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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Topic started by: KarenM on Friday 27 February 15 23:28 GMT (UK)

Title: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Friday 27 February 15 23:28 GMT (UK)
I was searching the 1901 Canadian Census for another home child, and I came across this boy, Ancestry and Automated genealogy seem to have his first and surname mis-transcribed.

Can someone please have a look to see what they think it may be?

http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census/View.jsp?id=71235&highlight=35&desc=1901+Census+of+Canada+page+containing+Terry%3F+Zubengaten


This is how is transcribed in the index on Ancestry

Name: Froy Babingaton
Gender: Male
Marital Status: Single
Age:9
Birth Day & Month:19 Jul
Birth Year:1892
Birthplace: England
Relation to Head of House: Oreven boy (Boy)
Immigration Year:1900
Racial or Tribal Origin:English

Thanks Karen

Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: DonM on Saturday 28 February 15 00:51 GMT (UK)
The original Census are available online http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/census/Pages/census.aspx


Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Saturday 28 February 15 00:59 GMT (UK)
Thanks Don,

I have seen the original census, and the enumerator had horrible hand writing, so between the indexes and original, I can't figure out what this boys name should be.

Karen
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: sami on Saturday 28 February 15 01:27 GMT (UK)
Hi:

I read it as Bubengaten, Henry

But that didn't get me anywhere since I couldn't find any immigration or Home Child records that were remotely close.

Quite a few of the names on that page were challenging  :P

sami
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Joyful on Saturday 28 February 15 02:30 GMT (UK)
I read it as Bubengaten...I wanted to make it Troy, but I think it's definitely

a 'F'...compare it to the 'F' in Farmer. I've never heard of Froy but that doesn't

mean alot ;D

Sorry I can't be of more help

Joy
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KNormoyle on Saturday 28 February 15 02:31 GMT (UK)
Wowzers.  I have seen some bad handwriting but this one is super bad.  I can see why they would think the first letter of his first name is an F but I see it as Henry.  I see the first letter of his last name as a Z but it could be a B (doesn't look like other B's on the page).  I see it as Zubengaten but that second b could actually be a ch. 
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Saturday 28 February 15 02:56 GMT (UK)
I thought maybe the last name might start with an R, close to the top of the page there is what looks like a Rossina.

Karen
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KNormoyle on Saturday 28 February 15 02:59 GMT (UK)
I thought maybe the last name might start with an R, close to the top of the page there is what looks like a Rossina.

Karen

Possible.  At first glance I thought it started with his first name and that it was Ruben.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Saturday 28 February 15 03:00 GMT (UK)
How about Babington? And he's an orphan boy?

I had a look in the 1911 and no likely candidates. But I did find these guys in a household in Brandon:
Evaeten Babington    16
Wales Vobbs    39
Edrret Euhtadt    30

You thought the 1901 handwriting was bad??

Just had to share :P :P :P :P

Cheers,
China
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KNormoyle on Saturday 28 February 15 03:09 GMT (UK)
If you look at the rest of the household it includes middle names.  What if the boys name was something like Gaten Henry Ruben?
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Saturday 28 February 15 13:58 GMT (UK)
Hi folks,

This is not a good one  :'(

When was the 1901 Canadian census taken?

When was 1901 English census taken?

Is there a chance this "oreven boy" which may be "oraphan boy" in broken english as "Orphan boy"...........could have been on the English census prior to being in Canada  ???  ???

I am wondering Karen what else you know of this lad & do you know his origin...........what is your connection or are you not connected to him at all ?

I have looked at your 1901 Canadian census..............how sure are you of his name being foreign (in terms)?

I wasn't sure with the canadian census but was the lad born in England ?

Annie

P.S. I should have explained my query in more detail. If the lad was orphaned (fostered) to a "foreign" couple his name could sound foreign if you understand what I mean i.e. written down how it sounded even if his name was a very British name ?

Just a thought to help get answers :-)

Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Saturday 28 February 15 14:13 GMT (UK)
Thanks everyone!

The 1901 Canadian Census was taken March 31, 1901

I think that it is supposed to be "Orphan boy"

I know nothing of this boy, just happened to come across him while searching for another and didn't want to leave him just lost in the census.

It says he was born in England, July 19, 1892, but the dates could be wrong, as that is quite common for children who are sent here through the Child Migration Schemes. 

It also says that he came to Canada in 1900.

I was sent this message from a chatter who had found this via genforum.....

Michael Henry Reuben-England/Canada/USA
Posted by: m booth (ID *****5257)   Date: August 10, 2004 at 19:48:07
     of 24

MICHAEL HENRY REUBEN/RHEUBEN,b.conflicting-aug.1,1889/aug.1,1893,NEW CASTLE-ON-THINE,NORTH UMBERLAND, ENGLAND. Believed orphaned at birth? MIGRATED AROUND 1900 TO CANADA. Married-LULU TANNEY NOWLAN-REUBEN/RHEUBEN,1909,BROCKVILLE,ONTARIO,CANADA. adopted daughter-ETHEL LUELLA MAY NOWLAN-REUBEN/RHEUBEN. moved to WATERTOWN, NEW YORK USA 1911.
ANY RELATED FAMILY HISTORY WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED! RESPECTFULLY-M.BOOTH, WATERTOWN, NEW YORK.


Karen
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KNormoyle on Saturday 28 February 15 17:16 GMT (UK)
Interesting how we go from Froy Zabagaten to Micheal Henry Rueben. 
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Saturday 28 February 15 17:21 GMT (UK)
But are they one and the same?  ???
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Saturday 28 February 15 18:29 GMT (UK)
Interesting how we go from Froy Zabagaten to Micheal Henry Rueben.

It seems to have been digitally transcribed hence the variation in name...............not a good system in my eyes  ::)

Annie
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Saturday 28 February 15 18:54 GMT (UK)
I just did a no-first-name/no-last-name search for anybody born 1892+/-2 who arrived in Canada 1900+/-2. Only 12 results and none of them anywhere close :P
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Saturday 28 February 15 19:33 GMT (UK)
Here is a copy & I'm sure there will be plenty of thoughts which is what is needed ?  :P

I'm Scottish so in my head when looking at names such as this which are hard to decipher I think Scottish names come to my head 1st  ???

My initial thought for the name was....in a foreign accent  ;D
Buchan Gorten (Gordon) Harry or Henry ???

Annie
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KNormoyle on Saturday 28 February 15 20:25 GMT (UK)
If only they realized how important their work would turn out to be to so many.  I thought all my attempts to decipher, bad handwriting, in French, with such bad spelling was bad.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Saturday 28 February 15 20:28 GMT (UK)
I hear you, KN :P

You know sometimes they wouldn't cross a T but cross an L instead...I tried Galen but no luck.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Seaocean0 on Saturday 28 February 15 20:32 GMT (UK)
zoomed in
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KNormoyle on Saturday 28 February 15 20:41 GMT (UK)
I thought the name may have been a misspelled version of Gaetan but a french name doesn't fit with the rest of the name. 

If you feel like a shot in the dark, what about looking for a Gaetan Henri Rubin?
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Saturday 28 February 15 21:24 GMT (UK)
I have searched the free BMD's with every scenario & none have turned up so far  :-\
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Saturday 28 February 15 21:45 GMT (UK)
No Gaetans of any stripe.

I just had a look at the enumerator. George H Holtzmann was born in Ontario but his father was German. He enumerated himself and describes himself as a "carbenter". We lived in Germany for a number of years and saw this ourselves...p and b are both pronounced soft and often confused.

So on to the b's in Buben. Or whatever :P
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: MaureeninNY on Saturday 28 February 15 21:56 GMT (UK)
Nice one,China!
I was wondering what sort of enumerator we were dealing with.


I just had a look at the enumerator. George H Holtzmann was born in Ontario but his father was German. He enumerated himself and describes himself as a "carbenter".
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Saturday 28 February 15 22:10 GMT (UK)
Aaaand...nothing.

I can't even find the family in 1911 or later. Worldwide search for David Chester East, Ida May East, Rex Linwood East. Nothing.

I suspect this whole mob climbed back into their buried spaceship and went home to Alpha Centauri.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Saturday 28 February 15 22:17 GMT (UK)
Did you see the notes on automated genealogy from someone who transcribed this......

The following note applies to line 12:
'Surname and given reversed - a common problem with this enumerator'
* The following note applies to line 24:
'Age inconsistent with birth year - a common problem with this enumerator'



 ::)

Karen
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Saturday 28 February 15 22:19 GMT (UK)
I don't see a note for "Cannot speak or spell English--a common problem with this enumerator"

 :P :P :P :P
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Saturday 28 February 15 22:19 GMT (UK)
Maybe his first name is Rueben?
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: sami on Saturday 28 February 15 22:28 GMT (UK)
I've tried so many combinations and variations and come up with all sorts of odd results - trouble is there is no way of knowing which 'odd result' is the right one  :P

Have started to wonder if he didn't come to Canada as an orphan but was orphaned here. Can anyone check deaths around 1900 with a surname of Buben/Rubin or any of the other possibilities?

sami
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Saturday 28 February 15 22:40 GMT (UK)
Maybe his first name is Rueben?

Been there, done that, wrote the book and got strangled with the t-shirt, Karen ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Saturday 28 February 15 22:51 GMT (UK)
I just found a Harry Ruben born in 1892, but he's counted for up to 1921 and lives with parents :(
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Saturday 28 February 15 22:55 GMT (UK)
This is unbelievable  :o

It would have been bad enough dealing with illiteracy in that period in the norm but to have someone whos 1st language wasn't English as an Enumerator............well  ???  ;D  :-\
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Saturday 28 February 15 22:59 GMT (UK)
I hear you, KN :P

You know sometimes they wouldn't cross a T but cross an L instead...I tried Galen but no luck.

China..........close with Galen  ???
Planet of the Apes/Aliens  ;D
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Saturday 28 February 15 23:16 GMT (UK)
Good catch, ammack...forgotten about that ;D

I missed Harry Rubin, Karen, because I had the Exact box checked. This Harry was born in Ontario and I've been looking for England. But now I'm wondering...what might the East family consider England??

Some of the 1911 census is very hard to read  :(
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: dbree on Sunday 01 March 15 02:27 GMT (UK)
Hi,

Just found a passenger list for David, Ida and Rex going to Australia September 1901.
Portland Maine to Liverpool, then London to Freemantle, Australia September 27, 1901.
David and Ida appear on an Electoral Roll, and there is a death for Ida May. No sign of our boy. So...where did he go at age 10. Both David and Ida May (Cobleigh) have numerous siblings. Perhaps he was taken in by one of them.  ???

Cheers,
DB
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Jacquie in Canada on Sunday 01 March 15 02:28 GMT (UK)
Aaaand...nothing.

I can't even find the family in 1911 or later. Worldwide search for David Chester East, Ida May East, Rex Linwood East. Nothing.

I suspect this whole mob climbed back into their buried spaceship and went home to Alpha Centauri.

I found the East family sailing from Portland, Maine to Liverpool in Sep 1901 and then to Fremantle, Australia later the same month. The boy in the census wasn't with them.

Jacquie
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Sunday 01 March 15 02:55 GMT (UK)
Well, drat. I was getting rather attached to my Alpha Centauri theory  :P ;D

Looking at the subsequent 1901 census page I see a couple of capital B's that have to be R's. With Herr Holtzmann's penchant for mixing up his consonants (as well as vowels) I wondered about Rupert. Or even Robert. Didn't find much in 1911 except a Rupert Berry b 1891 England who arrived Canada in 1905...arrival dates usually being suspect...so nothing more than a maybe.

This is driving me nuts  :o
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: dbree on Sunday 01 March 15 03:31 GMT (UK)
Hi,

Really reaching here....perhaps as far as Alpha Centauri ;D

With the mention of Gordon and Gaetan......

David had a sister Rebecca b. 1890, she is on the 1911 census in London, Ontario with
a lodger named Gordon Tongate b. 1892 England, imm. 1901, an oven loader.

http://automatedgenealogy.com/census11/View.jsp?id=152027&highlight=42&desc=1911+Census+of+Canada+page+containing+Gordon+Tongate

Cheers,
DB
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Sunday 01 March 15 05:00 GMT (UK)
Gordon looks attractive, doesn't he. Ancestry has him as Gordan Tungate. Can't really squeeze To/ungate into the 1901 writing but with this enumerator every entry's a flight of fancy ;D

The 1901's birthday is 19 July 1892.

Tongate's birthday is May 1892.

Found him immigrating, he's transcribed as Tangak, Lpool to Que 29 Jul 1901. Haven't found him in 1921 yet.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: dbree on Sunday 01 March 15 14:36 GMT (UK)
Hi,

Gordon looked attractive last night and being a Barnardo boy.....but this morning I think
too far of a stretch. Back to the drawing board..... ???

Cheers,
DB

Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: MaureeninNY on Sunday 01 March 15 15:22 GMT (UK)
Wouldn't Gordon have arrived too late for the 1901 census anyway??

I had another go at this today for a few hours and stopped when I realised I was starting to make up nonsense names.

Maureen
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Sunday 01 March 15 17:19 GMT (UK)

I was sent this message from a chatter who had found this via genforum.....

Michael Henry Reuben-England/Canada/USA
Posted by: m booth (ID *****5257)   Date: August 10, 2004 at 19:48:07
     of 24

MICHAEL HENRY REUBEN/RHEUBEN,b.conflicting-aug.1,1889/aug.1,1893,NEW CASTLE-ON-THINE,NORTH UMBERLAND, ENGLAND. Believed orphaned at birth? MIGRATED AROUND 1900 TO CANADA. Married-LULU TANNEY NOWLAN-

I wonder.........the dates seem to coincide. Aug 1 1889/Aug 1 1893 (that 3 could well have been a 9 with the top part faded)?

So............Orphaned would mean......... mother/parents died at time of his birth in Newcastle, UK

Did she die in childbirth?

I'm away to search for deaths  :-\

What about the marriage cert?

It may give at least fathers name unless illegitimate....mothers name if he knew those answers?

Annie

ADDED.............??? 1889 is a problem so back to square 1 as he would not have been 9 yrs old in 1901 :-/
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Sunday 01 March 15 17:23 GMT (UK)
Thanks everyone for all your help, this is great!

I tried looking for the marriage but couldn't find it?
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Sunday 01 March 15 19:07 GMT (UK)
No..............I will check deaths for 1893 Newcastle, UK as the 1889 could be an error.

Where was the date 1889 written & when?

To me that info. does kind of look to be him  :-\  ???  ;D

Annie
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Sunday 01 March 15 19:30 GMT (UK)
1930  ???

Name:   Michael Reuben
Birth Year:   abt 1890
Gender:   Male
Race:   White
Birthplace:   England
Marital Status:   Married
Relation to Head of House:   Head
Home in 1930:   Watertown, Jefferson, New York
Map of Home:   View Map

Street address:   S Massey
Ward of City:   5th Ward
House Number in Cities or Towns:   466
Dwelling Number:   40
Family Number:   41
Home Owned or Rented:   Rented
Home Value:   32
Radio Set:   Yes
Lives on Farm:   No
Age at First Marriage:   28
Attended School:   No
Able to Read and Write:   Yes
Father's Birthplace:   England
Mother's Birthplace:   England
Language Spoken:   English
Immigration Year:   1912
Naturalization:   Naturalized
Able to Speak English:   Yes
Occupation:   Fireman
Industry:   N Y C railroad
Class of Worker:   Wage or salary worker
Employment:   Yes
Neighbors:   View others on page

Household Members:   
Name            Age
Michael Reuben  40
Lulu Reuben      38


Would be good to know more about the posting re marriage to Lulu, where, when etc  ???

Not sure this is same person  ???

Annie

Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Sunday 01 March 15 20:53 GMT (UK)
My initial thought for the name was....in a foreign accent  ;D
Buchan Gorten (Gordon) Harry or Henry ???

Does anyone know what the pronunciation of George would be in German (by Enumerator)?

I found this birth............in Lancashire, UK not too far from Newcastle, UK

If this lad was brought up initially in Newcastle he may have believed it to be his place of birth ???

Scraping the barrel but one never knows  ;D


Name: George Henry Buchan
Registration Year: 1893
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration district: West Derby
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8b
Page: 384

On a census would read: Buchan George Henry ???

Annie
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Sunday 01 March 15 21:04 GMT (UK)
Georg in German is pronounced GAY-org. Both Gs are hard.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: sami on Sunday 01 March 15 21:04 GMT (UK)
Name: George Henry Buchan
Registration Year: 1893
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration district: West Derby
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8b
Page: 384

Have found a George Henry Buchan on the 1901 UK census and on the following UK census in Kirkdale, West Derby, Lancashire.

sami
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Sunday 01 March 15 21:16 GMT (UK)
I think that would be an embarrassment of riches... our guy can't be in both 1901 UK and Canadian censuses... :P

Although I have a great-grandfather who emigrated in 1871 and MISSED both  >:( >:( >:(
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Sunday 01 March 15 21:24 GMT (UK)
Aha...border crossing Morristown NY in 1918...Michael H Reuben age 29, machinist, from Northumberland, arrived Aug 1900 Montreal, destination Watertown, relative in country whence alien came: father-in-law Albert Tanney, something Corners Ont.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Sunday 01 March 15 21:34 GMT (UK)
I guess it's Four Corners, although it looks like Rour. Now part of Toronto (Tranna if you're Canadian  ;D)
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: dbree on Sunday 01 March 15 23:18 GMT (UK)
I think this is Michael Henry's WW1 draft reg. b. August 1, 1889, Newcastle, Northumberland
living in Watertown, NY.....says he served 7 years as a private, infantry, with the Dominion
of Canada.

I am not finding attestation papers on A*, and LAC isn't working for me. Can someone
see if they can find his papers, would love to know his nok.

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1951-26518-29939-29?cc=1968530

Cheers,
DB
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KNormoyle on Sunday 01 March 15 23:57 GMT (UK)
I think this is Michael Henry's WW1 draft reg. b. August 1, 1889, Newcastle, Northumberland
living in Watertown, NY.....says he served 7 years as a private, infantry, with the Dominion
of Canada.

I am not finding attestation papers on A*, and LAC isn't working for me. Can someone
see if they can find his papers, would love to know his nok.

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1951-26518-29939-29?cc=1968530

Cheers,
DB

I have lived here most of my life and have never pronounced it Tranna.  Maybe the enumerator we're looking at would have.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Monday 02 March 15 00:01 GMT (UK)
What? Not Tranna the Good? Hogtown?  ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Monday 02 March 15 00:10 GMT (UK)
So 1889 matches the border crossing age, and Aug 1 is wrong for our illegible mystery boy :(
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Monday 02 March 15 00:31 GMT (UK)
I'm not finding attestation papers either.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Monday 02 March 15 00:53 GMT (UK)
So 1889 matches the border crossing age, and Aug 1 is wrong for our illegible mystery boy :(

I think we have to assume the poor lad isn't too sure about ages/dates (given his circumstances) so margin for error a defo ???

Annie

P.S. Sami........thanks for discounting my thought  :-[
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: Rosinish on Monday 02 March 15 01:26 GMT (UK)
Couldn't find attestation papers but.........

If this is them, wife Lulu is Loretta which may help to trace a marriage ?  :o


Name: Michael H Reuben

Gender: Male

Residence Year: 1920

Street address: 173 Cedar

Residence Place: Watertown, New York, USA

Occupation: Brakeman

Spouse: Loretta Reuben

Publication Title: Watertown, New York, City Directory, 1920


Annie
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: dbree on Monday 02 March 15 14:02 GMT (UK)
Marriage 1913 Lewis, New York for Michael and Lulu, gives his parents as Harry Reuben,
mother Ida Simmons.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-12646-49599-2?cc=1618491

Cheers,
DB
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Monday 02 March 15 14:28 GMT (UK)
No wonder I couldn't find them in Ontario marriages.

Great find!

Karen
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: J.J. on Tuesday 03 March 15 01:38 GMT (UK)
You have still turned up another homechild ...There is a Gordon Henry Tongate b. 1891 Blything, Suffolk, England, appears as an inmate in 1901 census as Tomgate so was likely shipped soon after... listed in the BHC database as Tangate.... 
You need to have the exact first few letters now, or you'll not find a partial listing...I found this by using Gordon T*   But if the first letter was wrong, I would not have found it.
J.J.


 
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Tuesday 03 March 15 05:55 GMT (UK)
CEF #1084134 but no image appears  :(
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: dbree on Tuesday 03 March 15 16:20 GMT (UK)
Hi, :)

Karen.....thanks, hmmm....would a boy orphaned at birth know his parent's names, anything
is possible I guess.

JJ...just stumbled over Gordon.  :'( he was one of 330 on that passenger list.

Has anyone found parents Harry and Ida?

Cheers,
DB
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: sami on Tuesday 03 March 15 16:52 GMT (UK)

Has anyone found parents Harry and Ida?

Cheers,
DB

I've been looking for Harry and Ida and also for Michael's birth. So far, no luck at all.

sami
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: dbree on Tuesday 03 March 15 17:03 GMT (UK)
sami  :) we seem to be in the same place.....luckless ;D
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Tuesday 03 March 15 17:15 GMT (UK)
I haven't had any luck either with finding the parents, Ida and Harry.

It wouldn't be the first time one made up names :(

Karen
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: J.J. on Tuesday 03 March 15 22:11 GMT (UK)
The man spelled labourer "Lauber" so we may never know who this lad in the census was...
However....My 2 cents worth on the name from the 1901 is Gordon Hnry Zuben/Zuken ( capital "R" & "B" seem to have a definite downstroke, & many make a backwards script E for Z)... I also considered Layton (see Gaten) Hnry since the capitol L above him looks like a G ....However there are No Z in the BHC.  It is not fully indexed so hard to say if he's in there at all...
~~~~~
re: the original subject of Karen's Michael Henry Rueben found in the U.S. marriage
Not that it helps anything at this stage, but it appears he was shipped out in 1901 ( surname RUBIN) from Liverpool to Quebec so that is for certain not he in 1901. I cannot see Michael in the BHC database.

This might be Michael in 1911 Brockville, with incorrect age, but birth date down as Oct which doesn't match next entry  http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census11/SplitView.jsp?id=90247

says his birthdayAug 1 1889 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1942-27349-22839-22?cc=1999177
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: J.J. on Tuesday 03 March 15 23:17 GMT (UK)
Would someone be so kind as to check and post an age on that Michael arriving Quebec...? There was no age so I should not have assumed it was the correct person
If the correct one...Does anyone see him as an inmate in an institution or with grandparents in 1901 U.K. ?  I see no births or marriages either.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: J.J. on Tuesday 03 March 15 23:30 GMT (UK)
Have found several online postings inquiring about Michael. This one says he was found in 1901 Ontario but I could not see him in there... It also says he stated he was born NewCastle On Tyne, Northumberland?  Is this the same person who contacted you, Karen?

http://boards.ancestry.ca/surnames.reuben/21/mb.ashx


So far only a birth for an Esther and a marriage of a Bernard and a Jacob ( James) in Northumb. District   ( we need a Harry or Henry, or Heniek, Henio)

 
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: J.J. on Tuesday 03 March 15 23:37 GMT (UK)
Say I wonder if this is he...a  Harry Reuben age 14 ( c.1887) born POLAND (British Subject)  living Northumberland, Stannington. His occupation...General Field Worker ?
(If Michael Henry was Polish the enumerator might just have assumed that the lad was from there...)
I do see a Harry Rubin in 1911 but he is born c1881 ( Russia Mins Resident?) Westgate, Newcastle Upon Tyne, Northumberland, England
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Wednesday 04 March 15 00:14 GMT (UK)
The only Michael R(e)ubens I can find arriving in Quebec from overseas are Russians, JJ  :P
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: J.J. on Wednesday 04 March 15 01:25 GMT (UK)
The one from Liverpool said Russian then? That still doesn't rule him out as there were Polish Russians (or Russian Poles?) in Northumberland....were any of the right age? A Mike or Harry/Henry?
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: KarenM on Wednesday 04 March 15 03:22 GMT (UK)
  Is this the same person who contacted you, Karen?

http://boards.ancestry.ca/surnames.reuben/21/mb.ashx


I was never contacted by anyone, just happened to come across the census image while looking for another BHC.

I did post a reply on that thread to see if they are still active.  It was a while ago, but maybe they have more information since.

Karen
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: J.J. on Wednesday 04 March 15 05:42 GMT (UK)
ahhh!   So my brain actually may have been off to Alpha Centauri after all this poking about and deciphering with no results,  I totally missunderstood as I thought the BHC you'd been chasing down WAS Michael Henry Rueben when you came across the odd spelling in 1901... Brain fried again


Oh, well, posting this anyway regarding Michael Henry Rueben since we'd brought this other lad into the thread...and he might have been BHC
 
...If he really was born Newcastle there is a marriage with the wife's surname as SIMON....somewhat close to Simmons but that's where the naming similarity ends... Maybe grasping for straws but some of this story appears to suit the described scenario, orphaned from birth.

Barnard Ruben  &  Rachel Simon  Newcastle T.  vol 10b  p.295
In 1881 they have three children Cecily 4, Jules 3, Samuel baby
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XQCN-L43
The children are registered as "Reubens" and there is also a Henry b.1884, who died 1885

I found a Rachel Reuben b.1857  death March Quarter 1886 Middlesbrough, Yorkshire

and here is that family in 1901 Middlesbrough and a new wife, several new children with Bertha   http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ev3/

Marriages Sept. Quarter 1886.... but it is only a few months after Rachel dies and takes place back in Newcastle? Reuben, Bernard & Levy, Bertha   Newcastle T.  vol. 10b  p.227

Because she was so young...  perhaps Rachel may have died in childbirth....& could a baby have been rejected because of it? ( Happened to my husband's grandmother)

This may be the father's death in 1916 Middlesbrough https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2J4B-GV1

Sorry to have taken the thread sideways.  J.J.

Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: chinakay on Wednesday 04 March 15 17:32 GMT (UK)
I hear Alpha Centauri is lovely this time of year, and not too many tourists ;D

I see in 1891 and 1901 there is a 5-year gap between Reuben kids at just the right time, but there is no Michael showing up in Ancestry, LDS or FBMD. There's a Minnie 1885 Middlesboro, not a Michael anywhere.

I like the theory of a rejected baby. Well, I don't *like* it, but it's very plausible.

I'm thinking that if a child shows up in Canada with not one but two first names, they probably came from his parents, though.

I did find Michael Henry b 1889 getting US citizenship in 1928, no new details.
Title: Re: Who is this boy?
Post by: J.J. on Wednesday 04 March 15 20:09 GMT (UK)
I found today that there is a query, although cryptic, where they seem hint at having found all that stuff out about Michael, oh, well...It was fun searching....Good for the noggin. (Sans brain on Holiday in A.C.)
Not sure if we are to continue this search, as the initial query was to find the lad from the 1901 and we've crossed over to this lad...Is he proven not to be the same subject.
China, I am rather stuck on the intriging young lad who is said in 1901 to be from Poland. I am pretty sure the Reubens may initially have been from Poland or Russian Poles. What if, when Bernard returned to marry in Northumb. in 1886 he also returned his newborn son to leave him with others...If he was brought up by a Polish family he may have been speaking some of the language...Just a thought. Who is he with in 1901, might be a clue? I can find but cannot see in to the information/ census images...

~~~~~On the personal note
yes sadly hubby's Gmother had a very tough life all around, ( The story goes: rejected for having killed the mother, DUH!!!! nevermind the person who got her pregnant....He married her sister, and left the baby with her parents....) Her rotter husband later left her with a pack of children for a bigamist marriage where he made just as many more children. How lucky that she got along on her own and never sent any as BHC!!!