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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: tigtag on Tuesday 14 October 14 23:27 BST (UK)
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Good Evening
My GG Grandfathers time of birth is recorded on his BC which I, if I am correct, indicates that he was one of a multiple birth. However, there is no other birth recorded for that surname / year and quarter / district. I can only assume that this means stillbirth :(
My question is would a stillbirth be recorded anywhere back in 1849?
Thanks in advance.
Tig
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Hi
My question is would a stillbirth be recorded anywhere back in 1849?
No it wouldn't. Only the birth/death of a child born alive was recorded
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There is a death that I have later in 1892 in Edinburgh that has the exact time recorded - as do other's on the same page. Don't know if that was the custom there and no idea if this was recorded for births. I don't usually research there.
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Yes, I believe Scotland recorded time as a matter of course.
Thank you CaroleW
For my own GG Grandfather would it be safe to assume that he had a stillborn twin?
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I think it would. The only time I have seen a time recorded on an English birth cert was when it was a twin birth
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It's never safe to make assumptions! ;D
My own family were all from England/Wales - 4 generations of twins!
My mother's twin was stillborn, and there are no times on either certificate?!
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Me too..
Carol
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In the early years of registration some registrars entered the time for single births.
Stan
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In the early years of registration some registrars entered the time for single births.
Stan
I believe that times of birth were given (England & Wales) for multiple births, but I am now thinking that it could be what the Registrar asked - What date was the child born - When was the child born ???
The Registrar records what he is told.
Colin
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Stillbirths, or more correctly burials of stillbirths were recorded from at least 1515 to the present day.
In the past burials of stillbirths were often in the church itself rather than in the churchyard. Matters deteriorated in the twentieth century.
An official Stillbirth Register for England & Wales was commenced in 1927 and 1939 in Scotland.
The fact that people do not talk about stillbirths has caused years heartache and anguish for many parents, particularly mothers of stillbirths.
If you know of a stillbirth in your own family or a friends family do not be afraid to talk about the infant. His/her mother carried him/her for up to 9 months and he/her became part of the family to her.
Many such mothers are still grieving 30 or 40 years after the stillbirth because no one talks about their child.
That is one of the reasons I started the Historic Stillbirth register on Anguline Research Archives to acknowledge the existence and short lives of those babies who did not make it past birth.
Cheers
Guy
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In the early years of registration some registrars entered the time for single births.
Stan
I believe that times of birth were given (England & Wales) for multiple births, but I am now thinking that it could be what the Registrar asked - What date was the child born - When was the child born ???
The Registrar records what he is told.
Colin
Times are recorded on multiple births for inheritance reasons! ;D
Inheritance law doesn't recognise joint heirs. :-\ :D
How do I know?
Well, I am a twin.
My mother was a twin - sister registered as stillborn.
I have twin daughters!
One of my twins has twin daughters!!
That makes me an expert Knowledgable! ;D ;D
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Thanks everyone.
Guy: I guess for clarification as opposed to a hunch I should check the local church records (although I'm not sure which that would be). Thank you for that information and I agree with your sentiments completely.
KGarrard: Every day's a school day :)
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Times are recorded on multiple births for inheritance reasons! ;D
Inheritance law doesn't recognise joint heirs. :-\ :D
How do I know?
Well, I am a twin.
My mother was a twin - sister registered as stillborn.
I have twin daughters!
One of my twins has twin daughters!!
That makes me an expert Knowledgable! ;D ;D
Are you the eldest twin KG,the one to inherit all your parents worldly wealth LOL ;D
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I am indeed!
Born at 13:00, 15 minutes ahead of my brother ;D
The strange one was my granddaughters births - as seen on One Born Every Minute.
They were born by caesarean - but their births are recorded 1 minute apart?! ;D ;D
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I am indeed!
Born at 13:00, 15 minutes ahead of my brother ;D
The strange one was my granddaughters births - as seen on One Born Every Minute.
They were born by caesarean - but their births are recorded 1 minute apart?! ;D ;D
They work faster these days than they did when we were born ;D
Or do they have one doctor per baby to pull em out?
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That is one of the reasons I started the Historic Stillbirth register on Anguline Research Archives to acknowledge the existence and short lives of those babies who did not make it past birth.
Cheers
Guy
Guy,
I have just posted an application for a still birth certificate to the GRO. They will search from 1931 to 1933. If their search is unsuccessful, would it be worth my while to buy The Historic Stillbirth Register which you mention? Does The Historic Stillbirth Register contain any stillbirth type events which occurred in the 1930s but which are not recorded by the GRO?
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I understood that only the parent of a stillborn child can obtain the birth cert?
http://www.findlaw.co.uk/law/family/children/stillbirth/8747.html
Not even siblings are allowed to apply for them.
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I understood that only the parent of a stillborn child can obtain the birth cert?
http://www.findlaw.co.uk/law/family/children/stillbirth/8747.html
Not even siblings are allowed to apply for them.
Siblings can apply if the parents are dead.
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I understood that only the parent of a stillborn child can obtain the birth cert?
http://www.findlaw.co.uk/law/family/children/stillbirth/8747.html
Not even siblings are allowed to apply for them.
Siblings can apply if the parents are dead.
Ah that's why my friend can't apply then,cos her parents are still alive,but after more than 40 years are still too upset to do so.
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I applied after my mother had died; explained the reasons why I wanted the Stillbirth Cert.
First I had to phone GRO; they then posted (snailmail) an application form.
I returned said form with explanatory letter.
The certificate arrived within 2 weeks.
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I understood that only the parent of a stillborn child can obtain the birth cert?
http://www.findlaw.co.uk/law/family/children/stillbirth/8747.html
Not even siblings are allowed to apply for them.
As usual the GRO only give part of the story. ;)
Anyone in the world may apply for any birth certificate whether live-born or still-born.
The difference being is that the supply of a still-born certificate is controlled by the Registrar General he/she may allow or dis-allow the supply of such a certificate as he/she sees fit.
See Births and Deaths Registration Act, 1953. on my website at-
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~framland/acts/1953Act.htm
Parents of a stillbirth may obtain a copy of the certificate on payment of the fee.
Siblings of still-born children may obtain a certificate, either with the express consent of a parent, or on their own behalf, where they can demonstrate that their parents are no longer alive on payment of the fee.
Anyone else in the world may obtain a stillbirth certificate if they can show the Registrar General reason for requiring the certificate.
Cheers
Guy
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So would the register date back to 1849?
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Guy,
I have just posted an application for a still birth certificate to the GRO. They will search from 1931 to 1933. If their search is unsuccessful, would it be worth my while to buy The Historic Stillbirth Register which you mention? Does The Historic Stillbirth Register contain any stillbirth type events which occurred in the 1930s but which are not recorded by the GRO?
I wish I could say "yes it will" but unfortunately though my Register is growing it is not growing quickly enough.
Due to the secrecy with the Official stillbirth register I cannot say wether any of the stillbirth on the Historic Register are not held on the GRO register in theory every stillbirth is on the GRO register but I have accounts from many people who have found that their own stillborn child is not registered on the official register.
There are roughly just over 3,500 stillbirths in England & Wales every year a figure that has remained the same for around 10 years.
The Historic Register though still growing only has around 11000 stillbirth recorded, a drop in the ocean.
One claim I can make for the Historic Register is that it clearly shows that some stillbirths are linked with locality some pinpoint a problem with a district or even a single street.
Often in areas of heavy industry or coal mining.
The ultimate aim is to upload the database to the web to enable free access but at present there is a charge to help fund the purchase of registers and data sets to assist in the compilation of the Historic Stillbirth Register
Cheers
Guy
PS
The database covers entries between the years 1551 and 2005 ; though does not claim to be an exhaustive list of such stillbirths.
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Thank you Guy :)