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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lincolnshire => Topic started by: fedagent on Saturday 03 January 15 20:25 GMT (UK)
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Seeking help in finding birth information between 1944 & 1946 of a child fathered by Italian prisoner of war, located in Bassingham. Thanks.
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Welcome to RootsChat! ;D
Have you tried FreeBMD?
The birth, if illegitimate, may be registered under the mother's name?
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Thanks, for the quick response. I checked the FreeBMD, but there are too many listings of mother's name to be able to confirm anything. I was told the mother's name was Margaret Graves. The father was Antonio Minniti. Again thanks.
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If you use freebmd to do a birth search with surname Graves and mothers maiden surname Graves, restrict the years and the county to Lincolnshire there are only 3 entries.
Is Margaret still alive?
Please note that we have a 'no living people' policy here at Rootschat and her name may be removed.
Please take a few moments to read our guidelines for posting here
http://www.rootschat.com/help/posting_guide.php
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Thanks, for the quick response. I checked the FreeBMD, but there are too many listings of mother's name to be able to confirm anything. I was told the mother's name was Margaret Graves. The father was Antonio Minniti. Again thanks.
If you can't find the birth with the father's name, then try the mother's surname and enter the same surname for mother surname.
You have a name, area and approximate year of birth. http://www.freebmd.org.uk
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Do you know if Margaret was unmarried, or had a husband away in the war?
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There are only 3 births in the whole of Lincolnshire for Margaret Graves from 1910 to 1930.
The one born in Bassingham (Newark) dies, aged 1. (Bassingham also in North Kesteven 1934 - 1974.)
The other two were born in 1913 and 1915.
As previous, do you know if she was single or married?
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Are you trying yo find the child's birth or the mother's?
If you search for the child, you could search, as I suggested earlier, for a child and mother who both share the same surname, then you could apply for a certificate and check the mother's name.
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Trying to find the child's birth, but I don't have a name, only that he was a male. He would have been born in 1943 to 1945 range. Graves appears to be a popular name. I do know the parents of the mother farmed in Bassingham and that is where the father of the child, as a prisoner of war, worked on a farm for Mr. Graves. I realize this is akin to searching for a needle in a haystack, but I'm very interested in finding information, because I would be his half-brother. Thanks.
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If the Mother was not married, then the child will show as Graves/Graves at birth.
There is no male Graves/Graves born in 1943 to 1945 in Lincolnshire.
There are 11 male births throughout the country for 1943 to 1945. (Sent away to give birth?)
Is the surname definitely Graves, not Greaves or Grieves etc?
Any more information on the names of her parents?
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Good question. It could be Greaves or Grieves. Come to think of it that is how it sounded phonetically when my Dad pronounced the name.
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As you have been in touch with people in Bassingham, did you try to learn the names of the Farmer and his family?
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There are people named Graves in Bassingham in 1911 so name is probably correct.
There is a male birth in Lincoln in 1945, Lincoln or Newark would be the obvious places.
Edit On looking at that again it looks as though that birth was to a married couple and MMN is different.
There doesn't appear to be any Graves births anywhere at that time where the MMN is Graves.
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I could see Graves living in Bassingham in the 1890's, 1900's but not 1911 - so apologies if I missed them.
But as I could not see a family in 1911 called Graves, and no birth for a Margaret Graves in Bassingham, I wanted to know if they were there as farmers for only a short time, which could still be decades.
Also, because of the lack of suitable births for Margaret's son, then either incorrect spelling, or birth out of district, but we were told birth at Bassingham.
So as the poster has been in contact with people in Bassingham, I wondered if they had identified wartime farms and tenants etc.
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Mr. Graves or Greaves or Grieves was a tenant farmer in the area. In addition to owning his own farm, he also was, as was common during the war, a tenant farmer on other land. I was able to establish, through an individual living in the area, that one of the farms was nearby Bassingham close to Disney Norton. The property was apparently owned by the Haywoods. The property has been sold, but for a time it was a B&B named The River Farm House.
The two individuals I met in Bassingham, were not able to shed any light on the name or whereabouts of the Graves family. Thanks.
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Scroll down to Number 138, there was a camp at Bassingham.
http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2010/nov/08/prisoner-of-war-camps-uk#data
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Another snippet about POWs at Bassingham.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/ww2peopleswar/stories/11/a4622311.shtml
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Jaywit,
The poster has been in touch with people in Bassingham 3 (?) years ago, and is fully aware of the camp.
http://www.withamstaple.com/GArchive/CArchiveHistory.htm
I cannot see a Graves in the telephone directories in ancestry for Bassingham around the war years, which is annoying.
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The info re Haywood and the farm fits. There is a Charles Haywood in 1901 at Clay Lane, Norton Disney. The address of River Farm House was Clay Lane, I think.
It could be that the child's mother was married. Was the child adopted?
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Thinking back to the thread by Davetaxi the other week with a wartime birth In Dave's case he thought it was a girl and eventually we found it was a boy. There is a female birth in Lincoln for Graves MMN Graves in 1944
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I can put this one as this girl died very young, the death was recorded in the qtr. before the birth was registered suggesting less than 6 weeks old at death.
Christine M Graves
Date of Registration:
Dec 1943
Age at Death:
0
Registration district:
Lincoln
Volume:
7a
Page:
679
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chempat, since you couldn't find a Graves in the telephone directories in ancestry for Bassingham around the war years, could it be under Greaves?
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I have looked under Greaves, Greives, Grieves.
No.
But a search on ancestry for1945 +/- 5 years, living in Bassingham only gives 20 hits. There are numbers for the Bassingham exchange for at least 69 people, so some mis-match somewhere.
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In rural Herefordshire exchanges covered villages at least ten miles away, I know where my aunt lived and I know where the exchange was.
Mike
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Thanks for the responses. If I could get a hold of directories, it would give me a way to narrow the search by a process of elimination. Not sure what is available on-line. Thanks much.
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My grandad was a Italian prisoner
Who work on farm round that way
He brought a photo home when he went back to Italy told my nan this was his son I have a copy of photo I only found this out 3 years a go and have been looking from then.from what my mum told me uncle name is Jack
I only live in baldock not far from there
my mum is ill and 77 now would been nice to find her brother for her
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I saw Newark mentioned in this posting and as the town and surrounding area were targets for enemy bombing the birth might not have been in the obvious place. Due to bombing, hospitals and medical staff were busy tending the injured. Maybe the mother chose to take advantage of the government's advice and monetary offer to pregnant women to move inland for the birth where bombers couldn't reach. for instance my mother travelled from Yorkshire to lodgings in Lancashire twice for the births of my brothers.
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Welcome to rootschat, Giuseppe.
Do you know if the son, your uncle, was definitely called Jack, or could it have been John?
Do you think your grandfather's name was on the birth certificate, and do you know when your Grandfather was captured, and when he returned to Italy, to give us an approximate birth period?
Thank-you