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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Buckinghamshire => Topic started by: Marton on Friday 22 August 14 10:44 BST (UK)
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Robert Allen and Mary Saw immigrated to Australia on the "Formosa" in 1839.Seeking any evidence that Mary returned to England and married her sister Charlotte's husband , John Priest, as she appears in the 1851 census describing herself as widow. John died in 1845.All Charlotte's children live with her , and she calls herself Mary
Any clue would be welcome
Thanks Marton
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Just to clarify do you mean the 1851 census in England? When was Mary born?
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Is this the right family? If so Mary must have married John between 1841-1845 when he died.
I don't see it especially if Charlotte was still alive!
Was Mary married to Robert Allen - would her widow status be because he had died?
1841
John Priest 30
Charlotte 25
William 8
Edmund 4
Emanuel 2
Margree 11 months
What happened to Charlotte?
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Is this the 1851 family you are alluding to?
May A Prust 36 - name as transcribed
William 18
Edmund 15
Mary A 10
Emanuel 12
James 7
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Thank you Milliepede, yes, this is the family, Mary is my gt3 gran if that is her, we cannot find a death for Charlotte, and we have been looking for years.On the childrens births Charlotte is given as their mother.She then disappears from sight.
It has been quite a puzzle , and only recently has the immigration come to light. No marriage for Mary either to suggest she married a Priest.
Thanks for looking tho, much appreciated
Marton
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For what it's worth there is a family tree which gives a death for Charlotte in 1883 in Tring.
It also has a second marriage for her in 1866 to Cutler Beckett.
However the marriage in Berkhampstead Sep 1866 lists a Mary Priest as one of the two possible brides not Charlotte Priest.
And the link to the 1861 census on the tree leads again to Mary Priest * not Charlotte so unless Charlotte was using the name Mary it's all a bit of a mystery.
Do you know what happened to Robert Allen?
* census details for info
Mary Priest 48 born Ashendon
James 16
Mary 8
Elizabeth 9 and it actually says illegitimate after her name on the record
1871 may be more enlightening
Mary Beckett 60 - that ties in with the marriage mentioned in 1866
Elizabeth Priest 17
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1881
Mary Beckett mother in law 71
James Foster 29
Elizabeth 27
Arthur 6
Ada 4
Emily 1
Death for Cutler Beckett in Berkhampstead Sep 1870 age 70. Wouldn't have thought too many people with that name around.
It's very odd that Charlotte is only mentioned once (as Charlotte) in 1841. To outside appearance it looks like her using the name Mary. Her sister shouldn't claim to be the mother of her children she would be their Aunt on census - or should be - even if she had taken on the role of mother.
Yep very odd ???
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The death in Jun 1883 Berkhampstead is for Mary Ann Beckett. Maybe this is the death attributed to Charlotte.
I don't know if getting any certificates would help really :-\
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Also Daug Elizabeth Priest c 1854 on 1861 Census seems to be reg as;
Elizabeth Gunn Priest, Sept 1853, Berkhampstead, 3a 284
May be worth getting the Cert?
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Marriage;
Name: Mary Priest
[Mary Law]
Gender: Female
Birth Date: abt 1821
Age: 45
Father's Name: John Law
Spouse's Name: Cutler Beckett
Spouse's Age: 65
Spouse's Father's Name: John Beckett
Marriage Date: 11 Sep 1866
Marriage Place: Tring, Hertfordshire, England
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Is there any evidence of the marriage between Mary Law/Robert Allen?
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I wonder if Charlotte remarried and died under another name?
There are some marriages 1854 & 1859 in Bucks for a Charlotte Priest to check out.
Grooms are Thomas Green - Frederick William Goodyear
William Barnes
William Turner Gray - James Odell
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Robert ALLEN, Marriage to Mary SAWE, 12 December 1838, Ashendon, Buckingham, England
(Familysearch.Org)
FreeBMD has Mary as Sawe also.
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Thank you all, we do have a variety of certs. for Charlotte and Mary,but havent seen a death for this Charlotte, there was another Charlotte living in Tring but I believe she was married to Thomas
Mary was definitely married to Cutler Beckett,
I havent seen a tree for a Charlotte marrying Cutler but that might answer one query, but bring on another. Perhaps the lady simply called herself Mary after widowhood
Mary and Robert married by special licence just before going to Australia as bounty passengers, and no, havent distinguished what happened to them after that
If Charlotte re-married, her children are then with Mary, her sister. Both Saw girls were born in Ashenden, the writing appears to say Law, but it is indeed Saw
Thank you both for your interest in our family puzzle, we hope to crack it one day!
I will now try to find the tree you mention
Marton
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Would be good if we could find some evidence of Mary & Robert Allen living in Australia - maybe someone on the Australia board could find something.
I can understand if he died she maybe came back to England but why would she take on her sisters name Priest and claim the children as her own.
Maybe Mary had died and Charlotte took her name as remembrance or something. It makes more sense to me we are dealing with one woman in England not two but is certainly puzzling.
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Thank you everyone for working so hard on our query,we think , thanks to a reply on Ancestry, we have now cracked it as it were
We have a photo of Mary Allens grave in Wollombi NSW, which now appears to prove that she did not return to England, and it also appears that Charlotte, not Mary SAW will be our ancestor.It would be great to find her family in NSW, but I guess that is the next bit of detective work
As we set out to see if she returned a lot of things we know now fall into place, although why Mary not Charlotte on the English census returns- who knows!
I cant thank you enough
Marton
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Ah excellent so the real Mary did remain in Australia.
It's been really interesting so thank you for posting about it :)
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anyone still looking for info on Robert & mary in Australia?
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hi there, we knew very little about Mary/Robert, but did have a photo of the grave in Wolombi, still have the puzzle of why her sister called herself Mary--had a child called Elizabeth, went on to bring up her sister's children , then married Cutler late in life
Dont know any more about the Australian relatives, so any info would be great,as Mary/Charlotte was my gt.gt.grandmother
many thanks Marton
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Sorry about posting these details so late, as I was offline for almost 2 years when the original thread was started. But may help others in the future. ;)
From BucksFHS. Ashendon Transcripts CD.
Marriage - 12 Dec 1838. by Licence
Robert ALLEN of full age, Bachelor of Ashendon, Labourer son of William Allen, Labourer
Mary SAWE of full age, Spinster of Ashendon daughter of John Sawe, Labourer.
Witnesses - Mary(x)Saunders & William Saunders.
Two possible baptisms for Mary.
Baptism - 18 Jul 1813. Mary, natural daughter of John SAW & Martha MONDAY of Ashendon, Labourer.
Baptism - 7 Dec 1815. Mary, daughter of John & Elizabeth SAW of Ashenden, Labourer.
Baptism - 18 Jul 1813. Charlotte, daughter of John & Elizabeth SAW of Ashendon, Labourer.
Other children baptised to John & Elizabeth Saw......
Thomas. 1802.
John. 1808. Burial - 11 Jan 1820. John SAW aged 13 of Ashendon.
William. 1811. Burial - 30 May 1811. William SAW son of John & Elizabeth.
William. 1818.
Other burials......
19 Feb 1820 - Elizabeth SAW aged 45 of Ashendon.
16 Nov 1825 - John SAW aged 81 of Ashendon.
5 Jun 1827 - William SAW aged 9 of Ashendon.
20 Oct 1852 - Elizabeth SAW aged 57 of Ashendon.
2 Nov 1865 - Thomas SAW aged 65 of Ashendon.
16 Oct 1875 - Charlotte SAW aged 61 of Ashendon.
Marriage - 18 Oct 1827. by Banns
Thomas(x)SAW, Bachelor otp
Elizabeth(x)FATHERS, Spinster of Iver
Witnesses - John Figg & William Saunders.
Marriage - 25 Sep 1827. by Banns
Richard(x)FIGG, Bachelor otp.
Sarah(x)SAW, Spinster otp.
Witnesses - Ann Figg & John Figg
No other marriages in Ashendon, for the surname of Saw/Sawe.
Steve. :)
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Thank you very much Steve, we do know the two sisters , Charlotte and Mary, and only recently had more info about Mary who went to Australia,still have the conundrum about Charlotte and her children turning up in Tring, but calling herself Mary---I suspect this is one we will never know the answer to,and also about her brief marriage to Cutler Beckett
Thank you all for your help
regards Marton
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I'm not so sure that Charlotte Saw, morphed into Mary Priest.
There was the other Mary Saw, that was baptised to John Saw & Martha Monday 1813, @ Ashendon........it could be her, not Charlotte.
Anyway, I'll leave you too it. ;D
Steve. :)
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Dear Marton,
have sent info on John & Mary Allen of their family , along with her death certificate & photos to your daughter via ancestry, so no doubt you will get it.
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Thank you Schrader--didnt realise you were one and the same person!
Thank you
Regards Marton
And Buckboy, yes parents were John and Elizabeth Saw
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Went to Wollombi today and have photographed for you Mary's burial place, the church that her children were baptised at and the font. Sending onto Anne.
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How very kind of you, thank you
Hope there weren't too many snakes-it's 5 degrees here and bitterly cold
Marton