in Stockholm.
Travelled to New York in 1860 where his uncle*** resided.
Became a merchant in New York.
Catharina Charlotta Hortensia Leonhardina born 12 May 1849 in Stockholm.
Married in 1870 in New York City to lawyer George H. Thompson.
Axel Tyko Eugene, born 13 Oct 1850 in Stockholm.
Travelled to North America, where he became a merchant.
Died 18 July 1891 in New York.
Elin Leontina Astasia Eufrosyne, born 5 Feb 1855 in Stockholm
Travelled to New York.
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***And here is the birth of the uncle, Adolf Frederik SJÖSTEDT (Adolph Frederich SEASTEDT)
Adolf Frederik b.17 Apr 1808
son of G A SJÖSTEDT and C M TENGDIN
(Gustaf Adolf SJÖSTEDT and Catharina Margareta TENGDEN)
Storkyrkoförsamlingens kyrkoarkiv,
Födelse- och dopböcker för oäkta barn, CIb:4 (1791-1828)
I guess the next step is to find all of the children of Gustaf Adolf SJÖSTEDT and Margareta Catharina TENGDEN and see if one of them was a Mary/Maria born c.1811. You'd assume she was the lady on the PERSIA passenger list. (Wonder if that will lead anywhere :) )
Regards
Beg
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I guess the next step is to find all of the children of Gustaf Adolf SJÖSTEDT and Margareta Catharina TENGDEN and see if one of them was a Mary/Maria born c.1811. You'd assume she was the lady on the PERSIA passenger list. (Wonder if that will lead anywhere :))
My, you have been busy. Nice tree you found there, a lot of work gone into that!
Yes, it might be worth while looking into this family to see if there is a Mary. Just to get digging I suppose. lol.
Ian
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Hi Beg
My digging has dug some things up. I have found quite a bit but not the whole family. It looks like Gustaf Adolf Sjöstedt and Margareta Catharina Tengdén lived apart. Here are the notable records. Perhaps you may have a little more luck in finding them:
Danvik-Sicklaö AI:7 (1830-1847) Bild 2930 / sid 576
It says he was made a widow 21 Apr 1833.
Danvik-Sicklaö F:1 (1782-1853) Bild 106 / sid 103
Maria Magdalena FI:6 (1829-1849) Bild 51
Her death was registered in two parishes.
Danvik-Sicklaö AI:5 (1817-1829) Bild 420 / sid 39
Danvik-Sicklaö AI:4 (1782-1819) Bild 293 / sid 560
It says that they belong to Nikolai parish
So, I think they might be in Nicolai or Maria Parishes of Stockholm. There is also a Nicolai in Arboga, the parish/town Gustaf Adolf was born.
Ian
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The marriage cert states mother of bridegroom: family name at birth as Suisted. (m 11.07.1881) in the house of Mrs Barnett (bride's mother)
That is the only clue Spades that gives me a maiden name for John Smith's (1856 - 1930) mother is the marriage cert. That is all I have on John's parents thus far.
Hi Debsss
Is it possible to see the certificate?
Also, just curious, do you really know if she was Swedish?
Regards
Ian
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Hi Ian
Thank you for your interest
No I don't know for sure that Mary SUISTED is Swedish. It's just what all my initial digging has lead to...
I will attach the record :-)
Have also ordered the marriage record from Presbyterian Archives, for any possible clues
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Thanks for that.....
but it can't be read. It is a bit fuzzy. can you re-do it please.
Ian
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Hi Ian...
Are you able to decipher the words written in the left hand column.
Maria Magdalena kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, AIa:7 (1820-1824), page 246
http://www.rootschat.com/links/019ab/ (http://www.rootschat.com/links/019ab/)
... and if possible the words before Sophia Leontina. (Just wondering who this Sophia is)
Maria Magdalena kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder,AIa:12 (1825-1827), page 91
http://www.rootschat.com/links/019ad/ (http://www.rootschat.com/links/019ad/)
Thanks
Beg
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Hi Beg
The first one says "Öfre Badhusgatan" = Upper Swimming Pool Street.
The second says (I think, hard to read) "Oäkta Barn" = Illegitimate Child.
Ian
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Hi Ian
I've attached a copy of the original marriage cert just received, which has a little more info and is a clearer image.
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Hi again...
The 1930 death certificate for John SMITH says he was a labourer from Wyndham.
Have you viewed the 1930 probate file for John SMITH, labourer of Menzies Ferry.
As Menzies Ferry is only three miles from Wyndham it's possible that this probate file relates to your John SMITH
Ideally you could start a Dunedin Archives look-up thread but Rootschatters visiting Dunedin are few.
Plan B could be to ask for a look-up on your TradeMe thread as TradeMe has a Dunedin-based volunteer.
If you do ask for a look-up include the following info...
SMITH John - Menzies Ferry - Labourer 1930 - 1930
http://archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=22054448 (http://archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=22054448)
Regards
Beg
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Thank you kindly Beg for unearthing that possible connection, and providing the link. It looks promising!
We have planned a trip to Waikouaiti and Dunedin specifically to unearth ancestry info - visiting the Heritage Centre, Otago Settlers Museum, grave sites etc. This won't be til Feb 2015 but I would especially like to do this particular search myself, and have started the process to access those records. Whether I can wait that long tho remains to be seen! :D Thanks Beg
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Hi Ian
I've attached a copy of the original marriage cert just received, which has a little more info and is a clearer image.
Thanks. It's nice to see the original. We just have to find this Mary Suisted.
Ian
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Hi again...
From a genealogical point of view I wouldn't get too excited about the probate file. The very best you could hope for is an affidavit mentioning the deceased's place of birth. Fingers crossed but don't hold your breath.
You might also want to keep an eye on FamilySearch. They recently started uploading Dunedin Court probate files so maybe they'll add a few Invercargill Court files too.
Family Search - New Zealand Archives, Probate Records, 1848-1991
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0132t/ (http://www.rootschat.com/links/0132t/)
Regards
Beg
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You might also want to keep an eye on FamilySearch. They recently started uploading Dunedin Court probate files so maybe they'll add a few Invercargill Court files too.
Family Search - New Zealand Archives, Probate Records, 1848-1991
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0132t/ (http://www.rootschat.com/links/0132t/)
Thank you Beg for this headsup about familysearch.org. I had a major find for a g.grandfather's probate on that site recently and will continue to visit.
No luck with any SUISTED connections to my Mary yet, but always on the lookout...
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In the book "Svenskarna Inya Zeeland" (Akl Library Research Centre) a John Smith is shown as having married in Sweden and came to New Zealand 1857 . see attached photo with Father named. wondering if this has anything to do with my Mary and John?
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Hi Debs...
Here's the newspaper report of this John's death.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/019s3/ (http://www.rootschat.com/links/019s3/)
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Here's the associated entry from the Napier Courthouse Death Register
Napier Courthouse Death Register
Entry no.1794 - 13 Dec 1881
Died and buried in Napier
John SMITH, labourer
54 years old
Son of Eric ERICKSON
Born in Sweden
Married in Sweden aged 27 years
In NZ four years
Note how the time in NZ is only four years, so arrival in 1877. I'd go with this date and not the 1857 that Aminoff says. I'd say 1857 is a transcription error by Aminoff as he would only have had access to the same records we have.
Also need to remember that the "four years in NZ" doesn't necessarily mean that this John SMITH left Sweden four years previously. He may have left Sweden twenty years previously and spent the intervening years who knows where. So Emibas isn't really any help either. Maybe try and find a record of their arrival in NZ.
Even though the above Death Register entry gives a year of marriage (1854-ish) it's still not enough to narrow down the search. Without a location there would be hundreds of Swedish marriage registers to look through. Knowing his father's name is helpful but knowing his wife's name would be even more helpful.
FamilySearch gives pages of Johan/Jan ERICSSON/ERRSON/ERICKSON's born in Sweden in 1827. Really frustrating
Regards
Beg
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Hi again...
Just a quick follow-on from my previous post...
I've checked the female SMITHs listed on the Napier Courthouse Death Register fiche.
None of them mention Sweden.
Bit of a nuisance.
Regards
Beg
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Hi Beg
Thanks for your search results and response. I continue to beaver away in the background on this and consider the points you raise. :) I had to order this death cert just in case there were any further clues to at least try and eliminate this J.S....
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Hi again...
Family Search - New Zealand Archives, Probate Records, 1848-1991
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0132t/ (http://www.rootschat.com/links/0132t/)
Regards
Beg
This has been VERY helpful for other family I'm researching and so far they are up to 1929 for Dunedin
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Dear Debsss
Hi I've just joined this website - mainly to respond to your message thread.
I am a decendant of Charles E Suisted (1810-1860) (b Carl Eberhard Sjostedt) and I can advise you that Charles/Carl had no sister Mary.
I can find a reference to swedish nieces 'Maria Frederika Juliana Sjostedt(1825-1848)'. And her sister 'Adelejid Wilhemina Rosalie Sjostedt (b1832 - ?) is mentioned on Charles' Swedish passport issued in Stockholm 1858 during a trip back to Europe from NZ. But I haven't found any family record of Wilhemina coming to NZ and I've speculated that she may have only travelled from Sweden to England with her uncle - if at all.
Then a swedish cousin 'Maria Sophia Obiljana Sjostedt (b 1824-?)
Of the 15 children in total he & his English/Lincolnshire wife, Mary-Emma, had there was one daughter Mary Ophelia Suisted who died as an infant (1838-1841 Tasmania) and another daughter Mary Emma Campbell (nee Suisted) (1848-1933 NZ) no children.
Sjostedt is a reasonably common name in Scandanavia/North America but to date I haven't come across another Suisted that is not descended from Charles/Carl.
Good luck.
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Hi Ginny much appreciated that you took the time to come in an post here with this info. Yes I had looked intensively at the two children of Charles who were named Mary but dates simply didn't match my Mary. You say " Then a swedish cousin 'Maria Sophia Obiljana Sjostedt (b 1824-?) " do you believe this might worth looking further into? I am also awaiting a DNA kit and hoping I may find some leads when it's processed. I come back to Mary SUISTED quite a bit but still stuck! Thanks again.
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Hi,
I will throw this one in for elimination or not.
Looks like the NZSG hold in their Certificate Collection, a certificate for an Alice Cumberbeach and a John Smith for 23 June 1922, Dunedin, which ties in with a death for George Edward Smith.
Cheers
KHP
Just re-looked back over this thread just in case I missed something...
Death of George?? That's important to me! Have been trying to trace him for a long time. I will see if I can source this info from NZSG as you mentioned.
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Hi all
Just had a look in the Swedish books for the 2 Marys with missing death dates:
Adelaide Vilhelmina Rosalie Sjöstedt (b1832 - ?):
...died 4 Jan 1900 in Karlstad. She was unmarried.
Maria Sophia Ottiliana Sjöstedt (b 1824-?):
...died 12 Nov 1889 in Stockholm.
She was married to Pehr Axel Fröst, a reverend in Stockholm:
Pehr Axel Fröst: http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pehr_Axel_Fr%C3%B6st
(It is in Swedish but Google translate should work alright)
Ian
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Thank you for looking into that Ian. Everything helps.
ftDNA results in (approx. 970 matches) but no SUISTED to date. Am also searching for possible associated family names other than the ubiquitous SMITH. Have uploaded to gedmatch.
Probate was interesting but no new leads for John and Mary per se
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Dear Debss, further to your msge to me - sori I can't return msge.
DNA - me - no (not yet! and am unaware of any of the large extended family doing so). However I've since thought about your post. Sjostedt is not an uncommon name in Sweden. Somewhere on your thread is mentioned their marriage (1881) taking place / or a connection to Waikouaiti?? As Suisted was a well known early european settler for this area back in the 1850's I would suggest that if anyone later turned up with a surname 'Sjostedt' it would not be unlikely for someone to say 'Oh the english spelling for that is Suisted'. Even though the person concerned may not be any relative.
Cheers & good luck
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Hi Ginny99, and welcome. ;D
You will need to make another post for your Personal Message (PM) facility to be activated, after which you will be able to send and receive PM's/
Just reply once more to this topic, even just a smiley is fine.
Regards,
Spades
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Thank you for your thoughts Ginny :) I'll keep all this in mind in my continuing search for clues.
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Jacob Sjostedt
mentioned in the record of Maria Sophia Ottiliana Sjostedt
Name Jacob Sjostedt
Gender Male
Wife Sophia Ulrica Richnau
Daughter Maria Sophia Ottiliana Sjostedt
Other information in the record of Maria Sophia Ottiliana Sjostedt
from Sweden, Baptisms
Name Maria Sophia Ottiliana Sjostedt
Gender Female
Christening Date 25 Nov 1824
Christening Place JAKOB OCH JOHANNES, STOCKHOLM, STOCKHOLM, SWEDEN
Father's Name Jacob Sjostedt
Mother's Name Sophia Ulrica Richnau
"Sweden, Baptisms, 1611-1920," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:V7P2-765 : accessed 13 October 2015), Jacob Sjostedt in entry for Maria Sophia Ottiliana Sjostedt, 25 Nov 1824; citing JAKOB OCH JOHANNES, STOCKHOLM, STOCKHOLM, SWEDEN, reference ; FHL microfilm 77,759.
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I'm now wondering if their names are the anglicised forms of Johan Schmidt and Maria Sjostedt?
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:)