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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Topic started by: heatherrr on Friday 20 June 14 22:54 BST (UK)
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I have the certificate for Jessie/Janet Henderson, who married in 1889 aged 22. Parents listed as William Henderson & Elizabeth Brunton.
I've managed to find a death record (ScotlandsPeople) that matches that information which is from 1953 where she's aged 85.
I found a death for her dad William Henderson - married to Elizabeth Brunton - in 1863, which would be a few years before Janet was born.
Not sure where to go next, there's lots of Jessie/Janet Henderson births, searching by parents names she'd have a brother James and sister Margaret, but can't find hers.
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Have you found her on the 1871 census
Parents married 1856 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XTPW-79M
2 children on FS
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XTPW-79M
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FQQ4-RX5
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I don't have her in the 1871 or 1881, wasn't sure what age I should look for, or if I had got families mixed up. I have the census records after she was married, 1901 - aged 33, 1911 - aged 44 (both say she was born in Lanarkshire, Glasgow). I'm just confused about her life before the marriage.
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So her birthyear is pretty consistent as 1867/68
How old was William Henderson on the 1863 death cert and in which county did he die?
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April 1863 - aged 30 in Kirkcaldy, Fife. Under the date of death looks like it says Abbotshall, it was signed by a neighbour.
I also have Elizabeths death which I'm more certain of. She died 1898 in Glasgow, and it was signed by Jessies husband.
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Hi
What other information does it give on the certificate you have? What is her father's occupation? Does it say he was deceased? What are the names of the witnesses? This information might help to pinpoint the correct family in the censuses before she was married.
William
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Thanks. On both of the records for her parents deaths and on her marriage, William is listed as a grocer.
The witnesses at her wedding weren't of any relations that I've discovered so far, no relevant surnames.
William is down as deceased on her wedding cert.
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Not sure if you've seen this one:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FQ6Q-QRS
Maureen
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Hi
There is a birth for James Henderson in Kirkcaldy 26 June 1861 parents William Henderson and Elizabeth Brunton.
Looking at the 1871 census there is the following 390 Crown St Glasgow Govan
Elizabeth Henderson 44 B Coupar Fife Widow Sewer
James Henderson 10 b Kirkcaldy
Janet Henderson 4 b Glasgow
And in 1881 38 William St Glasgow Milton
Elizabeth Henderson 54 B Coupar Fife washerwoman
James Henderson 19 B Kirkcaldy Railway porter
Janet Henderson 13 B Glasgow General Servant
And going back to 1861 there is this in Cupar
John Brunton 62 builder B cupar
Margaret Brunton 57 Wife b Kilmany
Elizabeth Henderson 30 B Cupar Married daughter
Margaret Brunton 28 daughter
Jessie Aitken 9 granddaughter
Margaret Henderson 1 B Glasgow granddaughter
Margaret Brunton wife of John above maiden name Kilgour?
Perhaps the birth certs of James Henderson b Kirkcaldy and Margaret Kilgour Henderson would confirm if the above is the correct census information.
William
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Thanks Millmoor, I have Margaret Kilgour Hendersons birth from 1859 in Glasgow, had seen the 1861 census and was trying to find a Jessie Aitken that was related with no luck. I still have some more digging around to do.
Not sure if you've seen this one:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FQ6Q-QRS
Maureen
Hmm this is interesting, time for more research. Thank you.
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I can't find a marriage between Elizabeth and Finlay on SP. Any idea why he wouldn't be listed as Janets dad on her marriage/death cert if he was actually her dad?
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Found the birth for Janet, she's listed as Illegitimate, and under Elizabeth is written - widow of William Henderson (grocer). It all fits, thank you so much for the help.
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Hi
It looks as though Jessie Aitken was the daughter of James Aitken and Ann Brunton. 1851 census they are in Leuchars, Fife but in 1861 they are in Southport, Lancashire - so Jessie must have been visiting grandparents. 1871 they are still in Southport. Also in the household is mother in law Margaret Brunton age 70 and listed as a widow and sister in law Margaret Kilgour age 35 and married. Margaret Kilgour is a visitor. Jessie in 1871would appear to be recorded as niece in the home of David and Catherine Russell in Liverpool.
Marriage of James Aitken and Ann Brunton in Cupar 19 July 1847.
William
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Thanks, I'll check it all out tomorrow and piece it together.
Any idea what it says here next to grocer?
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Hi
Could it be (master) ?
William
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Hi
Suggest you have a look at the 1861 census for William Henderson Address Chapel Village, Abbotshall
James Henderson 69 Rd Labourer b Aucterderran
Mary Henderson 70 wife B Leslie
William Henderson 28 son grocer b Abbotshall. Unfortunately the space on the transcription is blank re married/unmarried.
And in 1851 the address is Cottar Houses Abbotshall. Father James is showing as an ag lab and victualler. William is 18, unmarried and a grocer's assistant. A brother James 24, a widower and currier is also in the household along with his son James 3.
There is a birth for William Henderson 2 Sept 1832 Abbotshall with parents James Henderson and Mary Paton.
William
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Could it be (master) ?
Yes, definitely.
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I had seen those census before thanks. Want to trace her actual father Finlay Ferguson now though. I think I've found a possible match in the 1871 and 1881 census but neither give much new information. What would be the best way to start tracing him given that I've got little info on him?
I appreciate the help.
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Hi
Is it the Finlay Ferguson b Killin 1840 that you have found? He is showing as shopman in 1871 and a spirit merchant in 1881 and unmarried.
The only Finlay Ferguson b Killin but born 1835 that I can see in 1861 is a lead miner living with his sister Janet.
I did have a look at the Glasgow Herald on the British Newspaper Archive but could not see anything about him. While on there I did find these two death notices from the Fife Herald which you might find of interest. 24 July 1862 - At Cupar on the 19th inst Mr John Brunton, builder aged 63 years. 25 April 1872 - At Southport on the 21st inst Margaret Brunton widow of the late John Brunton, builder Cupar.
I wonder if there was any sort of paternity suit re the birth of Janet Ferguson Henderson. To establish if so it would probably mean a trip to the archives.
William
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Yeah that's the ones I saw, in 1881 theres also a Duncan Ferguson living with him - also a lodger and spirit merchant, possible relation?
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Hi
I can see a Duncan Ferguson age 8 in the 1861 census in Clifton Village with mother Elizabeth 40. pauoer and domestic servant and siblings Peter, Alexander 6 Sarah 4 and Elizabeth1. There are a couple of births on Family Search in Killin for Alexander and Elizabeth of the right year with parents named as John Ferguson and Elizabeth McNab.
1871 Duncan Ferguson seems to be a shepherd. 1891 back with mother in Killin in Clifton and siblings in Clifton Village and showing as a railway labourer.
Note that in 1881 Duncan and Finlay have the G for Gaelic sign. The 1861 censuses for both in Clifton Village also have G for Gaelic. Could they be brothers? Frustratingly cannot find Finlay in1851 census or other likely Fergusons in Killin.
William
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Frustratingly cannot find Finlay in1851 census or other likely Fergusons in Killin.
William, with all your hard work here, just adding this possible 1851 census entry:
John Gerguson 49 Hand Loom Weaver b. Kenmore, perthsh
Dond Ferguson 24 lead miner b. Kenmore, perthsh
Janat Ferguson 22 b. Kenmore, perthsh
Peter Ferguson 19 tailor b. Kenmore, perthsh
Finlay Ferguson 16 b. Kenmore, perthsh
Christy Ferguson 15 b. Kenmore, perthsh
Margt Ferguson 11 b. Killin, perthsh
John Mcdiarmid 16 visitor tailor b. Killin, perthsh
Address: New Street, Clifton, Killin
Monica
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Good find Monica. It took me ages to locate it after reading your post!
I can now see a birth for a Finlay Fergusson in Killin 2 Sept 1834 Parents John Fergusson and Janet Fergusson. There is also a birth for Peter Fergusson 10 March 1832 with same parents.
And using the Fergusson spelling there is a marriage of John Fergusson and Elizabeth McNab in Killin 12 Dec 1852.
Now struggling to find them in 1841 census!
William
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Not surprising, William. I think this is 1841 as transcribed (haven't checked FreeCen, might also show there):
John Jupinon 39 miner lead
Catherine Jupinon 16
Duncan Jupinon 10
Peter Jupinon 9
Finlay Jupinon 6
Christian Jupinon 5
Alex Jupinon 3
Peggy Jupinon 1
Address: Clifton Village, Killin
Monica
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Killin is not on freecen for 1841 yet but have found them on FindMyPast ... and transcribed as Fergusson. Given that there is no sign of a wife of John Ferguson in either 1841 or 1851, might he have remarried in 1852?
There is a death coming up on Scotlands People in 1860 for a John Fergusson in Strathfillan district b 1802 . Might be worth having a look at.
William
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Wow, thanks for the help. Need to go over it all. I had no idea that's what the (G) on the census meant, was wondering about that, thanks.
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Hi
Just had a look at the wills index on Scotland's People and the following one caught my eye " Ferguson Finlay 05/12/1889 Sometime spirit dealer Glasgow, afterwards residing at Clifton, Tyndrum, D 17/06/1889 at Callander, testate. Court Dunblane Sheriff Court". The index says that there are 10 pages. It might be worth the 10 credits to download and if the correct Finlay his death cert should confirm parents names.
Doing a search for Finlay Ferguson d Callander 1889 comes up with a birth year of 1837. To go back to the subject of your thread if all the records uncovered are for the same Finlay he does seem to have been inconsistent with his age!
If it does turn out to be the correct Finlay do let us know!
William
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Thanks, I'll go over it over the next few days and hopefully figure it out and let you know. Janets mum Elizabeths age is inconsistent too so that doesn't help :P
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Missed this first time round!
Glasgow Herald 19 June 1889 " Ferguson. At Callander on the 17th instant aged 52 Finlay Ferguson, Clifton, Tyndrum formerly spirit dealer, Glasgow".
William
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Great, I'm working on Finlay just now.
The information I have on Elizabeth has her as 28 when she married in 1856 and 75 when she died 1898. All the other info is the same. Going by the 1871/81 census Finlay would be a good bit younger.
Underneath his signature on Janets birth is written '80 Eglington Place', and on the 1871 census that Finlay is at 144 Eglington Place. Looks like a match.
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Was finally able to get the 1889 Callander death for Finlay.
Anyone able to help with this name? Looks like Duncan Mc-?
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I suggest you try & find a marriage on scotlandspeople, perhaps a female Ferguson, to a Duncan, pre 1889. Hope this helps,
flst
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There is another way, but it may not work.
When an event was registered, the Registrar copied the details into a second, duplicate, book. At the end of the year one book was sent to Edinburgh and the other was retained locally. As the one with Duncan's actual signature is the one that has been digitised, the one where the Registrar copied the name as signed must have been retained in Callander.
Now, all the pre-1900 duplicate books were normally held centrally in the main Registrar's in the county town. Callander is in Perthshire so I would expect the second book from Callander to have been held in Perth. So it might be worth e-mailing the Registrar in Perth a copy of the signature and asking if they would be kind enough to look it up in their duplicate copy of the book and tell you what it says.
The snag is that there was talk about the duplicate books being pulped to save the cost of storing them. This is exactly the sort of thing that was used as an argument against them being destroyed, of course. I do not know whether the destruction has actually taken place, and obviously if it has, you won't be any further forward. But you have nothing to lose but a few minutes of time.
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Hi
Suggest you download Finlays will. It is fifteen pages long and names all his relatives. His brother in law was Duncan McFarlane who married his sister Janet. It confirms that you have found the correct Finlay as he specifically names his daughter Janet.
William
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I just purchased the will there.
Thank you all for the help ;D